has montezumas tomb been found ...?

Old Dog

Gold Member
May 22, 2007
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Re: has montezuma's tomb been found ...?

More theory and subject changes, conjecture and side stepping the one question.
I begin to believe that you have no proof of your claim. and that saddens me.

You get all indignant and act hurt when all keep asking,
but theory and conjecture do not make proof.

The kind of photos that provide proof would never give the site away.
what you provide is an excuse for every one to ridicule and laugh.
again that saddens me.

I am at a point where I can't do much more than Pity you BB
and rather than continue any charade
I will just stay away
I have better things to waste time on.

Thom
 

cactusjumper

Gold Member
Dec 10, 2005
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Re: has montezuma's tomb been found ...?

bb,

"see i dont dout the dutchman's acount of seeing a indain ruins..."

Can you tell us your source for that account?

Thank you,

Joe Ribaudo
 

BenThereDoneThat

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Re: has montezuma's tomb been found ...?

cactusjumper said:
bb,

"see i dont dout the dutchman's acount of seeing a indain ruins..."

Can you tell us your source for that account?

This whole thread has gone to shame....... ???
bb cant stay on track of what he thinks he's found or answer straight question like this one from cj, I think Einstein is building an ark and waiting for the pole shift
I watched the History Channel last night so im thinking this thread will go into the direction of the secret codes the mason put on the back of the dollar bill ! lol
 

Peerless67

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Re: has montezuma's tomb been found ...?

T.Parker said:
cactusjumper said:
bb,

"see i dont dout the dutchman's acount of seeing a indain ruins..."

Can you tell us your source for that account?

This whole thread has gone to shame....... ???
bb cant stay on track of what he thinks he's found or answer straight question like this one from cj, I think Einstein is building an ark and waiting for the pole shift
I watched the History Channel last night so im thinking this thread will go into the direction of the secret codes the mason put on the back of the dollar bill ! lol



Hi T.PARKER, dont hold your breath waiting for any answers, Bowman is expert at evading them

Gary :coffee2:
 

Springfield

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Apr 19, 2003
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Re: has montezuma's tomb been found ...?

It's all merely a game. A complete sham. It's lasted, what, a year now? Still chugging along.
 

OP
OP
T

the blindbowman

Bronze Member
Nov 21, 2006
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Re: has montezuma's tomb been found ...?

if thats how you fell ok ,you beleive what you want untill scott woods gives me a answer to my request , i have nothing else to say here at forum .. i have about 116 diffrent research paths going right now and answer stupid questions one after nother is not getting the work done , you beleive what you want .. this a waste of time , trying to see if you can under stand the research ...

if i post more evidence, i get dozen of question i dont have the time to answer anyway ... . not a problem you want it to end here great , latter ...

Oro if you ask i will answer you in a PM .. this cort is ajurned
 

cactusjumper

Gold Member
Dec 10, 2005
7,754
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Re: has montezuma's tomb been found ...?

I believe bb hit a dead end with Scott a long time ago, but he still has illusions that something is going on there. He seems to have no clue of how difficult the process is, and how much time is required to get a treasure trove permit. The evidence he has presented in support of his request, is the same out of focus photos and the same "facts" and "history" he has presented here.

It may be that bb has found something in the Superstitions, but each and every time he has been asked to present some proof, and said he would, we get the same fuzzy pictures and historical novels as well as a new direction or treasure to consider.

"It's all merely a game. A complete sham. It's lasted, what, a year now? Still chugging along."

I believe springfield has it pegged.

Joe Ribaudo
 

Oroblanco

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Re: has montezuma's tomb been found ...?

Greetings everyone,
Whew this one is going to be a LONG-LONG one, and I cannot hope to address every aspect in one post; so I beg your collective indulgence, and suggest you get that extra coffee (not beer or you will be bored to sleep!) :coffee2:

Blindbowman it appears that you are dismissing the idea that if the Clovis people were actually some kind of ‘gatherers’ for an advanced Aztlan civilization, then there would be evidence to prove it. I realize that historians will ‘demand’ to see LARGE amounts of evidence, but I would settle for SOME evidence. What can you point to and say “this was brought from Aztlan by the Clovis people”?

