An Interesting Legal Perspective

[bigscoop]

A few weeks ago I asked a lawyer friend of mine to read the pamphlet and treat it as if it had been presented to him in legal testimony, and then I asked him to further treat that testimony with his own legal perspective in considering the pamphlet’s possible accuracy/truth. After doing this, the following is what he told me…..

“From a legal perspective the most important statement is made on the cover of the pamphlet, “Containing Authentic Statements” which simply implies, from a legal perspective, that “only some of the statements in the pamphlet are true”. He went on to explain that if the author had felt he had penned an entirely true account of the events he most likely would have used something like ‘a true story’ or ‘a true account’ in referencing the contents of the pamphlet. By using the reference “containing authentic statements” he would only be required to include a few true statements VS an entirely true account throughout pamphlet.”

As far as the story itself, this is what he had to say:

“The story certainly appears to contain several situations where a lot of possible legal formalities and requirements could have existed, and probably did if those particular accounts were true?”

[47thelement]

My wife/attorney agrees.

[bigscoop]

My wife/attorney agrees.

Will your wife work on this with us pro-bono?
If so, I've got a lot of questions/possible angles for her!

[Rebel - KGC]

As a PARA-LEGAL, I would have to say that JUBAL EARLY, CSA and attorney in Lynchburg, Va. post "Confederate War" (aka Civil War) MAY WELL have "impacted" the BEALE PAPERS... BUT! LEGAL LAWS had to be based on "Civil War" era "legal system" or "legal system" of 1819, etc. BUT! I am NOT aware of attorneys in that era, except for J. B. RISQUE, who WAS involved in the PRE-Beale story, and LATER moved to Lynchburg, Va. and bought LOTS of land in Campbell County, Bedford County, and Lynchburg, Va. area. HE was J. Beverly Ward's GRANDFATHER!

[bigscoop]

If you do a search of the Virginia Bench & Bar, you'll eventually find a Thomas Beale I, and a Thomas Beale II. And as I recall, I believe at one time I traced on of these men to Richmond and also to New Orleans, but don't quote me on that because it was quite a while back. Also need to remember that Virginia was a much larger place during the period in question. But there were a lot of Thomas Beales out there and it is easy to get them confused.

[Rebel - KGC]

You ALMOST got it... Thomas Beale I had a duel with J.B. Risque, an attorney from Fincastle, Va. & LATER, JB Risque moved to Lynchburg, Va. and bought LOTS of land around Lynchburg, Va. and had a big old PLANTATION outside of Lynchburg, Va. His grandson, J. Beverly Ward is buried in a cemetery on the OLD Plantation... looking for it, now. Thomas Beale I DID move to New Orleans; Thomas Beale II ALSO moved down there, LATER. MORE later...

[bigscoop]

You ALMOST got it... Thomas Beale I had a duel with J.B. Risque, an attorney from Fincastle, Va. & LATER, JB Risque moved to Lynchburg, Va. and bought LOTS of land around Lynchburg, Va. and had a big old PLANTATION outside of Lynchburg, Va. His grandson, J. Beverly Ward is buried in a cemetery on the OLD Plantation... looking for it, now. Thomas Beale I DID move to New Prleans; Thomas Beale II ALSO moved down there, LATER. MORE later...

Yep, I've come across those details a few times.......but I think there "may" also be some questionable history here. "Could be", some things have gotten a little confused as to who was who? Still looking into this.....

[bigscoop]

Maybe, but maybe not? Still checking a few things out. The problem I’m having with this is the spelling, Beall VS Beale, and I do understand and appreciate all the previous explanations. What I don't understand is how those who spoke of him, and others who served with him and reported the details of his service, managed to get it wrong (Beale) so often when referencing his name? Or did they? Just didn’t, and still doesn’t, make sense to me.

[Rebel - KGC]

BEALL vs BEALE? EASY! If you have EVER done "family research"... hand-writings can CHANGE the last name of a person; OR! CREATE a family "dynasty" based on MIS-SPELLINGS, as in MY case; BOLLING became BOWLING. ANYWAY, back to BEALL vs BEALE; The LAST "L" in BEALL appears to be a "E" (BEALE)... in fact, Peter Viemeister has a copy of a signature on p. 98,
in his book; Thomas Beale I signed off on a sale of Lot # 9, on Main Street in Fincastle, Va. looking MORE like BEAL; AND! He was a MERCHANT, NOT an attorney, like J. B. Risque.

