The Offer

[Papa Bear]

I don't sell myself at all. I cache hunt, and I do so becaue I love doing it.

Empty your PM inbox I tried to PM you. PB

 

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[Kentucky Kache]

Empty your PM inbox I tried to PM you. PB

Done.

 

[ppratt]

ppratt, We were both working on it when we decided to join forces and put another few months into the research. He hit it from the names of the people involved and I hit it from the clues to the site location. We went up there for some boots on ground work and came up empty so we consulted a professional land locator for a 10% cut and he came up with the site complete with platts and deeds up to the present land owner. To me that is an equal 3 way split for my partner, the land owner and me. Personally I take these posts as suggestions. They are like the good, the bad, and the ugly. I take some of the inexperienced ones with a grain of salt and give serious consideration to the answers from the more experienced cache hunters. ppratt, what was the split on your last cache find ?

gunrunner61: I guess you could best describe it as 2 mules hitched up back to back. If we get a better offer or change ours, you guys will be the first to know. I don't mind doing research and never finding it, but doing research and the land owner wanting View attachment 633455 twice as much as I get will never happen.

Well most often I dont do splits (but it's talked about before hand). I figure my time my machine. If they want half then they can go learn this hobby on there own. If I really want to hunt it,then we talk split. The last cache hunt I was on was a 50/50 and it was OK with me. Onetime I had one owner look at a IH penny i just found and he put it in his pocket to keep I asked to see one last time before he took it. As soon as he put it in my hand I threw it in the woods and told him there was no talk about a split, and I walked away.

Do you think it's fair to the landowner to bring people in on a split without his permission. Your taking money out of his pocket without him knowing. what if it was just you and him would it have been a 50/50? What if you had a third person on your side would have been a 25/25/25/25?

 

[Frankn]

ppratt, If it was just him and me, 50/50 would be right. My partner and I spent months just trying to locate the site, so it wasn't him comming in later. I usually work alone. I would never work with a groupe on cache hunting. The land owner has nothing to say about my research or associates. The only thing he has to agree on is permission to hunt and the split.

 

[ppratt]

ppratt, If it was just him and me, 50/50 would be right. My partner and I spent months just trying to locate the site, so it wasn't him comming in later. I usually work alone. I would never work with a groupe on cache hunting. The land owner has nothing to say about my research or associates. The only thing he has to agree on is permission to hunt and the split.

I just feel the owners cut should never drop below 50%.

 

[Frankn]

WHY, The hunter does all the work, investes all the time, pays all the expenses and may come up the looser. The land owner risks nothing! Don't you value your time?

 

[ppratt]

I do value my time and effort thats why I said I don't do splits, but I talk to the land owner first before I continue wasting my time and money. He's the owner, he already owns it. He's giving you half. You have to work share.

Cant we just agree to disagree? You have page after page telling you that you are wrong and it seems like your not getting it. I'm done with this thread.

 

[Frankn]

ppratt, he is giving me nothing. He has nothing to give until I recover it. As I said before, every entry on here is a personal opinion and probably right for the person expressing it.

 

[Silver Searcher]

50/50 split sounds fair, that's how it's done hear no matter how much you have invested in time or effort, what the land owner has never had, he won't miss, so I would say he will hang out for the 50/50 split.

SS

 

[poorhunter78]

Hey KK, Did I ever splain that method I use of skinning a catfish? I do now have pictures for a tutorial.. We talked last summer about it, Don't remember if I ever filled you in on my way!! I have been so busy with work lately, I ain't sure which way I am going..

Has anyone seen a turtle wondering around with a note tied to his tail?

 

[John Silvered]

REad the first 5 pages...skipped to the end and see that nothing has been resolved.

I can only answer from the land owner's perspective. You told me there is treasure on my land.
I do some online research on biggest bang for the buck metal detector...and have a new hobby to enjoy
with my son.

If I never find the treasure...it's ok. Guaranteed there is a bunch on interesting "stuff" on a 9 acre plot of
undisturbed land.

I don't think I'd offer you 50/50. If you offered me $25,000 to have the rights to search my property for a specific duration...
I'd go for that. A bird in hand.

 

[John Silvered]

You see the owner is 5 billion times more powerful than you. That is what you are having a difficult time comprehending.
He pays taxes on the land. He holds all the cards.

