New to beach hunting help needed

aupvhunter

Newbie
Jul 30, 2015
2
4
Geelong Australia
Detector(s) used
Minelab 3000,3500.4000,4500,5000 GTi 1500, explorer, whites v3i
Garrett at pro
Primary Interest:
All Treasure Hunting
Upvote 0

Terry Soloman

Gold Member
May 28, 2010
19,408
30,017
White Plains, New York
🥇 Banner finds
1
🏆 Honorable Mentions:
1
Detector(s) used
Nokta Makro Legend// Pulsedive// Minelab GPZ 7000// Vanquish 540// Minelab Pro Find 35// Dune Kraken Sandscoop// Grave Digger Tools Tombstone shovel & Sidekick digger// Bunk's Hermit Pick
Primary Interest:
Metal Detecting
NO!

The quest for the perfect metal detector to this point has been quixotic. Minelab, has come the closest to building a fully submersible beach machine that can discriminate out iron in wet sand and saltwater. The “Excalibur,” uses Broad Band Spectrum, or “BBS” technology, and retails for about $1,500.00. According to Minelab, their BBS operating system, “simultaneously transmits, receives and analyses a broad band of multiple frequencies to deliver substantial detection depth, high sensitivity and accurate discrimination for a wide range of target types.” The key takeaway here is “multiple frequencies.” Unfortunately, radio waves regardless of their frequency still have to be filtered and balanced in heavily conductive wet-ocean sand and highly mineralized saltwater. That limits the systems depth capabilities.

Single frequency VLF machines (Very Low Frequency), have even more limitations in the harsh saltwater environment. Take for example the Tesoro Lobo Super Traq. This VLF single frequency machine (17.9Khz) is one of the finest and deepest gold nugget finders on the market today. The Lobo Super Traq, is capable of finding BB-sized gold nuggets eight-inches deep in heavily mineralized ground, or a nickel in dry beach sand at 14-inches. Put that same nugget – or even the nickel, seven-inches deep in wet saltwater sand and the Lobo could walk right over it while chattering, or maybe without seeing it at all. Why?

The magnetic iron sands (“Black Sands”), salt, and high concentrations of other minerals in the water and sand conspire to bounce the radio waves away from the target. Conductivity and mineralization act like a shield around the target and create white noise that must be filtered electronically. Think of it as turning on your bright headlights in a heavy fog at night. All that powerful light is diffused and causes a complete white out – you can’t see anything three-feet past the hood of your car! However when you turn on your yellow fog lights, you can see a little further – not as far as you could in clear daylight, but further. That is why all radio wave machines must be “ground balanced” or tuned, to maximize their depth potential, and why BBS filters and multi-frequencies are so effective – yet still limited.

Unlike BBS and VLF metal detectors, which constantly send and receive thousands of low frequency radio waves per second, a Pulse Induction (PI) metal detector fires high-voltage pulses into the sand several hundred times per second. If no metal is present the electric pulse decays at a uniform rate with no anomalies. When metal is present a small “eddy” current flows through it causing the voltage decay time to increase, which creates a measurable anomaly. Unlike VLF radio waves, electronic pulses are impervious to the effects of conductivity and mineralization, and are unaffected by salt or black sands.

PI metal detectors give the user superior depth capabilities in all metal detecting situations and soil conditions. Using the same heavy fog at night metaphor that I referred to earlier, pulse induction is like headlights that cut completely through the fog as if it were not there at all. The trade-off for that added depth and clarity is the inability to discriminate, or block out iron targets that you generally don’t want to waste time and energy digging. While a pulse induction machine detects all metals without discrimination, the minute differences in the signal tone and quality can give a skilled and experienced operator a clue as to what the target may, or may not be.

Will one machine do it all? Not in my opinion. I always advise new beach metal detecting hobbyists to have a VLF machine for dry sand (as well as their other dirt detecting needs), and a PI machine for the water and wet-sand (and deep farm field and relic hunting). Why? Let’s take a look at average depth capabilities for different technologies in wet sand and saltwater.

VLF – 4”-7” in wet-ocean sand or saltwater.
BBS – 15”-17” in wet-ocean sand or saltwater.
PI – 19” -25” in wet-ocean sand or saltwater.

You can buy a fantastic VLF – and a quality PI machine, for under $1,200.00, so why would you spend $1,500.00+ for one machine? In truth, it all comes down to what you prefer and can afford. I will say this. If you are not ready to dig it all in the wet sand you are leaving a lot of treasure behind for my pulse induction machine.
 

