Was Columbus the First Explorer to Visit the Americas? The Evidence Says NO!

[TreasureTales]

Scotto started a thread in Today's Finds that evolved into a brief discussion of who got to the Americas first - Columbus or others? Rather than continue to hijack scotto's thread, the discussion will begin in earnest right here.

What do you think? What evidence do you have to support such claims? Or do you think this is much ado about nothing?

Let's have some experts weigh in, and let's hear from everyone else who finds this topic fascinating.

 

Amazon Forum Fav 👍

Treasure of Victoria Peak - Grab it through Amazon!

[Oroblanco]

Re: Was Columbus the First Explorer to Visit the Americas? The Evidence Says NO

Content deleted due to new copyright rules at Treasurenet, apologies if this offends anyone.

Oroblanco

 

[TreasureTales]

For quite some time I've been trying to find answers to these questions. Maybe I'll finally get them anwered right here on TNet.

#1) Did the people who ultimately became the Native Americans actually get to this continent by crossing the Bering Land Bridge during the last ice age? Or did they arrive by sea?

#2) Why do some of the oldest Native American artifacts exhibit a higher craftsman skill level than subsequent examples? Did ancient peoples make them, or teach how to make them?

#3) Why are there Native American legends about the "ancient ones," who were said to be either "little people" or "giants," living in caves and caverns? Could the "ancient ones" have been the last remaining descendents of ancient explorers?

#4) Were bows & arrows a natural evolutionary development in weaponry? Or did the Indians learn about the tools only when visited by ancient and unknown explorers?

#5) Where did the Melungeons come from?

#6) Are the Native Americans part of the Lost Tribes of Israel as claimed by the LDS founder Joseph Smith?

#7) How could a Native American be 6'7" tall and have blue eyes? Those features were attributed to Chief Solano of California - features that did not match his fellow Suisun tribe members.

#8) How can some unusual and ancient pieces of "treasure" be explained if not through pre-Columbian exploration?

#9) Did any ancient peoples of Asia and Europe visit, settle, trade, and die off in the New World?

#10) Who were the people whose remains have been found in various locations throughout the United States, pre-dating 9,000 years, and whose skulls show no similarities to Native Americans? Kennewick Man came from where?

 

[TreasureTales]

Some background info for the questions in Reply #2 above:

Question #1 - Bering Land Bridge - http://www.cabrillo.edu/~crsmith/bering.html

Question #2 - Finely Crafted Artifacts - http://www.sdsmt.edu/wwwsarc/collectn/stone/folsom.html

Question #3 - Legends of "Little People" - http://www.firstpeople.us/FP-Html-Legends/LittlePeopleoftheCherokee-Cherokee.html

Question #4 - Native American Weaponry - http://www.webcom.com/outbooks/NativeAmericanWeapons.html

Question #5 - Melungeons - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Melungeon

Question #6 - Native Americans descendents of Lost Tribe of Israel - http://www.native-languages.org/iaq9.htm

Question #7 - Chief Solano - http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?file=/c/a/2002/11/21/SP170740.DTL&type=printable

Question #8 - Ancient "Treasures" in New World - http://www.lauralee.com/news/grandcanyon.htm

Question #9 - Evidence of Ancient Peoples in New World - http://www.heavener.k12.ok.us/community/local_authors/gloria_farley.htm

Question #10 - Kennewick Man - http://www.centerfirstamericans.com/mt.php?a=87

 

[bakergeol]

Surprising evidence has emerged recently. The old dogma was that the Clovis culture was the oldest but apparently it isn't so. A lot of Archies quit digging when they encountered Clovis material at a dig. They thought that the Clovis habitation was the oldest and nothing would be below the Clovis interval. Looks like successive waves of emigration from cultures in the Pacific. What was interesting was that one Archie thought that the Clovis culture in the US actually came from France. Just followed the edge of the ice glaciers across the Atlantic to reach the US. There is some evidence to support this as Clovis sites become older as you travel east.

Should be an interesting chapter in human history when it is all figured out.

George

 

[TreasureTales]

Oh please tell me the French weren't here first. LOL

 

[scotto]

Fossis will have to chime in here.......

I know there are stories and rumors that there were many unusual finds that were either covered up, or some recovered items were supposedly dumped into the ocean by the Smithsonian. :P

Truly sad. The whole "Columbus" thing is a joke, IMO.

 

[TreasureTales]

Right on scotto, some of the information covered in the background info I linked for Question #9 states the Smithsonian has been in the forefront of "losing" evidence and has been guilty of outright denial of any civilizations that pre-date the Native Americans. Conspiracy theory of the 19th century or fact? There is enough envidence now to prove it is in fact a real cover-up.

