Insight needed regarding Water Moccasins and such

[ericwt]

I am in need of ideas. I have a few target areas that need further investigation.

Here is the catch- it is about 8 feet underwater on a slow moving river. When I was surveying the area with the land owner I noticed there were several Water Moccasins or Cotton Mouths swiming around the area all up and down the river where I need to dive.

The six or so areas that I need to look at will take several days each to look at so there will be a few hours of witch I will be diving in the river each day. If we actually find something, recovery will take even longer.

I understand the snakes try to avoid people but I dont like to assume anything.

Any advise in either how to scare them away or at least protect myself with clothing or pading?

Thanks for any ideas.

[Lowbatts]

Cottonmouth bad. One of the few snakes that actually get aggressive in their territory. Had one come up over the side of the canoe once. Result: They can have my paddle when they pry it from my cold dead fingers!

Just get a long pronged fork and skew 'em when you see 'em!

[cpt_peewee]

It's a lot better to throw bullets at a cotton mouth than than trying to correct thier course with a fishing pole or rocks. That just gets them ticked off and then it seems they will do anything they can to get close enough for a bite. That's when you find out that they are a lot quicker than they look. They are naturally territorial and aggressive. When stirred up a lot of times they let out a foul odor from thier scent glands that will warn you they're around. (But don't count on it!)
Remember "Lonsome Dove"? The water is their element and we're the trespassers. Personally, I would rather rather swim with a herd of moderate sized gators than one tiny moccasin. And if I know either are around, I ain't swimming.
HH
PW

[ericwt]

Thanks for the information. However I will be about 10 to 15 feet under the water,so I do not think a gun will do any good. In addition these snakes swim faster than I ever imagined. There must be some protective clothing that I can ware,that will protect me.

I can't just give up. The risk is high but the payoff is huge.

[Bowman]

Better off with a dry suit and dive in the winter. Cold=No snakes

[ericwt]

Thanks for the Sage advise Bowman. I don't know why that never crossed my mind. Simple and safe. I will wait till December.

I owe you one Bowman.

[FISHEYE]

One night me an a friend decided to set out a trout line on my parents lake to try an get some large catfish,we had 30 triple barb hooks on it,spaced 5 foot apart,we baited it with cooked turkey meat and strung it across a narrow channel,later that night we went to check on the line an saw that there was 14 water moccasins hooked,plus more swimming around us,we were in a canoe,some were bumping into it,we wacked a few with the paddles an got out of there,the next day we pulled in our line every hook had a snake on it,one was 12 foot long,to this day we havent seen another snake in this lake,day or night,set some lines the night before you dive see what you catch.before we caught all the snakes,there was a guy that used to swim across the lake at night for excercise,he saw all the snakes we caught,never saw him swim at night after that.

[Gold Digger]

one was 12 foot long

LMAO.... If it was 12 feet long, then it wasn't a water mocassin, it wasn't even native to the US... Water Mocassin's (Cottonmouth's) only get an average of 24" long.... The largest snake native to the US is the Indogo snake... And with you being from FL. you may have very well seen an Indigo, since they are found from FL, to GA.... now endangered...

[cptbil]

:shock: Two foot long....
:shock: Really!
They only grow that size there in Texas!
I have a photo, around somewhere, of one that I killed on Cedar Key, Fla.
He was 7 feet long!
There were a lot of them on the key!
I ran into atleast four more!
And only one was that small!
They are the only snake that can and do bite underwater!
And! As mentioned, they are very aggressive!
I have had two of them try to climb in and share my kayak!
:shock: One lost his head!
A really lucky swipe with a machete!
:? The other got beat with a paddle!
I stay clear of them varmints!

[Highmountain]

If you're diving in the south the winter isn't going to help. I was with a friend deer hunting in Hog Bayou (near Tivoli) on the Texas coast in the early '70s when a Moc climbed into the flat bottomed boat with us (December). I was in the front and my partner was driving... blew a hole in the bottom of the boat shooting at the snake, which slithered off the side opposite the one it came over to get in.