You seem to be VERY influenced by Ray Dillman, and have mentioned his discoveries a number of times – and I respectfully disagree that finding a net bag which incorporated the “fishermen’s knot” is to be taken as evidence of SEAFARING abilities of anyone. We don’t even know the age of the net bag – it might be 10,000 years old, or it might be 10 years old! It is too much of a leap of logic to see a net bag and then conclude that this proves the former owner was a seafarer! For that matter, how can you put so much faith in the discoveries of Ray Dillman? I don’t know the man and have NO bone to pick with him but seriously, you must know that it is quite possible that Mr Dillman is the victim of a hoax, or could be perpetrating a hoax, or could be simply MISTAKEN about what he has found. We treasure hunters are guilty of being a little TOO over-optimistic way too often – we find something and it COULD be something that relates to a famous treasure story, so we then go straight from “could” to it MUST BE when we don’t have the item examined by any experts yet. How do you know that Mr. Dillman isn’t simply mistaken about his discoveries?

Cactusjumper wrote:
Logic dictates that no advanced civilization could have existed on this planet for the time it would take to become advanced, without leaving some trace of their having been here.

As you said – when you are right, you are right! Interesting theories are great entertainment, but without the evidence to support them……and what Blindbowman is proposing is nothing less than a world-wide civilization with a history of twenty millennia; I do realize that a great many things decompose over time and leave us nothing to prove they ever existed – however GLASS does not decompose, and many types of pottery (fired) survive for thousands of years. So… where are the artifacts from this super-ancient, world-wide civilization? Surely their glass and pottery items, as well as their GOLD would certainly remain for us modern folk to find!

Gary your mention of ‘ancient graffiti’ brings us to another possible type of evidence that Blindbowman might be able to show – petroglyphs and pictograms! These should survive for thousands of years, so…where are the glyphs left by these Aztlan=Clovis folk? Even if they had no alphabet or cuneiform writing, surely they had picture-writing, which even cavemen had right? There are caves in the Superstitions too so we can’t simply say there are no caves and that is why we don’t find them as an excuse.

Blindbowman wrote:
yes i do , in fact Ray dillman found a net bag made with tone of the oldest know knots, called the fishermans knots , so yes sea fairing culture has been found in sites related to Aztlan , i beleive the dillman site speacks for it self ... the next thing we need to define is the dillman site evidence go beyond that level . is there more evidence there and if so what is it . it has not been made public as of yet ..

I addressed the knots above, but did not address your next leap of logic to connect the net bag to Aztlan. Do we even know if the people of Aztlan used net bags, or were fishermen? You have insisted that Aztlan is inland and not offshore previously, and that the pictograms in the Aztec codices showing the ancestors of the Aztecs fleeing an island Aztlan by boat are being utterly mis-interpreted, remember? If Aztlan is in the Superstitions, there would be little reason for them to be out fishing, and little water to fish in, plus as you are translating the codex, they were not leaving Aztlan by boat nor crossing big waters right? So how does a net bag equate to Aztlan?

Blindbowman wrote:
"20th century intelligence"

you have to be jokeing right . what 20th century intelligence.. who are you talking about ...green peace ...lol i have to see this our landish clam where have you seen 20th century intelligence...

Now who is the joker? :icon_jokercolor: :D

Blindbowman wrote:
"some older than 30,000 years." 60,000 years old is the oldest known cro magnon shaman

May I ask for your source for this statement? How can we know for certain about a shaman among Cromagnon people 60,000 years ago? You have me baffled with this part.

Blindbowman also wrote:
i have pionted out that site is dirrectly linked to this culture ,if you dont beleive navigational charts and methods have no bearing in histroy ,then i feel sorrry for your failuar to under stand the value of navigation . everything on earth just about still needs navigation today , what is even more funny then that is we still use many of the same navigational skill that were defind in the 1500' to day

You keep insisting that your site is directly linked to this culture, but when I keep asking to see the evidence that will prove it (or at least support it) you keep evading the requests. When I asked what it was that led you to believe it was Montezuma, what it was that said to you ‘Aztec’ you indicated that you had been in communication with Montezuma himself, which I can only conclude was by means of remote viewing. So forgive me asking this, but it is beginning to appear that there is no evidence other than what you have received via remote viewing, unless you are withholding it for your own reasons? Is this the case? There is no shame in not having found the evidence a person is seeking, but there is shame in deception.

