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Thread: Metal detecting illegal on Massachusetts state beaches July 1, 2014 !!!!!!!

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  1. #391

    Mar 2007
    Salinas, CA
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    Quote Originally Posted by Msbeepbeep View Post
    .... The reason that was stated to me when all this started was the DCR in Mass. wanted to ......
    msbeepbeep, so are you going to change the title to the thread, so that this rumor will die ?

    As for your explanation of why you started the original post, I can understand how ..... following enough dots .... someone could think "oh no, this will mean no more beaches". And so, you "sounded the alarm". But this is where it gets tricky, because unless someone (rank & file rangers, etc...) ever cared to "connect those dots", it might never have amounted to anything. And by forming solidarities to "seek clarifications", etc.... It might have simply brought the very scrutiny we DIDN'T want.

    Let me give you an example: SO TOO in the state of CA, does our park dept. have "cultural heritage" verbiage. And SO TOO, if you follow-enough-dots, you would arrive at word definitions (of "artifact", etc...) to be "50 yrs", blah blah. As to whether or not this was a result of trying to be in-line with NPS wording, I don't know. But that's a moot point. The POINT that remains, is that someone taking a technical reading of CA state parks verbiage (existing no less, not just "proposed"), might conclude that md'ing is not allowed. Because (gasp) you "might find a 50 yr. old coin" .

    But strangely, you can detect CA state beaches till your blue in the face. And it's the EXACT SAME PARK'S DEPT. that administers the inland parks. So *technically*, there would be no reason why the same rules wouldn't apply to the ocean beaches they administer, as well. Hmmm.

    So what do you think would happen, if someone(s) "raised the alarm" and went to "fight" this ? And "seek clarification" ? We might only bring the very scrutiny we DON'T want. Ie.: swat hornet's nests, when the reality is, no one's ever cared.

    Perhaps I'm wrong about the MASS thing. Perhaps someone , even in the practical-application-enforcement end there WAS thinking "here's how we stop those dastardly md'rs". If so, then by all means: glad you fought it.

    But if that was never particularly on their radar as "the intention" of this proposed adopted wording, then odds are: Those md'rs that were forever ignored (ie.: grandfathered in, etc...) might simply have continued to be ignored. I might be wrong about your particulars there, but .... just 'sayin'
    Last edited by Tom_in_CA; Apr 17, 2017 at 01:26 PM.
    45th_Johnny likes this.
    Metal detecting is my one worldy vice!

  2. #392
    us
    Nov 2013
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    I vote with Tom/CA that the thread title needs changing. Especially if its gonna stay a Sticky.
    Tom_in_CA and 45th_Johnny like this.
    "Those who cannot compete intellectually tend to develop a cultural aversion to the whole idea." -- Fred Reed
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  3. #393

    Mar 2007
    Salinas, CA
    Explorer II, Compass 77b, Tesoro shadow X2
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    deleted
    Last edited by Tom_in_CA; Aug 04, 2017 at 10:52 PM.
    45th_Johnny likes this.
    Metal detecting is my one worldy vice!

  4. #394
    us
    I'm a greater believer in luck, and I find the harder I work the more I have of it” ― Thomas Jefferson

    Apr 2016
    Abita Springs....Born in New Orleans
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    Same here in Louisiana


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  5. #395
    us
    Jun 2012
    MA
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    No their intention was to put a stop to metal detecting on all DCR run areas. The beaches were the last areas open to detecting. They were enforcing the rule before it was ever signed into law.
    I think they were going for the blanket rule, one law covers everything, so they could just say no to it all.

    Because Roger Burbrick & Ron had a discussions with the head of the DCR they back off a tiny bit on detecting in the parks (you can only do it if trying to locate a lost item for someone and/or with permission of the park ranger).
    No they had the "no detecting" thing all but unsigned, sealed, and delievered, when we spoke up.
    They were telling people with detectors on the beach, that they couldn't do that here.
    Even later after Roger & Ron got them to let us detect the beaches, there were still some rangers that had not gotten the word that we could.

    We almost didn't catch this before it became law. So no one was stiring the pot yet.
    Once they take a bite out of you its very hard to get that piece back.
    45th_Johnny likes this.

  6. #396

    Mar 2007
    Salinas, CA
    Explorer II, Compass 77b, Tesoro shadow X2
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    Quote Originally Posted by Msbeepbeep View Post
    .... you can only do it if trying to locate a lost item for someone ....
    I dunno about the rest of you, but my wife looses a LOT of rings. And I can certainly commission a friend to go out there and loose a ring from time to time. He merely tosses a silver ring while blindfolded over his shoulder. Runs a CL "lost" ad, to which I reply to.

    Then I self-sacrificingly volunteer my time to go look for said-ring. And .... being the diligent thorough searcher that I am (knowing that sometimes people aren't 100% certain where they lost it), it will require me to make wide circles in the allotted search zone.
    Metal detecting is my one worldy vice!

  7. #397
    us
    Jun 2012
    MA
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    I tried replying to this the other day. Guess it didn't post, it was thru the old app.

    They had made up their minds to put forth the law prior to us protesting the attempted closing of the DCR beaches to detecting. We had not poked the hornets nest prior to that, that i know of. It was a blanket approach by DCR to just say "no" to everything.
    A lot of us were not even aware they had put the law in to be approved untill almost the last minute. They quitely put it in during winter, and it would have taken effect July of that year, if we had not protested.
    45th_Johnny likes this.

