Intergalactic travel... practical application.

mikeofaustin

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A space craft with infinite acceleration and fuel, can only accelerate at 1G (1 earths gravitation) because humans won't last at any other acceleration. Now mind you, This acceleration to the nearest star, Alpha Century, it's 3.4 light years away, and it would take a generation star ship to accelerate at 1G to get there. BUT, once you get to alpha century, you can't just stop like a break peddle.... You need to decelerate at 1G.

This means that after you left earth, accelerating at 1G, exactly halfway there, you need to start decelerating at 1g (you need to turn the bus around and start decell).... This is called "Retro-grade, and Pro-grade". Accelerate, and then Decelerate. So, this experience will take 480 years to get to the nearest like solar system (alpha century). This is called a 'Generation starship'. This means, that your grandchild's-grandchild-grandchild's-grandchild's-grandchild's kid might be able to land on the nearest solar system like our own.

This is because of the the current limitation on gravitation acceleration. To get around that, one might suggest suspended animation. This has it's own problems because of the various densities in our own organs. These variations will pull stronger with gravitation than others. Literally, everything, blood, bone, skin, etc.. .will be pulled for hundreds of years at their very own weight... so. Suspended animation is not an option either.

This brings us to technology that we, as in the 22nd century, matters. ...Take for example, the estimated lifetime of this planet. 4 billion years old. Supposedly, we have evolved from the last million. Now, a million years ago, we were about 1 foot tall, talking in nothing even remotely acceptable to basic communication amongst our peers (we were lizards). So, you have just image that we once stood, one foot tall, with tales and all, looking across this huge expanse of water... an island. We said to ourselves that it would never be possible to posses the ability to cross this pond to get to that island. And yet, look at us today. We've been to the moon.

Now, given the time frame that we've been alive, and in 1 million years from now, will we be saying, "Just look at us... we once thought that intergalactic travel was something that would never happen. We were once only 6 foot tall then. Look at us now. We are traveling to other galaxies now.
 

ivan salis

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pilots wear "g" suits --which allows them to suffer greater than 1 G -- so can space travellers --if they can build a suit to do it -- I/m sure they can made a room where folks can live in a G suit type enviroment while travelling as well.--pressurized liviing quarters
 

The Beep Goes On

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Contant acceleration is fine for the majority of the trip, but that doesn't mean they can't utilize higher g's at the beginning and end.

If we could figure out anti-gravity (or gravitic propulsion) then we wouldn't even feel the acceleration. Usually, like in a car, if you turn a corner (a form of acceleration) you get pushed out towards the outside of the corner. If gravity pulled you around the corner you would feel nothing since gravity pulls on both the car and you. You could make a right-angle turn at 5K mph and not feel a thing. By the same token, you could accelerate to near light speed in a very short time and not feel anything or suffer any ill effects (except for time dilation, I guess).
 

allan

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http://astrophys-assist.com/educate/spaceflight/spaceflight.htm

Acceleration and de-acceleration are expressed in terms of "G", with 1-G describing the effects of gravity we experience under normal conditions while at rest on the surface of the Earth. Therefore, when accelerating to 2-G you would feel the force of gravity doubled. As G-forces increase due to acceleration, you begin to feel heavier and experience difficulty in moving your arms and legs. As G-forces continue to increase, you may experience difficulties in moving your hands and feet, and are not able to lift your head to look around. At 5-G’s, your ten pound head would weight 50 pounds, a load that your neck muscles are not accustomed to handling.

There are other effects of increasing G-forces as well. Blood circulation becomes impaired as the heart must work harder to pump blood through the body. This impaired circulation can lead to a dimming of consciousness as the heart can no longer pump blood to the brain. You will start to experience tunnel vision, then colors will fade away and everything will appear white, then fade to black. You have just experienced a gravity induced loss of consciousness, or blackout. In general, anything more than 4 or 5 G’s will cause the average person who has not been trained to deal with these effects to black out. Extremely high G-levels can lead to more serious complications such as compacted bladders, bursting red blood cells, subdural hematomas, the inability to breathe and the cessation of circulation.