[bigscoop]

I guess I was suggesting that I have never come across a documented/notable "Beall's" Sharpshooters account.....always "Beale." There was a Beall at this battle, maybe even more then one, but it's always "Beale's" rifle regiment, or sharpshooters, etc. I'm just not confident that so many first hand accounts were all wrong?

[tat2guy]

BigScoop,

Checkout the following link. It list a muster roll call under the command of Cpt. Thomas Beall for 10 months in 1780. This is a Maryland and Virginian Rifle Regiment. I know its a number of years prior to the Beale time period, but a reference to explore.

http://www.msa.md.gov/megafile/msa/s...am18--350.html

HH Jay

[tat2guy]

Something else thats interesting to check out. Following this link is the info withy a book from Thomas J beall. Some things in what I read there peaked my interests and I thought back to the Beale Papers.

Re: 100 ONLINE DIARIES OF EARLY MINERS, TRAPPERS, SOLDIERS, ETC...MORE ADDED....

Reply To This Topic #14 Posted Dec 11, 2011, 11:08:36 pm

Quote Modify Remove


I find it very interesting that an account for Craig William was written by one Thomas J. Beall. Makes me think about Lynchburg Va..............

HH Jay

[tat2guy]

Sorry here it is http://user.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/html/craig.html

[bigscoop]

Jay,
I've read the diary and I'm pretty familiar with most of the other Bealls, but as for the New Orleans Beale in question, I think the problem perhaps resides in the issue that the New Orleans Beale Company were all volunteers, and not inlisted men, the same as Laffite and his privateers. Having said that, I think there is some confusion in regards to military records and genealogical searches VS un-inlisted Beale/Beall, etc. i.e.,....the right place, the right time, same battle, but the wrong Captain Beall and/or, in some cases, even the wrong regiment, etc. Fact is, there were many Beall, Beale, etc., and even a few "Thomas" Beall, Beale, etc. So when someone finds a Captain Thomas Beall that served at New Orleans it naturally becomes an assumption that it must be the right/same Thomas Beale/Beall. But the problem falls back on recorded history with first hand accounts of the New Orleans conflict that clearly use "Beale" just the same as our knowledgeable unknown author of the Beale Papers uses Beale. If the New Orleans Beale had actually been "Beall" we most certainly would be encountering that in some of these first hand accounts and in the Beale Papers, but that simply isn't the case, as it is always "Beale". So clearly something is amiss here.......

[bigscoop]

BigScoop,

Checkout the following link. It list a muster roll call under the command of Cpt. Thomas Beall for 10 months in 1780. This is a Maryland and Virginian Rifle Regiment. I know its a number of years prior to the Beale time period, but a reference to explore.

http://www.msa.md.gov/megafile/msa/s...am18--350.html

HH Jay

That was Thomas Jefferson Beall's uncle that lived at Cumberland, Maryland. Know him well.

He's still alive! Good lord, how old are you! Just kidding........ But seriously, do you have the birth and/or documented records for this Thomas "Jefferson" Beall?

[bigscoop]

Interesting. So these pension records actually list his full name as Thomas Jeffeson Beall, and not just Thomas J. Beall?

[tat2guy]

2nd Maryland Regiment, Col. Thomas Price
Muster roll of Capt. Davidson's Company, September 1778.
49 N.C.O.'s and rank and file for three years.
Check out this link on Beall

http://www.usgwarchives.org/pensions/misc/alllevy.txt

38 privates for nine months
Thomas Beall, private, included with his pension papers is the following note:

Thomas Beall having been enlisted as Soldier in the 2d
Maryd Regiment To Serve the term of Nine Months from July
3d .78 till April 3d 79 has Received ... the Following
articles of Cloathing 1 Coat 1 Jackett 1 Shirt 3 pair
of Shoes 1 Knapsack 1 pair of overalls and is discharged
from all Military Duty in said Regiment Given at the
Quarters of [the Regt?] Middle Brook April 3d 1779