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Thread: Ultra fine gold dust

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  1. #31
    us
    Apr 2014
    SW Oregon
    211
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    Prospecting
    Don't forget that JetDri is your friend. I tried an off brand and it had why too much foam. I don't really worry about the super fine gold but if I get real bored I'll use a metal pan with a magnet duct taped underneath the center of the pan to capture the black sand. I've also cleaned the black sand out after drying by placing the cons. on a mat finished photograph and gently blowing with a straw. Now I suppose if you could cover the bottom of a glass vial with your fine gold you retrieve in a couple of hours it could be called worthwhile but it's kinda like getting the last of the mustard out of the bottle.... Just as a footnote the largest amount of gold mined in the United States comes from refining the type/size you are talking about. We are talking about the big boys with big boy equipment and chemicals.Emak Refining & Recycling
    Last edited by mendoAu; Jan 24, 2018 at 01:10 AM.
    delnorter and Tahoegold like this.

  2. #32
    us
    Mar 2016
    Tahoe, CA
    Compadre, Gold Racer, White's TRX,Centech,Bazooka Gold Trap 24" Sniper, sluices with God Hog mats, Grizzly Gold Trap Motherload, Determination
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    Thank you all for these responses! I'll clarify a little as I agree there are questions about what and why I am doing this.
    I found the dust and yes, it's gold. I've been around gold a long time. My grandpa taught me to pan as a lad of 10. The pic really doesn't give the true color very well. But, it has that nice golden glow in the sun. I know mica, it floats and moves differently. And looks brighter, shinyer. I am confident it's gold.
    Yes, there's a little moving water. Just enough for my mini sluice and I used it yesterday and recovered some gold. Going back out today after changing my Gold hog mats from all UR to UR, Motherload, UR, Motherload, Motherload. I noticed some mats washing out a little too quick so slowed the water and one was loading up in the middle. The Motherload can be effective in faster water and the middle UR can get more flow.
    I understand that it's more productive to go for the larger gold. But like was said, who knows what kind of techniques may be able to get the dust? Look at Doc, he has changed the way we work at getting -200 in our sluices.
    Ok, so the reason I am asking is because it appears there is quite an amoumt of dust at this location. Along with a good amount of gold that can be sluiced. Sluicing looses the dust. Doing the screening method takes too long. So, there's gold sitting there that I want. But, alas, there seems to be no viable method for me to recover it effectively and efficiently.
    I love a problem like this. How are we to move mining forward unless we work on problems like this? Look at what Doc did in a few years. I love his products! I'm wondering if the new flow pan in a bucket would work to get the dust. Maybe a technique of not quite shaking all the material out before reloading would retain the dust. Then I am thinking that using the 2 bucket method with the test plug and swirling the cons would collect the dust. However, even if these methods worked, and I captured enough dust, what then? How could I separate this from the black sands. Not all sands are magnetic. Smelting takes fuel.
    Ok, so you all know, this is a quest. Also, I am understanding the futility of just getting material that contains this dust. I am using a sluice and moving much more dirt now as there is enough to really make it worth while.
    For me, I like solving un solved problems. Or, reading about how others have done it. Thank you Doc for the work you've done! I admire your fortitude. You really made a difference!
    There's a big mine in NV that has a huge mountainous leash pad. They capture this dust and turn it into gold bars weekly. Silver too. So, I know that method would work. I just can't do that of course. So, who ever is interested in joining this discussion, be assured, I am not just wasting my time and doddling around with cup fulls of dirt for hours. I'm looking at gold just sitting there, yet un recoverable. It makes me wonder how I may be able to get it in MY pocket. Ha!

  3. #33
    us
    May 2009
    Sailor Flat, Ca.
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    Free milling or placer are dealt with totally differently than recovering already refined pure metal or alloys from circuit boards.

    Interesting how a euro co. has mainly a recycle line. I would imagine in Europe much more secondary refining takes place than primary.

    Mining refiners won't touch circuit boards totally different process.