Shuttle astronauts are exposed to a very tolerable 3-G’s. Effects are mitigated by a variety of means, including the arrangement of seating relative to direction of acceleration and de-acceleration. Seats are arranged such that the entire body faces the direction of acceleration or de-acceleration, so forces are spread across the body rather than concentrated in one area. In addition, the seats are constructed of special composite materials designed to lessen the stresses on the body, and are contoured such that they provide extra support to areas of the body that are more susceptible to injury, such as the neck and the lower back. Astronauts are strapped in to these specially designed chairs so they remain seated correctly (1).

While exposure to 3-G’s poses no problems for astronauts during take-off, even this moderate level of G-forces can be problematic during landing, when astronauts with an already weakened cardiovascular system from the effects of microgravity are exposed to 15 minutes or more of 2 to 3-G forces. Space Shuttle astronauts wear G-suits during re-entry to prevent blackouts. The partial pressure suit is inflated on the abdomen and legs, so as to stop blood from rushing to the lower part of the body when returning from zero gravity.
 

pat-tekker-cat

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Interesting points mikeaustin, and all.

Taking all above into consideration, my grandson, came up with what he thought was a brilliant answer!
He plays with the little spinning gyro-scopes. He is just awed and fascinates with motion and non-motion?
He said, give everbody their own personal gyroscope to ride in. Suspend gravity in travels?
(where do 10 yr olds get this stuff? hehehehe) Personal golden globes aside? :icon_scratch:

But, it got me to thinking, of some scientist I saw, who makes the frog float? Can't think of his name, I think he's in Canada? Took a barage of equipment to do it too.
Or, would CERN and there new anti-matter, anit-helium, blahblahblah, suspend our known laws on earth, for experimentation, osbservation, etc............
I mean, we took our experiements to outer space, to determine, weightlessness effects on things, matter, microbes, and such.........
Might hafta tweak some dna, for longevity, or slow body function, then re-animate, am I getting ahead? :laughing7:
Where will our next great ideas come from, a man on a train looking at a clock?

If we step outside the think box, suspend what we think we believe, what may we then, come to know?
(cat-puke all of it)
 

homefires

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We don't have anything near the Technology to get there at this time. Not in one life time.

We could and do have the tech to get the but no one is willing to be the first generation and spend the funds to build the Sphere to get there.

It could be Done with the Tech we have.


The Biosphere in Arizona was a Bollix failure because of Greed and Want of Recognition.

They was on the right path.

I really think it could be done.

If the Plant life could be maintained, in a large enough scale it could work.

Were would you get the energy being away from the Sun for that long?

Collection of loose Hydrogen could be a answer.

Oxygen produced by the Plants could be used to Convert it to Electric.

More Electricity could be produced from the Free Ions collected from Space.

Could they be used to run a Ion Engine?

Yes We have those too.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ion_thruster

http://www.gizmag.com/ad-astra-ion-engine-mars-39-days/12342/

Until then the only way there is in our imagination.
 

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The Beep Goes On

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Rest assured that we have tech 20~50 years ahead of what is generally known. It may be that some just don't want to let the genie out of the bottle. Not to get all conspiracy on y'all, but 'extraterrestrials' may actually be 'terrestrials.' Where did all those fallen angels go? They may be 'ultraterrestrials' - from another universe or dimension. Point is, travel through space may become completely irrelevant in regards to a mode of getting from point A to point B. As when radio came on the scene; prior to that you (or documents) had to travel to communicate. Afterwards, travel became obsolete in certain respects.
 

The Beep Goes On

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Hmmmm...






London's "UFO mothership" video may be hoax
ByBenjamin Radford
A new viral video making the rounds on the Internet purports to show what's been dubbed a "mothership" and at least three separate smaller alien spacecraft filmed in the skies over London.

The most famous video (which was taken anonymously and is one of two or three versions in circulation) shows a large glowing white oval moving in and out from behind clouds over the course of about 20 seconds, and then zooming off, with three white dots also making an appearance.

So what are they? The pattern of movement does not resemble any known aircraft, and some are already proclaiming the sighting as proof of aliens. While not exactly the same as landing on the proverbial White House lawn (or above 10 Downing Street), some say an appearance over London is a pretty high-profile statement that aliens are here.

Others aren't so sure. Some believe that the videos are merely a viral marketing tool to publicize the upcoming alien sci-fi film "Iron Sky." One argument against that explanation is that the film is not slated to be released until April 2012, though studios often begin early promotion, and these amateur UFO videos would take little time or effort for special effects professionals.

