Reality check?

[pyledriver]

I've been doing some researching lately since it's been too hot to get out and all my funds have gone into vehicle repairs. I started off with some of the published stories that always begin with a bank robbery, an escape, an indian induced introduction to the afterworld..and various bits and peices of evidence turning up in the past that mean the story MUST be true. As I began researching bank robberies I ran across this (which I hope isn't entirely accurate!):

http://www.unpopulartruth.com/2009/0...-old-west.html

So that got me to just rounding up the stories that start with bank robberies and trying to find out if indeed, any corresponding bank robbery had ocurred...guess what-NOPE. So far I've eliminated one story for sure with correspondence to state historical agencies. Unless for some reason there are gaps in records, I haven't been able to find a record of this robbery. I would think a bank robbery would be a high profile event vs. the normal shakedowns and stagecoach holdups that were common 'back in the day'.

Certainly I haven't completely closed the door on the two stories that started me on this venture, but I post all this as a reminder to those starting out cache hunting that you have to try to rule it OUT before you can even entertain the notion that those brimming saddlebags of gold coins might still be out there waiting for you and your metal detector to just happen along!

[Kentucky Kache]

Find all you can about the story and then weigh the positive against the negative. Which ever way the scales tip is what you can consider most likely. Is there more reason to believe the story than to not believe it? There are also time when human reasoning doesn't allow us to consider the possibilities, so sometimes if you dig a little deeper you're able find things that wasn't shinning on the surface. Then when you do have a lead worth following, I have found that patience, along with effort, is key.

[boogeyman]

Start with Newspaper archives. Not just for the city town where you're researching but other counties & states. You'll be amazed at finding nothing mentioned in the area you're searching but it's mentioned in a paper in another state. You'll probably find a pile of bits & pieces of other leads while you search the archives.

Tool kit should include a pile of dimes for copies & a family sized bottle of Excedrin (I always get a headache from watching the pages flip by on the film strip machines).

[Kentucky Kache]

Start with Newspaper archives. Not just for the city town where you're researching but other counties & states. You'll be amazed at finding nothing mentioned in the area you're searching but it's mentioned in a paper in another state. You'll probably find a pile of bits & pieces of other leads while you search the archives.

Tool kit should include a pile of dimes for copies & a family sized bottle of Excedrin (I always get a headache from watching the pages flip by on the film strip machines).

You can say that again. Some of my best research finds have been a county away from where my lead was. Strange, but the county of incident don't always have all the info.

BTW, those copies cost more than a dime now.

[boogeyman]

Start with Newspaper archives. Not just for the city town where you're researching but other counties & states. You'll be amazed at finding nothing mentioned in the area you're searching but it's mentioned in a paper in another state. You'll probably find a pile of bits & pieces of other leads while you search the archives.

Tool kit should include a pile of dimes for copies & a family sized bottle of Excedrin (I always get a headache from watching the pages flip by on the film strip machines).

You can say that again. Some of my best research finds have been a county away from where my lead was. Strange, but the county of incident don't always have all the info.

BTW, those copies cost more than a dime now.

That's the cup of coffee & danish = I'll burn you a copy price Librarians gotta eat too

Also, if you're Googling don't stop at the first few pages. Sometimes you hit a jackpot 20 or 30 pages in.

[GoldBack]

I have a point system I used to determine if a "lead" is most likely to pay off or most likely to waste my time.
categories:
-time lines: rational placement of events
-dates: all events in the lead is shown in a rational span of time
-social structure: all events are in accordance with dates and relative economical conditions (can also be with people involved)
-message to the people: how the lead leaked out to the people
-history: what does the history surrounding that event say about it (macro & micro aspects)
-the hid: when hidden was it rational and/or plausible to do under the conditions specified

I put more weight on the "message to the people" and "the hid"; yes this doesn't give you a 100% fail-proof way to find anything, but what does?

[maipenrai]

Who says reality has anything to do with treasure hunting? Now you woke me up from my dream, now what do I do, spend my time at the flea market?? I was just going out to look for some of the Jessie James loot, and you had to bring up the word "Reality".

Anyway, except the Reality part, that was an interesting story!

[pyledriver]

Hey not meaning to bring anybody down! Lol! After more work it does appear that the local records might not be where verification comes from! A buddy explained it from the flipside-basically that a robbery might not be well publicized due to the bad rep it would give the bank. Plus the idea that the bank might've closed down afterwards. All these things enter the scenario including the notion that bank robberies were somewhat rare. However, with further research, the story I had ruled out might end up coming back to life....some library time and poring over dozens of old newspapers will be in store for me in the next couple weeks!

So I think reality isn't always what it seems. I'm actually not as ready to accept the theory put forth in the link I posted after all! I would like to see more discussion on this though because it's been said so many times that many stories just aren't true. Turns out a 'cursory' search in the obvious places isn't enough to rule one out or in! All part of learning I guess!

[boogeyman]

Dead on!!!

Don't ever get discouraged.

[maipenrai]

Well, now that Reality doesnt always have to Reality, I feel much better, and can get back to dreaming!
Thanks for the much needed update!

[Tuberale]

It's been my experience that bank (or other) robberies before 1890 are mostly suspect in my area. But between 1890 and 1910, they are often possible or even probable. And from 1910 thru 1935 bank robberies were so common newspapers often didn't run stories locally or wouldn't tell how much was taken, just because they were so common and the papers/FBI were trying to discourage that frequent reality. Most robberies in the latter period were never caught or brought to justice.

