New Water Detector

[Ammietuar]

I hope I'm not opening a can o worms, but I need to ask. I'm looking to buy my first underwater detector and would like to see what brand/model yall would suggest.
A few details-

- price less than 1000$
- gonna be used for snorkeling depth salt water primarily, fresh water, wet sand and dry land a possibility
- I don't like manual ground balance(already learned that lesson)
- very proficient with a MXT and love that operating system
- don't mind (but don't like) digging every blip of trash

Couple questions too -
with a PI detector, can you tell the difference between iron and another metal? - maybe with the tone or something?
and no bull- with a PI would I be digging hairpins at like 2 feet?

Thank you all for your suggestions.

 

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[Dixie Digger]

to do all the things you just ask,you only need an Excalibur !

 

[Sandman]

As Dixie Digger said, the Excalibur 1000 is the only one that nulls out on iron and still respond to a gold ring next to it. Also the Sov GT, but it isn't waterproof.

Yes with a PI you can find bobby pins at near 2 feet and a lot of other trash very deep too. Hairpins in freshwater can last for decades before rusting away.

Ground Balancing is no big deal and you should learn to do it. Just adjust the GB knob till the Threshold sound it the same volume in the air as it is close to the ground and it is set.

There are many detectors to choose from, but the Saltwater cuts your choices for stable operation.

 

[txkickergirl]

excal no questions

 

[DaChief]

I have to chime in every time the PI starts taking a bum rap. The fact is that yes, the PI will pick up iron but the bobby pin at 2 feet thing is a bit over the top. Yes I find bobby pins but I also find gold. I never knock any detector when talking about these things because I believe that to do so shows some ingnorance in the matter of choosing a detector.

I have said many times and will say it here again, there is no bad water machine from the top manufacturers, there are just some that are far more better than others and when it comes down to choice, if you are having to ask someone which one you need to use, then you don't need to be buying one right now.

You need to go online and look up detector reviews, feedback from other users and good old true stories like you see right here on Tnet. You should make you a list of what you read about all of the machines in the top tier of manufacturers. The good and the bad. Make that list and read it once, twice, and three or more times. Then ask yourself what you are looking for in a machine. It will be there looking at you in good plain sight.

If you are going to invest 1000+ dollars in a machine, you should buy one that you have an understanding of and not based on a statement from me or others that ours is the best. If you are brave enough to do that, you may get a machine that is not suited to you at all.

I can tell you from the bottom of my heart that I am among the list of folks that hate to dig. If I spent tons of time digging bobby pins at 2 feet, I would be out of the PI game. If you are looking for an easy hobby, you need to look elsewhere. Water hunting is a physical hobby and you will dig lots of junk with the Excalibur, Infinium, Mark II, Tigershark, Sandshark, CZ-21 and any other machine if you are going to find gold. There are many pros and cons to all machines. If you dig back through the past posts here where your question has been asked you will find many folks that have asked the same question time and time again and there are many people who will hype their machine and bust down others.

Do yourself a favor, do your research, write down the things you read about all the name brand machines both good and bad and decide after you educate yourself. I remember as a boy everyone touting a shiney new automobile that was called the Edsel. I sure am glad my dad didn't run out and buy one of those because they were all the rage.

I am not saying my machine is better than his or his or his. I am saying mine may not fit you and theirs may not fit you. That is a question that only you can answer.

Good luck and take your time and spend your money wisely unless you just have tons of it and don't need it.

DaChief

 

[COTTON]

I agree,Dead on.......................... Cotton

 

[Maui Mike]

I so agree.. i spent " Months researching before buying" and finally picked one. I may have bought a different machine than the one i have now and had been just as happy with it.. "Learning the machine i bought" has been one of the most important factors in owning it. my 2 cents worth. shaka Mikey

 

[nudels]

With a PI, you won't be digging hairpins at 2 feet! Maybe 1.5 feet.... but not 2 feet .

Some other questions to ask yourself before deciding:

1) Are the areas very trashy or relatively clean? Yes=get a good discriminating unit
2) Is weight a huge issue?
3) Do you mind a used detector? 1K or less will get you practically anything used.
4) Do you prefer to dig every target? Yes = PI

Few units can work flawlessly in saltwater and salt/mineralized sand. Are the areas you will be working highly mineralized sand? Be sure you check with users experience with certain models in your environment.

When I started my research, I pretty much ignored manufacturers claims, except for depth ratings, and read here, geotech and findmall for my research, and asked on this board when I got closer to see if what I thought I decided was a good choice, or if there were any other options I didn't see or hadn't thought of.

