Is there really enough frequency difference between 7.69kHz and 7.81kHz...

Diggin' History

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smokeythecat

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I doubt it. I am not good with the "math" on detectors, but I mostly run my Deus wide open at 74 khz.
 

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Diggin' History

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I doubt it. I am not good with the "math" on detectors, but I mostly run my Deus wide open at 74 khz.

I have four (4) high-end detectors that I run at max freq when I do club hunts - I do not use them for anything else so depending on what that they have seeded would depict what detector I would use.

EDIT: FYI (in case you didn't know), 1-30kHz is considered Very Low Frequency (VLF) and, I forget but I think it's, 31kHz to 300kHz, or near it, which is considered Low Frequency (LF). I'm a bit rusty on my frequency technology these days. I need to get back in school for a refresher course - or maybe not as I could just use the internet and read all about it, right? :grin:

CRAP... things keep popping into my head. LF produces a longer wavelength which allows for detecting deeper targets.

OK... I'm done now.

-DH-
 

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Diggin' History

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If you are interested in what different frequencies are the best for finding targets

If you are interested in what different frequencies are the best for finding targets, check out the video.

This is a video showing some different frequency results on a few different targets using the XP DEUS.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_VlKDhi1MWo\
-DH-
 

Charlie P. (NY)

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At 8 kHz the length of one full wave is 123,000 feet (over 23 miles). So the difference between 7.69 kHz and 7.81 kHz is probably pretty slight within the two feet we search under the coil.
 

smokeythecat

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All Greek to me! Isn't the 74 khz frequency on the Deus HF coil the highest frequency on a vlf machine at this time?
 

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Diggin' History

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All Greek to me! Isn't the 74 khz frequency on the Deus HF coil the highest frequency on a vlf machine at this time?

Smokey, I am fairly certain the Deus is considered LF as it's over 30kHZ. Dealers call it High Frequency which, technically, is correct as it's higher than most other detectors - play on words.

EDIT: I left out that it also uses VLF as noted below. That being said, I believe you are right. Hope I didn't mislead you.

The Deus from 4.0kHz up to 18kHz is still considered VLF on the Frequency Scale but, I look at it this way, if it's 12kHz or higher, it's high enough for general use. Gold is better detected in the 12kHz range - at least in my experience with the lower frequency coils. Somebody correct me if I'm wrong.

I think it is a selling point to say any metal detector is a HF detector. In other worlds, will handle 12kHz Coils and up.

I just know that the frequency scale I mentioned in my above post is a standard for Frequency definition.

Cheers.
-DH-
 

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Jason in Enid

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...to spend $50.00 more for a metal detector?

Open for discussion, comments, and your thoughts in general.

I've been MDing for a very long time and I'm interested in if you think that technology has really changed that much that it could make a difference.

Cheers.
-DH-

Nope, the only difference that would make is to MAYBE get away from a specific source of EMI.
 

SD51

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All Greek to me! Isn't the 74 khz frequency on the Deus HF coil the highest frequency on a vlf machine at this time?

Smokey, here's the specs for the E-TRAC: FBS Technology

Utilizing FBS technology with simultaneous frequencies ranging from 1.5kHz - 100kHz the signal received from the detectors coil is analyzed from a wide range of responses. This allows E-TRAC's advanced signal processing to analyze more target information so that target identification is more accurate.

CTX-3030: FBS 2 combines Minelab's FBS multiple frequency rectangular-wave transmission (1.5 kHz –100 kHz) with advanced digital coil-to-detector communications.
 

Charlie P. (NY)

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Nope, the only difference that would make is to MAYBE get away from a specific source of EMI.

I agree. On my F-75 I can flip through 12.821, 12.876, 12.931, 12.987, 13.043, 13.100 and 13.158 kHz if required to find a "clear" frequency if there is EMI. For lack of any better ideas I usually leave it in the middle - 12.987 kHz.
 

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SD51,

IMHO: Minelab (I love their machines) may "push" many frequencies (harmonics) into the ground, but I believe they only process 2 frequencies per there selected/auto channeling. My understanding is each selected/Auto channel uses two frequencies; one high and one low. Each channel selection groups two different frequencies for searching. I will look into this again to make sure I'm thinking correctly.

Doc
 

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Diggin' History

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Doc,

That Vanquish 540 is looking pretty slick. Trying to find it without the Pro Pack but seems it's out of stock. Can't figure that out though as the 540 Pro Pack is in stock and there are plenty available. Gotta be a marketing thing which I won't play that game. If I decide on the 540 I'll wait until I can get it by itself.