Bumpstick

Hero Member
Jun 1, 2008
602
229
Lake Country WI.
Detector(s) used
MineLab/ Excalibur&Exterra705/ Gold Bug
Primary Interest:
All Treasure Hunting
It looks like you own a wide variety of machines. I use and old blue Excalibur and my partner runs the sand shark.
We both hit the gold but he gets more nails.
I use a scoop shovel and he snorkels'
 

MrMikeJackie

Bronze Member
Nov 3, 2013
1,751
2,258
Long Island
🥇 Banner finds
2
🏆 Honorable Mentions:
1
Detector(s) used
CTX 3030,
Xp Deus,
That's it, I'm done.
Primary Interest:
Metal Detecting
Minelab Excal or Whites Beach Hunter ID 300 are two of my choices for wet sand. A used Minelab Sovereign is also a good choice but not waterproof. Good luck
 

CASPER-2

Gold Member
Jan 3, 2012
17,153
19,933
NEW ENGLAND
🥇 Banner finds
1
🏆 Honorable Mentions:
6
Detector(s) used
WHITE'S XLT, PI PRO, GARRETT 2500, 3- FISHER CZ21s, JW FISHER 8X
Primary Interest:
All Treasure Hunting
Isnt my CZ21 a VLF? - I get targets (gold rings - silver coins) down to 24" all the time in all metal the way I set it up

NO!

The quest for the perfect metal detector to this point has been quixotic. Minelab, has come the closest to building a fully submersible beach machine that can discriminate out iron in wet sand and saltwater. The “Excalibur,” uses Broad Band Spectrum, or “BBS” technology, and retails for about $1,500.00. According to Minelab, their BBS operating system, “simultaneously transmits, receives and analyses a broad band of multiple frequencies to deliver substantial detection depth, high sensitivity and accurate discrimination for a wide range of target types.” The key takeaway here is “multiple frequencies.” Unfortunately, radio waves regardless of their frequency still have to be filtered and balanced in heavily conductive wet-ocean sand and highly mineralized saltwater. That limits the systems depth capabilities.

Single frequency VLF machines (Very Low Frequency), have even more limitations in the harsh saltwater environment. Take for example the Tesoro Lobo Super Traq. This VLF single frequency machine (17.9Khz) is one of the finest and deepest gold nugget finders on the market today. The Lobo Super Traq, is capable of finding BB-sized gold nuggets eight-inches deep in heavily mineralized ground, or a nickel in dry beach sand at 14-inches. Put that same nugget – or even the nickel, seven-inches deep in wet saltwater sand and the Lobo could walk right over it while chattering, or maybe without seeing it at all. Why?

The magnetic iron sands (“Black Sands”), salt, and high concentrations of other minerals in the water and sand conspire to bounce the radio waves away from the target. Conductivity and mineralization act like a shield around the target and create white noise that must be filtered electronically. Think of it as turning on your bright headlights in a heavy fog at night. All that powerful light is diffused and causes a complete white out – you can’t see anything three-feet past the hood of your car! However when you turn on your yellow fog lights, you can see a little further – not as far as you could in clear daylight, but further. That is why all radio wave machines must be “ground balanced” or tuned, to maximize their depth potential, and why BBS filters and multi-frequencies are so effective – yet still limited.

Unlike BBS and VLF metal detectors, which constantly send and receive thousands of low frequency radio waves per second, a Pulse Induction (PI) metal detector fires high-voltage pulses into the sand several hundred times per second. If no metal is present the electric pulse decays at a uniform rate with no anomalies. When metal is present a small “eddy” current flows through it causing the voltage decay time to increase, which creates a measurable anomaly. Unlike VLF radio waves, electronic pulses are impervious to the effects of conductivity and mineralization, and are unaffected by salt or black sands.

PI metal detectors give the user superior depth capabilities in all metal detecting situations and soil conditions. Using the same heavy fog at night metaphor that I referred to earlier, pulse induction is like headlights that cut completely through the fog as if it were not there at all. The trade-off for that added depth and clarity is the inability to discriminate, or block out iron targets that you generally don’t want to waste time and energy digging. While a pulse induction machine detects all metals without discrimination, the minute differences in the signal tone and quality can give a skilled and experienced operator a clue as to what the target may, or may not be.

