Was Columbus the First Explorer to Visit the Americas? The Evidence Says NO!

[Oroblanco]

Re: Was Columbus the First Explorer to Visit the Americas? The Evidence Says NO

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Oroblanco

 

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[TreasureTales]

Oroblanco, thanks for the additional stories - I could read this stuff all day (and apparently all night, too, LOL). I was hoping Realde would step forward to regale us with his tales of the giant redhaired "men" of Mexico, but he hasn't shown up yet. I recall when I was just a newbie to TNet I read some of his posts pertaining to the "men" and have often hoped he would tell us more about them. Do you know their story? Please do tell, if you have info.

I remember watching several years ago a TV program about the development of mammals. The show said that the earliest mammals were tiny, to avoid detection, and therefore consumption, by the predatory dinosaurs that were inhabiting the earth in those ancient times. It occurred to me then, and re-occurs to me now, why wouldn't the same be true about humans? Why wouldn't humans develop first as a small species, thrive and develop into a "giant" species, falter, and then ultimately become the size we generally see today? What would make our species any different, in development, than any other mammal? I don't hold with univeral evolutional theory, but in some instances I think creationism and evolution could have been co-contributors to our present existance. (Maybe this is merely rationalization?)

Anybody with more stories of this type, please tell them. This is a fascinating and emerging area of American history that should no longer be suppressed. The truth will out, and Oroblanco and a handful of others are doing their best to let the truth be known. Bravo!

 

[tinpan]

Hi

Can i please see ,the ancient texts found by J. Smith and way he translated them.

  Then these ancient cultures traveled to the America's surely they would have taken their diseases with them.Which infact would have caused major epidemics. Like those which took place all over the world at time after 1492.The Igneous American cultures would have almost be totally destroyed.A event of this must have been recorded by some one in some sort of method.Can i see evidence of this.

  Can please see ancient old texts relating to these historic travels. That mean complete texts recored by the travelers or their culture.That doesn,t mean part texts or those writen by other cultures after the fact.

Can please the see the methods of navigation used by any of the above mentioned cultures and designs of ships that could sail across the Atlantic Ocean.

Resent DNA testing over 20 years from ancient remains of Jew and Palestine to present day people showed that they are infact related
So if this method is applied to ancient world and native American there would evidence they are related.Can i see that evidence also.

Even by 1850 standards the amount of support needed to sail across the Atlantic Ocean then travel inland hundreds of miles would be huge.Can i please see settlements remains,camps,graves and any thing else found other than a hand full of coins and relics.

Gene odities like Australia Aboriginals with white hair and fair eyes has been well recored.But there had been no outside contact at any stage before 1660.DNA test proved it.Your evidence please

50,000 years of culture in Australia and more that 400 different cultures and languages.many examples of rock ,head dresses have similarites to rome ,greek,both text and painting.Also like other ancient cultures too.
Yet there is no evidence of these ancient cultures ever coming here.

Chinese Empire lasted 3500 years and Australia is not that far but they never came here but they sailed to the America's Why there and not here.Being a nation of sea found eaters they would have the largest fish and chip shop in the world.lol But they didn,t

  tinpan

I don,t doubt the ancient world ships may have landed on the american main land but by accident  lost or wrecked.

 

[fossis]

Regarding Wyoming Little People.
The Anthropological Department of Harvard University claimed that there was no doubt as to the genuineness of the mummy. & two experts of the American Museum of Natural History revealed their x-rays showed a small skeletal structure covered by dried skin. It is smaller than any known human types. & the supposition developed that it might be a form of anthropid which roamed the North American continent about five million years ago in the get this!! (Pliocene age).
A printed state brocure in the 1940's (Wyoming),
said that skeletons of a race of Little People encased in solid rock extends as far north as the Yellowstone River & have been found in caves near the Colorado line. A group of scientists is seeking a cave in the Big Horn Mts where five of these mummies are said to be buried cross-legged on an ancient ledge.
Several other reports of mummies found in the area include, James Reynolds of Casper & others, found a bunch of small skulls in the local mountains. A man herding sheep, Jose Martinez, said he found a whole mummy & six skulls.
In Montana's Beartooth Mts A sheepherder Bill Street, found small skulls , as well as whole mummies in 1922.
The Snakes, Bannocks, & Arapahoe all had legends of little people.
The Arapahoe could not contact the little people with sign language, & very much afraid of them.