-DH-
 

SD51

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SD51,

IMHO: Minelab (I love their machines) may "push" many frequencies (harmonics) into the ground, but I believe they only process 2 frequencies per there selected/auto channeling. My understanding is each selected/Auto channel uses two frequencies; one high and one low. Each channel selection groups two different frequencies for searching. I will look into this again to make sure I'm thinking correctly.

Doc

Thanks Doc, I knew they didn't use all twenty-eight frequencies concurrently, but I thought I heard they were using three frequencies per channel. Let me know what you find. I've been tempted to take my E-TRAC to a radiation lab that I use to use to have medical device equipment analyzed for radiated emissions testing, prior to getting the equipment certified by U.L.
 

Jason in Enid

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Thanks Doc, I knew they didn't use all twenty-eight frequencies concurrently, but I thought I heard they were using three frequencies per channel. Let me know what you find. I've been tempted to take my E-TRAC to a radiation lab that I use to use to have medical device equipment analyzed for radiated emissions testing, prior to getting the equipment certified by U.L.


The thing is, nobody knows what frequencies are being listened to. The detector could be driving 3 freqs, but there are naturally occurring harmonics coming off those emitted freqs. So, how many are being transmitted, how many harmonics are produced, how many of what are being listened too, what are TID freqs, what are ground analysis freqs?
 

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Diggin' History

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From Minelab: Low Frequency 3khz, Medium Frequency 7kHz, and High Frequency 18.75kHz referencing Coils. Haven't found anything else that says these freqs are the starting point for the Frequency definitions.

-DH-
 

Carl-NC

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Is there really enough frequency difference between 7.69kHz and 7.81kHz...to spend $50.00 more for a metal detector?

DH, for all practical purposes those frequencies are equal. However, the rest of the designs may be very different, and may perform very differently.

EDIT: FYI (in case you didn't know), 1-30kHz is considered Very Low Frequency (VLF) and, I forget but I think it's, 31kHz to 300kHz, or near it, which is considered Low Frequency (LF). I'm a bit rusty on my frequency technology these days. I need to get back in school for a refresher course - or maybe not as I could just use the internet and read all about it, right? :grin:

VLF = 3-30kHz
LF = 30-300kHz

When talking metal detectors we play very loose with terminology. Most detectorists refer to any modern ground-balance IB design as "VLF" whether it is or not. I'm not inclined to nit-pick.

All Greek to me! Isn't the 74 khz frequency on the Deus HF coil the highest frequency on a vlf machine at this time?

The XP ORX runs 81kHz, that's the highest current machine I'm aware of. Back in the bad old days, BFOs typically ran 200-500kHz, with one design (Bounty Hunter) at 1MHz.

The thing is, nobody knows what frequencies are being listened to. The detector could be driving 3 freqs, but there are naturally occurring harmonics coming off those emitted freqs. So, how many are being transmitted, how many harmonics are produced, how many of what are being listened too, what are TID freqs, what are ground analysis freqs?

Of course we know. FBS runs at 3.125kHz and 25kHz. Two frequencies run sequentially, with time-domain demodulation.
 

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Diggin' History

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Carl - NC,

Thanks for the info. My point was to make people think about when upgrading to a new detector, why buy an expensive "single" frequency detector that is close to the same frequency as the one they already have when for a few more dollars you can get a Multi-Frequency detector.

Personally, I like frequencies from 6.xx to 12.xx kHz for around town hunting. I have four detectors that all run over 30kHz but, I only use those for Seeded Coin Hunts or Nugget hunting. Call me lazy but, I don't have to mess with the settings every time I head out the door. :) That's why I'm filling the gaps in my single frequency detectors.

I was going off the top of my head on the VLF and LF frequencies. Didn't miss it by much. :)

I'm currently Looking at buying either a Teknetics Liberator or another Bounty Hunter Land Ranger Pro (since I loaned it to a friend of mine and now she has decided she wants to buy it - sure, why not as I can always replace it) or both... for no specific reason except just to have them. I take friends out trying to get them interested in the hobby and loan out my detectors.

An Equinox 800 is on my buy list as well but, that will be early July before I buy one.

Thanks again for your input! Very good information!

Oh, I started with a Radio Shack detector when I was a kid... trying to remember the model - it was a box with a needle and an on/off knob and had no armrest, just a forward facing handle. I've learned a lot since then but, technology is changing so fast it's about to get ahead of me. Analog is fast going the way of digital but, for now, they still incorporate analog into new digital detectors.

-DH-
 

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