A local bank was robbed in 1923, and the robberies made their getaway down a local street in a motor car. Their story was atypical, in that the police caught them for "speeding", but not until after they had hidden nearly $130 in mostly silver coins. Since the particular street the police were careening down at 30mph was straight and had good visibility, few places that could not bee seen at the time. One particular block was highly suspected for the hidden funds. No metal detectors available then. I'll admit to having been by that block a few times. Even today, there is a large unbuilt lot with a large billboard there. Never could figure out why a home was never put on the site, since the local street is now considered a major arterial.

[boogeyman]

It's been my experience that bank (or other) robberies before 1890 are mostly suspect in my area. But between 1890 and 1910, they are often possible or even probable. And from 1910 thru 1935 bank robberies were so common newspapers often didn't run stories locally or wouldn't tell how much was taken, just because they were so common and the papers/FBI were trying to discourage that frequent reality. Most robberies in the latter period were never caught or brought to justice.

A local bank was robbed in 1923, and the robberies made their getaway down a local street in a motor car. Their story was atypical, in that the police caught them for "speeding", but not until after they had hidden nearly $130 in mostly silver coins. Since the particular street the police were careening down at 30mph was straight and had good visibility, few places that could not bee seen at the time. One particular block was highly suspected for the hidden funds. No metal detectors available then. I'll admit to having been by that block a few times. Even today, there is a large unbuilt lot with a large billboard there. Never could figure out why a home was never put on the site, since the local street is now considered a major arterial.

I can see it now..

Local paper reports local man arrested for digging up billboard. The man a local THer had a metal detector & shovel in his possession when arrested. The man claimed he was looking for a post hole cache.

[NOLA_Ken]

I tend to agree with the article for the most part, robberies in a town where almost everyone was armed would be a very risky proposition. Not to say they didn't happen, but most likely not as often as the popular belief. But keep in mind, outlaws DID rob payroll shipments, mule trains, stagecoaches, and the railroad, among many other things. There were a lot of robberies in that time, and there are lots of lesser known outlaws in history.

That being said though, I tend to think the outlaws likely spent most of their ill gotten gains rather quickly, living the high life on cards, drink, and women. Just because the loot was "never recovered" doesn't mean it's still buried along the trail. Most of these guys had pretty short careers and died young, and I'm sure many knew the odds were against them in the long run, so it seems reasonable to expect them to live it up rather than hide money for the future. Plus, having done a robbery, if they were known to people in the area, it's not like they could just sneak back in and dig up the loot without the risk of being seen.

[rwd mo]

pyledriver I believe u hit the nail on the head about information of a site. Generally u have to dig dig dig into a story to find if it is true or not, To me this is the most disgusting time spent to see if a site is true or not.Very time consuming but must be done. I dug into a cache site for 2 years only to find out when I got to it that I was too late so no 86,000$ just an empty hole and disgust. But I learned what heart break was. Happened twice to me in 40 yr of cache hunting.

[pyledriver]

Bummer! However, I think that is the highest potential we face as cache hunters..all those that searched before us had everything we do except a detector. Those guys were just as dedicated and just thaaat much closer to this stuff timeframe-wise. However, I do also firmly believe that not everything has been found, and there are probably so many undocumented caches that we'll just never have a clue we've walked past while looking for 'the one'! It gets tiring in the field, tiring in the library, but I can't help myself! I'm a glutton for punishment..at least if there's a potential payoff in the end!

Made up stories, empty holes and wasted time aside, you sure learn some FASCINATING history along the way!

[cw0909]

from an internet search,its how you search the story headline too,like X bank was robbed,
robbery, or X co. payroll robbed/robbery and sometimes omit a word or 2
i was looking for more info,on a robbery in dayton,oh.was starting to think it didnt happen
then looked for the co. name,and what you do know 6-8pg into google the robbery shows up.
thought i was close,then the woman that owned the land passed away,i havent tried to talk to
the new owners,they have had the place about 3yr, maybe the next time im over that way,who
knows they could be receptive to the idea

[Tuberale]

Remember cw0909: you don't have to tell the landowners what you are looking for. Just ask for permission to use a detector on their property.

[Frankn]

Everybody has their pet method, here's mine . I find an interesting store, preferably not a "top Ten" story but one with a good size cache. I try to verify that it happened. The best way I have found is a newspaper search. The big papers carried stories from all over the country. Now for the most important thing LOCATION of the cache. I weed thru all the newspaper stories and versions that might be repeated in books and magazines. My next step is to get aerial maps and topos of the suspected location. Does the terrain match? Is the area developed? Now for the guesswork, did the cache planter return? The final step is can I get permission. The last part is the part I love, boots on ground! You only have to find one big cache in your lifetime. I have found my share of empty holes and posthole size caches. Now I am looking for the big one. Frank

[Tuberale]

Don't you find the work on the big one a little more satisfying? I do.

[boogeyman]

Suppose the whole thing boils down to. If you hate ( I think the word disgusting was used) spending time in libraries historical societies etc. doing research & methodically putting all the stories & bits & pieces together, you're not going to do well. The people who excel at pretty much everything do well because they enjoy the end result of their work, and the rewards are perpotional whether it be learning history of making a recovery. Gone are the days of driving out to the roadside ghost town, hopping out of your car, walking ten feet and detecting pocketsful of coins while the wife & kids drag back so many good relics you need to tie some on the roof. We have to research better and work harder to find the little pieces of the puzzle, even if we only end up with a history lesson that's worthwhile.
And yes, I know some of you are saying to heck with that! Tie the mother in law on the roof so you got room for the relics.