In fact, the crudeness of the London UFOs may be a sign of fakery. The spacecraft in the video resemble those in an alleged UFO video taken over Jerusalem earlier this year, and which many experts (including myself and those at MUFON, the largest pro-UFO organization in the world) concluded were faked.

The mothership and its UFO siblings videotaped over London are among the absolute easiest images to fake: glowing ovals and dots. There's no detail, no flying saucer windows or aliens waving hello from high above. Just white moving dots that anyone with some video-editing chops could create with little effort.

Another sign that this is a fake is the way the video begins. The cameraman is apparently randomly videotaping a mundane sidewalk, and then moves quickly to a street corner, where he takes careful note of the reactions from passerby before aiming the camera up into the sky to see what, exactly, it is that has so captivated their attention. He videotapes the skies for about a minute, then once again brings the camera down to show us a small crowd of people who are also staring into the sky and getting photos.

This is highly suspicious behavior for someone who truly believes that there are alien spacecraft in the skies above that could reappear at any moment. If you spotted what you believed to be a UFO that could zip away at any moment, wouldn't training your camera on the spaceship be the first thing you would do? Whoever created, edited, and posted the video clearly wanted to make sure that viewers knew that others had seen, and were reacting to, the lights.

Aliens may in fact be out there, but the evidence so far suggests that the London UFO video is another hoax.

~~~

Dang, I had my tinfoil hat all ready to go!
 

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mikeofaustin

mikeofaustin

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homefires said:
We don't have anything near the Technology to get there at this time. Not in one life time.

We could and do have the tech to get the but no one is willing to be the first generation and spend the funds to build the Sphere to get there.
It could be Done with the Tech we have.
The Biosphere in Arizona was a Bollix failure because of Greed and Want of Recognition.
They was on the right path.
I really think it could be done.
If the Plant life could be maintained, in a large enough scale it could work.
Were would you get the energy being away from the Sun for that long?
Collection of loose Hydrogen could be a answer.
Oxygen produced by the Plants could be used to Convert it to Electric.
More Electricity could be produced from the Free Ions collected from Space.
Could they be used to run a Ion Engine?
Yes We have those too.
Until then the only way there is in our imagination.

I've thought about this too, but any kind of 'real' travel, would mean we'd have to accelerate at 1G. And ION engines simple do not accelerate enough. Ion engines produce very little acceleration... It was said that the most basic of engine would generate the weight of a piece of paper, given our current technology. To do it correctly, and to be able to live on this spacecraft for this long, with a generation starship, we would have to generate exactly 1G of pull from acceleration. Anything more or less would give us health problems (our bodies have adapted to 1G for millions of years).

BUT, If we were able to create a 'ring-world', that just might work,.... that you could generate the force needed for 1G, with a gentle thrust, but it would take a LOT longer for travel time to get to the next star... and you'd better have your plants able to produce enough food and oxygen, because it will be a LOT longer than 480 years. A light source for plants and oxygen (and living conditions) could be a fission reactor, like on earth and currently, our navy subs... but again, if you are pushing your craft at such a small amount of acceleration to travel to the nearest star (alpha century), .....Wow. That would really take a very long time. And, if you were able to create a craft that's capable... you would have basically just made your own self sustaining infrastructure, that didn't even need to live on a planet. So, I guess, if you were to create this craft, it would be an 'option' to colonize a planet, not a necessity. Perhaps that's what happened long ago.... We will never know.
 

dirty digger dude

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We can't even get back to the moon. Intergalactic travel will not happen. We, humans, will no doubt over populate the planet causing a planet wide catastrophy of some sort.
 

worldtalker

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What makes you believe we ever went to the moon to begin with,on paper we did!!!!!!!!
 

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mikeofaustin

mikeofaustin

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homefires said:

Yes, they are... but what is the thrust from them? For a ship the size of a very small city? What would that acceleration be if it was given an unlimited amount of energy to create this thrust? It's actually very small. But, if one were to perhaps create multiples of multiples of ion engines, it might be feasable... but, the tail end (the thrust end) would most likely be 100's if not thousands of times bigger than the living quarters. that's of course, if humans were able to stay viable long enough to reach our next sun.
 

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