Any experts on old (really old) records out there?

[Tallone]

I couple of weeks ago, I picked up a stack of 22 old 78 rpm records. Paid $15 for them.



Normally I stay away from stuff like this but I bought them because many of them have the original sleeves and there appeared to be some old jazz or blues records in the pile.

In the stack was this record by The Georgia Crackers:



A little eBay research suggested this might be the best of the lot. I listed it on eBay yesterday and it is getting a lot of attention (4 watchers in the first 12 hours of the listing). I also got a message from someone asking about the numbers pressed into the wax. So, I posted a couple of more pictures and responded to the question with this info:

Side with Diamond Joe: Above the label reads "A-1", below the label reads "W80597B" (with the "W" inside a circle).

Side with The Coon From Tennessee: Above the label reads "A-2", below the label reads "W80595B" (with the "W" inside a circle).​

I presume these numbers have something to do with when the record was pressed but I admit I'm ignorant of such things.

Also, printed on the label is the following text: "Made and Pat'd in U.S.A. Jan. 21 '13 and May 22, '23"


I presume the Jan. 21 date is the patent date and the May 22 date is the date the actual recording was made. Would that be correct?

I would appreciate it if someone would educate me on this stuff. TIA.

 

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[jerseyben]

The Radio Phono Shop sticker is very cool!

 

[jeff of pa]

this Vid says was originally recorded 1920's

 

[jerseyben]

I bet this guy would love to get his hands on it:

Joe Bussard - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

 

[Tallone]

Cool to hear the Crackers perform. Thanks for posting that, Jeff.

I contemplated (for about 5 seconds) trying to remove that record shop label but then realized it represented a piece of this record's history and I would probably damage the Okeh label in the process so it will remain. With a collection that large, I would be surprised if Mr. Bussard doesn't already have this one.

Any info on what the numbers mean would be greatly appreciated.

 

[nathan104]

Lots of info on the marking here.

markings on, and in, 78 rpm records

 

[Tallone]

Great stuff there, nathan! Thanks for that link. Assuming the guy that wrote that web page knows his stuff, I now know that this record was made sometime after 1925 because it has the "W" in a circle indicating it was made using Western Electric's recording equipment. I guess that the "A-1" means Diamond Joe was recorded on the first take and "A-2" means The Coon From Tennessee was recorded on the second take.

BTW, my eBay listing for this record continues to get a lot of attention. It has been listed less than 24 hours and has had 23 views with 7 watchers. 3 watchers have come on board in the last 7 hours.

 

[Tallone]

I found a little information about the Radio Phonograph Shop in Jacksonville. The following is from a 1928 edition of a publication titled Talking Machine World:

This is a jazz age in which we are living, and so the jazz methods of advertising the new records are frequently the best methods to use. For proof of that one need but go to Jacksonville, Fla., and look at the Radio Phonograph Shop run by William C. Gillespie. Mr. Gillespie is a live wire when it comes to merchandising. He always is doing something new that gets the attention of those who pass his store.

Recently he has been having quite a run on spirituals and blues, and in order to put the new numbers over big he has adopted regular carnival ballyhoo methods. The accompanying photos show two examples of this ballyhoo method. The one was a sidewalk display, whereas the other was a full window trim with all the fixings. But in both cases the central idea of the number was ballyhoo in the good old style, in each case sales of the number featured increased to a marked degree, according to reports at this establishment.

Frequently the crowd is so thick that it is almost impossible to get past the store. And the people are not all lookers either. In three days he will sell as many as five hundred to a thousand records of a new number, which is certainly selling them in a city with about a 100,000 population. When it is borne in mind that there are other shops in addition to the Radio Phonograph Shop this would appear to be a record of which to be proud. Mr. Gillespie makes it a rule to get a run out of a record while it is new, and as soon as another new one comes along that is good he ballyhoos that and cashes in on it before the fad dies out. That is one of the secrets of his success.
​

Unfortunately, the web page just had text of this publication. I would love to see the photos mentioned in the article.

HA! Persistence pays off. I found a copy of the article, including the photos. Here is Mr. Gillespie's shop:

 

[Ursus]

Let us know how this turns out. I remember some time ago that overall, the only old records that do well are old bluegrass and jazz. I have looked ( with no success ) ever since for them. Great finds!

 

[Tallone]

As of this morning, my listing for the Georgia Crackers record has 54 views, 13 watchers, and 1 bid (for $29.99). The auction closes Wednesday night. With that many watchers, I think the chances are good that I will get a few more bids. I'll post up the final result.

 

[dumpsterdiver]

Thats always been one of my favorite versions. I once heard that Diamond Joe was actually a gambling boat.

 

[Tallone]

The auction closes tonight. Still just the one bid but there are now 15 watchers. Hoping for lots of bids in the closing minutes.

 

[texasred777]

Tallone, that's a great find! When I was in junior high school, I bought a large box of old records from a shoe repair shop. I went to school with the owners son. I had stopped by the shop one day to see if Kenneth was there helping his dad. It was Saturday and Kenneth wasn't there. I saw this box of records on the floor and asked Mr. --- what they were. He said they were for sale if anyone had two dollars to pay for them. He said they were old and were no longer listened to by his family. I looked through several of them and didn't recognize any of the songs. But I had the money and bought them. Dad took me in the car to get them. I played the records one by one and only had about 12 or 15 that I was interested in. Dad didn't recognize very many of the songs. I believe there were about 60 or 70 of the records; could have been more. Several of my friends and I took most of them out into a field and 'sailed' them until they were broken. Someone made us pick up the pieces. The only name that I remember is 'Tears on My Pillowdown'. No idea now who the artist was. This may give someone an idea of how old they were. I bought them sometime in the mid to late 1950s. I don't know what ever happened to it.
My 7th grade English teacher had an old RCA cylinder-type record player, had the dog 'listening to his master's voice' (I believe that was the phrase). She would bring it to school once or twice each year and show it to the class. She had several of the cylinders. I don't remember what was recorded on them. I was in 7th grade during the 1955-56 school year. I've often wondered what happened to that player. It would probably be worth a fortune today!

 

[Tallone]

The record sold last night for $61.00. Not exactly the $7,000+ somebody recently paid for an old Robert Johnson 78 but I'm happy with it! Especially since I only paid $15.00 for 22 records (this among them). There are a few others in the lot of 22 that I will probably list soon but I don't think they will bring anywhere near $60.

 

[Tallone]

So I've been doing a little more research on a few of the records in this group. I think I may have another winner.



Burnett and Rutherford warrant a nice writeup on the web site, Roots of American Fiddle Music:

Roots of American Fiddle Music

This record appears to have been recorded sometime between 1926 - 1930. The record appears to be in very good condition and the paper sleeve is in remarkably good condition given its age. I only found one other Burnett and Rutherford 78 that has sold recently on eBay. That one went for almost $50.