Met a jerk today

[Blacksheep]

Slow down, and once again dissect your statements slowly to see on-going in-correct inferences:

1) "may adversely effect those neighbors". Sure, once again, if there is some damage or adverse affect, then by all means, DON'T DO IT. We agree on this. What's the problem? The problem is, that you make an automatic connection between metal detecting and damage (or "adverse affect"). I do not. If you, on the other hand, create "adverse affect" and/or "damage", then you are right, do not do it.

2) "berates common courtesies". Do YOU berate common courtesy? If so, then you're doing something wrong. Are you leaving holes? I don't get it. And how about the other neighbor who initially who approached Ray with nothing but a friendly "good luck"? Certainly if Ray, or other md'rs on parking strips, are such an atom bomb, why isn't everyone rushing to their alderman?

It is clear that you have a pre-set mental image that everyone is against md'ing, and that metal detecting means automatic holes, lack of courtesy, etc... To the contrary! I find, when I metal detect, that most people are naturally curious, friendly, and always want to know "what's the best thing you ever found?" and "how deep will it go?" and "gee that looks like fun", etc... But no: your mental image is that we are geeks with shovels stepping over people's beach blankets, leaving holes, blindly stepping out in traffic, and boofing all at the same time. Where do you get all this? Lighten up!

Your back-peddle needs work Tom, I am quite informed on the ins and outs of metal detecting and the nuances in attitude from region to region. I have no preset mental image, the mental image I have of metal detecting was and continues to be formed by what I read right here on TNET and right now at this exact moment in time I see the "me me me" syndrome running rampant. Who cares what the home owner thinks, "Im" not breaking any law! Why should I care if "Im" within "my" rights?

That`s what I see Tom, its ugly and disgusting and you should feel ashamed but doubt you will be. I love treasure hunting but I refuse to bow to a mindset that trampling my neighbors happiness in pursuit of my own is accepted as normal.

The meeting with my alderman is set for next week, no bullcrap.

 

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[Tom_in_CA]

Do you "trample" your "neighbors happiness"? I don't I have no doubt that anyone can approach any bureaucrat, and with loaded false premises like the ones you espouse, get anything they want out-lawed. So too could I beat you to the draw, show up with good images of nice clean neat fun, and get my alderman to declare August 10th of each year "National metal detecting fun" day.

Let's do some simple text swaps, and tell me what's wrong with this picture:

Blacksheep,I am quite informed on the ins and outs of whistling dixie and the nuances in attitude from region to region. I have no preset mental image, the mental image I have of whistling dixie was and continues to be formed by the noise pollution I, right now at this exact moment in time I see the "me me me" syndrome running rampant. Who cares what the guy on the beach blanket next to me thinks, "Im" not breaking any law! Why should I care if "Im" within "my" rights?

That`s what I see blacksheep, its noisy and disgusting and you should be ashamed but doubt you will be. I love whistling dixie but I refuse to bow to a mindset that trampling my neighbors quiet peace in pursuit of my own is accepted as normal.

The meeting with my alderman is set for next week, no bullcrap.

And yes, to answer the question this analogy begs: I do consider metal detecting as innocuous, harmless, and proper personal choice, as the person who chooses to whistle dixie on the beach. Sure, someone now and then will tell the whistler "it bothers me". So what? Move and and ignore/avoid just that one person. It didn't make it wrong to whistle dixie.

 

[Blacksheep]

Do you "trample" your "neighbors happiness"? I don't I have no doubt that anyone can approach any bureaucrat, and with loaded false premises like the ones you espouse, get anything they want out-lawed. So too could I beat you to the draw, show up with good images of nice clean neat fun, and get my alderman to declare August 10th of each year "National metal detecting fun" day.

Let's do some simple text swaps, and tell me what's wrong with this picture:

Blacksheep,I am quite informed on the ins and outs of whistling dixie and the nuances in attitude from region to region. I have no preset mental image, the mental image I have of whistling dixie was and continues to be formed by the noise pollution I, right now at this exact moment in time I see the "me me me" syndrome running rampant. Who cares what the guy on the beach blanket next to me thinks, "Im" not breaking any law! Why should I care if "Im" within "my" rights?

