Had every intention to detect (UPDATE 7/12/11) Final Chapter

[packerbacker]

Re: Had every intention to detect (got some names)

Glad you enjoyed the post. I've emailed the National Museum of Naval Aviation to offer this stuff to them but I haven't heard back from them as yet. When I find a final resting spot for this stuff I'll update this thread.

 

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[Alchemy]

Re: Had every intention to detect (got some names)

I really enjoyed this post.

Wow packer...how lucky for it to have found it's way to you too.

It's wonderful that it should end up with someone who has such a respect for this historical memorabilia.
You must have good karma!

It’s just awesome and thanks so much for sharing!

 

[ramjet2187]

Re: Had every intention to detect (got some names)

Good God. Rambo, my a$$. THAT man was a Hero. Heck, anybody who'd fly the way they did was a hero...............

I can't find the words.

Roger

 

[Cladius]

Re: Had every intention to detect (got some names)

Thank you for sharing a great peice of someones life and american history. I bet the man himself would never have told (most of his generation were too modest and felt they were just doing their job for the country). Please take time this holiday season and think of the brave men and women serving now.

 

[packerbacker]

Re: Had every intention to detect (got some names)

I just received word that my email to the Naval Museum has been forwarded to their Artifacts Collection Manager for consideration. I'll update when I hear more. I'm going to be kind of, out of commission, for the next couple weeks so I may be gone a while.

 

[packerbacker]

Re: Had every intention to detect (got some names)

Guess this will be the final update to this thread. I got an email from the Historian and Artifact Collections Manager of the National Museum of Naval Aviation in Pensacola, FL today. He said they would be "Honored" to receive this stuff as a donation and thanked me for thinking of their museum. I have to pass this credit on to Cheryl and some others on this forum for making me think of this stuff in terms of historical and not just some neat memorabilia.

 

[packerbacker]

Re: Had every intention to detect (got some names)

Ooops, another update. I've been contacted by a lady whos grandfather was Mother Tusch's brother. She was doing some geneology research on her family and was directed to this site because of this thread. She is pretty excited about seeing the stuff related to "Mother". Most of that stuff, except for some copies I'd like to keep, will be getting sent to her.

 

[deedeelou]

Re: Had every intention to detect (got some names)

This is an amazing story!!! I am so impressed with your integrity and the respect you have shown for this true American hero.

Looking through all these posts I was reminded of my dad, who was a Navy Corpsman for 19 yrs. I agree with the earlier post that most men coming back from the war did not talk about it much if at all. My dad told us things about his experiences just before he passed away in 1997 that he had never mentioned before.

I still have some Christmas ornaments, like the ones in the picture, that my parents got while stationed in France in 1958-60. (I was born in Nice.) I believe they are German blown glass ornaments - there is a cool display on the history of these ornaments in the Christmas Museum in Lancaster, PA. How they survived so many moves (not to mention 5 Navy brats) intact is beyond me.

Thank you so much for sharing.

Dena

 

[slingchine]

Re: Had every intention to detect (got some names)

May God bless you as you have already blessed the memory of this man and all of his fellow soldiers. God bless America!

 

[ScubaFinder]

Re: Had every intention to detect (got some names)

Dude, incredible find! I'm an aviation buff myself, and got all of my grandfathers stuff when he passed away, it is about 1/4 of what you have! My grandfather flew Libby's (B-24's) in the war, and I have sent copies of some of his stuff to the Commemorative Air Force headquarters in Midland, TX. They house and maintain the Air Heritage Museum there also, and short of the Air Force Museum at Wright Patterson AFB, it is one of the best around. You should definitely try to make up some packets or something with COPIES of everything, and get them to some of the museums. It's getting very rare to find in tact collections like you have there, congrats! And thanks a million for sharing, it means a lot to guys like me.

Jason

 

[peter-four-oh]

Re: Had every intention to detect (got some names)

I've recently been made aware of this thread through a friend...

I'll echo what's been said already... this is an outstanding find and should be preserved as is. Paperbacker, I know this is an old topic now, but I'll be going through the thread over the next day or so and try to offer whatever additional info I can...