Blindbowman also wrote:
ok let me ask you a question dose anyone here know any cave paiting from the 60,000 year old caves in france frist hand ... > have you seen any of them your self and who ... translated the meaning of those art work for you ... would you trust your own judgement to translate the art of any old culture for your self...?

I cannot speak for anyone else but I have not been to the caves of France to see the ancient cave paintings, as interesting as they are, I have several reasons not to visit them – first being that I cannot afford the trip, next that I have many other sites to visit that are (for ME) much more interesting and possibly related to my own work. So let me ask you the very same question – have you been into the caves in France to see the cave paintings in person? Your next question I can answer with a simple reply – no one has translated the cave paintings for me, as far as I know, no one has ever translated them perfectly. Would I trust my own judgement to translate the ART of any particular old or ancient culture, that depends very much on which culture we are talking about. If we are talking cave paintings perhaps 20,000 years old, my own interpretation of them would suffice up to a point, if we are talking Egyptian hieroglyphics I would have to turn to an expert (or at least buy several books even to start) with some cultures I have studied enough to be able to make a fairly accurate interpretation. No one is expert in every subject, and when we are talking about ART the interpretation is ambiguous at best. Are you saying that you can interpret cave-art and be absolutely certain that your interpretation is 100% accurate?

Blindbowman also wrote:
dose any of you know how to translate lunar scales and navigate by your own judgements and translation of those lunar dirrection ...?

Again speaking only for myself, I am un-familiar with lunar scales, and would not navigate by lunar direction – however I can, would, and have navigated using stars and have researched this ancient method fairly well. Are you saying that you are expert OR quite familiar with, lunar scales? Would you navigate using only your own translation of lunar directions?

Blindbowman also wrote:
good piont ..?

No. Trying to insinuate that your friends here that are not able to translate lunar scales and/or navigate by the Moon thus allegedly means that they are wrong and you are right is NOT going to go very far to prove your case. You could be mistaken in your interpretation of a lunar scale, or even that there IS a lunar scale in play here. I do appreciate that you posted enough images (maps) that I could get what you were driving at, but you must also realize how thin a case that is – one could as well build a theory using the west-ward expansion ‘lines’ of the USA, resulting in the regular pattern of state boundaries as the population reached statehood levels. Without some kind of an ancient trail linking each site you posted, what is there to tie them together? Are you saying that there are ancient trails linking each site, that no one has yet discovered? (This reminds me – how are you saying that the Clovis people transported their goods to Aztlan? Were they packing it all on their backs or using dogs as pack animals? What were their trails? Do you know of any seaports with remains of Clovis boats? )

Cactusjumper wrote:
No one knows, for sure, how far back the spoken language of man goes. That's because, for a language to be dated, it must be written......in some way. For a people to reach the level of sophistication that you imagine, they would need a language and the ability to speak, record and reason, in abstraction.

Without those abilities, what you propose these people did, would seem impossible. I doubt the law of random chance comes into play, so your people would have to have a reason to chart the heavens and earth. IMHO, for that reason to take place, over a 10,000 year period, it would require a written historical record.

I only wish to add to this statement that most historians link the charting of the heavens and calendars with agriculture – so the logical link here would be that Aztlan must have been an agricultural culture, not a hunter-gatherer type like the Clovis people were. Blindbowman has proposed that the Clovis people were hunting/gathering FOR Aztlan, perhaps for the simple aesthetics of the hunting life or whatever reason, but IF this were the case, then it is logical that the Clovis people would have received something in trade goods FROM Aztlan, logically this would be the agricultural products produced by Aztlan (which necessitated their charting the heavens and making calendars, in order to plan when to plant and harvest etc) yet as far as I know, there is no evidence of any kind of agricultural product ever found in any Clovis site. It is possible that a non-farming people could have a reason to chart the skies and track the calendar, as some have suggested Stonehenge to be, so again I am left with more questions for you Blindbowman:

Are you saying that Aztlan was NOT an agricultural civilization?