That`s what I see blacksheep, its noisy and disgusting and you should be ashamed but doubt you will be. I love whistling dixie but I refuse to bow to a mindset that trampling my neighbors quiet peace in pursuit of my own is accepted as normal.

The meeting with my alderman is set for next week, no bullcrap.

I do hope the sponsors to this site are paying close attention. 60,000 people in this city may be effected by this Tom. I`m one guy Tom, with nothing to lose (as far as metal detecting goes). I could have been a great advocate for the use of that one specific tool used in treasure hunting (the detector) but now find I am forced to act against that tool because the relative few again cause issue for the great many, how very sad.

One can only imagine what all the "Joe homeowners" think while reading this thread.

 

[thrillathahunt]

Everybody seems to be so testy nowdays.

Like a ticking time bomb ready to go off.

Maybe it's a sign of the times.

P.S. I agree with Tom in Ca

 

[vibes]

Everybody seems to be so testy nowdays.

Like a ticking time bomb ready to go off.

Maybe it's a sign of the times.

P.S. I agree with Tom in Ca

I'm chalking it up to sperm retention.

 

[Tom_in_CA]

good, go do that blacksheep. Go act against those that trample the rights and happiness of homeowners, against those that dig holes, those that are "ugly and disgusting", those that break laws, etc.... Good thing that's not Ray, and the likes of his/our type! Because by all means, these other people you allude to must be stopped!

 

[thrillathahunt]

You are probably right vibes.

Ah for the good ol' days!

 

[Goodyguy]

I do hope the sponsors to this site are paying close attention. 60,000 people in this city may be effected by this Tom. I`m one guy Tom, with nothing to lose (as far as metal detecting goes). I could have been a great advocate for the use of that one specific tool used in treasure hunting (the detector) but now find I am forced to act against that tool because the relative few again cause issue for the great many, how very sad.

One can only imagine what all the "Joe homeowners" think while reading this thread.

Right.............. you are up in arms about something that happened to someone else in another state, where even the police were on the side of the detectorist. So now you are going to try and do what exactly? You want to try and get metal detecting outlawed in your own city because you do not agree with someone Else's personal opinion who doesn't even live in your state?

Are you listening to yourself?

Most any intelligent "Joe" homeowner would not see a problem with someone detecting in an area that is not even their property, when care is given to preserve the turf. Especially if they are reading this thread, because now they know we are not out to do them any harm whatsoever. We are only pursuing our hobby in a lawful manner.


GG~

 

[Jeep]

Ohhhhhh

I like this game

MMmmmm I will see your Alderman and raise you a Senator

Your move

 

[lostcauses]

well i had best satrt with this. It was stated the individual claimed "He then informs me he's with the sheriff's office"

If the person is not, well they need a complaint filed on them.
Impersonating can find some one in a lot of trouble.

just goes with the territory in these trying times...

Permission from the land owner
The land is owned by the city, the city says it's OK to dig it. How EXACTLY does that put metal detecting in a bad light?

MDing friends, PLEASE stop apologizing to the world for obeying the law!

Enemy in the sherifs office? Do you REALLY think this is the first call stupid call they've gotten from this crack pot? DUH. Miserable people like that love to share their misery with everyone else and the cops, who have REAL issues to deal with just ignore cranks like this. The cops know who this freak is and didn't exactly rush over to his aid to stop the evil metal detectoring, did they?

 

[Blacksheep]

I do hope the sponsors to this site are paying close attention. 60,000 people in this city may be effected by this Tom. I`m one guy Tom, with nothing to lose (as far as metal detecting goes). I could have been a great advocate for the use of that one specific tool used in treasure hunting (the detector) but now find I am forced to act against that tool because the relative few again cause issue for the great many, how very sad.

One can only imagine what all the "Joe homeowners" think while reading this thread.

Right.............. you are up in arms about something that happened to someone else in another state, where even the police were on the side of the detectorist. So now you are going to try and do what exactly? You want to try and get metal detecting outlawed in your own city because you do not agree with someone Else's personal opinion who doesn't even live in your state?