 

[Nick in NEPA]

Re: Was Columbus the First Explorer to Visit the Americas? The Evidence Says NO

There are many Indian words with European and Scandinavian origins. There were Roman coins in Venezuela in a jar on the beach. There is a Roman wreck WITH amphorae in Venezuela. There is a huge list of evidence that debunks the Columbus fairy tale.

 

[fossis]

Hey Guys, Just got in from another day in the great Outdoors, visited the sick in a VA hospital, took my third cousin family history he had never seen, hit a few yard sales, & took pic's of a giant wood Fossil, posted on (Fossils), also gathered some cone in cone Fossils.
I will chime in as soon as I can, Great post, Treasure Tales.
Fossis.................

 

[BIG61AL]

I firmly believe that there were not one but several migrations to north and south America. I also believe that the native Americans were Asian in origin and that sea faring peoples of Europe did infact travel vast distances including as far as the west coast of the Americas long before the vikings and Columbus were on the east coast. Small vessels could have traveled close to shore along the African, Asian continent all the was to alaska and down the the coast all the way to south America. Remember just because the evidence for this has rotted away with time does not mean it did not happen.

 

[fossis]

Regarding the Cherokee little people, A newspaper reported with the name of,S.W. Ross, told the INDIAN PIONEER PAPERS , in the 1930's, a story that happened before the Civil War of Prominent Cherokees on a fox hunt, & the dogs chased a small, man, (like a midget) with long, black hair, through the brush, after he disappered, the dogs quit the chase. Wierd!!! The Choctaw's in my area, also have stories about little people, & they hated (Old Hickory), so much for the trail of tears, that they wouldn't carry a $20.00 into their house at the end of the day.

Fossis.................

 

[sonny0065]

Very interesting thread. I really enjoy reading about the prehistory of the americas. From what I have read over the years, I believe that there have been a number of people from different parts of the world here before Columbus. I also believe that there were people here before the time period commonly thought to be the earliest. All Columbus discovered anyway was the islands in the caribbean. Sorry, I didn't mean to talk so long. HH Sonny

 

[fossis]

On one of Columbus's trips back to Spain, he left some of his crew behind, & while exploring nearby islands, they found IRON COOKING POTS!!! (someone got there first).

Fossis.................

 

[Oroblanco]

Re: Was Columbus the First Explorer to Visit the Americas? The Evidence Says NO

Content deleted due to new copyright rules at Treasurenet, apologies if this offends anyone.

Oroblanco

 

[Oroblanco]

Re: Was Columbus the First Explorer to Visit the Americas? The Evidence Says NO

Content deleted due to new copyright rules at Treasurenet, apologies if this offends anyone.

Oroblanco

 

[fossis]

Hello Orablanco, great stuff, I will get back on the (iron pots) story, my books have been in storage,(I can't even find my autographed copy of Gloria's book).
Have you seen True West, April 1983 issue? It has a great story of small mummified people found in Wyoming, one sitting on a ledge, in a cavern blasted out of solid rock, by miners.
A long list of calamities befell the people who were in contact with the mummies, I have the book with great pictures.
(the mummies were x-rayed & found to be genuine).
Regarding ancient peoples, I quote from Jim Brandon's book
(Wierd America), Yell CO.AR, The Aikman mounds, in a remote area near Bluffton in the sw corner of the co, midway between Ft. Smith & Hot Springs, have been found to contain hugh numbers of human skulls, Washington University, St Louis, & the University of AR, Fayetteville, sent teams to excavate here in the late 1920's.
They found that many of the skulls had been crushed, & this has led to speculation that their owners might have been clubbed to death in a great prehistoric battle. there were also large quantities of bracelets, rings, & animal bones.

Another such mass grave was uncovered by a professor Edwin Walters closer to Ft. Smith in 1898. In a 30 acre area, he found hugh numbers of skeletons,many of which had crushed skulls or spearheads lying among the ribs. The battle, if that was what it is, has been estimated as occuring about 8,000 years ago,( in another report , he said 20,000) & must have caused the deaths of about 100,000 persons. this would make it one of the greatest battles of all history & certainly one of the most intense.

I have a newspaper article regarding the same story, A booklet called (Ft. Smith, Souvenir of the Queen city of the southwest), by RH Mohler, published in 1898.
According to the booklet, when the Kansas City, Pittsburgh & Gulf Railroad was built through this area workers discovered many human skeletons at Redlands, eight to nine miles southwest of Ft. Smith.

