My Expanded Case for 3 Tones
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Thread: My Expanded Case for 3 Tones

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  1. #1
    Charter Member
    us
    Colonel

    Jan 2014
    Central Florida
    CTX 3030; EQX 800; Excal II
    515
    723 times
    Beach and Shallow Water Hunting

    My Expanded Case for 3 Tones

    I previously posted a similar thread on this forum but thought I'd expand on and share my reasoning for using 3 tones since I've now used this exclusively/extensively and like it more every day.

    Over the years, I've tried numerous ways through a combination of VDI and tones to better identify targets that were under my coil. It didn't take long for me to discover that trying to cut the tone and VDI distinction too fine in an attempt to accurately identify targets was unproductive. Through some trial and error, the obvious finally became clear.

    VDI is not an exact science by any stretch. Target ID can be affected by numerous variables such as depth, soil composition, the metallurgical make up and orientation of the targets in the soil. Expecting a consistently exact value for each possible target was unrealistic. I finally concluded that what I wanted was only an indication of what might be under my coil rather than expecting or trying for a precise ID. Can VDI and Tones do that for me? Yes

    After realizing what I wanted or needed from of a tone/VDI combination, I settled on a 3 tone option. Below are a few bullet points that summarize my case or reasoning for adopting that 3 tone solution.

    ~ My attempt at using 50 tones proved impossible for me...information overload! I then tried 5 tones and although much more understandable than 50, I felt that 5 tones was really unnecessary and might even be overkill. Why?

    ~ ALL targets fall within 3 categories/zones of conductivity of Low, Medium or High so it made more sense for me to focus on those 3 zones and then align the tones accordingly. The tones provided information on what zone I was dealing with while the VDI gave me some rough indication as to where that target fell within the range of that zone.

    ~ I also wanted a system that wasn't apt to cause me to ignore good targets because they were similar in make up to worthless targets. Example; gold and aluminum are both mid level conductors and generate similar VDI within that range, I therefore didn't want to exclude anything within the Mid or High level conductivity scale. Yes, I'll dig aluminum so as not to pass up potential gold and dig other high conductive targets so as not to pass up silver.

    ~ I tested quite a number common targets of varying size and metallurgical composition and came up with some common VDI ranges that I see on our beaches for each of the conductivity zones. I then modified the 5 tone option to 3 tones which suited me just fine for the beach hunting I do.

    My results:

    Low conductive targets ranged from -9 to 0 and I assigned it Tone level 1 (the old iron grunt)

    Medium targets ranged from 1 to 19 so I chose Tone 12...a nice mid level tone

    High conductors were 20+ so I gave them the highest Tone level of 25



    ~ In my work with a local museum however, the 2 tone option could also be used. When digging museum quality artifacts, iron is a valued metal so I dig everything. I also dig it all when I detect along Florida's Treasure Coast as remnants of the ships fall within the iron or low conductive range and are often times found along our beaches.



    Just the view from my foxhole...your view may vary.
    Last edited by ColonelDan; Oct 04, 2018 at 06:18 AM.
    ~The Challenge: Big Beach; Little Coil; Tiny Targets ~

    "Simplicity is the ultimate sophistication"~ Leonardo da Vinci

    ~Pre-determined settings serve only to get you in the ballpark. Itís up to you to pick the best seat~

  2. #2

    Apr 2013
    N.E. Ohio
    XP Deus, NOX 600
    1,423
    1338 times
    All Types Of Treasure Hunting
    I agree 100% i use 5 tones and relic hunt....beep = dig
    I am not sitting there trying to distinguish if its an oil lamp shard or a button.

  3. #3

    Feb 2017
    Pa
    EQ 800 & 600, Fisher F75 +, Tesoro Tejon, Tesoro Conquistador, Bounty hunter Tracker iv
    2,442
    3772 times
    Metal Detecting
    I love the 5 tone reduced to 3. It really helps when you're trying to move a little quicker while being selective in your digging. Obviously, it's not the setup for every site but it's awesome having the adjustability at your fingertips!

