Treasure Coast Report....

[Mitch1FL]

Well I know everyone wanted to hear that we were finding gold bars all over the beaches here. But it was not to be. The storm did very little to the beaches here. Remember that the hurricanes of 2004 severely eroded the beaches, in many cases all the way back to the old dune. The county and state in its infinite wisdom and to appease all the rich condo and homeowners living on the beaches, decided to replenish the sand after the 2004 season. They claimed it was for tourism. But yet the county does not promote tourism. They want to keep Indian River County all to themselves. Most places now sport a nice wide but ugly filled-in beach. Not a nice white sandy beach, but this ugly gray pumped in muck. Most areas are filled with a 50-foot wide by about 10 foot deep pile of this mess.
Also all public beaches in IRC were off limits and closed to NON-residents, as in NON-beach residents. Just like in 2004. Once again sighting public safety as an excuse. But yet they allowed the beach resident to go down to “their” beach! They did not drive down the beach and tell the residents that it was unsafe and they could not pick up seashells or metal detect. And we all know about a certain police dept that in 2004 chased people off the beach so they could go down with their detectors and find stuff themselves. (FACT).

Ok, sorry I got a little side tracked…..
But now I will get down off my soapbox and get back to the storm,

Basically the storm was not strong enough to cut the beaches back to their post 2004 hurricane status. I put over 100 miles on my truck the day of the storm, checking the sites. There was NO significant erosion anywhere. I don’t know and did see any Spanish treasure, coins or other wise that was recovered. I think there may have been a possibility of some ½ or 1 reales washing up out of the troughs and unto the beaches, but certainly not any heavy 4 or 8 reales. There were NO cuts even close to the dunes in my area. We did work a few beaches that had cuts. But we only had hope of finding post 2004 jewelry drops. But that was not to be either. All we found was coins, fishing sinkers and junk!

Better Luck next time.

 

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[-Jones-]

Mitch,

thanks for the update and perspective.............

 

[Trez]

Re: Treasure Coast Report...time to rise up !!!

Mitch and to anyone else who noticed...
I must say....I was steamed also that all the beach accesses were closed...except for the "priveleged" home owners, beach condo squatters, and if the beach had cut this past week...the IRS police dept.
I say...I have had enough...enough of the bureaucratic BS that is starting to become the norm for this town. We need to act now to change it...
I could not then and will not now go along with the quote "closed for unsafe conditions"
I have lived on the Treasure Coast since 1989...been to the beaches during the N'easters, H-canes, and never once had any beach accesses closed during all these events...except for the 2004 season. The surfers, detectorists, the public !!! anyone who wanted to go to the beach had access to them if they chose to do so.
WE HAD THE CHOICE THEN...we do not now.
They have made it more and more difficult to even park...Do you remember when the lots were full of cars during the storms, the old paths we used to take...they are dissapearing...
It was a blast in the good old days to see everyone having a great time during these storms...enjoying the "FREEDOM" of being able be there...and still be safe. How can we change it back to being PUBLIC again? It will take "us" and those like us...to change it.
Enough is enough, Ernesto may have been a dud...but in a way...he may have started another storm.
anyone else interested in pushing this issue?

Trez.

 

[diggummup]

This is becoming commonplace up and down both of Florida's coasts.It's a joke that public beaches are becoming privately controlled entities.Just another prime example! Seems a little fascist to me. Yup!

 

[ericwt]

Hey Trez: Why not try some creative ways to get around the beach closings?

There has got to be a way for some of us to get together and rent a Condo or house on the beach for a week or so before the storm hits. Do a short term lease.

Maybe rent a hotel room on the beach.

There has got to be a way. The best revenge is being crafty and out smarting the so called authorities.

Perhaps I do not have a clue, but I am willing to bet there is a way to do it.

ericwt

 

[Trez]

Eric......
Outsmarting them isn't the problem...if and when a good storm comes.
They haven't outsmarted us yet.......

The problem is why...after all these years and years of hunting, surfing, beach walks during all the storms of old...that now it is become "unsafe" for the general public...
But yet if you live on the beach in a condo or house...you get access to them...they can hunt them, surf, and walk them w/o any hassle...........
Bull *^&% !

FREEDOM baby...........we are losing it slowly but surely.

Trez

 

[ericwt]

I agree freedom is dissapearing in this country.