  8. #398
    us
    Jun 2012
    MA
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    The rule they have in the parks when your "helping" to find a lost ring or etc. is you must show the found item (s) to the ranger and he keeps everything but the so called "lost" item, which is returned to it's "owner", leaving you with -0- for your time, trouble, and good deed. They may have questions if there are more items found than were stated to have been lost.
    45th_Johnny likes this.

  9. #399

    Mar 2007
    Salinas, CA
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    Quote Originally Posted by Msbeepbeep View Post
    ... and he keeps everything ....
    Msbeepbeep, what you are saying is not unique to Mass. beaches. It is for every speck of public land everywhere. It's wrapped up in 2 different laws:

    1) Lost & found laws of every single state. The cut-off-valuation for the need to turn in items to law enforcement is usually something like $100 or more, etc.... And if no one claimed after 30 days, you'd get the item back. After you pay storage fees, etc... Let's take a show of hands: How many people who proudly post their show & tell rings on beach forums, have promptly run down to the police station to turn them in ??

    2) Laws that forbid "harvest", "take", "remove", etc.... Pertains to park or beach features. So that, of course, no numbskull thinks he can start harvesting the sand for commercial industrial sale. Or take home the park benches, etc.... Could such rules be applied to the things we find on the beach (or park, etc... ) ? SURE. Just ask enough rangers or lawyers , and I'm sure that someone would apply it. After all , we "TAKE" and "REMOVE" things. Right ?

    So what you are saying is not unique there. And .... as I'm sure you can see ........ it's not enforced, nor ever crosses anyone's mind. If it's "thought of" and "enforced" where you're writing about: All I can figure is someone went and made it a "pressing issue" (by perhaps seeking clarifications or permissions ?). I could probably get a similar answer if I asked the right questions, phrased the right way, for every single place I hunt as well.
    Msbeepbeep and 45th_Johnny like this.
    Metal detecting is my one worldy vice!

  10. #400
    us
    Jun 2012
    MA
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    I think they are going for #2 the harvest law, aka -EVERYTHING.
    And you don't even have to ask any of them any thing.
    If they see you detecting they will come up and let you know what their law is in the DCR parks.
    Beaches are still ours to detect.
    45th_Johnny likes this.

  11. #401

    Mar 2007
    Salinas, CA
    Explorer II, Compass 77b, Tesoro shadow X2
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    Quote Originally Posted by Msbeepbeep View Post
    ...
    Beaches are still ours to detect.
    The quickest way to end that, will be if someone goes in asking "Hi. Can I take and remove beach features ?" When they say "no", you then say "so that must mean metal detecting too then, right?". They might agree with that connection of dots. But if they change their stance and say md'ing is ok, then you further clarify and ask about coins over 50 Yr old.

    As for the DCR parks: Perhaps no one NOW is asking "can I ?" questions. But perhaps in the past someone maybe did. Thus making it the "scram" offence that it is now. Who knows ?
    45th_Johnny likes this.
    Metal detecting is my one worldy vice!

  12. #402
    us
    I'm a greater believer in luck, and I find the harder I work the more I have of it” ― Thomas Jefferson

    Apr 2016
    Abita Springs....Born in New Orleans
    AT PRO Fisher F75 LTD AT MAX
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    It's the same here in Louisiana


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

  13. #403
    us
    I'm a greater believer in luck, and I find the harder I work the more I have of it” ― Thomas Jefferson

    Apr 2016
    Abita Springs....Born in New Orleans
    AT PRO Fisher F75 LTD AT MAX
    3,744
    5115 times
    Metal Detecting
    Quote Originally Posted by Tom_in_CA View Post
    I dunno about the rest of you, but my wife looses a LOT of rings. And I can certainly commission a friend to go out there and loose a ring from time to time. He merely tosses a silver ring while blindfolded over his shoulder. Runs a CL "lost" ad, to which I reply to.

    Then I self-sacrificingly volunteer my time to go look for said-ring. And .... being the diligent thorough searcher that I am (knowing that sometimes people aren't 100% certain where they lost it), it will require me to make wide circles in the allotted search zone.
    Will that work! lol I'll do it if so


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  14. #404
    us
    Jun 2012
    MA
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    On the besches we just go detect, no asking.

    Like i said parks if they see you they will stop you, no asking involved.
    But i get what you are saying, Don't invite trouble by drawing attention and asking permission when you shouldn't.👍

  15. #405

    Mar 2007
    Salinas, CA
    Explorer II, Compass 77b, Tesoro shadow X2
    11,201
    7191 times
    Banner Finds (4)
    Quote Originally Posted by Msbeepbeep View Post
    ....
    But i get what you are saying, Don't invite trouble by drawing attention and asking permission when you shouldn't.
    I am only jesting for point of illustration. Of course no one should go "swatting hornet's nests". I'm just wondering if that's exactly what brought about your park's situation. Ie.: maybe no one's asking silly questions NOW, but ... maybe at some point in the past, they did.

    I know of a park here where that's exactly what happened. No one ever had a problem , until a newbie showed up at the kiosk as asked "can I metal detect here ?" His questioned got bandied back and forth between the 2 on duty. One of the picked up the phone and called to some off-site superiors somewhere else (headquarters 100 miles away ?). He returned to the window and told the md'r "no". Then guess what happened ? Others started getting booted.

    So I'll tell you what I'll do Msbeepbeep, for a mere $100 (I accept paypal), I can be persuaded not to consult with your state dept. archie about the old coins you guys find on the beach, and the indian bones you disturb. Extortion at its finest . Muhahaha (just kidding).
    Msbeepbeep likes this.
    Metal detecting is my one worldy vice!

 

 
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