  4. #4
    Charter Member
    us
    Jul 2006
    Florida
    Minelab_Equinox_ 800 Minelab_CTX-3030 Minelab_Excal_1000 Minelab_Sovereign_GT Minelab_Safari Minelab_ETrac Whites_Beach_Hunter_ID Fisher_1235_X
    37,630
    29607 times
    All Types Of Treasure Hunting
    You can always set up the 3 tone in the personal user profile that comes on the 800, just a simply button to jump for 3 tone to 5 tone then.
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  5. #5

    Apr 2015
    CZ-21, Minelab Equinox, Garrett AT Pro
    1,440
    1324 times
    Metal Detecting
    I started with a 3 tone mode... the more I learned the machine, the more I found the stock settings had been well tested in the field... I found myself going back to 5 tone eventually and staying there.
    A2coins likes this.
    Minelab Equinox 800,Fisher CZ-21, Excalibur II

    ... waiting to see that elusive dowser on the beach with a bucket of gold rings ...

  6. #6
    Charter Member
    us
    Apr 2018
    North Florida
    Nokta Fors Relic, Garrett Infinity LS, Minelab Equinox 800, Teknetics Pinpointer
    22
    56 times
    Metal Detecting
    I may try that. I just got my Equinox last week and am still learning the machine. Most of my sites are 1915 era without much modern trash, so iron is about all I want to manage.
    A2coins likes this.

  7. #7

    Jun 2012
    Oklahoma
    Equinox 800, Ace 250
    408
    318 times
    All Types Of Treasure Hunting
    I would agree that 3 or 5 tone is easier to master. I can see how it is appropriate for some people, maybe even me. But in general, I know that 50 tone ultimately provides better results to those who master it. Yes, there are certain types of hunts that 50 tone won't be helpful on. But if you hunt various types of sites, there will be times when 50 tone comes in handy. There will be nuances learned in the sounds. They'll be certain VDI's and tones that most detectorist will want to skip. They'll be bouncy mid tones that, when learned, will save you from digging a lot of trash at sites where you don't want to dig all the trash.
    A2coins likes this.

  8. #8
    Charter Member
    us
    Jul 2015
    Near Ground Zero for Insanity
    XP Deus with HF Coils and Mi6 Pinpointer/ML Equinox 600/800/ML GPX 4800/Garrett ATX/Fisher F75 DST/Tek Delta/Whites MXT/Garrett Carrot/Piranha Relic Shovel
    4,065
    6413 times
    All Types Of Treasure Hunting
    Quote Originally Posted by Owassokie View Post
    I would agree that 3 or 5 tone is easier to master. I can see how it is appropriate for some people, maybe even me. But in general, I know that 50 tone ultimately provides better results to those who master it. Yes, there are certain types of hunts that 50 tone won't be helpful on. But if you hunt various types of sites, there will be times when 50 tone comes in handy. There will be nuances learned in the sounds. They'll be certain VDI's and tones that most detectorist will want to skip. They'll be bouncy mid tones that, when learned, will save you from digging a lot of trash at sites where you don't want to dig all the trash.
    1000% agree with this. I think Dan's 3 tone setup is great when you want to give your head a break for a casual Park run or something like that, but when I am hunting in a junky mess, I need to hear the tone distortion nuances that clue me into whether I am listening to a solid blob of melted aluminum or an Eagle Breast Plate which will give similar VDI's AND similar tones in 5 tones - but which really stood out in 50 tones (true story, and how I found the plate in my Avatar amongst an exploded aluminum motor block from a tractor in a bean field).

    If I am going to just multi tones then, I too, would prefer Dan's 3-tone setup, but I am also inherently lazy and won't bother taking the time to do the tone setup necessary and will just default to 5 tones in Park 1 if that is what I want to do in a soccer field.

    Frankly, I would be content with 3 to 5 VDI's (iron, low, med, high) as long as I had the 50 tones in my ears. But that's just me. I'm kinda crazy.

    But great tip from Dan on how to do 3 tones since ML did not see fit to set up that option explicitly (probably because they knew you could set it up the way Dan suggests).
    "The future ain't what it used to be..."

