GPR

[thebulgar]

Anyone found something using 'Sensors and software' GPR?
I am eager to buy one, but don't know if they are any good.
Thanks.

[Sandman]

Forget it and save you money for a real detector. When these don't work for people the manufactures says statements like, "Your operating it wrong. You don't have the right mental outlook. Your wearing the wrong color socks."

[jeff of pa]

My Understanding

GPR (Ground Penetrating Radar) is Very Expensive.

Used By Archaeologists In Europe more then around here,
can also be very hard to Interpret

Sort of looking at a Catscan & knowing what to look for.

and Very Expensive.

I don't know of any Hobbyists using them.

[99thpercentile]

Of the three major GPR manufactures (GSSI, Sensors & Software, and Mala) I am biased towards Sensors & Software. They make very good equipment that is reliable and well thought out. They also have very good GPS integration, better in my opinion than GSSI. We just bought a new Sensors & Software PulseEKKO Pro system with most of the low frequency antennas (10 MHz to 500 MHz) and the cart for about $80,000. It isn't cheap and requires some technical know how. Before I would tell anyone to buy a GPR system I would suggest that they get some experience with a knowledgeable user or a training course. Also buy borrow the following two books:

Conyers, L.B., 2004. Ground-Penetrating Radar for Archaeology, edn, Vol., pp. Pages, AltaMira, Walnut Creek.

Daniels, D.J., 2004. Ground Penetrating Radar. in IEE Radar, Sonar and Navigation series 15, pp. 726, eds Stewart, N. P. & Griffiths, H. The Institution of Electrical Engineers, London, UK.

The book by Conyers has almost no math but will conceptually help you get an idea of whether GPR will help solve you problem. You could also try out GPRmax (www.gprmax.org) modeling software to model your target.

I would caution against the idea that GPR is a silver bullet of some sort. As I have said in many other posts, each geophysical method is a tool and may or may not be applicable to your problem. Buying a rather expensive piece of equipment may limit the number of tools in your toolbox. All geophysical equipment is available for rent, as many practitioners don't own any of their own equipment.

[gollum]

Forget it and save you money for a real detector. When these don't work for people the manufactures says statements like, "Your operating it wrong. You don't have the right mental outlook. Your wearing the wrong color socks."

Hey Sandman,

I think you have your acronyms mixed up. GPR is actually based in REAL science (not like MFDs or LRLs). As Jeff stated, it has been used for many years by archaeologists and treasure hunters alike.

What it does NOT do: It doesn't look for metal or any substance in particular.

What it DOES do: It can see disturbances in the layers of earth. It can see if there is an object or empty space underground.

Here is a pic of it being used in Iraq

Mike

[Peerless67]

here is a link to an affordable piece of equiptment thats on this site

http://forum.treasurenet.com/index.p...54433.300.html

[Tim Williams]

Before you go off and spend a ton of money you need to talk to someone that owns one of those. I know a guy that came down for training on my equipment and brought one with him. He was not happy at all. If you want to talk to him email me and I will give you his email address.

Tim

[gollum]

The only way someone will not be happy with a REAL GPR System, is if it is too complex for them to use (many of them are). As I stated previously, these are not LRLs or MFDs. They are based on sound and proven scientific principles, and work the same every time, just like a metal detector. The only way they don't work is if the manufacturer or seller overpromises what they can do (I saw the 200 foot depth claim BS), or if the operator doesn't work them properly.

Best-Mike

[Tim Williams]

Gollum, I agree. He is not happy and I talked with him today and may sell it! Again ask for numbers to people that are using the equipment you wish to buy. If the manufacture does not want to give you numbers or emails, do not buy his products!

Tim

[inletsurf]

Anyone found something using 'Sensors and software' GPR?
I am eager to buy one, but don't know if they are any good.
Thanks.

FWIW

We have used GPR for locating subsurface anomalies (sinkholes) in civil engineering studies. Let me tell you, even for looking large objects, even something like a chest, it is difficult to interpret the GPR data unless you are very experienced. For small scattered objects (coins, etc) it will be useless. For cavities, large changes in densities (like an empty hold in a buried shipwreck in sand) etc, or large metal objects, GPR can be useful.

Also, the GPRs we used, all the data was post-processed in an office rather than real time. Think of it as a shallow typical bottomfinder sonar that you can only look at after the fishing trip.

[99thpercentile]

The "GPR" that is discussed in the forum link that peerless provided is most likely not GPR. In my email and phone conversations with Accurate Locators I am 100% convinced that they don't sell instruments that do what they say. GPR is a great tool, if you know how to use it. It doesn't solve all problems and won't work in many places. The GPR systems sold by reputable manufacturers (GSSI, Mala, Sensors & Software) are expensive and used regularly in the geophysics, archaeology and engineering fields. They are expensive because they are not simple instruments to make. A metal detector is a pretty simple instrument, and hasn't changed much in 50+ years. All real geophysical data is processed later in the office. The office might be a trailer 50 feet from where the data was collected but there are very few instruments that can be processed in real time.

The important issue here is not to think that GPR is a magic bullet. If used by an experienced operator at a site that has geology that will allow for the collection of useful data it is the highest resolution geophysical method available. But you still aren't going to get a 3D image of a buried treasure chest with each gold coin showing up in beautiful detail. At many sites a metal detector is more appropriate, or a conductivity meter, or a resistivity meter, or a gravity meter. Everything in geophysics is site specific.

[gollum]

Hey 99PT,

I have wondered about that USA Locator. It seems to work okay, but was priced way under any REAL GPR Systems I had seen.

What do you think this thing actually does, or more accurately, how would you classify it? I mean, it's not something whackadoo like LRLs or MFDs. It actually does (from what I understand from a couple of people who have them) what it is supposed to do.

Best-Mike

[thebulgar]

I am very eager to go to Bulgaria and look for ancient stuff. The problem is that many people there do metal detecting using the cheaper coil detectors (they call them coin detectors) and everything up to a foot deep (30sm) is scanned and recovered. Some people do that for a living. The good stuff is deeper and chances are is still there, so I must have some tech edge over the locals if I am to have some chance. I checked out some Sensors and Software stuff couple of years ago on the geofis. convention in San Fransisco (Moscone Center) and I was not impresed by the imagery. It was in one color and vague.In other words it was not consumer friendly so to speak, but that was 5-6 years ago. What do you mean by real detector Sandman?