    Most primary (dore , highgrade ore, placer) in the US are in a much smaller simpler building than you would imagine. a lot is done close to the mines.

    The type of gold being mined by the three biggest mines in the U.S is coming from big pits (some under ground) and contains pyrite, arsenopyrite and is heap leached.

    You never see the gold. The processing plants are right in Nevada where the mines are.

    Yes, the majority of gold is small. That's why the name of the game for the Artisanal guy is to find concentrations of the bigger of the small stuff.

    The big boys do have the toys and the barrels of stuff to deal with material a small guy should really only waste time reading about.

    There are however nice spongey lumps that can be found in that are part of those same disseminated deposits where...and believe it or not a gold pan lead the original miners to the deposits.

    The early miners had no idea what was under their feet or the method to mine them at a profit.

    It wasn't until the 1960's that those deposits could really be effectively mined and processed.

    It isn't the same as what Tahoe found.


    As rare as gold is. Plopping down on a creek or river in a good bit of California (Nevada also) can show you some fine colors with a few hours of effort consistently.

    Once someone does that they tend to get sidetracked inventing some machine or new process or rework of an existing method, in a shortsighted effort to get more gold in the same amount of time.

    Totally makes since right?

    Well, I think it is a better Idea to find a spot that gets you more gold that adds up much quicker in weight using that same initial method.

    It is very cool to go out and find gold.

    If you Live in the Sierra Nevada you have access to places where two hours with a gold pan can get you ten times what Tahoe is showing.

    Why try to figure out how to squeeze water out of a rock ?

    What he did was sample and the sample I see in the time described doesn't seem to warrant too much more effort.

    If that was from one pan it would almost be encouraging.


    Not a critical post of what he is doing...I just know he is not that far of a drive from much better days.
    Last edited by Goldwasher; Jan 24, 2018 at 09:45 AM.
    arizau, et1955, Bonaro and 1 others like this.

  4. #34
    us
    Mar 2016
    Tahoe, CA
    Compadre, Gold Racer, White's TRX,Centech,Bazooka Gold Trap 24" Sniper, sluices with God Hog mats, Grizzly Gold Trap Motherload, Determination
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    Thanks Goldwasher,
    I understand your concern. The pic does show a small amount I agree. Since I started sluicing I have confidence there is more than I initially thought. I believe it's worthwhile to sluice this. I am in full agreement that we currently are not capable as a one person miner, to recover dust. And, that my efforts are best spent on a viable location. I believe this location is. Please don't go by my photo. I have done more samples and have a nice spot to work. It's perfectly ok to let me know your thoughts. There's others reading this and truthfully, these coments are relevant and words of good advice. I am grateful.
    However, if anyone can find a way to get this gold dust and reads this post, maybe I can get my mits on this stuff!! Meanwhile, I'm just moving the dust to the creek bed for safe keeping. I know where to find it!
    Thank you all for your concerns. I don't have any desire to waste my day over the impossible. So, I'm headding out soon to get some cons. Winter I hope will be here soon and make it difficult to get them. I'll have time to work them down then.
    Where the heck is the snow this year? Last year there was tons!

