Trouble at East Fork from the homeless/forest trashers today. Livid.

[GoldHunter24k]

So my girlfriend and I randomly decided to go up to Heaton Flats this morning because we had to make a few stops along the way.

We were digging about 500ft below the campground and for about an hour when I noticed a figure standing at the top of the hill staring down at us. I didn't think anything of it when I glanced up and saw he was gone but when I walked up to where my girl was digging I noticed a figure hunched behind a rock at the top of that cliff right before the campsites and what looked like binoculars. Now having years of experience dealing with these types of people, I knew he was up to no good. My girl had been digging which involved a lot of bending over and I noticed that the bugger was looking down at my girl with binoculars just barely visible.

Now I won't have any of that, so I marched up to where the guy was hiding and I noticed they have a huge camp with 4 tents hidden to the left of where the bathrooms are at heaton. They are hiding in those woods and when I walked up I saw trash and crap was everywhere. These guys clearly have been there for months. You can't see the campsite and you would never know it was there unless you walked those tiny trails that leads to the edge where the campsites are. So as I approached I was hesitant because I thought it was just one random guy up there but when I noticed 4 tents there I stayed at the edge of the camp and called out "Hey guy with the binoculars" He replied "yea" Then I told him to "come here" in a stern voice and he came into view but stayed at the other end of the campsite. I told him he was creeping my girl out and he said he was "looking for his friend" well bullshit. You don't stare with binoculars at one spot if you're "looking for your friend." I told him he was making us uncomfortable and he just said "well i don't f-ing care." Big mistake buddy. I am not an enemy you want to have and now you and all your friends are on my bad list.

So I walked back down to the dig the the a-hole stood up on a rock and proceeded to stare down at us with the binoculars making it very obvious. Then his friends came out of their shanty tents and one took his shirt off and they were just standing up there staring down at us. If my girl wasn't there, they would have had another thing coming but out of respect and safety of my girlfriend we decided to pack up. She didn't feel comfortable being there anymore and is now saying that she doesn't think she wants to go back.

I can't express how angry I am that I was run out of the mountains by these shitbags and retaliation is being planned.

So as a warning to watch out for that spot if you don't want to have your day ruined. We only got to dig for about an hour when we were pretty much forced to leave. I will never be scared off a mountain and these guys have made the worst kind of enemy.

This tent site is right before the Heaton Flat campsites on the left. There are small trails that lead to the edge. The tents are completely invisible from any other direction until you walk those trails to see it. Probably how they have eluded the forestry for so long. Why can't they actually do their jobs and get rid of these people and leave us law abiding citizens alone.

Anyway this whole experience has put a bad taste in my mouth about the East Fork and I don't think i'll go back without my Smith and Wesson .40c. Really sucks that we can't feel safe in such a peaceful place. What a shame.

 

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[Aurabbit79er]

That lady hiker sure sounds like an undercover officer to me. she was talking pretty brazen to be in the wilderness alone. She may have been more dangerous than those guys were. I kind of hope she was. Then again, this is just like what the government might try to get us to screw up so they can move in legally and stop us from doing what we like to do. I hope they were just after that 1% you're talking about. Keep in mind though these are public boards. Though conspiracy is hard to prove, it does attract unwanted attention. And as tempting as some things would be to do, if anything happens that resembles what we've talked about here on this board, there could be a lot of unwanted attention paid here. Our society is sitting on the ragged edge. The affluent around us is rising. You know what I mean. I'm as disturbed as anyone regarding situation of the homeless. There but for the grace of God go I. I have been on unemployment for almost 3 months now. I'm not worried about being homeless, and I'm not worried about the world ending. It's almost as if we are entering a modern Wild Western era. I firmly believe we should all be able to defend ourselves. Only money has prevented me from renewing my NRA membership. as a good marksman I'm not afraid of using a gun. And my grandfather told me more than once that gun control is hitting your target. Also my early martial arts training reminds me that my most powerful weapon is my mind. I won't stop going to EF. And Gold Hunter knows I won't tolerate bullies. Expect the unexpected and you will always have the upper hand. When you meet me out there, in the gold fields, I'm sure to have a smile. It's genuine. My character demands that I be cordial and outgoing. I'm also acutely aware of the present dangers around me. As a locksmith, dealing with peoples security, I need to endear their trust that I'm going to help them be secure. The most important tool in my toolbox is trust. And I won't jeopardize that. Also to that end I won't let anyone else jeopardize that, at least within all the legal limits at my disposal. As much as I disagree with some of the government actions and policies out at East Fork, if somebody in the woods is being bad it's good to know that there is a Sheriff with a gun that can respond. For us it may be a simple as going out with a smart phone and video taping these guys, and showing it to the Sheriff. There's nothing illegal about it, and it documents exactly who is causing the problems. There are hundreds of ways of approaching a problem like this, where you skirt the bounds of legality. Ways of intimidation without actual aggression. Of course if they're going to be total xxx holes you may have to put their dixx in the dirt. Most of the time I can keep that from happening. My self-confidence is a lot stronger than my pride, and that has kept me out of a lot of trouble, but I'm always ready for it. And I've learned from my mistakes. I will probably never walk into a bar in Yuma Arizona that I know is full of drunk cowboys, and I have long hair. That kind of mistake.