Mocs weren't the only snakes that were active that time of year, which was above freezing, but still cold enough to satisfy most usual purposes. The rattlers were out, too.

I don't think there's any kind of protective clothing to help you. I'd say, if you're determined to dive there, just cross your fingers and keep a snakebite kit handy. T-hunting's a risky business.
Jack

[BRD]

When I was a teenager (many years ago), my dad and I ran a dairy farm in Montgomery, Texas. My brother-in-law set out a trot line in a stagnant water stock pond that was on the farm. He ran the line the next morning and had caught three huge water moccasins. If I remember correctly, they were still alive. I had my picture taken holding these snakes at arms length next to my younger brother who was about nine years old at the time and about four feet tall. It was all I could do to maintain that position while the picture was taken. I was probably about seventeen at the time and fairly strong from doing farm work, playing high school football, baseball, etc. Those three snakes were the same length as my brother and probably weighed eleven or twelve pounds each! Not trying to discourage you but they are mean, ugly snakes. Do be careful. Wishing you the best of luck in your diving.
BRD

[Highmountain]

one was 12 foot long

LMAO.... If it was 12 feet long, then it wasn't a water mocassin, it wasn't even native to the US... Water Mocassin's (Cottonmouth's) only get an average of 24" long.... The largest snake native to the US is the Indogo snake... And with you being from FL. you may have very well seen an Indigo, since they are found from FL, to GA.... now endangered... :(

Anyone who's ever stepped on a rattler or discovered he just put his foot into a bush with a moc knows they get 12 feet long and can get right up next to your face to look you in the eye without moving a fraction of an inch.

Best to you,
Jack

[Slingshot]

One place I pan at here in Georgia has Mocs. I respect these reptiles, especially when they are of the poisonous persuasion. I try to avoid killing anything, and used to run them off with a long stick, but they always swam back again in a few minutes. I just shoot them as soon as I see them now - 1860 Colt + 20 grains FFF black powder + wad with plumbers solder cut into small sections + a wad on top = Blue Whistler Load & no more Moc.

[Highmountain]

I used to fool around kicking up dust at the site of the old WWII AFB outside Monahans, Texas. They broke up thousands of bombers and fighters there after WWII and had a radar site until the late 40s. Lots of pieces of old airplanes lying around instruments and whatnot, each mostly making its home under a rattler. I found one manhole cover for the 8' deep holes every hundred yards along a conduit for power to the radar site wasn't back on right, made a crescent about a foot wide. Naturally I pulled it off the rest of the way. That hole had caught every rabbit looking for a place to run, and every coyote chasing it for 40 years. There was a 3-4 foot thick layer of coyotes and rabbits in various stages of decomposition with a layer of rattlers on top and slithering around in the bones below.

I finally started wearing a fairly handy set of snake leggings I'd gotten somewhere, canvas over something harder underneath. I usually don't worry much about snakes, and while they looked spiffy those gators rubbed my legs raw at the top. But that old base had enough of them to make me feel it was worth putting them on, impressing the women if I ever ran into any, which I didn't. Women, or anyone else.

[coinshooter]

Man, there are definitely some reasons I am glad I live on the West Coast. Snakes give me the creeps!! Rattlers are bad enough! My wife and 5 yr old daughter were hiking up a mountain trail about two months ago. It was still somewhat cold for CA, but the sun was shining and the day was quite nice. We were coming down the mountain when I heard a buzzing sound like a bumble bee. I looked to my left and about 4 ft away was a dark brown rattler about 3 ft long coiled and waiting to strike. My wife doesn't hear so well, so she was still coming towards me. I pushed her back and she didn't know why. When I pointed out the snake she stopped quickly. At least these snakes don't chase you! He just slithered off into the bushes, but we warned everyone still coming up just to be safe.

[Highmountain]

At least these snakes don't chase you! He just slithered off into the bushes, but we warned everyone still coming up just to be safe.