Will one machine do it all? Not in my opinion. I always advise new beach metal detecting hobbyists to have a VLF machine for dry sand (as well as their other dirt detecting needs), and a PI machine for the water and wet-sand (and deep farm field and relic hunting). Why? Let’s take a look at average depth capabilities for different technologies in wet sand and saltwater.

VLF – 4”-7” in wet-ocean sand or saltwater.
BBS – 15”-17” in wet-ocean sand or saltwater.
PI – 19” -25” in wet-ocean sand or saltwater.

You can buy a fantastic VLF – and a quality PI machine, for under $1,200.00, so why would you spend $1,500.00+ for one machine? In truth, it all comes down to what you prefer and can afford. I will say this. If you are not ready to dig it all in the wet sand you are leaving a lot of treasure behind for my pulse induction machine.
 

MrMikeJackie

Bronze Member
Nov 3, 2013
1,751
2,258
Long Island
🥇 Banner finds
2
🏆 Honorable Mentions:
1
Detector(s) used
CTX 3030,
Xp Deus,
That's it, I'm done.
Primary Interest:
Metal Detecting
Isnt my CZ21 a VLF? - I get targets (gold rings - silver coins) down to 24" all the time in all metal the way I set it up
Pretty sure he was referring to single frq vlf machines.
 

Captain Caveman

Silver Member
May 14, 2015
2,513
2,234
Madison, MS
Detector(s) used
Fisher F75SE, F44, F2 and CZ-20. Minelab E-TRAC and Go-Find 60. Tesoro Tejon. BH Quick Silver.
Primary Interest:
Other
I would use a dedicated beach/water machine. Specifically, the CZ-21 or the Tesoro Sand Shark. Those are my personal choices only though.
 

adamBomb

Hero Member
May 30, 2014
645
551
Wilmington NC
Detector(s) used
Nox 700;
Past: Nox 600; CTX; CZ21; Excal II; White's DF;
920i Stealth Scoop
Primary Interest:
Beach & Shallow Water Hunting
Hi i am new to beach hunting and i am trying to find a detector which i can use on the wet sand i have narrowed my choices down to the marko racer or the teknetics G2+, what do people think? Any other suggestions would be great. Thanks
peter

Do you want a pi or vlf? what is your budget? Have you tried your other machines? How did they work?
 

Terry Soloman

Gold Member
May 28, 2010
19,408
30,017
White Plains, New York
🥇 Banner finds
1
🏆 Honorable Mentions:
1
Detector(s) used
Nokta Makro Legend// Pulsedive// Minelab GPZ 7000// Vanquish 540// Minelab Pro Find 35// Dune Kraken Sandscoop// Grave Digger Tools Tombstone shovel & Sidekick digger// Bunk's Hermit Pick
Primary Interest:
Metal Detecting
Isnt my CZ21 a VLF? - I get targets (gold rings - silver coins) down to 24" all the time in all metal the way I set it up

Again, it is a multi-freq machine (5/15 kHz), but yes, it is a VLF machine. Down to 24"? I caught a fish that long once.. :thumbsup:
 

finderzzs

Bronze Member
May 2, 2007
1,533
336
Sunny South Florida
Detector(s) used
White's PI Pro Dual Field, Garrett Ace 350,
Just my 2 cents, but all those machines are waterproof machines for water hunting. You stated you wanted to hunt wet sand and you are new, my suggestion is to buy an affordable yet good machine like Garrett's Ace 250 or 350. Great machines at a great price. The box is not waterproof, but the coil and shaft is.
 

CASPER-2

Gold Member
Jan 3, 2012
17,153
19,933
NEW ENGLAND
🥇 Banner finds
1
🏆 Honorable Mentions:
6
Detector(s) used
WHITE'S XLT, PI PRO, GARRETT 2500, 3- FISHER CZ21s, JW FISHER 8X
Primary Interest:
All Treasure Hunting
Again, it is a multi-freq machine (5/15 kHz), but yes, it is a VLF machine. Down to 24"? I caught a fish that long once.. :thumbsup:

well I hunt behind a lot (at least a dozen and ones people here know here)
of excal users and a few 3030 ones too
that say spots are cleaned out - you say BBS machine can go 15"-17" and Im finding a good amount of "old"gold behind them deeper than that
do the math - I hunt in all metal with sensitivity at max =10 and go for the slightest fluctuations these 2 land finds made with cz21 - both 1 1/2 feet down+
and in area hit by many with top notch land machines first