  5. #35
    us
    May 2014
    AZ
    Whippet Dry Washer, Lobo ST, 1/2 width 2 tray Gold Cube, numerous pans, rocker box, and /home made fluid bed and stream sluices.
    1,714
    2393 times
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tahoegold View Post
    Thanks Goldwasher,
    I understand your concern. The pic does show a small amount I agree. Since I started sluicing I have confidence there is more than I initially thought. I believe it's worthwhile to sluice this. I am in full agreement that we currently are not capable as a one person miner, to recover dust. And, that my efforts are best spent on a viable location. I believe this location is. Please don't go by my photo. I have done more samples and have a nice spot to work. It's perfectly ok to let me know your thoughts. There's others reading this and truthfully, these coments are relevant and words of good advice. I am grateful.
    However, if anyone can find a way to get this gold dust and reads this post, maybe I can get my mits on this stuff!! Meanwhile, I'm just moving the dust to the creek bed for safe keeping. I know where to find it!
    Thank you all for your concerns. I don't have any desire to waste my day over the impossible. So, I'm headding out soon to get some cons. Winter I hope will be here soon and make it difficult to get them. I'll have time to work them down then.
    Where the heck is the snow this year? Last year there was tons!
    The only dedicated piece of equipment on the market today for the average prospector, that was primarily designed* to concentrate truly fine powder gold (minus 100 mesh), is the gold cube. It is relatively expensive but if you feed it enough gold bearing material then, in time, you will be able to make it pay for itself with some to boot. The feed is suggested to be minus 1/8" so that necessitates a lot of screening/labor or maybe the addition of the gold cube trommel. Once you do have cube concentrates you still have to be anal about how you separate all or most of the gold from the black sands, etc. That mostly involves additional screen classifying to smaller and smaller size fractions and then panning or miller tabling, etc. the fractions separately. Due to the size of the unit, total throughput per day is limited to much less than you can probably process in a conventional sluice but the capture rate of "flower" gold is higher and probably in the 90%+ range.

    IMO If your gold values are mostly in "flower" sized material the cube may be worth your while and at the same time it will capture the larger gold in the feed but I am with Goldwasher in that there other better spots in your area.

    Have fun out there.





    *It was originally developed to process beach sands whose average size is less than 100 mesh.
    Last edited by arizau; Jan 24, 2018 at 12:29 PM.
    Tahoegold likes this.
    If it can't be grown, it must be mined!

  6. #36
    Charter Member
    us
    Look at the Historical Gold Mining photo albums on my page

    Jan 2013
    Huntington, Or./ Stanton, AZ/ former Outlaw California Gold Dredger
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    Personally, I've found lots of sub 200 in paying quantities. I've got the Mulit-Sluice and I have the dream mat also. My trommel from the goldcube is on its way and I'm going to adapt it to the Mulit-Sluice. You still want throughput and your going to lose some anyway, so go with a Sluice. Classification is the key and Doc guarantees 98% recovery on -200....
    10 minutes into the video, I show the Falcon pan being used for fines. The secret is... put them into a vial and don't open it again until your ready to melt it down. I have some pics of the fines recovered after refining them into 1ozt+ buttons. But when dealing with fines like this, cap them into a sealed vial and don't open it until you're ready to melt them together. My fines came out of mercury from the hydraulic miners but the end result is the same.
    Last edited by Reed Lukens; Jan 24, 2018 at 04:24 PM.

  7. #37
    us
    Mar 2016
    Tahoe, CA
    Compadre, Gold Racer, White's TRX,Centech,Bazooka Gold Trap 24" Sniper, sluices with God Hog mats, Grizzly Gold Trap Motherload, Determination
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    129 times
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    [QUOTE=winners58;5676407]should be able to push it all into a pile with your finger and know its gold
    even if you have to look at it under x40 magnification with a jewelers loupe.
    otherwise its just powdered pyrite, some oxide, sulfide or something else.
    I would say it's more likely not Gold. I would go for the bigger gold.

    -350 is not visible to the naked eye, that means if it is gold it would be multiple pieces together to see it.
    I've zoomed in and don't see that, it looks like iron oxides from the soil.

    Winner58,
    I got to get a day's worth of dirt washing through the sluice. I tried to keep in mind it could be oxides. When home and panning into a white tub. I noticed lots more of this powder. When pushed together it really doesn't look like gold. Not to say there isn't any in ther though. I would bet there is. But, I am grateful to have this advice. I know I am getting better amounts of the regular stuff. Now I'm just throwing dirt onto a 1/2 screen over a bucket. That seems to work the best. I tried using a 1/4" screen after but there was so few pebbles doing that it just seemed a waste of time. The 1/2 inch screen left rocks plenty small enough to roll right down easy. So, I get it. I'm just beginning but this sure jump started my efforts to get better. Unless I can go big time and get a leach pad going, I'm prospecting for stuff I can capture. I am confident in my equipment. Now I need to get to work! Lol