However they can not watch us all.

Yes it is silly to close the beach to the public. But I imagine they will use some lame excuse about public safety. I imagine they want to keep people out so they can get the the beach finds.

What I am saying is they are unlikely to change. So we need to be more creative and take back our rights on our own. If they close the public assess we need to find other options.

I have no doubt that things will get worse. So we need to figure out a different approach.

You are right about freedom. I wish something could be done. Until then I live by my rules, not theirs. There is always a way. You found your way around them somehow. If it is planed right you can avoid the frustration in the future.

ericwt

 

[Silver Striker]

Yeah, at this pace, pretty soon they'll be banning fish from swimming in the lease areas. All it'll take is for one fish to swallow a gold doubloon. The last time I checked, God created the seas and He has the only real lease on them. Maybe someone should start some kind of a fund to bail out people that get arrested for metal detecting, like they did back in the 1970's for people who got arrested protesting the war in Vietnam. Has anyone tried bribing any of the ATV riding beach patrols, to look the other way? Could be an option. This is crazy. Yes, the lease owners have an investment to protect, but so do we. We invest in MD's, coils, scoops, survival gear and our time and hard work and get very little reward for it. So, they can all kiss my lilly white @$$.
SS

 

[Bottle-cap Bee-otch]

I would just like to know....who is the "they" that you guys keep talking about?

"they" are taking away our freedom? Who is "they"? And please don't say George Bush. I expect more of an explanation from people who metal detect as a hobby.

Thanks for reading.

 

[Bigcypresshunter]

Is it really illegal to dig a large hole on the beach, between hi and lo tide? Is there some certain depth that is illegal?

 

[deepsix47]

Great Post Trez!! You're absolutely right on all points as far as I am concerned. The "privileged few" are going out of their way to make it difficult for the average person to get out there and pursue their hobby. It should be noted though that they have been doing it in various degrees for years and those of us that have been at it awhile have found ways to get around them. The secrets are actually several.
1) Know the Law.
2) Have some local knowledge (the little secret accesses, etc).
3) As far as the IRS goes (and the law may have changed, I'll have to check) it is my understanding that treasure is only taxable when it is sold or when it is accepted in lieu of wages. Then, under the law you need to pay your taxes.

Know this also. THERE IS NO SUCH THING AS A PRIVATE BEACH IN THE STATE OF FLORIDA, despite what some of the high dollar home owners and/or their "rent-a-cops" would have you believe. If you are between the dune line and the water line, you are legal, that's all their is to it.

Here's something else you might want to keep in mind. Now I'm the last person in the world to stir up anything but, should you be confronted by home owners, their rent-a-cop flunkies, or any other private citizen do-gooder, take it casually and calmly, smile, and simply attempt to move around and/or away from them (you are complying with the law here and attempting to avoid a confrontation).

Should this person/persons choose to continue the confrontation you could politely suggest that they call a real cop, otherwise they need to leave you alone. Then, once again, attempt to withdraw from the confrontation. Should these idiots still wish to annoy you with threats of confiscating your equipment, arrest, etc., you now silently begin to pray. Ask them flat out if they are placing you under arrest (continue to pray they say yes). You have complied with the law to the letter if you have followed these suggestions. NOW you can look the offending person square in the eye and tell them to get lost (as you silently continue your prayers) and again attempt to walk away. Should you be assaulted, defend yourself!!!! In other words, protect your life from what is obviously a deranged idiot. You are in fear that they are going to do you harm and "officer, that's why I beat the s%#t out of this guy".

1) There is no such thing as a "citizens arrest" in the State of Florida. Only a duly authorised law enforcement officer (rent-cops are everyday citizens) can arrest you. An off duty police officer, even working as a rent-a-cop, can arrest you but he MUST identify himself and tell you the charges. No problem, the resulting suits only get better as you HAVE THE RIGHT TO BE ON THAT BEACH. A citizen may only "detain" you IF a crime has been witnessed. The persons in the above scenario have committed two crimes (a) unlawful arrest (b) unlawful detention. Should they have actually put their hands on you they have committed battery and you are in your legal right to defend yourself.

2) Not only will the arriving officers arrest the offenders (on your insistence), you now have an unbelievable civil suit against them that will hurt them where it hurts most, their pocket book (you might even find yourself the owner of some expensive beach front property that you can let all of the TH'ers here on TN use as an access....lol).

