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Thread: Bonafide Proof

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  1. #16
    ECS
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    Quote Originally Posted by masterpoe View Post
    Jean has the letter from Friedman on his Facebook from 1949 and he seems to like and is researching them according to 1949 letters?
    That letter is from Elizabeth Smith Freidman, Federal codebreaker, and wife of William Friedman, also a Federal breaker who met with Ward's daughter, Adeline Ward McVeigh in the middle 1930's, and concluded that the Beale Papers were "diabolical ingenuity, specifically designed to lure the unwary reader".
    There have been many unwary readers of the last 130 years, will more will continue to join that club.
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  2. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by ECS View Post
    That letter is from Elizabeth Smith Freidman, Federal codebreaker, and wife of William Friedman, also a Federal breaker who met with Ward's daughter, Adeline Ward McVeigh in the middle 1930's, and concluded that the Beale Papers were "diabolical ingenuity, specifically designed to lure the unwary reader".
    There have been many unwary readers of the last 130 years, will more will continue to join that club.
    The one he has said it was to Alfred Percy from W F Friedman!
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  3. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by ECS View Post
    That letter is from Elizabeth Smith Freidman, Federal codebreaker, and wife of William Friedman, also a Federal breaker who met with Ward's daughter, Adeline Ward McVeigh in the middle 1930's, and concluded that the Beale Papers were "diabolical ingenuity, specifically designed to lure the unwary reader".
    There have been many unwary readers of the last 130 years, will more will continue to join that club.
    Can you show a link to this document you have referred to or is this just something you read in a novel somewhere?
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  4. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by masterpoe View Post
    Can you show a link to this document you have referred to or is this just something you read in a novel somewhere?
    That is a letter from Elizabeth Friedman to Clayton I. Hart. Not the letter on Jean Laf blog.

    I have a copy of all the letters, all the code breakers research in the 1930's both in Lynchburg and in St. Louis. I also have the letters by Friedman in 1949. All the research that was done in New Orleans for Peter Viemeister and other researchers. I even have a copy of the DOI in a newspaper in St. Louis in 1821 on the front page which TJB could have used for the KEY but I know the KEY came from an 1878 US History Book. I have several volumes on different avenues of the Beale Treasure some of my own some of others and I even have ten copies of C1 deciphered by others. Yet there is still more to research that is to prove whether the Beale Treasure is fiction or fact.
    Last edited by franklin; Sep 18, 2016 at 10:58 AM.

  5. #20

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    It is in the paper-back, GOLD cover book by Innis... GOLD IN THE BLUE RIDGE, I think.
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  6. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by masterpoe View Post
    Can you show a link to this document you have referred to or is this just something you read in a novel somewhere?
    Poe, Poe, not everyone here post misleading information that alludes to Beale just to support a pet theory or a solution claim.
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  7. #22
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    .....the Friedman opinions can not be considered at all, the bases of their summations being arrived upon on the assumption that the proposed solution resides within the entire C1 code presented in the narration, as it is presented, and by assumption that all of this cipher was to be applied in the same fashion, but "today we know that neither of these assumptions are accurate." So the Friedman opinions carry no weight or value unless you are one of the few remaining who still believes the same.
    45th_Johnny likes this.
    "Treasure is wherever it can be found."

  8. #23
    ECS
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    If you say so.
    What about John Laflin's memoirs of Jean Lafitte?
    There's a Sherman and a Ward mentioned, but still no mention of Beale.

  9. #24
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    I believe the Friedman's opinions about the Beale Ciphers says a lot. Expert cryptologist's opinion ways in that the Beale Treasure is a hoax. I can prove it is by the author using an 1878 DOI to decipher the codes and while decoding them he miss counts after 480 but yet every letter he needs to decipher is right on, there is no way this could happen other than the author made the cipher codes himself. Think about it the author's mistakes clearly tells you it is a hoax.
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  10. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by franklin View Post
    I believe the Friedman's opinions about the Beale Ciphers says a lot. Expert cryptologist's opinion ways in that the Beale Treasure is a hoax. I can prove it is by the author using an 1878 DOI to decipher the codes and while decoding them he miss counts after 480 but yet every letter he needs to decipher is right on, there is no way this could happen other than the author made the cipher codes himself. Think about it the author's mistakes clearly tells you it is a hoax.
    All that really tells us is that C2 was contrived for the story presentation. Yes I agree that the C2 was a product of the story being narrated, have even pointed out many flaws in this regard to myself. But this doesn't conclude that the entire narration wasn't without alternate purpose.
    ECS, Rebel - KGC and 45th_Johnny like this.
    "Treasure is wherever it can be found."