I went with a Tesoro Sandshark, a PI unit, mainly because the next step up IMHO and in the research I did would have been a 1.5K PI (JW Fishers Pulse 8X) and finance (read: my wife) wouldn't have any of that. My main deciding factor was I prefer to dig every target, and the areas I plan on hammering are not full of trash. That and for US $543.20 (current price) I had a bit more budget for the other gear I wanted to get, a good long handle scoop (decided on Nuttall scoop, hopefully on it's way this week), a proper belt and other misc gear. In the end i'll be about US $800 in and completely outfitted. And the lifetime warranty just can't be beat.

My plan is, if I can find enough cheese, I may go for a higher end unit later but it will be all with hobby money. In the meantime, everything that crosses my coil will be dug (I prefer it that way anyhoo).

 

[Ammietuar]

Thank you for all of your replies. I have actually been looking into it for near 1 year now, just got the green light from the war department (the wife) a few days ago. I welcome all of your thoughts and see that they are very close to what I was thinking.

I know there is no "one size fits all detectorists" when it comes to detectors. My main reason for posing the question is that I will not be able to test drive what I decide on as I have been unable to find a store selling anything related to what I'm looking for (If you know of one in Korea send me a location.. I'm up for a bus ride). As for the ground balancing, I didn't realize how much I disliked it until I used the auto balance function of the MXT. I was adjusting my Garrett every 10ft. because of bad mineralization. MXT hummed right through the same area, just missed all the bird shot... I have already been leaning towards the SandShark, but like the idea of iron disc. Therein my dilemma deciding weather disc is worth 2-500$. How much is scrap iron selling for?..lol Thanks again.

 

[nudels]

I just stumbled across this neat article in another thread. It talks about discrimination and PI, it's worth the read:

http://www.dankowskidetectors.com/behindthemask.htm

 

[Ammietuar]

Wow, that article is very much worth the read. I knew of iron masking, but I did not think that such small pieces would have that much of an effect. tyvm for that eye opening post.

 

[beachboy]

One things is true with all water machines is one needs a good scoop...

 

[Keppy]

I just stumbled across this neat article in another thread. It talks about discrimination and PI, it's worth the read:

http://www.dankowskidetectors.com/behindthemask.htm

Then what i read in that is that the Excalibur & Sovereign will not pick up a coin under iron so it is not a true iron mask. Or it is a true iron mask it will mask out the iron but if there is a coin under the iron it will not pick it up........................==Jim==

 

[Ammietuar]

I know that this is a bit of an old topic now, but I thought I might fill yall in on what I went with. I ultimately decided to go with a Whites Surf PI Pro Dual Field. I have only been able to use it 3 times since I received it in the mail, but I am very happy with it. The scoop came late so I have only been able to get in the water with it once and I must say you people who water detect have gained alot of respect from me! I managed to get in there for 4 hours then a 20 minute break and then back in for 4 hours. I didn't go very deep but the waves were going from knee to shoulder and I had a hand scoop! So every target was a fight against the time before the next wave. I am amazed at how much stamina the water takes. Now I'm used to going on land for 8 to 10+ hour hunts, but after I got out of the water I was done! I couldn't hardly move I was so worn out! You water guys and gals are truly the Olympians of MDing, hats off to ya. As far as the Surf Pro goes it has definitely lived up to my expectations. I'm really impressed at how sensitive to any sized metal the large coil is. Here in Korea the locals dont see many detectorists, so they are constantly coming up to me. As they were walking up I could hear the threshold raise from the change in their pockets. It will easily pick up tiny(like 1/4in long) iron bits of wire at 5-6+ inches. The first day I took it out, I found a small gold plated copper ring and about 3,500 won in change (around $2.50 US with the exchange the way it is) and alot of trash and iron which is normal. One of the pieces of iron was a chain that had a silver letter "L" attached to it. When I took it home I ran it under my MXT at my normal hunting disc. The MXT tuned it right out. The biggest issue Ive had with it was pinpointing with the bigger coil than I'm used to. This went away when got the scoop and could just grab large amounts of sand until the hole stopped beeping. Once I put a magnet inside my scoop digging alot of iron got way easier. I kinda like the idea of "clean sweeping" the beach anyway, it makes a beach the way it outta be and makes me look real good to the locals when they see a foreigner picking up all their trash. Maybe they will stop trashing the place and start "jewelrying" it..lol. All and all I'm happy that I went with a PI, and Whites has again made a happy customer.

