Legit or Bogus Gold Claims for sale?? What do you think??

[huntsman53]

Well my Gold seeking folks, I came across the Ad at the link below while searching Craigslist for metal detectors. I was wondering your opinion on whether it is legit or bogus??!! If you read well into the Ad, the poster leaves out some stuff that he said he has provided and this made me think that it is a possible scam. However, since the poster is asking for cash payment or they will do financing, then it is likely that no money will change hands or a financing agreement be made until the prospective buyer has had time to very everything the poster stated!

If this is legit and not a scam, it might be a great opportunity for some folks on here to explore.

http://boone.craigslist.org/for/4888050316.html


Frank

 

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[azblackbird]

Legit.

 

[Hefty1]

Looks legit to me.

 

[Lanny in AB]

Best shot, get a reference from some others that have bought claims in the past. Ask for contact information, and see what they have to say.

All the best,

Lanny

 

[goldenIrishman]

I see what you mean about the ad missing some stuff. I am usually very skeptical about any gold claim ad on Craigs list and this one is no exception. There's just to many omissions in it for me to feel comfortable with it as is.
If you're really interested in one of his claims, contact him and see if he can fill in the gaps in the information. Get Claim numbers so you can check them with the BLM. Do your full "Due Diligence" just as if you were locating and filing from scratch. Turn over every rock in the paper trail before you turn over any cash. Get references and double check them as well.

 

[huntsman53]

Thanks for the responses so far! I can't afford a Gold Claim but posted this information in case others come across it and wanted to know everyone's thoughts on the matter. It may or may not be legit but this information might keep someone from being scammed or it might just get someone a great Gold Claim with lots of Gold.


Frank

 

[Clay Diggins]

Bogus - probably not but certainly not a good deal. Never buy a pig in a poke.

The claims are less than a year old. The pictures were taken last year just after the claims were made.There has been no effort to prove the claims have any minerals. Some were made as recently as this January. These claims were obviously located just to sell them. Locating claims just for resale is illegal.

Prices of $7,000 and up are a joke for an unproven claim. A 20 acre claim costs about $240 to locate. The only value of an unproven claim is what it costs to locate. Several of these claims were "located" in the dead of winter last month.

Claims over 20 acres are offered for sale to individuals. There must be one claimant for every 20 acres. Transfer to a single individual will be challenged and the claim will be void unless you can scramble and find several other people who have an interest in mining that particular claim. I'll bet your "financing" doesn't depend on whether you still own the claim.

Lode claims for sale that obviously have no exposed mineral in place. Lode claims being offered as having placer potential. No real evidence the sellers even know the difference.

Main selling points are camping, cabins, streams, meadows and access. None of those things will belong to the buyer. The "cabins" are more of a PIA to the claim owner than the bonus they are being sold as. Lot's of luck trying to mine a meadow. A road through the claim just means you are going to be fighting off higraders. Lots of pans full of "gold" shown but no mining equipment in evidence.

There is an offer to go on a "prospecting adventure" with the seller "All mining equiptment supplied". Real claims should always be sampled alone. Never use the sellers equipment or let the seller "help" you sample the claim. This is a big red flag.

Is Travis Hollon a scam artist? Probably not. His Uncle Mark is, or used to be, Alan Trees partner in Dredge Builders Warehouse. Several of these claims for sale are Mark's. The seller not being a scam artist is not a selling point - it just means they will actually produce valid paperwork for the unproven claim.

Are these claims worth the asking price? Probably not. No one knows, including the seller, they haven't been proven. Unproven claims are just a hole in the ground that hasn't been dug yet. If you are fascinated by undug ground you might as well make your own claim just about anywhere. The price for your own claim is a lot less than the Hollon's are asking and the odds are about the same you will find gold. But you will only be out $240 - not $7,000 or more.

Never buy a claim based on pictures or the seller's pitch. Visit the claim. Go alone and do real sampling with your own equipment. If you can't pay for the gas from what you find on the claim in a day it's probably not worth buying at any price. There's lot's of land out there that won't pay gas - why pay someone else for your labor?