How do you prove they actually did "arrest you" despite their possible denials?? Well, in my case I carry a small tape recorder in my shirt pocket. I use it to record observations I make on the beach (sea life, birds, possible new beach accesses, etc) when I get home I transcribe them into my journals for future reference. A few times, when it was pretty obvious there was about to be a confrontation, I have casually reached up and hit the record button (no, I don't record average conversations I have with people I meet on the beach).

Only once did I ever use it in the manner described above and that was in California. A local resident had turned his dog on us, a large German Sheppard, the result was a dead dog (I still feel really bad about that dog but it was the owners fault) and a huge police turn out. Actually the tape was necessary only to keep us out of jail and put the dogs owner into jail. A number of his neighbors had witnessed the whole incident and testified on my behalf in court.

Yes, the resulting law suit was nice. Unfortunately, my wife got most of it in a later divorce

My point is, know the law. By doing this you will be able to make it work for you.
Deepsix

 

[gold-digger]

I second the motion for a hunt. Sometime in the fall after hurricane season would be great. Just before the holidays would cut down on the snowbird traffic.

 

[deepsix47]

Its done.
There will be a massive TN Hunt to be scheduled in the future. I'm all in.

Secondly, I want to thank Deepsix for a great post. Period.

Now for a little humor: How do you prove they actually did "arrest you" despite their possible denials?? Well, in my case I carry a small tape recorder in my shirt pocket.(Deepsix)

I myself have a micro-chip planted in my frontal lobe..In the event I am roughed up..it ALL is on micro.

Lets do it!

Cap Z.

Hey Cap, I'm up to the TN Hunt too (forgot to second it....getting old I guess....lol). If you need any help with volunteer labor to pull it off, let me know.
Deepsix

 

[Ocaliman]

Its done.
There will be a massive TN Hunt to be scheduled in the future. I'm all in.

If the central Florida hunters are invited to the party, then myself, along with some of my MD club would like to join in...

 

[tedpank]

Hey DeepSix ... knowing the law?
It is illegal to tape a conversation in the state of florida without both parties knowing it is tapped! Anything you may record would not be admissable in court (civil or criminal), and you may find yourself being prosecuted for the act itself!

 

[deepsix47]

Hey DeepSix ... knowing the law?
It is illegal to tape a conversation in the state of Florida without both parties knowing it is tapped! Anything you may record would not be admissible in court (civil or criminal), and you may find yourself being prosecuted for the act itself!

Recording a crime in progress on video, tape, etc, is fully admissible in court as many a bad guy has found out.
Deepsix

 

[tedpank]

Without a doubt, but you are describing an unforseen circumstance that has not occurred yet, but you may be anticipating.

So you can't violate anyone rights in anticpation of them maybe doing something wrong!

Video taping etc as you described in your response as an example is a whole different set of circumstances.

But privately recording a conversation without the other person being aware of, is illegal, and all fruits of an illegal act are not admissible in court!

Ted

 

[lou423]

great thread

 

[ericwt]

Hey Cappy: When do you want to do the ALL DAY PICNIK TREASURE HUNT FISHIN CLAM DIGGIN OYSTER HUNTING CASTLE BUILDING DOG SWAPPING TN DAY IN SEBATSIAN INLET THIS WINTER?

Let us know.

ericwt

 

[deepsix47]

Without a doubt, but you are describing an unforseen circumstance that has not occurred yet, but you may be anticipating.

So you can't violate anyone rights in anticpation of them maybe doing something wrong!

Video taping etc as you described in your response as an example is a whole different set of circumstances.

But privately recording a conversation without the other person being aware of, is illegal, and all fruits of an illegal act are not admissible in court!

Ted

The scenario offered was of a person/persons repeatedly showing aggression and of the victim repeatidly attempting to withdraw from the confrontation. Therefore, there is probable cause to assume a crime is about to be committed. In which case, once again, the recording is admissible as evidence.

On the other hand, personally, I agree. Law or not, going around surreptitiously recording casual conversations should not be allowed although I'm sure it happens.
Deepsix

PS: Surreptitiously is a $3 word for me and according to Spell Check I got it right. My father just turned in his grave and said it is now a $5 word....lol.