It ain't that bad, really. Most snakes are just minding their own business, trying to make a living the same as everyone else. Copperheads mostly won't move out of your way and will strike if you get close enough for them to think you're a threat. Rattlers will strike if they're cornered. Mocs are a bit more aggressive. But I've been around all three an awfully lot for 60 years and have never been bitten, despite some close calls, though I've been around several compadres when they were bitten. Usually they were doing something stupid.

I used to go nosing around with a guy who was in to bottle hunting on old dump sites that had been cut away on the banks of watercourses ... gave me the fantods to watch him reach into holes to feel around for bottles inside. He'd been bitten 22 times; I was with him on the 23rd when he said, "Uh oh!" and brought a rattler out of a hole with a fang through his fingernail hanging there flopping and trying to get a wrap around his wrist.

We pulled the fang with a pair of needlenose pliers and he didn't get too excited about it. Didn't even go to the doctor. His signal finger swelled up to about the size of a banana over the next few days, and his hand swelled to the wrist, his armpit was evidently pretty touchy for a while, but it didn't last too long.

But most times snakes just don't want to be bothered by all the complications that come out of biting a human. I was chousing calves once when I was a youngster, horse ran spang up on a coiled rattler under a clump of beargrass, jumped sidewise sort of sudden and left me hanging in the air for a moment, coming down with my face about a foot from one who looked me over pretty carefully and wagged his tail a year or so before he slithered off.

My granddad told me after this incident that if you're so close to them you can't back off, if you hold your breath and stand real still they won't strike you if they haven't already. Said the same was true of bees. I've never been stung by a bee, either, though I've stumbled up on a wild hive a time or two and gotten them fairly excited.

(I even used that breath-holding-sit-really-still-think-about-something-else method successfully once when a daytime sick skunk I felt pretty sure was rabid staggered out from some bushes and paused to look over my leg, which wasn't more than 18 inches from him. I was catching my breath, sitting with my back to a tree with my legs spread out, still with my backpack on. The skunk appraised my situation for a while and wandered off into the trees in the direction he was originally headed.)

You leave them alone and they'll usually leave you alone.

[cyntexas]

only good snake is a dead one lol i hate the things

[Highmountain]

I've heard New Mexicans, Looooisianans, Arkansawers, Coloradoans, Oklahomans and even a Wyomian or two say roughly the same thing about Texans, cyntex. All a matter of perspective, I reckin.

We can be grateful snakes don't have a mutual feeling toward humans. Surely would complicate going into the woods for a hike, but sleeping there would lose a lot of the appeal for most people..

J

[MDnoob]

Snakes really hate 12-guage squirrel shot.

[Highmountain]

Snakes really hate 12-guage squirrel shot.

Probably explains why squirrels use it, mebeso?

Snakes being so easy to kill probably explains why the 12 ga a definite man's weapon for snake killing and 3/4 oz. squirrel shot the appropriate load.

A woman usually uses a stick or the heel of her shoe. Never heard of a woman killing a squirrel with a stick or the heel of her shoe, but it might have happened.

I did read once where a squirrel went on the rampage in Austin, Texas and attacked several people and a dog, then a cop. Cop dispensed it with his pistol... .38 in those days. Likely as not he'd have used a 12 ga. with squirrel shot if he'd had one handy. Those rampaging squirrels can be tough.

I don't recall what the largest thing I ever killed with a 12 ga. was. Probably a big dog that was trying to tear his way through my pen to get to my chickens. It's hard to know how big he was, but I elected to drag him off instead of trying to toss him into the back of the truck. I can't recollect him ever getting around to hating the 12 ga. though. Might have been I wasn't using the right shot.

But the smallest thing I ever knew of anyone killing a rattler with was my granddad's thumb and forefinger. He liked to show off by reaching in and grabbing them by the tail, swinging them around a time or two, and pop them like a whip. I don't know whether they hated it or not.