Great opportunity? No.

A great opportunity comes for the prospector when they discover a paying deposit and locate it. This is more like the "great opportunity" you get from the lottery - a one in 120 million chance not to lose your money. Unlike the lottery your "bet" is $7,000 or more. Not good odds in the world of mining.

Heavy Pans

 

[huntsman53]

Clay,

Thanks for the great post and great information! For the very reasons you pointed out, is why I posted it to determine if it was legit or bogus (a scam). Hopefully, this Thread and your post will keep someone from being taken to the cleaners! It should also open up the eyes of anyone looking to purchase or make a Claim.


Frank

 

[Bonaro]

For me the red flag is in the opening statement
"[FONT=Bitstream Vera Serif, Times New Roman, serif]These claims have been sampled by us with small scale equipment and produce a prudent mans wage very easily, they also have prior history from the 1800s but have been worked very little since."[/FONT]

[FONT=Bitstream Vera Serif, Times New Roman, serif]Translation = we have panned them and found some color and you could sell this gold for a small amount of cash although not much. They haven't been worked in a century because there was no reason to.

I dont know these people but I know people. This guy seems to be running a claim flipping business. These are likely real and valid claims and there is probably a wee bit of gold. Most people are completely baffled by the claim staking process and that is his demographic.
I would not buy any claim until after I tested it[/FONT]

 

[goldenIrishman]

Another thing I've noticed on some of the claim listings on Craig List here in Arizona is that they're offering claims of 80 acres and more. As Clay stated above, an individual can only claim 20 acres. Any more requires another person to be listed as a claimant for every 20 acres or part there of. If I understand the laws right, a person can have more than 20 acres, but each 20 acre claim must be filed separately and the fees paid for each claim. I'm not sure, but I believe multiple claims by the same person can have adjoining borders but as long as there's only one person listed as claimant, they have to be filed as separate claims. Maybe Clay could clear this point up a bit more for us?

If you want to do a little mental exercise, go to the LandMatters mining claims map page and look up some current claims. Bring up the information for a section and look for claims that have more than one person listed as the claimants. Then click on the link to the current BLM-LR2000 data and read through it. You will see that every claim that is over 20 acres in size has more than one claimant listed in the records. In the case of where the claim was filed by a company (which I've seen many of those listed on the LM maps page) I'm not sure how they work that as I'm not a company. Again, maybe Clay would be good enough to clear this up for us.

Clay also pointed out (in a round about way) that you should pay close attention to when a claim was located. In the case of the claims listed above, it was located in the dead of winter. In that area, there's a very good chance that there was a ton of snow on the ground. So actually locating a valuable mineral is pretty unlikely. By doing your research with an open mind and paying attention to everything, you can pretty much always spot a scam.

As the old saying goes... If something looks too good to be true...It usually is!!!!

 

[bobw53]

The claims are less than a year old. The pictures were taken last year just after the claims were made.There has been no effort to prove the claims have any minerals. Some were made as recently as this January. These claims were obviously located just to sell them. Locating claims just for resale is illegal.

Hey Clay, I've heard this before, any chance you know where the actual laws are on this? And what would be the penalty, and who enforces it?
Thanx.

 

[treshuntintom]

Afternoon to all.I had/have a 160 acre claim north of Wickenburg Arizona were I live.Had a firm do the GPS numbers for me so they would be right.Set my 8 monument markers,placed a total
of 32 corner markers,drove to Prescott to Yavapai County Recorder office,paid taxes,drove to Phoenix to BLM,paid all due fees in cash,all paperwork was completed in about 30 minutes,walked
out with my copies of work and new AMC #'s.Took a little time to do it all,but then it was done.Have since sold 2 claims with NO problems with paperwork.By the way,still wet here,been digging
spreading on tarp and returning to run in couple of days.Good luck to everyone out there.Tom

 

[goldenIrishman]

Good to know that you can walk the paperwork through the BLM quickly! With all of the "Claim Brokers" that have been over filing and back dating lately my plan was to gt the paperwork all done as quickly as possible.

