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Thread: Sometimes you cannot go back any further

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  1. #1
    mx
    May 2010
    859
    357 times

    Sometimes you cannot go back any further

    Sometimes you simply can't go back any farther. My father, born in 1907, long deceased, had an incredible memory until the very last. He had listened to his father and mother and siblings telling what they were told about family history.

    Allegedly, 7 sibling family members came over in a group to Brooklyn, then most dropped out of contact. Two of the brothers moved to Iowa, and lived miles apart in the same country. We knew what their father's name had to be, because of the Irish tradition of naming the eldest son after the grandfather

    But, though a distant cousin spent most of his adult life seeking documentation, we found no solid proof until a younger brother joined LDS. Hew as able to obtain permission to enter the mountain in Utah, and a high ranking official showed him that man's birth records, 1790's in Newry.

    But. though my father was told the names of the other 5 siblings, we have found no solid documentation to show where they went. Census and other records show such individuals in NYC, but William and George and Terrence were common names, so it tells you nothing.

    It was alleged several might have gone on to Australia. Family Matching DNA does show a fourth or fifth cousin in Australia. But, when I contacted him, all he could tell me was the common ancestor was reported to have come walking down the road one day, and asked for something to eat, then married into the family. I assume that was back in Ireland, but I am not totally sure of that. It might well have happened in Australia in the first years. I do think that man who came wandering in was probably from my family, part of the siblings that went to Australia, but am convinced we will never know.

    I do know my male ancestry came from Ireland, and DNA reports the Irish were mostly migrants from the Iberian Peninsula, 5000 to 10000 years ago. Thus, since 2/3 of Mexican men are descended from the Spanish, my y-markers are very close to my neighbors here in the mountains of Mexico.

    There are some cynical people who believe that there are in fact good records in Ireland, and they are sitting on them, to keep the genealogy funds flowing, pretending they were destroyed. I can't say this is not true; I can only say I don't believe it.

  2. #2

    Mar 2017
    23
    18 times
    All Types Of Treasure Hunting
    Dna is about all you can rely on. Are you member of ancestry.com, family tree dna, or gedmatch? If not, check them out. We never knew who my grandfather's dad was until dna proved it (or at least close relatives). Good luck.
    Wrightdigger likes this.

  3. #3
    mx
    May 2010
    859
    357 times
    I have used FTDNA for a long time. I even found a fifth cousin by Family Matching, which to me is the only cost effective test. Well, I sent her a message, and told her who my close ancestors were, and she found that my maternal grandfather's grandmother was also her ancestor. I don't know who her other ancestors were, nor do I have that need. But, we did verify a family match.

    It may sound strange to say it, but I can clearly say there is evidence of no paternity errors close to me. Many people do find them.

    Back to OP topic. There are other reasons people lose track. In my case, family oral history said 7 came over in a group. Two went west to Iowa. In those days, people moved out from Brooklyn very fast. So, if the Iowans lost track for a year or two while getting settled, letters back to the address were often not deliverable at all. Once they lost track, there was no mechanism to find each other again. Only with luck by indexed records on the LDS database is there any way to link up.

    I also remember a story about part of a family which left Ireland and went to Canada. Some months later, they received a desperate plea for help from Ireland. "We are dying." They were not yet able to send money, and when they were, they could find no trace of family back in Ireland.

    And, being from the Fighting Irish, sometimes family members got on their ear and simply stopped communicating. Two or three years ago, I got a mail from a woman who saw my name on Ancestry.com, and asked me if I were who I am. She was given up for adoption and moved clear across the US to the border area around 1950.

    It turns out she was indeed my first cousin. One of her brothers lived in the town where I went to high school and I knew of him very well. But, my dad was alienated from that family, because their father was violent to my dad's sister, that is, my aunt. So, we were never told they were close kin. I didn't even know I had all those cousins.