Are you saying that Clovis people were NOT bringing anything OUT of Aztlan?

What goods do you believe the Clovis people were obtaining FROM Aztlan?

Are you saying that Clovis people were charting the skies, and/or making calendars?

Are you saying that the dead body of Montezuma was brought to the Superstitions because that is the ancient site of Aztlan?


IF that is what you are saying, why should the Aztecs, whom had stoned their emperor to death, have treated the dead body with so much respect as to haul him there?

Blindbowman you have presented some astonishing theories here on T-net, and this one has some interesting features (like you lunar scale idea) but some questions remain un-answered (I presume oversight) and I get the impression that perhaps you did not think this one through, that is to say that perhaps you did not consider all the implications that must go along with saying that the Superstitions are Aztlan, that Montezuma is buried there, that the Clovis people were in some way a part of Aztlan as the ‘hunter-gatherers’ for the main civilization etc. Do you really want to hear us say ‘attaboy’ and praise you for your discoveries, then we need to see evidence that even the experts must admit is solid proof to your claims. Do you have any solid evidence that is un-deniably Aztec, or un-deniably directly related to Montezuma? Do you have something that can prove some caves to be the caves of Chicomoztoc? Like I said earlier, the Black Hills here have caves, was a “holy place” etc and is “north” of Tenochtitlan, I could propose this area here is Aztlan with that kind of evidence – but without some kind of SOLID evidence to prove it, it is just another wild-hare theory.

One last thing my friend Blindbowman (and everyone with a wild-hare idea) I get the impression that you sometimes feel as if you are being persecuted for your ideas, is that impression correct? If that is the case, know this – you are not being persecuted, when we question your theories it is simply that – questions. Speaking only for myself, I do try to keep an open mind to new ideas and theories, but I need solid evidence to convince me. I don’t need to stand on a newly-discovered pyramid, something as simple as pottery shards and arrow points would work to at least make the theory seem probable instead of POSSIBLE. Lots of things are POSSIBLE but there is no evidence they ever happened. Far-out ideas do sometimes turn out to be correct – who would have thought that a race of small humans once lived in the islands of SE Asia (the “Hobbit” people) just a few years ago, or that there was a vast civilization deep in the Amazon jungle several thousand years ago, a region long thought to have been pristine wilderness forever. You are not the only one who has had (and has) some far-out theories either, I have mentioned this before but I too have proposed and published unconventional ideas such as ancient visitors to America, and have faced the same rejection of the idea and criticism, some fair, some quite un-reasonable which is one reason why I keep asking you to show some evidence to support your claims. We are friends here and even we sometimes get ruffed feathers in the discussions, consider what you will face when you finally either publish your book or go to the newspapers with your discoveries and conclusions. Those experts we keep referring to will INSIST on seeing un-deniable proof in your discoveries to back up your every word, and if your evidence is somewhat thin (some of my evidence was in the form of ancient coins found for instance) then some of the experts will refuse to even consider that part of your evidence. If you get discouraged by your friends questioning your theories, you will not like what you will get from the experts when you go ‘public’.

So while it may be irksome and tiring for you to be explaining things and the constant requests for evidence, we are actually only pointing you towards what you are going to need in the near future when you go public. I respectfully have my doubts that your interpretations are correct, on the grounds that you have shown no solid evidence that is un-deniably Aztec, and you have obtained at least a part of your information by remote viewing - and it is a known fact that information obtained by remote viewing is often SYMBOLIC in nature and the best psychics in the world struggle with getting the interpretations of the perceived symbols correct and you have never addressed my questions on this point. I am not trying to cast aspersions on you amigo, we all make mistakes (I make plenty of them, believe me!) and it is so easy to go off in the wrong direction.

Or is it all just a game for you amigo? Toss out into the forum a shocking, far-fetched theory and argue for its authenticity without posting any solid evidence, just to see if you get a “rise” out of us here? If it is a game for you then I hope you are having a good time with it, if it is not a game then I hope you can put this Montezuma-Aztlan-Clovis theory all together and back it up with at least SOME kinds of solid evidence, like I said it need not be a pyramid for me, but it needs to be something besides theory and information obtained by remote viewing.