Proffesor Walters, eminent archaeolist-geogolist of the time investigated. He said 60,000 to 100,000 indian warriors had been killed in battle more than 20,000 years earlier when the moundbuilders tribe from up north clashed with the Mayas from South America.
They were two great races contending for North American supremacy.
the battle line was south of the Ar river, Walters studied for 17 years, some bones were cleft with javelin, some skulls pierced by spears, & stone axes.
neither side won, & both retreated, eventually to disappear from the earth, it was he theorized, the biggest fight ever on this continent.
But the Archaelogists in this area don't want to talk much about it,
much less mention it in a history of the area. (I plan to read the book), it is not allowed to be checked out of the library. remember, this man spent 17 years studing this. ( not in FT. Smith library).


(more on giant & little people)

In another quote from WIERD AMERICA, BY JIM BRANDON,
Near Grand Canyon South Rim, 90 mi. NW of Flagstaff; permission of The Havasupai Tourist Enterprise, Supai, Az 86435, is necessary for entry. Inquire in advance for best access route. This is the site of a freizelike band of rock carvings that are full of riddles, among others, there is an apparent likeness of a carniverous, dinosaurlike creature- presumably Tyrannosaurus rex- that no human eye should have seen, since according to standard chronology, dinosaurs vanished at least 20 million years before human beings appeared.
Aside from the putative dinasour, other extinct animals such as the North American rhinoceros are more clearly visible. One figure is undoubtably an elephantidaean, possibly a mammoth, and seems to be fighting with a humanoid who, if drawn to scale, would be about 10 feet tall. Dating of the glyphs has been practically impossible, but their 20 foot height above the canyon floor is intresting, leading to speculation that they must have been made when the creek was much higher, an inestimable amount of time ago(or else by giant artists!).
the only way to reach the figures today are either to be let down with a rope from above or through the use of long ladders. the pictographs were made by chipping through a black scale called (desert varnish), on the surface of the red sandstone. this oxide is extremely slow to form, but it has already layered over the pictographs. again, a sign of an age so vast as to make the chronologies of the !! Bering Strait boys!! seem paltry.


Fossis.................
























I

 

[TreasureTales]

WOW! Thank you Oroblanco for answering my questions. Leave it to this forum to have such knowledgable and generous members. When your book is published, sign me up for an autographed copy, please.

I harbor no ill will towards Columbus. I think he gets a bum rap each October 12 precisely because he did nothing new. LOL But it does point out the power of omission, and the huge coverups that have been taking place in the scientific community. The Kennewick Man story is one of the most controversial evidentiary issues in modern archaeological and anthropological times. If Kennewick Man predates the Amerindians as America's first settlers, what will become of the Native American casinos? (I jest, of course.)

Now I will tell a local story about small people living in a mountain. I first heard this story about 3 years ago at a gem and mineral club meeting. The guest speaker was retired from the military and had subsequently done some other government work in which he would often fly over the nearby extinct volcano on his way to another location. The volcano fascinated him to such an extent that, upon his final retirement from government service, he and his wife moved to the town that sits at its foot. He began to learn as much as he could about the geological history of the mountain and soon learned that the mountain itself was a primary feature in the Native American culture, Indians who had lived in view of it for thousands of years. They called it Konocti. The man joined a preservation and exploration group, a group that made regular trips up the mountain in hopes of learning more about it. He said that on one such trip they discovered a giant stone head, the size of a VW bug on end, which was covered in thick brush and lichens and was unrecognizable as anything but a boulder until one member of their exploration team pulled some of the lichen off of what turned out to be a large stone nose! Nothing like it had ever been found in the region before. It was nothing the natives had ever mentioned in their oral histories as theirs - instead is was something that the "ancient ones" had made. He also learned that the Pomo Indians (the Native Americans of the area) had a legend about a race or tribe of small people who lived in the caverns and caves that dot the side of the volcano. The Pomos said the little people were not Pomos, and that they were "the ancient ones." How such small people could carve a large stone head defies logic, but it seems they managed to find a way. Not so dissimilar to other ancient accomplishements.

There was also a 3' carved stone fish, found when a local farmer plowed his field, that also is inconsistent with the Pomo people. People were here before them, but who? We may never know because to date no human remains of a small race of people have been found - or have they? Who can trust the scientists to be forthcoming?

Given the age of this planet, it seems very likely, to me anyway, that peoples have roamed the earth since day one, looking for a better life and/or for peace. To assume the scientific community has all the answers - or will provide all the answers - is to be missing out on a lot of fascinating information.

More, I want more!!!!

 

[Nick in NEPA]

Re: Was Columbus the First Explorer to Visit the Americas? The Evidence Says NO

Oroblanco- gold coins? Do you know anymore on this one?

 

[scotto]

Wow, great post Oroblanco!