 

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[mellowyellow]

Well this thread took a turn. Lol.

People on both sides of this thread have made good points.

First off. Don't ever talk about anything violent or threatening on a public forum. People have no life these days and will go out of there way to turn u in, cause they have nothing else to do, or they are a tree hugger or something, lol. But not wise to publicly talk about a "plan". Do not sneak around anyone's camp at night. IMO, you are going to get in trouble. Everyone at east fork has a means of protection on them. Not a good idea. Yes these crack heads are still humans, barely, but they are. As prospectors we have to take the higher ground.

Maybe "Mad" has never been to east fork and has not dealt or seen the many forms of "trash", we see at EF, an how BAD it has got there. It's not pretty there with the crack heads in one corner and the weekend party animals/gangstas in another corner and us prospectors somewhere in the middle.

I know people who have had a few bad experiences there. Been shot at, been robbed, ect... Me, never had one bad trip. Other than falling on my head, lol . But things do happen there.

Point is there is no doubt, that EF can be a rough place and I feel you should be prepared to defend yourself if needed. It's up to each person to decide what defense they go with. If u bring a firearm to any place you are not allowed to, be prepared to deal with the consequences of the law. Or even worse, if u had to use it.... Be prepared for a life change.

I suggest anyone goin to east fork go on week days. Much nicer and not a lot of people there at all. Keep it cool there boys and assume that anyone has a means of defense on them.

Just my humble opinion.

 

[oxbowbarefoot]

As a gold prospector it seems to me that: Who Am I to decide, interfere with anyone camping and using the land as they see fit.. I get it they were rude and inapropriate so what Their bums or drunks so what!! As a prospector the land that I Have rights too are getting less and less. As for tricking people to get them to leave or coming armed to be intimidating. As for littering, trash, abuse of land I willing to bet thats these issues seem to be an issue with all people.. I say if you really had a problem with them it would have been handled then and there. But they commited no crime that ain't common on any street corner, and by no means illegal. The only thing that disgusts me here is the talk of retaliating and tricking people!! Only a fool would sneak around another mans campsite at night. YOUR ******* is most likely to get shot and good riddance to you!

It's not like I have any experience in asymmetric conflict, utilizing force multipliers, moving undetected through cover, topographical, environmental or overall situational awareness during tense situations. But I have seen A LOT of Rambo movies and have a vivid imagination. I think that though this thread began by covering a serious topic, it was quite evident by my post and those of others, that the some of the suggestions were not intended to be taken seriously. Rather, they were intended to allow the reader to imagine the situation and visualize a fantasy version of events. I do not advocate violence or intimidation, but I am fine with people talking in "what if's?" If helps them to feel like they are getting the thrill of action without putting one's self in harms way or inflicting any harm on others. Kinda like Rambo.

I do advocate being aware of what is going on around you at all times and taking steps to make sure to mitigate unnecessary risk.

 

[GoldHunter24k]

My battles are fought against rocks buts that's just me.

Mad- Harass a 6' guy and his girl and see how quickly that changes

And thanks guys I really appreciate the replies. I'm not dumb enough to post on a public forum my "plans" if any. And i'm not dumb enough to sneak around someones camp at night that's for sure. All I said was that action is going to be taken to make the EF a safer place for all. Nothing illegal. I'm no stranger to conflict and I was raised around combat so I can handle myself.

I think most of these posts weren't very serious in their remarks of what they would do. Just a bit of over zealousness and what some of us would "like" to do to them. But the more people that are aware of where they are and what they are doing, the better. I certainly wasn't going to keep my mouth shut about the matter and have someone else get forced out of EF because they didn't feel safe. I personally don't like people watching me especially when I have a female with me, in an area with no cell reception or help, and hunting for gold. I'm sure i'm not alone in that.

The least I could hope to gain is that they think twice next time they want to hide in a bush with binoculars and stare at a woman who's digging.

Wishful thinking

 

[Hard Prospector]

I do a lot of hunting and sometimes I will use a cover scent, my favorite being skunk oil(Tinks #10 Skunk Scent...Cabelas) I would put only a drop or two on and it is so strong and foul its almost unbearable. A 1oz botttle dumped on a tent would make it uninhabitable for weeks. The funny thing is, when these pumpkin heads return to camp they will likely assume a skunk invasion and probably move on.

 

[NeoTokyo]

A drop of that skunk scent on yourself will keep trouble away too.

 

[Hard Prospector]

Years ago my boss at the time was a real prick and I'd had about enough of his crap. As much as I wanted to beat his ass it would have cost me my job so I couldn't do that. I work 24hr shifts so one night I went out to the parking lot and dumped some of that stuff into his car and man, did it feel good! So the next morning I'm watching this guy walk out and get into his car to leave and he suddenly jumps right back out and says he thinks his cars been sprayed by a skunk. So I walk over and I say to him " Thats what happens when you leave your car window open at night and it probably pissed in there too." He was one of those abrasive a-holes that nobody liked working for so when I heard he spent a bundle getting the interior detailed it was even more gratifying. A year or so later he retired and the only reason I went to the party was to tell the dork what really happened.