But first, I'm a wingnut and am interested in vintage military aircraft, especially those of the USAAC/USAAF... so I'd like to comment on a few posts made by dg39...

In reply #3 in the thread, you posted a photo of an aircraft that is labeled as a DC-3. The ship in the photo is a C-39... a development of the DC-2. Actually, the type is really a hybrid of the DC-2 and DC-3, and was nicknamed the 'DC-2½'. More info HERE...

Anyhoo, that ship was assigned to the 10th Transport Group. The marking on the rear fuselage (partially obscured by a man) is an arrowhead emblem used by USAAC air depots... I believe this one is from Wright Field, although I'm not totally certain.

Here's a look at a C-39 with the Wright Field arrowhead...

NASM

And here's a look at a paratrooper jumping from another 10th TG C-39...

Epay auction image

packerbacker ]
This is just a flyer and cool looking plane
*******

A) that is a PT-19, or Stearman. It was a the basic trainer...

'Tis not a PT-19... the biplane many know as the 'Stearman' was the PT-17 and, earlier, the PT-13. These were primary trainers, not basic trainers. Both were pretty much the same design with different powerplants. Also, 'Stearman' is the manufacturer's name, not the name given to the PT-13/17... which was 'Kaydet'. However, the type has indeed become universally known as 'The Stearman' for whatever reason... possibly because it was the most produced and most well-known type produced by the company.

Also, since it's a Navy aircraft in paperbacker's photo, the designation would be 'N2S', as the Navy had a different designation system from that of the Army.

The PT-19 was a monoplane, produced by Fairchild and called 'Cornell'.


Lastly, you posted a photo showing a pair of B-29s... thought you might like to know that these Superforts were from the 73rd Bombardment Wing; the ship on the left was with the 498th Bombardment Group ('T' over the 'Square' on the tail) and the ship on the right was from the 497th BG. ('A' over the 'Square') The photo was taken sometime between October 1944 and April 1945. The 73rd BW was based on Saipan at this time, so that is the likely location.

Thanks for sharing these photos!

More later, I hope...


Fade to Black...

 

[gdrumm]

Re: Had every intention to detect (got some names)

I'm new to the forum, but I have to say this is one of the most amazing finds I have ever seen.

 

[crazyjarhead]

Re: Had every intention to detect (got some names)

Those are some rare relics and pictures

 

[packerbacker]

Re: Had every intention to detect (UPDATE 4/21/10)

I'm going to have to resurrect this thread again to add a couple more pics. Yesterday I received these two pics from the son of Harry Henders. Mr. Henders was one of the survivors of the crash but, sadly, has passed away at age 88 just a couple years back. We had talked to Harry in the past and, when we tried contacting him again, we heard the sad news. I scanned these photos and they didn't come out too sharp but you'll get the idea. "Henders" is on the deck of the sub and doesn't have much on for clothing. Most of it was ripped off during the crash and his son said that when Harry would show this pic to people, he would ask them if they wanted to see a naked picture of himself. Lt. Wallace is in the back of the life raft and, as stated by Mr. Henders, Wallace would not leave the raft until all of his men were safe on the boat. I have also been in touch with the granddaughter of Mr. Brumley who did not survive the attack and subsequent crash. The family did not have any military photos of him and she was able to get a crew pic of him from this great site. I keep thinking I'm making the final post to this thread but stuff keeps popping up. If this is indeed my final post to this, I find it more than fitting that it involves pics of the rescue 7-1/4 hours after the crash. There were 13 men in all. The 8 that perished are: Lt. Cdr. John Ellison Muldrow, Lt. (jg) John C. O'Connell, and six aircrewman: John J Denton AMM1c, James Arthur Brumley ARM2c, Daniel H. Webster AFC3c, Bill D. Martin AOM3c, Henry J. Struck S1c (AOM) and William P. Heaford S1c (AOM). The 5 that survived and were rescued are Lt. Maurice Radford Wallace, Ens Jerome Palma, Harrison "Harry" J Henders AMM3c, Robert L Livesay AMM3c and Elthus J Lassiter Jr ARM2c. I will still research first names and ranks and update this as appropriate. (I was able to get all names and ranks updated 4/29/2010) The main reason for doing this is a number of people have contacted me as a result of their internet searches and the more thorough the names are, the easier for them to find them. One of these pics was taken by one of the bombers supplying aircover for the men until the sub could pick them up. In that pic the raft is off the starboard bow of the sub (in the front but off to the right landlubber ) The other pic was taken from the conning tower of the sub by one of her crew. I can't believe we ended up with pics of the actual rescue to add to this thread. If I can get them scanned better on another machine I'll replace these pics.

