1834 Capped Bust Half Dollar, small date, small lettering

[Tuberale]

At least that's what I think it is.

Just read through Steelheadwill's thread about his 1834 half dollars,
http://forum.treasurenet.com/index.php/topic,437665.0/topicseen.html
and now not so sure about mine.

Let me apologize for the photo quality: taken after dark, so using overhead flourescent lighting, which distorts the actual coin surface and turns silver into gold. I'll try to post better photos tomorrow.

 

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[Don in SJ]

http://rob.com/russ/collection/2738.html compare your coin with this one, too hard for me to say from your photos, but a quick look seems close enough to warrant closer examination. The example is a O-119 variety.

I think the key on helping to ID the Bust series coins is having a head on shot of the coin(directly above), since attribution is basically done by the alignment of the E PLURIBUS UNUM position in relation to the letters above, so angle shots can skew viewing that alignment.

Don

 

[The Silver Pirate]

That is beautiful!

 

[Tuberale]

At least similar to O-119 (thanks for the attribution, Don!). But not sure of complete match. The E seems too far left. Rest of motto similarly seems to be too far left as well. Hope I'm wrong, though. Also, in the Bust Capped Half Dollar series, isn't the motto typically weakly struck in PLUR? This seems to be a full strike there.

Adding 2 more photos today, first in full shade (yellowish tint), the other in full light.

 

[Don in SJ]

The more I read on the internet about Bust Half Dollars the more I am becoming convinced, that without the knowledge from the books and those who do collect them, that it is not easy to get a true attribution on many of the Bust Half Dollars, seems like counterfeiting was rather big for this coinage and without reference books/material, coins like yours that are close to known varieties but not right, perhaps are counterfeit and should be looked into further.

The best I can suggest is check out this link and perhaps use the Contact us....

http://cccbhcc.com/index.html

Don

 

[Tuberale]

Thanks for the site, Don. I see where there are 12 different varieties of counterfeit 1834 Draped Bust Half Dollars. Apparently the large date large letter half is the most common (and commonly counterfeited); followed by the large date, small letter; then the small date, large letter. None I could find refers to the small date, small lettering.

 

[CoinHELP!]

Here's an authentic O-119, only a person with the coin in hand can be 100% sure.

 

[Tuberale]

Thank you, CoinHelp. My half looks nearly identical. Lacks the hairline scratch from the last A in AMERICA, and does not appear to have quite as much wear on it. But the E and M of the motto match, compared to the lettering in UNITED STATES OF AMERICA.

You've given me hope mine may be authentic.

 

[CoinHELP!]

You're welcome. This coin was graded by NGC. Also, there's different die states for every die, and certain die marriages are often found. So, if one O-119 has a die crack, but another doesn't, than it's more than likely just a different die state.

 

[Tuberale]

Wow! So you're saying your coin has a die crack? I'd guess there might have been less than 100 coins struck between them. What did NGC grade your coin as?

I was able to find a couple of PCGS-graded coins, closest was AU55, and I personally think mine has less wear than that.

 

[CoinHELP!]

This coin was graded MS61 by NGC, but it's not my coin, it's an example that sold on Heritage Auctions for $862.50. Also, I am a bit confused by your statement about the mintages since there were 6,412,004 struck in 1834, and all varieties are included in this figure, and this variety isn't rare.

Also, the die crack comment was just an example of how a working die, with the same variation of the date and letters, can strike coins without a die crack, but after repeated use can obtain a crack, and strike some examples with die cracks.

So, a missing die crack doesn't always mean the coin isn't the same variety. The O-119 is about the size of the date and letters, nothing more. However, extremely serious collectors look for even more variations within a single variety, but there's only a few of these collectors around.

My first impression was that your coin would grade at least AU58, but an MS grade is a possiblity. I don't dare make definitive grades based on images alone. I know you understand that. Heck, I am careful to make to many conclusions about anything based on an image alone

Sorry for any confusion!

 

[Tuberale]

This coin was graded MS61 by NGC, but it's not my coin, it's an example that sold on Heritage Auctions for $862.50. Also, I am a bit confused by your statement about the mintages since there were 5,352,006 struck in 1934, and all varieties are included in this figure, and this variety isn't rare.
There may have been 5,352,006 pieces struck in 1934. But this was 1834. There should have been 6,412,004 pieces struck.

Also, the die crack comment was just an example of how a working die, with the same variation of the date and letters, can strike coins without a die crack, but after repeated use can obtain a crack, and strike some examples with die cracks.

So, a missing die crack doesn't always mean the coin isn't the same variety. The O-119 is about the size of the date and letters, nothing more. However, extremely serious collectors look for even more variations within a single variety, but there's only a few of these collectors around.

My first impression was that your coin would grade at least AU58, but an MS grade is a possiblity. I don't dare make definitive grades based on images alone. I know you understand that. Heck, I am careful to make to many conclusions about anything based on an image alone

Sorry for any confusion!

I guess I'm confused now.

Capped Bust Half Dollars struck in 1934? Must be a typo. This was 1834. But a quick check online shows 6,412,004 pieces struck in 1834, right?

I would not have expected an MS60 grade with wear on the wing tips and blunted feathers. So the photo of the MS61 is quite encouraging.

The thing that had me going big time was the flattening of the feathers on the eagle's right wing (left facing on coin). This seems to have been done raise the image of the cheek area on the obverse, something I would associate with a poor copy attempt. But your NGC-graded coin has the exact same feather flattening. Anyway, I think I'm still encouraged.

 

[CoinHELP!]

No you're not confused! It's a typo and I edited my post to reflect the correct info. You're correct and should be encouraged by your coin.

 

[Tuberale]

Thanks, CoinHELP! I would never have guessed my coin might reach that level without your assistance.

Now just have to decide which company to have grade it. Currently looking at PCGS, NGC, ANACS. Any others that would be cost-effective?

 

[CoinHELP!]

Honestly, your choice of grading services are the best choices. I use PCGS since the coins sell for more in their holders, and NGC is second best. It costs, but this coin is holder worthy. I would send it if I owned it. I am just glad I could help, and hope you post the grading results. I hope our hunches are correct on this one!