  4. #4
    us
    Kace

    Aug 2017
    MOx2--KS
    Whites DFX SPECTRUM E SERIES
    623
    1242 times
    All Types Of Treasure Hunting
    One thing to remember is that in the not so distant past you could just get up & decide to change your name. Poof!! Old name gone. My Mother's (86) Grandfather did this. Census records showed original name & then his New Name?? I did one side of the family back to 1673, but that is not always the norm. If you go to Elis Island there are tons of info on the dates, ships, staterooms that your family used. There is also a virtual search. The name changes were rampant there. It just depended on who was 'checking you in'. I was fortunate on 3 sides, the 4th was much harder, but I got in contact with another searcher in Ireland that did the hard records search check that never will probably make it online due to them being Smaller Church & Cemetery records that have birth, marriage & death hand written. Wills are also found that way on occasion. I traded her this service for doing her search in the USA. They couldn't find records of some of their ancestors who came here. Most countries have people who will trade services at no cost to either party except time. Just an Idea if you want to go back far.

  5. #5
    us
    Detectorist, Historian, Collector

    Nov 2017
    Southaven, MS
    Garret AT Pro, Fisher F22
    5
    8 times
    All Types Of Treasure Hunting
    Professional genealogist here (I have way too many side jobs, self admitted work-a-holic). The only real way that I know of to get access to those Irish records is to travel there yourself or hire a proxy, usually a college student, or someone who doesn't mind making some copies for you for a big fat fee. It's expensive, and the results are limited by whats available, highly localized, and not always very reliable. Plus theres always some kind of static over there, for whatever reason, concerning those records. The ones I have had success with are Church documents and things, but again, you have to know WHERE to send the proxy, and tell them WHAT exactly they are looking for.

  6. #6
    Charter Member
    us
    Jan 2009
    South East Tennessee on Ga, Ala line
    Tesoro Conquistador freq shift Fisher F75 Garrett AT-Pro Garet carrot Neodymium magnets 5' Probe
    16,588
    7360 times
    All Types Of Treasure Hunting
    Banner Finds (1)
    Back to 1549 on my Fathers side.Mothers side not as far but well documented during the civil war.
    Please read our rules and enjoy the site. TreasureNet.com Rules

    All finds posted by me are from private property with landowner permission.

  7. #7
    Charter Member
    us
    Jul 2017
    Texas
    bounty hunter time ranger bounty hunter quick draw 2
    2,096
    2604 times
    Metal Detecting
    My dad traced his side of the family back to 1600's then couldn't back any further
    proud descendant of three Alamo soldiers

  8. #8
    Charter Member
    us
    Nov 2012
    Maryland
    XP Deus, Tesoro Cibola
    8,025
    10735 times
    All Types Of Treasure Hunting
    Banner Finds (4)
    I have some of my line back to Edward I of England. We went everywhere, did everything and bought every last t shirt out there. Had 9 ancestors fighting for the Americans in the Revolution, had a land grand in Mississippi from the Spanish in 1799, and family names like Lee, Washington, Carter, you know, the little things. Got to actually visit the ancestral home at Stratford Hall, In Virginia, the home of the Popes and the Lees, and took my daughter there. It was quite the experience to stand on the actual piece of land at "The Landing" where our family came into this land about 1660.
    Wrightdigger likes this.

  9. #9
    Charter Member
    us
    Sis

    Jun 2017
    Ohio
    AT MAX, Delta 4000
    1,690
    2464 times
    All Types Of Treasure Hunting
    Quote Originally Posted by smokeythecat View Post
    I have some of my line back to Edward I of England. We went everywhere, did everything and bought every last t shirt out there. Had 9 ancestors fighting for the Americans in the Revolution, had a land grand in Mississippi from the Spanish in 1799, and family names like Lee, Washington, Carter, you know, the little things. Got to actually visit the ancestral home at Stratford Hall, In Virginia, the home of the Popes and the Lees, and took my daughter there. It was quite the experience to stand on the actual piece of land at "The Landing" where our family came into this land about 1660.
    thats pretty awesome
    piegrande likes this.


    John 15:12-13
    12 My command is this: Love each other as I have loved you. 13 Greater love has no one than this: to lay down one’s life for one’s friends.



    I'm in last place, if I place at all
    But there's hope for this underdog
    ~Audio Adrenaline~

 

 

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