one of these days I get a good vid and show just how deep I get the goods in water
if you look at my albums - 90% of the old finds you see - old gold - old silver - all from hammered spots and all from a foot and deeper
I followed a club hunt at a beach that had 8 minelab users a Tesoro user - 2 Whites PI users and a couple of sea hunters
I was way to the right of beach - they blanketed the left - they moved all the way down to me - I got out - walked to where they had been
and got 2 old gold (one a 1917 class ring)

and some old silver - out of all of them - other than recent coin losses - one got a thin gold anklet
none of them wore masks either and I found a $20 floating on the bottom too
I get a whisper - I fan with my dive boot about 4-5 inches down - then recheck - I then stick my large RTG straight down in hole and scoop -not at an angle
recheck and most of this stuff is 2 - 2 and a 1/2 scoops farther down - I wear a mask and know how deep Im getting these finds - got a lot of practice goin deep
using PI for 10 yrs first and going to "hunted out"spots
My finds are my proof - not a dealer so got nothing to gain by pushing my machine (actually I warn most people wanting to get a cz21 if your not gonna use it my way - then don't bother - they probably are better off going with another company cause they are not gonna get the depth I am if they don't or cant hunt in all metal at their spots)- actually I did the same with my Whites so cant say its the machine
but more probably the way I use it - I used to crank the sensitivity on the Pi too and go for the whispers too - hint for older Pi pro users - don't use the factory presets marked - I got half the depth using theirs - don't know where the guys that designed it used it to come up with those presets
but don't think it was in New England waters
about 90% or more of my gold finds are old or older gold - maybe 10% or less are fresh drops over the yrs
I never ever hit a virgin bch - I have always gone where others have given up on
you may think Im telling fish tales but like I said you can look at some of this yrs finds and my past yrs
http://www.treasurenet.com/forums/members/29748-albums.html
 

CASPER-2

Gold Member
Jan 3, 2012
17,153
19,933
NEW ENGLAND
🥇 Banner finds
1
🏆 Honorable Mentions:
6
Detector(s) used
WHITE'S XLT, PI PRO, GARRETT 2500, 3- FISHER CZ21s, JW FISHER 8X
Primary Interest:
All Treasure Hunting
I should have taken pics showing outside of holes too - but you should be able to tell from the first one an idea od its depth - it was past my elbow when I reached in and you can see it did not fall in from the side - oh its a CW 3 ringed minie ball(bullet) - for those that cant tell
I took my cz21 on 2 large group relic hunts - I was about in the top 10% for finds out of all the other hunters (100 to 150 guys) using top notch land machines - In one spot I got 2 super faint readings - 2 guys with expensive machines came over and asked if they could check my readings - I said sure - and told them so faint that they could be root or ghost - one guy got nothing on both other said he got nothing on one and what sounded like a ghost - in and out faint signal on the other. once I got hole on first one open and took out about 5 inches - it got louder and even told them - think its a musketball - they both checked again and got nothing another foot plus down and bang - musketball - told them signal about 10 feet away was same and probably a musketball too - once again they stayed by me and I let check - one never got a reading - other got faint one after I got hole open - once again over 1 1/2 feet down - nother musketball
next day they both did some major adjustments and tried using super low discrim and I pointed them in the right direction and they came up with some deep finds
 

CASPER-2

Gold Member
Jan 3, 2012
17,153
19,933
NEW ENGLAND
🥇 Banner finds
1
🏆 Honorable Mentions:
6
Detector(s) used
WHITE'S XLT, PI PRO, GARRETT 2500, 3- FISHER CZ21s, JW FISHER 8X
Primary Interest:
All Treasure Hunting
I have always wished to find an old area on land out away from modern junk (don't we all)
where you don't have to worry about nails and cans and shotgun shells where I could put a PI to test on land
I wish I had mine with me where I got those deep musketballs - I got some really deep iron frags there too
and think Pi would have gotten stuff even deeper from there - especially since Pi really like iron and lead the most
 

Terry Soloman

Gold Member
May 28, 2010
19,408
30,017
White Plains, New York
🥇 Banner finds
1
🏆 Honorable Mentions:
1
Detector(s) used
Nokta Makro Legend// Pulsedive// Minelab GPZ 7000// Vanquish 540// Minelab Pro Find 35// Dune Kraken Sandscoop// Grave Digger Tools Tombstone shovel & Sidekick digger// Bunk's Hermit Pick
Primary Interest:
Metal Detecting
I have always wished to find an old area on land out away from modern junk (don't we all)
where you don't have to worry about nails and cans and shotgun shells where I could put a PI to test on land
I wish I had mine with me where I got those deep musketballs - I got some really deep iron frags there too
and think Pi would have gotten stuff even deeper from there - especially since Pi really like iron and lead the most