If you are a big shot that is 100% certain of everything...pony up cash. Just like gold prospectors. They pay to dig holes. The owner always wants
cash. % of finds is BS as you can be a chump and now you have torn up his land and he has nothing to show for it.

A 50/50 split is waaaaaaay more fair than an intelligent land owner would offer. Who pays to re-sod the land after you are through? By getting 25k up front...
I figure out how much $$$ is needed to get the land back into original condition. If 25k doesn't cover that? I want a lot more.

 

[maipenrai]

How did we get from recovering a cache, to re-soding the land? Does anyone really think Frankn is going in there with a D-8 Cat and dig up the whole property? He has a good idea where it might be located, and Im quite sure he has the right tector to find it with. We may not all agree on his idea of what the right percentage should be, but at least give him credit for being able to recover the cache, if its there.

 

[Frankn]

Dead John, It is not undisturbed land. It was farmed for years and the back several acres are kind of damp. If the land owner does take up the hobby, maybe he will see how much work is involved on the other side of the deal.
On most of my cache hunts, I only dig one hole, and it is always filled. If that is how you cache hunt I would hate to have you on my farm. Looks like you are in the 10% that is giving us a bad name.
I have never gone over 50% on a split. You don't seam to realize it cost hundreds, sometimes thousands to acquire the information to locate a possible cache location and only about 1 in 10 can be found for various reasons. You show a real lack of experience in cache hunting, maybe none at all! What you don't realize is when you make the offer, some just say yes, some say no, and others see it as a game of whits and play it out.
You appear to be a bit wet behind the ears. Give it some time . You will learn.

 

[John Silvered]

Dead John, It is not undisturbed land. It was farmed for years and the back several acres are kind of damp. If the land owner does take up the hobby, maybe he will see how much work is involved on the other side of the deal.
On most of my cache hunts, I only dig one hole, and it is always filled. If that is how you cache hunt I would hate to have you on my farm. Looks like you are in the 10% that is giving us a bad name.
I have never gone over 50% on a split. You don't seam to realize it cost hundreds, sometimes thousands to acquire the information to locate a possible cache location and only about 1 in 10 can be found for various reasons. You show a real lack of experience in cache hunting, maybe none at all! What you don't realize is when you make the offer, some just say yes, some say no, and others see it as a game of whits and play it out.
You appear to be a bit wet behind the ears. Give it some time . You will learn. View attachment 634267

I have no cache hunting experience at all. That's why when I first posted I said that I can only speak as a land owner. What I would require of you is what I described. Do you expect any of us to say we KNOW what anyone will actually do? That's silly.
He could build a rocket ship, fly to Mars and have sex with a rock. Or he could spontaneously explode. We can only say what we would imagine he would say. You are defensive for someone who wanted to hear other's thoughts on a matter. If you did not wish to hear anyone's thoughts...there was probably a better way to accomplish that than posting all about it on a messageboard. But worse ways too. You did not for example buy digital billboard advertising space in the New York Times Square saying "Give your opinions on this endeavor of mine...but not really."

Your exact quote is: "The question for this post is do you think he will accept the 1/3 cut?"

Have people not being trying to give you what you asked for?

 

[spartacus53]

All this time, thought and money, just t dig one hole What if your expert calculations are off by a few yards, I guess the cache will sit until the next guy happens along

The clock is ticking and the thread count is up but you're still no where nearer to digging than you were when you first posted this.

Funny part is that even if and when you do get the chance to hunt, you may just find a huge rusted tractor sized crate, when opened, a little note will say "Kilroy, was here"

 

[Frankn]

John, I can really see a 50% split if it was the land owner and me, but in this case I really believe my partner deserves the same as the land owner and so do I. What gets me is some reply and when I point out the holes in their theory, they get defensive.
Spart, When I am looking for a cache that is big, I use my 2 Box. It doesn't pick up the small junk so I don't have to dig a lot of holes. As far as the exact location, I will just go by the story details which gives a marker and describes the terain. This with my 2 Box should nail it. Kilroy was here, that was WWII this cache is older than that.