  9. #9
    Charter Member
    us
    Jul 2015
    Near Ground Zero for Insanity
    XP Deus with HF Coils and Mi6 Pinpointer/ML Equinox 600/800/ML GPX 4800/Garrett ATX/Fisher F75 DST/Tek Delta/Whites MXT/Garrett Carrot/Piranha Relic Shovel
    4,065
    6413 times
    All Types Of Treasure Hunting
    Quote Originally Posted by Owassokie View Post
    I would agree that 3 or 5 tone is easier to master. I can see how it is appropriate for some people, maybe even me. But in general, I know that 50 tone ultimately provides better results to those who master it. Yes, there are certain types of hunts that 50 tone won't be helpful on. But if you hunt various types of sites, there will be times when 50 tone comes in handy. There will be nuances learned in the sounds. They'll be certain VDI's and tones that most detectorist will want to skip. They'll be bouncy mid tones that, when learned, will save you from digging a lot of trash at sites where you don't want to dig all the trash.
    1000% agree with this. I think Dan's 3 tone setup is great when you want to give your head a break for a casual Park run or something like that, but when I am hunting in a junky mess, I need to hear the tone distortion nuances that clue me into whether I am listening to a solid blob of melted aluminum or an Eagle Breast Plate which will give similar VDI's AND similar tones in 5 tones - but which really stood out in 50 tones (true story, and how I found the plate in my Avatar amongst an exploded aluminum motor block from a tractor in a bean field). You get so much more from audio than you can ever get from staring at a number on a screen and that is why I try not to sell my audio short when doing serious relic detecting, hence 50 tones. With 50 TIDs you get 50 TIDs, it is black and white. 50 tones gives you 50 tones but it also gives you different sustain, distortion, rise and fall times on two different objects that will have the same TID (and base tone). It is like adding color to your black and white TID number.

    If I am going to just multi tones then, I too, would prefer Dan's 3-tone setup, but I am also inherently lazy and won't bother taking the time to do the tone setup necessary and will just default to 5 tones in Park 1 if that is what I want to do in a soccer field.

    Frankly, I would be content with 3 to 5 TID's (one for iron, one each for low, med, and high conductors) as long as I had the 50 tones in my ears. But that's just me. I'm kinda crazy.

    But great tip from Dan on how to do 3 tones since ML did not see fit to set up that option explicitly (probably because they knew you could set it up the way Dan suggests).
    "The future ain't what it used to be..."

  10. #10
    Charter Member
    us
    Colonel

    Jan 2014
    Central Florida
    CTX 3030; EQX 800; Excal II
    515
    723 times
    Beach and Shallow Water Hunting
    Quote Originally Posted by vferrari View Post
    1000% agree with this. I think Dan's 3 tone setup is great when you want to give your head a break for a casual Park run or something like that, but when I am hunting in a junky mess, I need to hear the tone distortion nuances that clue me into whether I am listening to a solid blob of melted aluminum or an Eagle Breast Plate which will give similar VDI's AND similar tones in 5 tones - but which really stood out in 50 tones (true story, and how I found the plate in my Avatar amongst an exploded aluminum motor block from a tractor in a bean field). You get so much more from audio than you can ever get from staring at a number on a screen and that is why I try not to sell my audio short when doing serious relic detecting, hence 50 tones. With 50 TIDs you get 50 TIDs, it is black and white. 50 tones gives you 50 tones but it also gives you different sustain, distortion, rise and fall times on two different objects that will have the same TID (and base tone). It is like adding color to your black and white TID number.

    If I am going to just multi tones then, I too, would prefer Dan's 3-tone setup, but I am also inherently lazy and won't bother taking the time to do the tone setup necessary and will just default to 5 tones in Park 1 if that is what I want to do in a soccer field.

    Frankly, I would be content with 3 to 5 TID's (one for iron, one each for low, med, and high conductors) as long as I had the 50 tones in my ears. But that's just me. I'm kinda crazy.

    But great tip from Dan on how to do 3 tones since ML did not see fit to set up that option explicitly (probably because they knew you could set it up the way Dan suggests).
    Great post!

    I salute you and all those who have mastered 50 tones. Perhaps I never gave 50 tones an honest chance but where I hunt (Florida beaches) 3 tones is effective, efficient and all I really need. More importantly, the 3 tone option keeps life simple for my 70 year old brain.