Are you listening to yourself?

GG~

I am listening to myself and I can appreciate the opinions of everyone here but at the same time I need to keep my (and my neighbors) small part of the American dream in mind. We all share a rather quiet, shady, tree lined street. We all take pride in how our properties look, spending our hard earned money to maintain the right-of-way in front of our homes.

I have read many threads here about plugs turning brown, popping out, getting pulled out and countless other threads concerning slobs who refuse to fill holes and of course, the "the law says I can" crowd. I have no clue as to which type of detectorist is working his way towards the street I live on and have no choice but to refer back to this thread.

Somebody at least try to show me a real argument as to why I (or anybody else who may silently agree) should change my stance.

 

[Goodyguy]

I am listening to myself and I can appreciate the opinions of everyone here but at the same time I need to keep my (and my neighbors) small part of the American dream in mind. We all share a rather quiet, shady, tree lined street. We all take pride in how our properties look, spending our hard earned money to maintain the right-of-way in front of our homes.

I have read many threads here about plugs turning brown, popping out, getting pulled out and countless other threads concerning slobs who refuse to fill holes and of course, the "the law says I can" crowd. I have no clue as to which type of detectorist is working his way towards the street I live on and have no choice but to refer back to this thread.

Somebody at least try to show me a real argument as to why I (or anybody else who may silently agree) should change my stance.

I doubt anyone wants to detect an area such as you describe, there would be no reason to. We are looking for older areas to detect. I personally would see no value in detecting your type of neighborhood. And especially not without homeowner approval. I have only detected downtown ROW's in older cities. Usually those residences are built far back from the sidewalk and have a fenced yard near the sidewalk and the area between the sidewalk and the curb is clearly city property.
If abandoned then I detect, if occupied I get permission as a courtesy.

GG~

 

[lostcauses]

As for the detecting easements, I simply would not do so. It can upset the people that live in a house that easement is on. I would ask first, LOL might get to hunt the property also.

I can not say the method is wrong, I simple do not know.
It might even have that aspect of what can you find at my place to it.

It would not, and is not my thing. No direct permission, I don,t go.

In this case it was an empty house they were in front of, on easement.
No big deal to most folks.
Makes me wounder what and who that person really was. What is really going on there? In such cases it may be worth calling the local PD and see if they actually called the cops. Never know what going on for sure. The individual might have thought you were watching them for some paranoid reason.

 

[Tom_in_CA]

Ah, so you acknowledge (I'm reading between the lines now) that there are md'rs who will do no harm to the city's grass curb median in front of your house, right? Good! Glad you realize that not all md'rs fit into your previous viewpoint.

Then to answer your question, I would do what any person does, when someone is walking down the street towards yours/my house: Assume they are not morons who are about to rob you, p** on your lawn, or whatever. In the case of md'rs, assume they have the common sense not to leave brown divot marks. I won't even hunt turf in the peak of the summer, when there is the chance that a plug (or a flap, or a screwdriver pry, or whatever) could turn brown. We do all our turf hunting here only when the grass moist, and thus easily re-packs with no evidence. In the peak of summer I turn to other types hunting: beach, old-town demolition sites, relicky sites in the country, etc...

If your assumption is wrong, and the guy makes/leaves a mess, THEN call the cops to complain. In just the same way you would call the cops, talk to your alderman, etc... if I p**d on your parking strip. But there mere fact of someone walking towards your house walking his dog, whistling dixie, swinging a detector, etc... does not mean you pre-emptively call the cops, talk to your alderman, etc... because he might be about to spoil your life.

To be honest with you, I don't even hunt curb medians in housing neighborhoods to begin with, and if I did, I certainly wouldn't pick a neighborhood where I knew there could be a confrontation by an complainer, even if I'm in the right. But if someone gets in my face, for no good reason, ........ that's a different story. I think you are of the impression that a lot of md'rs choose this as a hunt site in their hobby. It is actually not that common, at least where I'm at. The strips here are VERY narrow. But I have heard of some states where the strips are as wide, or wider, than the front lawns themselves. But in any case, it's probably not that widespread, to begin with, as a usual hunt destination. I think the point of this thread is not "Can we run nilly-willy on any public spot we want", but rather, "what to do in a situation like Ray's?"