 

[petersra]

I find this process of deciding on the best detector at the best price to be quite frustrating. I have a Tesoro Tiger Shark. I bought it hoping that it would be a good all around detector, and for the most part it has been. I have learned that it does not like the saltwater line where the wave action is churning the sand. (it falses a lot) So I am looking for another detector to work in the SALTwater and I want good depth. (I understand that the Tiger Shark does great in fresh water, but I live near the ocean. It works fine in the wet salt sand, just not the churning water.) I have tried to find depth comparisons between different units and although I have found some good charts, they always seem to be missing the units I am considering or the type of finds I would like to find. Can you give me some idea what kind of depth you are getting on your Pulse on a gold ring? and perhaps compare it with the other VLF detector you have. That information would be very helpful. Thanks. Ralph

 

[txkickergirl]

this is my first year water hunting so it was an experience for me as well. It took a lot more energy than I had thought and worked muscles I didn't know I had. Even now sometimes after long hunts I can barely move. This is especially true when I go chest deep and try to scoop, I end up floating to the top in rather odd positions. I can only imagine what I look like out there doing this. I thought I was kinda tough before hunting in brush, cactus and, digging in concrete dirt. Well in the water its a whole new game and not any easier. I fight the waves, the current, the shell, the jelly fish, and other assorted sea life, and a lot of times targets are few and far between. That being said I wouldn't trade it for the world, it has been great and I love it.
So stick with it and don't get discouraged, its not about the finds, its the hunt and enjoyment you get dragging your exhausted butt home with less than a handful of change, explaining to your other half why after 8hours, of being thrashed and fried, you didn't even have enought to buy a drink with, but that you wouldn't of traded the day for anything.

 

[Ammietuar]

Petersra asked "Can you give me some idea what kind of depth you are getting on your Pulse on a gold ring? and perhaps compare it with the other VLF detector you have?" I certainly can, I actually just air tested this on last Saturday. The ring was an 18k yellow gold band that I had previously found with my MXT (VLF) at approximately 6-7 inches in wet salty sand. The MXT was falsing really bad despite my best efforts to tune as much of it out as I could by lowering sens, raising descrim, and slowing and even doubling my swing. It made a terrible but repeatable choppy blip with the settings I had on the MXT. On the same beach I air tested the ring with the Surf PI DF(thinking about it now I wish I would have buried it tied to a string) with the settings at presets. The PI would give a strong solid signal at around 8 in, and would taper off until about 14 inches where it would fade into the hum of the threshold. I also tried this with a silver ring with pretty much the same results. As far as coins go on the PI, I am definitely getting more depth out of it. I took it over the exact same areas that I used the MXT to get everything up to about 6 in, and am now recovering coins and the same sized items(the Korean coinage that I'm finding ranges from slightly smaller than a dime to a little larger than a quarter and of roughly the same metal content as US coins) from around 8 -15+ in. I am also noticing that the PI is not falsing, on dry land. Any time the threshold raises, either there is something below ground or it is caused externally (my scoop too close or pockets full of change walking up), even at maximum sensitivity. It does seem to false however in the surf a bit, right where you were speaking of - the churning water. The threshold would raise a bit as a wave passed that was a foot or two+ over the coil. I did read about this happening with this detector and others prior to buying and most of the reviews that discussed it attributed it to the detector trying to balance its self with the wave, and then dropping back when the wave had passed. This is a bit annoying, but I think I can deal with it just as I am learning to know when I'm picking up my scoop. One thing that really suprises me, and kind of makes me question this detector is that it doesn't seem to pick up thin foil at all. Since I know that light foil is in the same VDI range of small gold according to my MXT, I am wondering if I might be missing it with the PI. Hopefully soon I can test this. I hope I answered your questions, and if you have any more that I may be able to answer please feel free to ask.

 

[Loosemoose]

Dachief, one of the best posts I've read on Tnet, you hit the mark about subjectivity perfectly. I've also read one previous post somewhere "beware the person with only one detector, for they probably know how to use it very well", just a point that if you get to know ANY detector very well, you will be far more successful than most.

 

[petersra]

I agree with the "LooseMoose", I read DaChief's post with great interest. Excellent information. Ammietura, Thanks for the reply. Your information was a great help also. I assume that you went with the more expensive White's Duel mode PI rather than Tesoro's SandShark PI with a lifetime warranty, because the duel mode is "suppose" to find smaller objects that a single mode coil might miss. Since I dig almost everything now anyway, my next detector may just be a PI to get the added depth and find the stuff even the best VLFs miss. Happy hunting in Korea, sounds like you are going to be the Pro before long. Ralph