(I am NOT knocking remote viewing amigo – if I were capable of it, I would be using it to try to find the answers to many historical questions, and to find the Lost Dutchman mine as well! I would not rely on it to convince other people of any theory because there is no way to prove it up.)

Blindbowman also wrote:
if i am right . i change history..<snip>

My friend you have mentioned this little snippet repeatedly as well…IF I AM RIGHT yet you don’t seem to question your own theories. I can tell you this, that I have indeed had some far-out ideas, but I also question my own theories, repeatedly and at each step along the way. You appear to seek fame for making one or more historical discovery(ies) yet refuse to post solid evidence to back up the claims, then appear to get frustrated when your “audience” has doubts about your claims. Put yourself in our place for a moment. Suppose that I said, I have found the lost Tibetan paradise of Shangri-la, and it is in the Puzzles mountains of Arizona. I then say that the tomb of the first Dalai Lama is there too, and Pegleg Smith was there but after he uncovered the tomb he covered it back up. Wouldn’t you want to see some kinds of evidence to prove that what I claimed to have found is what I claim it is? Or would you believe it without seeing any solid evidence?

Blindbowman also wrote:
if thats how you fell ok ,you beleive what you want untill scott woods gives me a answer to my request , i have nothing else to say here at forum .. i have about 116 diffrent research paths going right now and answer stupid questions one after nother is not getting the work done , you beleive what you want .. this a waste of time , trying to see if you can under stand the research ...

if i post more evidence, i get dozen of question i dont have the time to answer anyway ... . not a problem you want it to end here great , latter ...

Oro if you ask i will answer you in a PM .. this cort is ajurned
??? ??? :-\ :icon_scratch:


Well amigo I hope that you will answer this post before you quit the game in public, and will happily continue the discussion via PMs. I do hope that you will have greater patience with “John Q Public” when you go public because this past series of discussions and debate is quite mild in comparison with what you will face. Getting yourself into the history books is not a simple thing amigo!

My apologies to everyone for such a LONG winded post, and even so I did not address some parts (such as the rogue-waves etc) but will close here.
Your friend,
Roy ~ Oroblanco
 

OP
OP
T

the blindbowman

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Nov 21, 2006
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Re: has montezuma's tomb been found ...?

you are treating me like i am gilty of a crime .

i dont need a public forum to do my research ,think what you want ,but if you find out i am right dont call me ...you have my answer right here ...

"Do you have something that can prove some caves to be the caves of Chicomoztoc?

yes !

learn something about the lunar cycle and the shaman effects in these cultures before you ask me any thing else ...


"http://www.answers.com/topic/maya-calendar"
 

cptbild

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Oct 3, 2005
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Re: has montezuma's tomb been found ...?

Cactus Jumper
Actually the Aztecs weren't surrounded by "Enemies" :-\
First off, the Apache were friendly and allied with The Aztec
Also, out in So.Ca. there are numerous mines, Turq/Gold/etc, that are Aztec in origin
So!
They were back and forth before the death of Montezuma :'(
If you'd like to see these mines? :)
Just, contact Doc & I, we'll be out there this summer/fall/? :thumbsup:
 

Peerless67

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Re: has montezuma's tomb been found ...?

the blindbowman said:
you are treating me like i am gilty of a crime .

i dont need a public forum to do my research ,think what you want ,but if you find out i am right dont call me ...you have my answer right here ...

"Do you have something that can prove some caves to be the caves of Chicomoztoc?

yes !

learn something about the lunar cycle and the shaman effects in these cultures before you ask me any thing else ...


"http://www.answers.com/topic/maya-calendar"




Are you claiming to have found a "calender" and shaman "effects" in the supers?
 

OP
OP
T

the blindbowman

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Nov 21, 2006
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Re: has montezuma's tomb been found ...?

lol woould'nt you like to know . i got better things to research right now . i dont have time to play any more .. i beleive i just found out what caused the Younger Dryas period....you guys will have to play with your selfs for now ...lol
 

Peerless67

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Re: has montezuma's tomb been found ...?

the blindbowman said:
lol woould'nt you like to know . i got better things to research right now . i dont have time to play any more .. i beleive i just found out what caused the Younger Dryas period....you guys will have to play with your selfs for now ...lol





ROTFLMFAO, Me to, a change in the earths climate.
 