 

[lostcauses]

Blacksheep
You would like the common courtesy of some one asking before doing, even on the easement. To me it is not an unexpected response. It is why I would ask.

Even though this was in front of an empty place the neighbors took notice. One talked and saw no harm went on there way, the other took offense and here is the thread.

 

[Blacksheep]

Ah, so you acknowledge (I'm reading between the lines now) that there are md'rs who will do no harm to the city's grass curb median in front of your house, right? Good! Glad you realize that not all md'rs fit in your previous viewpoint.

Then to answer your question, I would do what any person does, when someone is walking down the street towards yours/my house: Assume they are not morons who are about to rob you, p** on your lawn, or whatever. In the case of md'rs, assume they have the common sense not to leave brown divot marks. I won't even hunt turf in the peak of the summer, when there is the chance that a plug (or a flap, or a screwdriver pry, or whatever) could turn brown. We do all our turf hunting here only when the grass moist, and thus easily re-packs with no evidence. In the peak of summer.

If your assumption is wrong, and the guy makes/leaves a mess, THEN call the cops to complain. In just the same way you would call the cops, talk to your alderman, etc... if I p**d on your lawn or whatever. But there mere fact of someone walking towards your house walking his dog, whistling dixie, swinging a detector, etc... does not mean you pre-emptively call the cops, talk to your alderman, etc... because he might be about to spoil your life.

I tend to be a bit more cynical Tom, waiting to make that call would result in nothing other than a strong probability of brown spots. Chances that the detectorist in question comes back to check those plugs is slim at best, you know "out of sight, out of mind". He or she has already made their pass and there is no reason for them to return, unlike somebody walking their dog.

Here`s an idea Tom, pick the street you desire to detect and make an effort to make contact with the property owners, be proactive. Chances are damn good you have little if any issue if you introduce yourself and your hobby in a positive light. Would it hurt you or the hobby to be courteous by knocking on a few doors?

lc, I appreciate you (and others) speaking up, to bad others refuse to acknowledge there is a real problem with this particular mindset. Its the same one that closes off lands to hunting, four-wheeling, snowmobiling and many other activities enjoyed by thousands and it needs to change.

 

[BuckleBoy]

blacksheep, the next time you think about parking on the street, think again. because according to you, nobody can park there, it's for city use only and the homeowner of the adjacent property.
you still have to use your head and RESPECT the property you're on.
I like Jeeps idea, nobody questions the working guy, they just let them work and are surprised if anything is fixed

Well, for starters, the property owners don't have to mow or maintain the street. If they did, then maybe--Just Maybe--they might feel a sense of ownership over that part of the front of their house too.

As for the detecting easements, I simply would not do so. It can upset the people that live in a house that easement is on. I would ask first, LOL might get to hunt the property also.

I have always felt that this was the way to approach the curbs and easements situation. Permission rate will be High for this type of small request--as long as the detectorist specifies that it is only the little strip by the curb that they wish to detect on. And simple psychology will work in one's favor for getting permission to detect their yards too: After they have already said yes, they are more likely to give permission for a yard (after seeing that plugs don't turn brown, and no damage is done). Or, one could piss off the whole block by utilizing their "right to detect the curb." It makes no sense to me--why take the chance? This is not a hobby for those who are afraid to ask permission.

Your back-peddle needs work Tom, I am quite informed on the ins and outs of metal detecting and the nuances in attitude from region to region. I have no preset mental image, the mental image I have of metal detecting was and continues to be formed by what I read right here on TNET and right now at this exact moment in time I see the "me me me" syndrome running rampant. Who cares what the home owner thinks, "Im" not breaking any law! Why should I care if "Im" within "my" rights?

That`s what I see Tom, its ugly and disgusting and you should feel ashamed but doubt you will be. I love treasure hunting but I refuse to bow to a mindset that trampling my neighbors happiness in pursuit of my own is accepted as normal.