    This just boils down to using what works best for you...that's why we have options on these great ML detectors!

    Soldier on my friends...
    ~The Challenge: Big Beach; Little Coil; Tiny Targets ~

    "Simplicity is the ultimate sophistication"~ Leonardo da Vinci

    ~Pre-determined settings serve only to get you in the ballpark. Itís up to you to pick the best seat~

  11. #11
    Charter Member
    us
    Jul 2015
    Near Ground Zero for Insanity
    XP Deus with HF Coils and Mi6 Pinpointer/ML Equinox 600/800/ML GPX 4800/Garrett ATX/Fisher F75 DST/Tek Delta/Whites MXT/Garrett Carrot/Piranha Relic Shovel
    4,065
    6413 times
    All Types Of Treasure Hunting
    Quote Originally Posted by ColonelDan View Post
    Great post!

    I salute you and all those who have mastered 50 tones. Perhaps I never gave 50 tones an honest chance but where I hunt (Florida beaches) 3 tones is effective, efficient and all I really need. More importantly, the 3 tone option keeps life simple for my 70 year old brain.

    This just boils down to using what works best for you...that's why we have options on these great ML detectors!

    Soldier on my friends...
    Totally agree. 50 tones and even the calcophany of All Metal is not for everyone and for those of us who have hearing limitations it is very important to have the ability to customize tones and is essential for a machine that is marketed to a spectrum of users to offer that feature. That is also why applaud you and others who have come up with innovative custom tone patterns to fit users needs and detecting styles. Thanks.
    "The future ain't what it used to be..."

  12. #12

    Feb 2017
    Pa
    EQ 800 & 600, Fisher F75 +, Tesoro Tejon, Tesoro Conquistador, Bounty hunter Tracker iv
    2,442
    3772 times
    Metal Detecting
    V, I tried the delta pitch on my f75 back when I had it and almost threw it over the hill! Lol. Like you said though.....everyone is absolutely different in how we hear, interpret and ultimately make the dig, no dig decisions.

    I still love the adjustability in the tones with this unit. At least we're not stuck with set factory programs that can't be tweaked!
    vferrari likes this.

  13. #13

    Apr 2015
    CZ-21, Minelab Equinox, Garrett AT Pro
    1,440
    1324 times
    Metal Detecting
    Quote Originally Posted by ColonelDan View Post
    Great post!

    I salute you and all those who have mastered 50 tones. Perhaps I never gave 50 tones an honest chance but where I hunt (Florida beaches) 3 tones is effective, efficient and all I really need. More importantly, the 3 tone option keeps life simple for my 70 year old brain.
    I had 50 tones mastered in the dry sand, but in the water it's a no-go. When 50 tones falses it's a mess.

    For the beaches I find 3 tones and 5 tones to be the most productive in the salt.
    ColonelDan and vferrari like this.
    Minelab Equinox 800,Fisher CZ-21, Excalibur II

    ... waiting to see that elusive dowser on the beach with a bucket of gold rings ...

  14. #14

    Sep 2013
    447
    545 times
    All Types Of Treasure Hunting
    Thanks for this
    I am really stuck on 5 tones, I ventured into both 2 and 50 tones, in 2 tones the false drove me crazy, in 50 it was like listening to really bad jazz

    but very keen to try both 3 and 50, 3 to simplify my searches when I am exhausted and only half with it
    50 when I am alert and hungry for all information
    V i am all ears to your breast plate story, would love to hear the nuances produced in 50 that inspired you to dig that beauty

  15. #15
    us
    Sep 2012
    D'Iberville MS
    E-Trac Equinox 800 Equinox 600
    1,169
    792 times
    Metal Detecting
    Honorable Mentions (1)
    I was strickly a 5 tone guy the 1st month I had my 800 but I read a post from vferrai and decided to try 50 tones. I bit the bullet and hung to the 50 tones and now I love it. The more I use 50 tones the better it gets. It takes awhile to process all of the good from the bad but to me it is well worth it
    vferrari likes this.


    I don't detect for the stuff I find, I detect for the stuff I haven't found.

    If I didn't find it I hope you did.


 

 

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