OP
OP
T

the blindbowman

Bronze Member
Nov 21, 2006
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Re: has montezuma's tomb been found ...?

i do have photos of 6 out of the 7 caves . but that will have to wait for next fall ...

i went to get the med wife for the Amish family next door .... this after noon i was resting and i could sence the babay a few hunderd feet away .. i knew right then it was a baby girl . the father came over to tell us the babay was health and before he could say what the baby was with out thinking about it a said haveing little baby girl is goign to be a hand full . he said how did you know it was a baby girl . then i told him and my girl friend said he knew way this after noon even told us it was girl and he could sense her moveing and she would be good and healthy .. he lol and said she is ... .. some times i feel i should just walk away from treasure hunting and do what i like best with my gift ..

thats 19 in row i have picked correctly ,the med wife was in shock when my friend helen said no i have seen him pick a dozen or so orrectly ... i think i got a friend for life right then ....

you guys take care ...
 

Oroblanco

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Re: has montezuma's tomb been found ...?

Greetings,

Blindbowman wrote:
you are treating me like i am gilty of a crime .

Huh? :icon_scratch: ??? I don't see it that way.

Blindbowman also wrote:
"Do you have something that can prove some caves to be the caves of Chicomoztoc?

yes !

learn something about the lunar cycle and the shaman effects in these cultures before you ask me any thing else ...

Well thanks for the link suggestion amigo, but that level of information I already had, and I do not see how the Mesoamerican calendars are helping OR hurting your case here.

Peerless wrote:
Are you claiming to have found a "calender" and shaman "effects" in the supers?

to which Blindbowman replied,
lol woould'nt you like to know . i got better things to research right now . i dont have time to play any more .. i beleive i just found out what caused the Younger Dryas period....you guys will have to play with your selfs for now ...lol

Amigo I am beginning to really understand both you and your theories.

Blindbowman also wrote:
i do have photos of 6 out of the 7 caves . but that will have to wait for next fall ...

How will photos of caves prove that the caves are related to Chicomoztoc? Is there a carving of an Aztec king at the entrance or an Aztec calendar etc?

Blindbowman you did not answer my question in my last post here, an oversight I presume, but if you were in my place, and someone you met online (lets say it was me for the example) and I told you that I had found something extraordinary, something that does not fit with the history books, like the mythical paradise of Shangri-la and it had the tomb of lets say the Buddha himself in a cave, would you believe me or would you ask to see some kind of solid, un-deniable proof? How you answer this simple question will tell me whether it is worthwhile to continue our discussion or not.

In any case good luck and good hunting amigos, I hope you find the treasures that you seek.
your friend,
Roy ~ Oroblanco
 

cactusjumper

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Dec 10, 2005
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Re: has montezuma's tomb been found ...?

Roy,

You were doing just fine until you said: "How you answer this simple question will tell me whether it is worthwhile to continue our discussion or not."

I was under the impression that bb gave everyone his answer to that question some time ago.

Surely you jest. :icon_jokercolor:

Take care,

Joe
 

Oroblanco

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Re: has montezuma's tomb been found ...?

Hi Joe - no I wasn't kidding, been trying to understand each new theory as it comes along from our friend Blindbowman and there is a pattern pretty well developed. I entertained hopes that this one was fully developed and thought out but when we ask questions it appears that Blindbowman is in some way insulted. I don't know why, because I am not trying to insult Blindbowman or anyone else, just want to see something to substantiate the claims.

Blindbowman you know that part of human history, the last Ice Age, is perhaps one of the most interesting periods - we know that SOMETHING terrible happened and the climate went through horrendous changes leading to extinctions, sea level changes, floods etc so when you started to tie in your Montezuma's tomb/Aztlan theory to that period it really got my attention. Is it all just theory without any solid evidence? Is the solid evidence simply that net bag found by Dillman?
Roy ~ Oroblanco
 

Nov 8, 2004
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Re: has montezuma's tomb been found ...?