Old farm fields! I use my Sand Shark up in Kingston, NY, with good (deep) results. http://www.treasurenet.com/forums/today-s-finds/307729-kingston-ny-farm-field-hunt-8-14-12-a.html
 

dewcon4414

Bronze Member
Mar 22, 2006
2,138
1,237
Gulf Coast, Fl
🏆 Honorable Mentions:
4
Detector(s) used
MDT, Nox, Blue Xcals and CTX
Primary Interest:
All Treasure Hunting
Why are you looking for a SINGLE freq machine when you already have some of the best machines on the market for wet sand hunting..... or any hunting for that matter? You are trying to convince the wife you need another machine arent you :thumbsup:................smart guy.
 

cudamark

Gold Member
Top Banner Poster
Mar 16, 2011
13,171
14,457
San Diego
🥇 Banner finds
1
🏆 Honorable Mentions:
3
Detector(s) used
XP Deus 2, Equinox 800/900, Fisher Impulse AQ, E-Trac, 3 Excal 1000's, White's TM808, VibraProbe, 15" NEL Attack, Mi6, Steath 920ix and 720i scoops, TRX, etc....
Primary Interest:
All Treasure Hunting
Just my 2 cents, but all those machines are waterproof machines for water hunting. You stated you wanted to hunt wet sand and you are new, my suggestion is to buy an affordable yet good machine like Garrett's Ace 250 or 350. Great machines at a great price. The box is not waterproof, but the coil and shaft is.
Yeah, but, they're terrible in the wet sand at a salt water beach....especially if there is any black sand.
 

flgliderpilot

Bronze Member
Apr 28, 2015
1,504
1,427
Saint Augustine, FL
Detector(s) used
CZ-21, Minelab Equinox, Garrett AT Pro
Primary Interest:
Metal Detecting
Here on Gulf coast of FL, I almost never find anything in the wet sand. You need to be either in the dry sand (coin shooting) or waist deep (looking for gold).

Almost any detector will work for coin shooting... and Ace 350 is nice because you can easily avoid bottle caps.

If you want to go in the water for gold, be prepared to spend $$$ on a detector, swing your arm off, and not find crap most of the time. Water detecting takes a far bigger commitment and it is more dependent on conditions and times.

Coin shooting you can at least walk away with a few bucks in coins and maybe some jewelery and hit the beach any time it's convenient.

You might want to consider a detector that is great in dry sand and "ok" in the wet sand unless you are sure you want to do wet all the time.
 

Fletch88

Silver Member
Mar 7, 2013
4,841
2,367
Valdosta, GA
Detector(s) used
Garrett ATPro- 8.5x11, 5x8, CORS Fotune 5.5x9.5
Tesoro Silver microMax- 8 donut, 8x11 RSD, 3x18 Cleansweep
Minelab Excalibur ll- 10" Tornado
Minelab CTX 3030
Minelab Xterra 305
Primary Interest:
All Treasure Hunting
Why are you looking for a SINGLE freq machine when you already have some of the best machines on the market for wet sand hunting..... or any hunting for that matter? You are trying to convince the wife you need another machine arent you :thumbsup:................smart guy.

I'm with Dewcon, I just looked at your profile. The GPX's and the Explorer you already own are all you need for wet or dry sand hunting and will do it very well compared to any single freq machine.
 

dewcon4414

Bronze Member
Mar 22, 2006
2,138
1,237
Gulf Coast, Fl
🏆 Honorable Mentions:
4
Detector(s) used
MDT, Nox, Blue Xcals and CTX
Primary Interest:
All Treasure Hunting
Did he say hes hunting in the Gulf and not finding anything in the wet sand or water????? Dats because you are trying to use the wrong machine in those conditions. Ive not had any problem paying for my hobby hunting in the water and wet sand. That Explorer will get you plenty of depth, but i prefer the Sov because the tones are separated a little better in the lower range. The PIs should kill it in the wet sand. The V3..... you can run in one of the higher single freq in the dry sand as well and do a little better than the Exp on smaller targets.
 

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