 

[khpony]

Frankn, this has been interesting to say the least but most still don't understand the amount of work that it takes to get to the "offer". Most probably still believe that you go to a book (or search the internet), read a story, look at a few maps, and then go find the treasure. I believe most credible opportunities come from word of mouth stories handed down. These prospects if properly and painstakenly searched generally prove more productive by far than those everyone in the country has written about. When researching stories it sometimes takes hundreds of hours, if not more, and in many cases several years to get to the offer. By the time we get to the offer we're 99% sure that it was there to begin with and still there! Still there being the operative term. Most of the time after many, many hours of research we find the story is in fact a story or odds are someone found it and kept their mouth shut. This results in an enormus amout of time and effort down the tubes. In my case as in yours it's a job. We expend those hours, with no income from it, then we hope at some point to retrieve something worth the cost and time spent. Also it's not just reading things on the net. We've been researching a story (handad down by a grandaughter) and after several months (off and on) of reaserch we needed to go to the county for records research. It started at the historical society, then to the county register of deeds, and then to the country to see the farm which had disappeared more than 40 years ago. After researching the site we were undecided on where the farm originally set on the section. We came back home, explored the township maps we got at the historical society, then reviewed the property on google earth. We finally was able to determine where the farmhouse originally stood. We probably spent $100 in gas and meals that day just to get to that point. Oh and we were able to get the current property owner info at the courthouse. Now we're finally ready to contact the owner and make the offer. This is on a small cache. Generally when working on a much larger cache it takes an enormus amount of time and resources. Point being, we spend resources (money) out of our own pocket and at some point actually need to make a recovery. In our case it's a form of income and those that believe their time is free just don't really grasp what and how we do what we do. But like you said earlier everyone has their own opinion and we respect that. For me and my partner we are equal and a 1/3 each split with the owner is fair.

 

[Kentucky Kache]

Frankn, this has been interesting to say the least but most still don't understand the amount of work that it takes to get to the "offer". Most probably still believe that you go to a book (or search the internet), read a story, look at a few maps, and then go find the treasure. I believe most credible opportunities come from word of mouth stories handed down. These prospects if properly and painstakenly searched generally prove more productive by far than those everyone in the country has written about. When researching stories it sometimes takes hundreds of hours, if not more, and in many cases several years to get to the offer. By the time we get to the offer we're 99% sure that it was there to begin with and still there! Still there being the operative term. Most of the time after many, many hours of research we find the story is in fact a story or odds are someone found it and kept their mouth shut. This results in an enormus amout of time and effort down the tubes. In my case as in yours it's a job. We expend those hours, with no income from it, then we hope at some point to retrieve something worth the cost and time spent. Also it's not just reading things on the net. We've been researching a story (handad down by a grandaughter) and after several months (off and on) of reaserch we needed to go to the county for records research. It started at the historical society, then to the county register of deeds, and then to the country to see the farm which had disappeared more than 40 years ago. After researching the site we were undecided on where the farm originally set on the section. We came back home, explored the township maps we got at the historical society, then reviewed the property on google earth. We finally was able to determine where the farmhouse originally stood. We probably spent $100 in gas and meals that day just to get to that point. Oh and we were able to get the current property owner info at the courthouse. Now we're finally ready to contact the owner and make the offer. This is on a small cache. Generally when working on a much larger cache it takes an enormus amount of time and resources. Point being, we spend resources (money) out of our own pocket and at some point actually need to make a recovery. In our case it's a form of income and those that believe their time is free just don't really grasp what and how we do what we do. But like you said earlier everyone has their own opinion and we respect that. For me and my partner we are equal and a 1/3 each split with the owner is fair.

Why is it that those who don't agree with you are those who don't understand or realise what all is involved in researching and finding a cache? I can tell you, you've never been more wrong.
What you say makes no sense. If you spend the amount of time, effort and money as you talked about, why wouldn't you want to get SOMETHING out of it? Would you really go through all that just to walk away empty handed, when you could possibly have at least part of what you wanted. No, it seems to me that those who say what YOU say are the ones who don't understand. You would really walk away? After all that time and expense? I don't think so, not if you actually believe the treasure is there.

 

[Frankn]

Kentucky, you quoted khpony, but your reply sounds like it was directed to me. You don't seem to get it. The fairness of the split in relationship to the effort and cost involved are far more importion to me than the money. Yes more important to me than the money! I have a strong sence of ethics ground into me from my upbringing. It's kind of like the old saying "Death before dishonor". It's like that post way back that suggested dumping my partner an just spliting with the land owner. I could not do that, even for millions. Sounds against the norm, but that's the way I live.