  11. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by ECS View Post
    If you say so.
    What about John Laflin's memoirs of Jean Lafitte?
    There's a Sherman and a Ward mentioned, but still no mention of Beale.
    What about those memoirs? I don't don't believe I've even made reference to them lately, you being the only one who doing this?

    You know, it's funny, for years you've been touting that whole "family fiction thing and Risque's fabulous library" while all along I often suggested to you that perhaps that family thing wasn't exactly as you perceived it to be, all the while suggesting an Adams Onis Treaty connection. Now, many moons later, you have even presented evidence connecting Risque to that very same treaty. What you fail to realize in doing so is that you've actually strengthened my prior claims and weakened your own.

    You see I learned long ago that in these forums it is always better to let the doubters discover the information themselves, sort of puts them in something of an embarrassing quandary or paradox that they have to deal with. You have continued to deny my theory in support of your Risque claims, and then "Boom Baby!" You find evidence supporting my theory deep inside your own. There's more, by the way, if you're not too afraid to go looking for it. "let that ground shake, my friend, and it will set you free!"
    AARC and 45th_Johnny like this.
    "Treasure is wherever it can be found."

  12. #27
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    If Risqué received a payout from the Federal governments Adams-Onis "claims" slush fund for the "patriots" that aided Andrew Jackson in forcing the Spanish governments hand in giving the US Florida, it is still all in the family.
    The ground didn't shake for you until I mentioned that Major Risqué was in Florida with Jackson (remember your "Risqué was in Florida? post?), and the "fraudulent" claims of spoliation made against the Spanish government in Florida-until those posts, its been Adams-Onis repeated over and over without any connexion to the Beale story- then off you go.
    Last edited by ECS; Sep 18, 2016 at 04:42 PM. Reason: Trip down memory lane

  13. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by ECS View Post
    If Risqué received a payout from the Federal governments Adams-Onis "claims" slush fund for the "patriots" that aided Andrew Jackson in forcing the Spanish governments hand in giving the US Florida, it is still all in the family.
    The ground didn't shake for you until I mentioned that Major Risqué was in Florida with Jackson (remember your "Risqué was in Florida? post?), and the "fraudulent" claims of spoliation made against the Spanish government in Florida-until those posts, its been Adams-Onis repeated over and over without any connexion to the Beale story- then off you go.
    Really. I'm sire I can still find the post where I suggested to folks that they needed to find out more about Risque and his time spent with Jackson, when, were, etc. I'm positive that the referenced post is still in these recent threads somewhere. And so you followed that suggestion, and now look what you found. maybe you should see what other suggestions I have also made?
    45th_Johnny likes this.
    "Treasure is wherever it can be found."

  14. #29
    ECS
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    Remember that post I made about the 1815 Jackson banquet which James Beverly Risqué co-sponsored, and Pascal Buford was also in attendance?
    Want to take a guess at who conducted the prayer invocation?
    Was that Rev Charles Green Clay, the Clay mentioned as a frequent guest entertained at Morriss's in Ward's 1885 Beale Papers?
    I'll give you clue: It was not Henry Clay.

  15. #30
    ECS
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    Quote Originally Posted by franklin View Post
    We need facts of the Beale Papers actually happening? Does anyone have anything that is bonafide that actually substantiates that the Beale Party left Virginia in 1817? Is there any information or facts that they were seen or documented as being on the trail from St. Louis, MO. to Sante Fe, NM? Are there any proof of them being in Sante Fe, NM or returning to their homes in Virginia? Folks it is time to prove this story before we continue to hunt for a GHOST TREASURE. GHOST are hard to see and even harder to find if not impossible. So here it is what bonafide proof do you have let us have it?
    So far on these Beale threads no bonafide proof is offered.
    It is either someone claiming they solved the ciphers without proof, another creating alternative stories behind the Beale story based on a name, a word, a date, or on a whim, or those who knowingly post unrelated misinformation as a could have.
    WHY?
    Because there is no direct evidence outside of the Beale Papers that can prove that the job pamphlet is nothing more than a work of fiction sprung from the imagination of this "unknown author" who included vague references of actual events to make the dime novel seem believable, an inducement to burn the candle and play the cipher game.
    Rebel - KGC, Dr. Syn, AARC and 1 others like this.

 

 
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