OHIO BB: you posted --->

if you dont under stand you have a lot of company .. i write the code over 9 years ago and there are some very smart people still trying to under stand the thoery today ...and how it works ...
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

????? clarify, so far it is simply basic reasoning? Nothing remarkable, and not necessarily correct in actuality.

Don Jose de La Mancha
 

cactusjumper

Gold Member
Dec 10, 2005
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Re: has montezuma's tomb been found ...?

Roy,

No intent to offend you, but I would suggest that you go back and carefully read bb's last dozen or so posts. The pattern you see is there, and has been since day one. There are times when he makes some very interesting claims.....or "clams". :wink:

At other times, it's obvious that something else is doing bb's thinking for him. Anyone trying to find some degree of sense or logic at those times, is doomed to abject failure. It's akin to trying to understand the ramblings of someone with advance dementia. You can practically see the electrical impulses bouncing around inside their heads, and what finally escapes that tightly bound prison has nothing to do with reality.

Is there a genius hiding in there? I would not be surprised at all. Can the genius come out and talk to us.......not a chance in hell. Beyond his obvious bent towards self medication, it should be obvious to all that bowman is taking (prescribed) medications to keep him from flying off the face of the earth.

I hope you and bowman keep exchanging posts or email's. Having someone like you in his life is nothing but wonderful therapy. I tried for awhile, but don't have the patience that you have always exhibited.

I commend you, Sir.

Take care,

Joe
 

Oroblanco

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Re: has montezuma's tomb been found ...?

Hello again,

Joe you are right, the pattern is there and apparently has been since day one. What it looks like to me, is that Blindbowman has found something - that he has been unable to pin down and convince everyone that his conclusions are correct. Hence we have had it proposed as the lost mines of Waltz, the Peraltas, Jesuits, Tayopa, the Templars, and now Montezuma, the Aztecs and Aztlan - always trying to tie in several legends into a single place - the Superstition mountains. What he has found I do not know, and doubt that Blindbowman actually knows; it could be something interesting and important, or it could be something not that remarkable, perhaps some old petroglyphs left behind by Amerindian visitors a few centuries ago that has made such an impression on him. His attempts to use shamanistic 'remote viewing' are (in my opinion) being severely hampered and distorted by his use of a mind-altering substance to supposedly "enhance" the experience. The practice of using 'herbs' or even cactus buds (peyote) among shamans was fairly widespread, but he seems to have missed the fact that the mind-altering substances so distorted the images/information that the medicine man (almost always) was led into errors. I would suggest that he research the Ghost Dance craze for one example of this. By contrast, the so-called Sun Dance, using self-induced hypnosis via exhaustion, fasting and pain had strikingly accurate results sometimes - without the use of any mind-altering substances being ingested. I doubt that Blindbowman will take any advice from me on this subject however as a key element of such mind-altering substances is self-delusion and self-deception.

I have seen Blindbowman post some very interesting things, showing remarkable insight - but when we try to 'flesh out' any particular idea by asking questions to fill in the blanks, it is taken as insult. I don't know what I can say that could possibly change this situation either. I am fairly convinced that no one would continue such a long discussion based on complete falsehood, which makes me think that Blindbowman at least believes he has found something important, and is not simply making it all up.

Blindbowman if you are still participating here, I hope you will answer my hypothetical question, if you choose not to answer it, then I will assume that you would do the same thing we have done - that is to ask for some kinds of proof that what you claim to have found really is that and not a case of mistaken identity. You mentioned that your site(s) in the Superstitions are Clovis and posted a pic of some points, without saying they were found there - have you found a Clovis site? Or is it an unknown culture site?

One last point for you Blindbowman and I will close this post - if I ask you a question and you do not have the answer, there is no shame in simply saying that you don't have the answer. No one has "all" the answers to anything, if there are still some gaps in your theory (or theories) it only shows that you have not found the answer to that part -yet-. I have run into some problems in my own wild hare ideas that had me stumped for a while too, and in some cases it is not possible to have an absolute, definitive answer.

In any case good luck and good hunting to you all, I hope to see someone find the Tomb of Montezuma and the lost land of Aztlan some day....
your friend,
Roy ~ Oroblanco
 

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