 

[swiftfan]

My understanding is that to use the term "miner" or "mining", means to extract. Which is generally not allowed on govt. land. Where "prospecting" is to show existence of mineral or aggregate such as quartz. Am I right on this?

 

[ivan salis]

the forest folks might be "ignoring" them * giving them a "break"so to speak ---- but if they insist on acting rude and foul mannered then they need to be taught "manners" -- a "offical" complaint in writing about being "harrassed" by them should spur the folks ranger folks to take corrective action and force them to "move along" -- a pity for them but then some folks are slow learners and have rto be taught the hard and painful way to be polite to others.

 

[russau]

My understanding is that to use the term "miner" or "mining", means to extract. Which is generally not allowed on govt. land. Where "prospecting" is to show existence of mineral or aggregate such as quartz. Am I right on this?

partly!it is NOT government land! its public land that "we the people" own!prospecting=looking for/mining=extracting,correct!and generally,it is allowed on public land !the gubermint dont own ANY land,we do!

 

[mamabear]

So sad. It makes it hard to want to go hunting. I've had a few run-ins with this type of "animal" Now I carry a gun. If I go out at all.

 

[freddy williams]

Yeh the FS is quick to chase us all away from prosepecting maybe they have a set up with the river rats, maybe the rats grow dope for them as long as they keep the miners out of the area. they are the reason we are being evicted from the rivers not the miners. You can report them but I guess the rangers won't even check it out or they will come back to the office and say they found nothing like scared little kids. HH everyone and be safe out there if you carry a firearm make sure it is visible or make sure you have a consel and carry permit. Alot of trouble came come from carring a weapon in some states but enjoy yourselves out there, enjoy nature.

 

[CT8620]

AU - We were thinking she was probably a meth runner or something. You could see the excess energy boiling off of her like heat waves in the mojave, plus sporting an awful lot of bad $5 tattoos and just a little TOO skinny. OR she was just an obsessed exercise-a-holic with bad taste. Heh heh, it's a fine line...

CT

 

[GoldHunter24k]

Thanks for the support guys (and gals)!

Hardprospector you are my hero

CT - I think you're probably about that. I've never seen any female joggers by themselves. They know better. And a decent woman wouldn't have responded the way she did.

 

[rawdog]

There may be ways to entice them to reconsider their base camp location using non-violent means. It's amazing how much of an advantage one could have with the proper reconnaissance to gather intel on them for a few days. Learn their habits, particularly at night. Find a way to "encourage" them to leave on their own. Perhaps they can't sleep for a few nights because of unusual noises near camp, maybe the recurring sounds of a mountain lion get a little closer to them every half hour... Who knows, even Bigfoot could be lurking near by. The human mind is capable of manifesting some pretty scary stuff, especially at night under the cover of darkness. If one were so inclined, one could certainly play to the most basic of human fears. Fear is a fantastic force multiplier, I guarantee, if they feel like they are being stalked by something that is looking at them as prey, they will not sleep. One night of that fear would likely drive them to move on. Multiple nights of loosing sleep, they would start to get careless, make mistakes, and even turn on themselves.
As far as carrying a more persuasive deterrent, I would make sure I was protected to the maximum extent to the law. By the way, Hornet and Wasp spray has effective ranges of 25-30 feet, and is effective against more than just insects...

Hornet and wasp spray LOL..only a prospector would be so crafty...nice!

Rawdog

 

[H-2 CHARLIE]

Can you dry wash up there or any where up there ? Is it just for panning ?

 

[SmithgrindSteve]

H-2. The rule is "no mechanical advantages".... which doesn't make much sense. A shovel is a mechanical advantage. Basically, anything that is electric or gas powered is a no-no.


GoldHunter24k. I just got home from Heaton Flat. I camped/prospected the 19th-21st with two friends. They are camping for the next two weeks. Our spot was up the trail just above the flat. No one else was camping at Heaton Flat during my stay. Most people pack heat. I've heard some wild stories about the place.

Why would they **** in a bucket? The bathroom is right there.

 

[Aurabbit79er]

How about Water Powered.


I was testing this at Follows Camp, when Follows was still open.
I did some high banking there. The owner( the late Joe Davidson)came over to our camp site to see it and said I could use it to High Bank and even point at a near by river bank to work. Found nice gold there.
I'm working on a electric generator waterwheel now.

Since I can't dredge I'm re-tasking my dredge platform to make it.
I need more old bike parts.

 

[NeoTokyo]

Thats a pretty neat rig, how did it work out for you?

 

[Troy Palmer]

I sluiced Heaton Flats last Friday and today without a problem. Worked the area across from the camp ground. Averaged 5 colors per bucket. Question- are you allowed to camp at the parking lot? Would make for a fun weekend. Water isn't to cold yet. Friday was cold in the morning with most puddles frozen. Today it rained and got to 60 and sunny about 11am.
Troy