This mummy is also mentioned in Wierd America,( quoting again from the book) An expert from the Boston Museum's Egyptian Department observed that it resembled in appearance those mummies that the Egyptians had left unwrapped.

Also quoting from the book Wierd America, (and for decades there have been stories in east Tennessee and southwest North Carolina of stone tombs found along the eastern slope of the Great Smokies. skeletons were all three feet tall, no more , or so' tis said).

Another story (Quote), Berryville Ar., 40 air ni. NE of Fayetteville., eight miles southwest of here, on private land between the Prescott farm and brushy creek, a rock outcropping holds a neatly formed rectangular doorway about 4 feet high and 18 inches wide. behind the opening is a meandering passage that leads to a small, circular chamber. The structure has been dismissed as " a spanish mine" or a treasure chamber, but the low ceiling height would seem to militate against that. Spanish conquistadors were probably somewhat shorter than the modern American average, but not that short.

(Giant Skeletons)
Quoting from the book Wierd America, by Jim Brandon.
Lompoc Rancho, About 60 mi NW of Santa Barbara ( California, my addition) on S.R. 1
soldiers digging a pit for storage of powder in 1833 broke through a layer of gravel and found a 12 foot human skeleton, (yes that was 12 foot folks, my addition also), surrounded by carved shells, stone axes, and blocks of porphyry covered with unintelligible symbols. The skull had a double row of teeth on upper and lower jaws. According to the only surviving report on the incident, the authorities ordered the remains reburied in a secret location when superstitious natives began to be troubled by what they regarded as a bad omen. So possibly the archaelogically priceless material is still somewhere in this area, perhaps not too deeply buried.

More Later, Fossis...............

 

[TreasureTales]

One of the articles I linked earlier mentioned some large (giant) human skeletal remains found in Alaska during WWII. The heads measuring 22 inches long.

 

[Nick in NEPA]

Re: Was Columbus the First Explorer to Visit the Americas? The Evidence Says NO

In Pennsylvania near a mountain called Carantouan there is a story that in 1822 people digging a foundtion for a house found a stone tomb that contained tone coffins and huge skeletons...supposedly the Susquehannock Indians were huge. Kent Hovind has formulated a theory about the Biblical phrase 'there were giants in the earth'...www.drdino.com

 

[TheDane]

Just wanted to say thank you for a very interesting thread !!

Coming from Denmark, we have known for more than a 1000 years that the Vikings were there before Columbus !!

Still today this FACT seems to be difficult to get throu in public oppinion ??

There seems to be a very strong south European lobby supported by the Catholic Church doing everyting they can to deny that fact !! A kind of conspiracy ?? What do you think ??

I also believe, that America was at least visited long before that, interesting if one day there could come some clear evidence on that too !!

 

[Nick in NEPA]

Re: Was Columbus the First Explorer to Visit the Americas? The Evidence Says NO

It could be a hack, but has anyone read "The Lost Treasure of King Juba"? It supposedly tells of a huge African treasure discovered in a south Illinois cave in 1982.

 

[fossis]

Re: Was Columbus the First Explorer to Visit the Americas? The Evidence Says NO

It could be a hack, but has anyone read "The Lost Treasure of King Juba"? It supposedly tells of a huge African treasure discovered in a south Illinois cave in 1982.

This is getting good, haven't read that one pather,
If I can locate all my books, I have more to come.


Fossis....................

 

[Nick in NEPA]

Re: Was Columbus the First Explorer to Visit the Americas? The Evidence Says NO

A good read that I have is "The Lost Treasure of the Knights Templar". It has some compelling evidence for preColumbian visits to the Americas. Good read!