Were all of your claims right next to each other or were they spread out?

 

[treshuntintom]

Hey Golden,they are all together.2640'x2640'.Need any help PM me.

 

[SLNugget]

Afternoon to all.I had/have a 160 acre claim north of Wickenburg Arizona were I live.Had a firm do the GPS numbers for me so they would be right.Set my 8 monument markers,placed a total
of 32 corner markers,drove to Prescott to Yavapai County Recorder office,paid taxes,drove to Phoenix to BLM,paid all due fees in cash,all paperwork was completed in about 30 minutes,walked
out with my copies of work and new AMC #'s.Took a little time to do it all,but then it was done.Have since sold 2 claims with NO problems with paperwork.By the way,still wet here,been digging
spreading on tarp and returning to run in couple of days.Good luck to everyone out there.Tom

Hey Tom, I am curious what taxes you paid to the Yavapai County recorder? And how many locators do you have on the 160 acre claim? I am also curious how much it costs to have a firm do the GPS corner numbers for you? It is pretty quick to walk the paper work through the BLM state office in Phoenix. TIA

 

[treshuntintom]

Cost is $10.00 per claim.Cost another 10 every time you transfer ownership.I have a monument marker for each claim plus marker post on each corner.used 2"pvc with cap(heard that is required to
keep birds,lizards,etc.out).Then write direction and distance to each corner.i.e.SW corner,660' to NW corner post,east 1320'to NE post,660' south to SE monument corner post,1320' to SW post.That
way you give all directions and size of claim.Also good to put AMC # on all post and copy of paper work needs to be in monument post.Just try to cover your tail as much as possible.The geologist that
did my GPS # has some program that did them.Cost me lunch,guess that was fair enough.Also,my claims are out Scenic Loop Rd across from Box Canyon and Black Hills.

 

[SLNugget]

Cost is $10.00 per claim.Cost another 10 every time you transfer ownership.I have a monument marker for each claim plus marker post on each corner.used 2"pvc with cap(heard that is required to
keep birds,lizards,etc.out).Then write direction and distance to each corner.i.e.SW corner,660' to NW corner post,east 1320'to NE post,660' south to SE monument corner post,1320' to SW post.That
way you give all directions and size of claim.Also good to put AMC # on all post and copy of paper work needs to be in monument post.Just try to cover your tail as much as possible.The geologist that
did my GPS # has some program that did them.Cost me lunch,guess that was fair enough.Also,my claims are out Scenic Loop Rd across from Box Canyon and Black Hills.

The actual Arizona State Law for Mining Claims is here: How to File a Mining Claim in Arizona

 

[jbarker52]

I talked to the Claims Seller in Idaho about these claims. I was going to check them out but changed my mind. Basically this is an area that these guys staked out and registered the claims only paying out a couple hundred dollars for each claim. $7000.00 is a lot of money to pay for a claim as most claims will never produce near 7 ounces of gold, many only a gram or a few grams. I would never consider paying any money for a claim I did not check out for a few days on my own. I lost some money on claims in Arizona and Nevada. My opinion is that most claims are barely worth the money paid to the County and BLM, never mind thousands to the claim seller. I saw where a guy paid $5000.00 for a claim near Wickenburg, Az. recently. I bet He will never get five ounces of that claim
.to cover His costs, never mind the expense to prospect on it. The Great Author Mark Twain once called a Mining Claim Seller a ""Liar Standing next to a Worthless Hole""". Most of the money being made in Gold Prospecting comes from "" Miners being Mined""""., separated from their hard earned money.

 

[goldenIrishman]

Hey Golden,they are all together.2640'x2640'.Need any help PM me.

Hey Tom, thanks for the info and the offer. The area I'm looking at is in Mohave County and from the geological reports, past history and current claims in the area it should be pretty good. I'm going to be very selective in the grounds I claim so getting them right next to each other may not be possible. It would be great if I could get a couple of them next to each from a logistics standpoint but I'll have to see how that works out. I'll be hitting the County Registrars Office first thing to finish up my due diligence and then begin testing the different areas I've been researching.