Possible trade item

[USNFLYR]

I found this item yesterday along the Columbia River. The item is "plyable" so I assume it to be pewter. But it could be copper as well. It was buried six inches deep, yet emitted a strong signal so I dug it. I almost threw it away when the dirt pile did not yield a buckle as hoped for! Later I noticed the intricate markings on one side (lower/outer side of plate), and that it has been cut by shears. Which got me thinking.......

Why would a person take the time to cut a plate up before tossing it out? Who in the Oregon fur trading era would "dull" their cutting devices to clip a plate?

I have heard of early mariners using "all things" metal to trade with the indigenous population. Also, the Columbia River had a lot of ship traffic to Hudson’s trading post (fort) and many trappers in the field upstream. I suspect it was originally owned by a sailor or a trader.

Any advice from the experts on this sub forum would be greatly appreciated!

 

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[Older The Better]

If it is pewter, maybe it was cut up into more practical pieces to melt down into round balls, or it could have been on its way to becoming an arrowhead.

 

[USNFLYR]

Good theory about the round balls ... that is a possibility!

 

[releventchair]

Dang. Experts required.
I'm out.

 

[Ia.FurTrade]

Dang. Experts required.
I'm out.

Me too!!!

Iowa Dale

 

[nagant]

Maybe they cut it up to make jewelry/trinkets or inlay work.

 

[smokeythecat]

I don't think it's pewter. Pewter in the ground, even 50 years turns a funky grey white and tends to literally shatter.

I think you have silver there, I'd test it. AND...yes, I think it was used as a trade item by American Indians. They would commonly cut these with whatever they had to make decorations out of. Congratulations.

Here is a picture of a Northeast trade earring made of silver, 18th century, for comparison.

 

[IMAUDIGGER]

i would have expected a hammer and chisel would have been used to cut it, not nippers.
Did the trappers typically use shears to cut up trade silver?

 

[A2coins]

Me 2

 

[eyemustdigtreasure]

Yep, that metal could be silver....!
Test it, and TREASURE it, as it is a great Find...1

 

[Ia.FurTrade]

i would have expected a hammer and chisel would have been used to cut it, not nippers.
Did the trappers typically use shears to cut up trade silver?

The Indian's cut up the Trade Silver with shears they traded for from the Fur Traders..............

Iowa Dale

 

[USNFLYR]

Hey gang...thanks for the replies!

I did in fact take the item to the grass and used my metal detector to get a reading ....

..... it was solid "nickel" on the meter. It was definitely far from the "Silver" range. The item was definitely a plate. The back side had a design....floral?


I will keep researching....

 

[USNFLYR]

I will try to grab one of my wife's pewter heirlooms and check with the detector for a reading. If it shows up at the same range than I can rule out Nickel/Silver

 

[Muddyhandz]

Well, if you held a gun to my head and demanded an answer I would say it's the cut up base of a "pewter" gooseneck kettle.
I have more experience with copper/brass trade kettles but do know that traders, explorers, etc. personally owned "gooseneck" kettles.
I'm not sure if they were used as trade items but they were found at underwater rapid sites (Quetico research team) with typical trade goods.
Could be from a plate but not a gorget or any other adornment that I could think of.
No doubt it was cut up to utilize the metal for some sort of implement made on the go.
Lot of traffic on the Columbia back in the early 1800's!

#Funny, the book I was thinking about has a gooseneck kettle right on the cover!

https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Voices_of_Rapids,_by_Wheeler,_Kenyon,_Woolworth,_Birk,_1975.jpg

 

[USNFLYR]

Muddyhandz..... I like your theory! I always assumed it to be a plate. Although, the plate option is still viable, I now question why the plate would have the "eating" surface clean, and the underside surface with the ornate design. Also, the piece is now almost flat. But originally, I could imagine two dimensions. The lip and surface almost making a ninety degree angle. In looking at both copper and pewter versions rarely is the bottom/base ornate. Mostly they are clean, with only number stamps or makers marks.

I could see this being the lid of a kettle. The curled in lip would wrap along the wall of the kettle, leaving the design side to be viewed from above. Missing in my theory is that there would be a top/handle...but the room for that is possible as the the pie slice I have indicates a large lid.


These are working examples to the kettle top theory......

 

[beadman2]

My opinion would be its silver, that would patina ,grey to black...prob not pewter as that would be pitted and patina grey & sometimes "scale"...similar to lead....copper patinas brownish red to green,its not iron,brass is same as copper,sometimes with zinc ,will produce red green....and sometimes you have mixed alloys such as "gunmetal" as in some Jesuit rings.....the indians absolutely cut with scissors as someone suggested ,same way the iroquois would cut copper kettles to make brass Madison pts...hope that helps....I'm not an expert ,but have experience,I really dont think anyone is an expert ,history constantly gets proved wrong cause there is a lot no one really knows ,even archeologists r still learning new things ,and theres a lot of missing information.......common sense works...
..if you found this near indian occupation, its prob that if not ..."it could be" ...but it could also be pioneer....maybe look up Ottawa indian silver type artifacts, in Michigan that will give you an idea of what kind of things they made out of any sheet silver....best regards

 

[USNFLYR]

Thanks beadman...will get on the research!

 

[DetectingGodlikeOnOlympus]

One of the hallmarks of my very early sites in the American West is that the artifact assemblages largely consist of random scraps of metal. Fabrication of tools and decorations from other implements was a staple. Fragments of kettles are common. Cold chiseled metal pieces are common. I also encounter early muskets which were disassembled and turned into other tools, like using the barrel as a hide scraper for example.

It's hard to say if your piece is a Native trade item as early Anglos also had to adopt some of these same strategies, and the Columbia river drainage had plenty of both. I think there is a very good chance it is a Native trade good, though. I agree with Muddyhands on the identification, and I also believe it is made of pewter. Lots of people from back East will have a hard time understanding the level of preservation that is possible in the West.

You will need more artifactual evidence to determine the truth. Do not discard any tiny scrap. Early Indian camps in the West can be very ephemeral, and everything together will tell us the story.

 

[USNFLYR]

Very nice advice. I have saved every scrap of metal...just with the possibility that the early Native Americans once attempted to mold the metal....

Thanks!