 

[fossis]

One of the articles I linked earlier mentioned some large (giant) human skeletal remains found in Alaska during WWII. The heads measuring 22 inches long.

Thanks for starting this post, getting good,
Fossis................

 

[TreasureTales]

Oh, fossis, thank you but believe me the pleasure is all mine. There are so many questions an old duffer like me wants answered before I forget what the questions are. LOL

 

[fossis]

Oh, fossis, thank you but believe me the pleasure is all mine. There are so many questions an old duffer like me wants answered before I forget what the questions are. LOL

I heard that, just answered the doorbell,
& lost my glasses,before I got back to the computer!!

Fossis.................

 

[Real de Tayopa Tropical Tramp]

morning Tt and peeps:

Regarding the red haired giants here in north western Mexico, I have seen evidence personally, they do/did exist. also the diminutive people.

My first contact was about 1955 when I had walked to Chinapas in Southern Chihuahua from Alamos in Sonora, some 55 miles over a mountain range.. I was treated as the guest of honor in Chinapas since they had had no foreign visitors for some years, as a result they opened up their store of stories, from lost treasures to legends. Later the same thing happened while I was living with the Yaqui's. I seem to have a report with the natives, a confidence that I have worked hard to never betray.

The first reference to the giants came when one of the local Indians, knowing of my interest in History etc , took me to see the Cave with the inscriptions., "The Painted Cave'.

We left early one morning afoot and climbed steadily for hours until we finally reached a large sloughed off part of the cliff, almost at the crest. It was perhaps 25-30 ft high and 60- 70 ft long. It was literally covered with drawings with iron oxide making a reddish paint.

It actually ran from left to right starting at the top and working it's way down. They must have erected some form of scaffolding to work the upper parts. I questioned my guide as to who had done this, he merely shrugged and said "The old ones".

Whoever had done it had duplicated life size the foot prints of every living creature of the region. There were human foot prints, deer, mice, etc. . but what impressed me most was the print of a human foot, perhaps 20 - 24 " long in perfect detail. I asked him why were they soo big, he replied "that was their size".

When we returned to Chinip as, I commenced to question different people about these giant foot prints. One gentleman told me that the last one had been killed about 1900. His father had killed him when he encountered the giant on his land. I asked him "Why"?, he merely shrugged and said "it seemed right at the time.". sheesh.

later, back in Alamos, a schoolteacher in Camotes,a small village nearby, sent for Me to go see the skull of a giant. Naturally I went. He had the skull on top of a table in his dinning room, along with a femur. Frankly I do not remember the exact details now, but it was approximately 1/3 + larger than a normal human skull. The femur was about the same in length. Crude estimates would place this giant at around 9-10 tall.the skull was still covered with wisps of reddish hair.

He told me that it had come from the giants' burial caves in the nearby "Cerro de La Campana", the bell hill. It lay approx, a days ride by mule north east in view. but he couldn't go just then. Before we managed to get together he was transferred to Mexico city.

I have always intended to go investigate, but something always took precedence. sniff.

Up at Tayopa one of the local; Indians found a sealed cave. He opened it with expectations of having found a treasure site, but only found two giants wrapped in woven cloth. He was so disgusted that he threw them down the face of the diff. I told him to go retrieve them and that I would pay him good money for them. However, when he went, he could not find them. i told him that he had probably destroyed a true treasure in both $ and history He has since passed the word around to take care of any future finds and report them to me...

I will be returning there in a month or so to finish Tayopa, we shall see what may have developed.

I also had contact with the small peoples thingies,which i will talk about tomorrow..

Don Jose de la Mancha Tropical Tramp

 

[TreasureTales]

Tropical Tramp, thank you for that great story. How truly interesting all of these tales are. More, please.