 

[Cheryl]

Re: Had every intention to detect (UPDATE 4/21/10)

Wow! That is so cool! Appreciate you keeping us up to date on this.

 

[Real de Tayopa Tropical Tramp]

Re: Had every intention to detect (UPDATE 4/21/10)

good evening: Paper back's fault, he brought me back in and i covered it from post one again. I found P-40's post which I never saw or answered so I will do it now with apol.
_________________________________________________________________________________

P-40, You posted -->

Quote from: Real de Tayopa on May 10, 2006, 09:13:47 AM
packerbacker ]
This is just a flyer and cool looking plane


A) that is a PT-19, or Stearman. It was a the basic trainer...
'Tis not a PT-19... the biplane many know as the 'Stearman' was the PT-17 and, earlier, the PT-13. These were primary trainers, not basic trainers. Both were pretty much the same design with different powerplants. Also, 'Stearman' is the manufacturer's name, not the name given to the PT-13/17... which was 'Kaydet'. However, the type has indeed become universally known as 'The Stearman' for whatever reason... possibly because it was the most produced and most well-known type produced by the company.

Also, since it's a Navy aircraft in paperbacker's photo, the designation would be 'N2S', as the Navy had a different designation system from that of the Army.
**************************************************


You are quite correct of course, chalk it up to my infamous typos and not post editing. During the war I was a Naval horizontal bombardier, but after the war left college to accept USAF pilot / officer training.

We started out in the AT-6 from day one. The designation in WW-2 days was Advanced Trainer-6, in our case beginning.

As it turned out it was almost too much aircraft for an absolutely beginning flyer and too expensive.

You were just learning how to fly, and while landing you were worrying about air traffic, patterns, which tank to use, correct radio channel, flaps, pitch, mixture, wheels down and locked, and even shoulder harness as well as pleasing your instructor who was in the rear seat with both big feet on the cross bar, puffing contentedly on a cigar.

Sigh, those were the days. paper / P-40 you have brought back almost forgotten memories.

Don Jose de La Mancha

 

[packerbacker]

Re: Had every intention to detect (UPDATE 4/21/10)

ok..one more post. If this takes up too much room feel free to remove it. There is just so much interesting stuff and short stories it's hard to decide what to post that would be of interest to all. I did find out that Wallace was actually wounded twice at Pearl Harbor. He was hit in the arm by a machine gun bullet while he was firing his 45 at the Japanese Zeros flying just overhead and then, while he and another officer were directing machine gun fire, a bomb went off killing the other officer and impaling Wallace with a large piece of shrapnel from the bomb. (We have that schrapnel with his possessions) This is copied from a little booklet that Mr. Wallace had among these possessions. It had been given to Wallace as a gift.It is a letter that a RAF pilot wrote to his mother in case he was killed during the war and how he felt about serving his country. This is the type of man that won the war and our own people here in the good ol' USA should take a sober look at what he wrote. Glenn Beck would love this one. P.S. Don Jose, I'll fly with you anytime!
Letter to Mom

preface
This is a letter that was found and published during WWI

This letter was found among the personal belongings of a young R.A.F. pilot in a Bomber Squadron who was recently reported “Missing, believed killed.” It was addressed to his mother--- to be sent to her if he were killed.
“This letter was perhaps the most amazing one I have ever read; simple and direct in its wording but splendid and uplifting in its outlook,” says the young officer’s station commander. “It was inevitable that I should read it-- in fact he must have intended this, for it was left open in order that I might be certain that no prohibited information was disclosed.”
I sent the letter to the bereaved mother, and asked her whether I might publish it anonymously, as I feel its contents may bring comfort to other mothers, and that everyone in our country may feel proud to read of the sentiments which support ‘an average airman’ in the execution of his present arduous duties. I have received the mother’s permission, and I hope this letter may be read by the greatest possible number of our countrymen at home and abroad.