You are exactly right. It all comes down to whether or not MDists are care about their hobby or only themselves. The greed factor raised its ugly head earlier this year already, when some guy posted that he was traveling around and hunting a bunch of parks with a dozen or so others. When I thought about it, he had every "right" to do it--and yet folks hit the ceiling around here, so much as to level false accusations against him that were deleted from the post! In retrospect, that was a case of "My Greed" vs. "Your Greed." It is ugly, disgusting, and it reflects poorly on ALL of us.


Regards,



Buckles

 

[lostcauses]

" Its the same one that closes off lands to hunting, four-wheeling, snowmobiling and many other activities enjoyed by thousands and it needs to change."

This is true. Yet it is a bit more involved than mindset.
As more people get into such hobbys, the areas become less and less it can be done, with more and more people desiring to do so.

This is they why the rules, and laws get broke, common courtesy and sense goes out the door for a few, which causes damage to all.

In metal detecting the modern detector has allowed a great deal of new folks into the system. Trying to find places to do such and find items becomes less and less. There is a reason it is called a non renewable source.

Folks in there very strong desire to find, push the limits. It will only get worse it seems.

Take the mind set of "DO it until told no" as saying they have permission. It totally goes against any basic considerations of real ethics. I can see this in the easement thing allso.

I can not say they are wrong because I do not know the laws of the area. Yet here is a thread of a confrontation, that so far has ended with out physical harm. The question I have is how long before that does happen.

I already said: if the person is in, and or around LE, as claimed, this whole situation is bad.

In the Off Road Vehicle case it is even easier to see the lack of area as a major part of the cause. They demand more public property to do there thing on.

Even Md'ing has now gotten to that point. It seems the private areas are not being allowed, so the demand for public areas is being used, right or wrong.

It is not just a simple mind set. Yet the end result is more area will be removed as this continues.

 

[BuckleBoy]

I am listening to myself and I can appreciate the opinions of everyone here but at the same time I need to keep my (and my neighbors) small part of the American dream in mind. We all share a rather quiet, shady, tree lined street. We all take pride in how our properties look, spending our hard earned money to maintain the right-of-way in front of our homes.

I have read many threads here about plugs turning brown, popping out, getting pulled out and countless other threads concerning slobs who refuse to fill holes and of course, the "the law says I can" crowd. I have no clue as to which type of detectorist is working his way towards the street I live on and have no choice but to refer back to this thread.

Somebody at least try to show me a real argument as to why I (or anybody else who may silently agree) should change my stance.

Blacksheep, I know that you realize that for every person who approaches these situations with the "I have a right to do so" argument, there is a person like me. Please read my replies to this thread (specifically #140, #156, #189, #263, #353, and #372) if you have any doubts.

http://forum.treasurenet.com/index.php/topic,257946.0.html


Best Wishes,


Buckleboy

 

[Ray in CA]

Blacksheep,

As I have already intimated, I don't go and detect nicely manicured easements. I look for the old, unkept easements. The strip I was detecting was already a brown, dead grassy area. The only thing someone did to it was to mow it to keep it from looking completely like a weed field.

Secondly, I have to assume that you are a treasure hunter of some sort and, like everyone else, enjoy your hobby. But I have a real problem with your type of argumentation because it can be used against even someone like yourself. You said:

I love treasure hunting but I refuse to bow to a mindset that trampling my neighbors happiness in pursuit of my own is accepted as normal.

The fact of the matter is, treasure hunting in all forms is offensive to the happiness of greenies in government and environmentally like-minded people, even when it is proved to have a beneficial impact upon the environment (such as dredging for gold in streams). But that doesn't matter to some people who are intent on imposing their environmental vision upon you and me and our legal right to treasure hunt.

So my question to you is, are you willing to give up your happiness in treasure hunting to pacify those whose happiness is predicated upon a mindset that seeks to completely preserve the environment from people like us despite our legal rights?

Just trying to see if how far you're willing to take your own logic.

HH,

Ray