 

[fossis]

Great Story Tropical Tramp,

Here is another one from the book Wierd America,
Brewersville Indiana, (Jennings co, about 17 mi. SE of Columbus; near where S.R. 3 crosses the sand river) A stone mound, 71 feet in diameter & between 3 & 5 feet high, was excavated in 1879 & found to contain a number of skeletons, one of which was 9 ' 8" long. It wore a necklace of mica & at it's feet stood a rough image made of burned clay with pieces of flint embedded in it. weapons buried nearby were unlike those used by the indians.
This digging was made under supervision of the Indiana state archaeologist & included guest scientists from Ohio & New York, as well as the neighborhood physician, Dr. Charles Green, & the owner of the property, a man named Robinson. The bones & Artifacts were preserved by the Robinson family in a basket at a grain mill near the site, until a flood swept them away in 1937.

Helen Ochs, for many years the " unofficial Historian" of Jennings co, ferreted out this story from old records. In the late nineteenth century, as she points out, scientists-some-of them were not afraid to say that the mound builders were a different people from the late indians who apparently stamped them out. today, official dogma is that Indians of the Hopewell & Adena cultures built the mounds.
At Walkerton, 20 miles SW of South Bend, a group of amateur archaeologists opened a mound in 1925 & unearthed the skeletons of eight giants ranging from eight to nine feet long. All were wearing heavy copper armor like the famous(skeleton in armor) that had been found in Fall River Massachusetts, in 1831.

Through the bungling of these diggers & the total disinterest of the archaelogical museum establishment, these discoveries have now been lost.
Fossis................

 

[TreasureTales]

WOW! That is another eyepopping story. Thanks, fossis.

Wouldn't it be something if this continent wound up having a civilization living here that rivaled the Romans or the Greeks or the Egyptians? But evidence for it was destroyed, lost, vandalized, ignored, or misinterpreted? I am thinking we could have had our own advanced culture, but it is now...well, with apologies to Margaret Mitchell...GONE WITH THE WIND. Floods, hurricanes, earthquakes and tornadoes wouldn't have helped, of course. Sheesh.

 

[fossis]

Another one from Wierd America,
(Fall River Massachusetts), in 1831, the skeleton of a male wearing heavy metal plates was dug up at the corner of what is now Fifth and Hartley streets, the metal appeared to be copper or bronze, and after some debate, the skeleton was taken to be that of a Viking. Henry W. Longfellow wrote the poem "The Skeleton in Armor" on the basis of the discovery, recounting the story of a Viking who built a "bower" for his lady fair.
In 1843, the skeleton was destroyed in the great fire that swept over Fall River (along with Lizzie Borden, this town has definately had it's share of quirks)
By the 1880's, experts at Harvard's Peabody Museum decided that the metal objects were of brass and that this made them English and hence of recent origin.
The case against a pre-Columbian intruder was considered closed when Anthropologist C.C. Willoughby found, in 1938, that the burial had been that of a Wampanoag Indian, which was a neat piece of deduction to make on a skeleton that had been nonexistent for 95 years.I believe the matter rests there today. Some of the metal objects are still in the Peabody Museum at Harvard, at last report.

The only contribution I can make is to marvel at an extreme display of isolationism by those who are trying to keep this strictly a New England/European affair. There have been many discoveries elsewhere in the country of skeletons clad in copper armor or vestments. (Authors comments).

Fossis..................

 

[TreasureTales]

I gotta get me a copy of that Weird America book. I'm just weird enough to truly appreciate it. LOL

Talk about a conspiracy. This is the one to beat all others.

 

[Nick in NEPA]

Re: Was Columbus the First Explorer to Visit the Americas? The Evidence Says NO

As I have mentioned in a previous post, I have had an obsession with ancient Egypt since I was four. Today, I was reading a book by Rosalie David after reading this post. There was a picture of a corpse that was buried in the sand and eventually mummified. There were some of his grave goods displayed with him, and one of them looked almost exactly like AN AMERINDIAN CROCK. Google 'Ginger desert mummy' or something similar, look at the pics, see for yourself. Maybe I'm crazy, I could be right. Let me know your opinions, PM or on this post.