An Airman’s Letter To His Mother
Though I feel no premonition at all, events are moving rapidly, and I have instructed that this letter be forwarded to you should I fail to return from one of the raids which we shall shortly be called upon to undertake. You must hope on for a month, but at the end of that time you must accept the fact that I have handed my task over to the extremely capable hands of my comrades of the Royal Air Force, as so many splendid fellows have already done.
First, It will comfort you to know that my role in this war has been of the greatest importance. Our patrols far out over the North Sea have helped to keep the trade routes clear for our convoys and supply ships, and on one occasion our information was instrumental in saving the lives of the men in a crippled lighthouse relief ship. Though it will be difficult for you, you will disappoint me if you do not at least try to accept the facts dispassionately, for I shall have done my duty to the utmost of my ability. No man can do more, and no one calling himself a man could do less.
I have always admired your amazing courage in the face of continual setbacks; in the way you have given me as good an education and background as anyone in the country; and always kept up appearances without ever losing faith in the future. My death would not mean that your struggle has been in vain. Far from it. It means that your sacrifice is as great as mine. Those who serve England must expect nothing from her; we debase ourselves if we regard our country as merely a place in which to eat and sleep.
History resounds with illustrious names who have given all, yet their sacrifice has resulted in the British Empire, where there is a measure of peace, justice, and freedom for all, and where a higher standard of civilization has evolved, and is still evolving, more than anywhere else. But this is not only concerning our own land. Today we are faced with the greatest organized challenge to Christianity and civilization that the world has ever seen, and I count myself lucky and honored to be the right age and fully trained to throw my full weight into the scale. For this I have to thank you. Yet there is more work for you to do. The home front will still have to stand united for years after the war is won. For all that can be said against it, I still maintain that this war is a very good thing; every individual is having the chance to give and dare all for his principle like the martyrs of old. However long time may be, one thing can never be altered -- I shall have lived and died an Englishman. Nothing else matters one jot nor can anything ever change it.
You must not grieve for me, for if you really believe in religion and all that it entails that would be hypocrisy. I have no fear of death; only a queer elation… I would have it no other way. The universe is so vast and so ageless that the life of one man can only be justified by the measure of his sacrifice. We are sent to this world to acquire a personality and a character to take with us that can never be taken from us. Those who just eat and sleep, prosper and procreate, are no better than animals if all their lives they are at peace.
I firmly and absolutely believe that evil things are sent into the world to try us; they are sent deliberately by our Creator to test our metal because He knows what is good for us. The bible is full of cases where the easy way out has been discarded for moral principles.
I count myself fortunate in that I have seen the whole country and known men of every calling. But with the final test of war I consider my character fully developed. Thus at my early age my earthly mission is already fulfilled and I am prepared to die with just one regret, and one only – that I could not devote myself to making your declining years more happy by being with you; but you will live in peace and freedom and I shall have directly contributed to that, so here again my life will not have been in vain.


Written by
Frank O. Salisbury

 

[ivan salis]

Re: Had every intention to detect (UPDATE 4/21/10)

the sword or knife has a african or asian type look to it -- I would say based upon my world travels and interest in knives . --the creasent moon is often seen on many muslim items -- many parts of north africa had local muslim populations during WW2 and still do today * --it might have been either a gift from a local or a bought item to bring /send home

 

[Gypsy Heart]

Re: Had every intention to detect (UPDATE 4/21/10)

This is one of the best posts that I have ever read on Tnet! Just fantastic

 

[packerbacker]

Re: Had every intention to detect (UPDATE 4/21/10)

Gyps, that statement coming from you is an honor in itself, thank you very much.
I figured the knife Asian or Polynesian as he spent his time in the Pacific arena from Hawaii to the East.