  8. #38
    us
    Mar 2016
    Tahoe, CA
    Compadre, Gold Racer, White's TRX,Centech,Bazooka Gold Trap 24" Sniper, sluices with God Hog mats, Grizzly Gold Trap Motherload, Determination
    120
    129 times
    Prospecting
    This has been great to hash out the options for ultra fine gold for a small time miner with a sluice and a pan basically. Sometimes it just cant be done like in this case. I know now I can just concentrate on sluiceable stuff as that's where our technology is as of now. Great! That settles my curiosity. Much abliged to you all for your advice. Heavy pans all!
    KevinInColorado likes this.

  9. #39
    Make America Great Again

    Apr 2013
    Oregon
    1,446
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    I did watch a show about 10 or 15 years ago of a guy in Seattle WA that knew of a turn of the century stamp mill.
    they went out and dug and sluiced to get all the heavies (goldhog mats would clean it too much) they
    roasted and soaked in acid what they got from sluicing and precipitated out a black sludge then they
    added borax to it and melted out a gold dore bar, they took it to the refiner that drilled it and put it in the XRF
    to get the %'s, as I remember they got something like $80,000, not bad for a couple days work.
    Last edited by winners58; Jan 27, 2018 at 09:35 PM.
    " A pessimist is an optimist with experience "

  10. #40
    us
    Apr 2014
    SW Oregon
    211
    350 times
    Prospecting
    A little off subject but my Dad told me a story about the guy that bought the old Schaffer pen company plant I believe in Pioria after they moved. He took all the old wood flooring out and burned it in a kiln. Year after year all the dust from manufacturing all those gold pen parts turned a nice profit for the guy.

  11. #41
    us
    Aug 2010
    Maine USA
    258
    229 times
    The slits in gold fountain pen nibs are cut with an extremely fine saw. The nibs themselves are die cut from thin sheets of 14 or 18 karat gold, then formed half round on a mandrel and tipped with a hard alloy to minimize wear when writing. Over the years, those operations generated a good amount of gold waste that worked its way into the grain of wooden floors. There is a story about a fellow who pulls dirt from sidewalk joints in New York’s jewelry district. Over a period of years, fine gold dust from workers’ clothing fell off and worked its way into the joints.
    KevinInColorado likes this.

  12. #42
    us
    Aug 2004
    Olympia WA
    Minelab Xterra 70, Minelab SD 2200d, 2.5", 3", 4"and several Keene 5" production dredges, Knelson Centrifuge, Gold screw automatic panner
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    Quote Originally Posted by placertogo View Post
    The slits in gold fountain pen nibs are cut with an extremely fine saw. The nibs themselves are die cut from thin sheets of 14 or 18 karat gold, then formed half round on a mandrel and tipped with a hard alloy to minimize wear when writing. Over the years, those operations generated a good amount of gold waste that worked its way into the grain of wooden floors. There is a story about a fellow who pulls dirt from sidewalk joints in New York’s jewelry district. Over a period of years, fine gold dust from workers’ clothing fell off and worked its way into the joints.
    Tahoegold likes this.

  13. #43
    us
    Mar 2016
    Tahoe, CA
    Compadre, Gold Racer, White's TRX,Centech,Bazooka Gold Trap 24" Sniper, sluices with God Hog mats, Grizzly Gold Trap Motherload, Determination
    120
    129 times
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    Running at about 6 to 7 degrees seemed to just clear material in the sluice. I fitted it with UR in the flair, then 2 razor back then 3 motherload. I got the majority in the sub 50 mesh and quite a bit in the -100 as well. No amount in the + 20 and barely much in the +50. I am happy that I am capturing such fine gold. I can't run the Motherload GGT because the water is shallow. However, with a flat sluice like this one, the water is great and I can move dirt really well. I am really getting the hang of setting up my gear and am seeing the capture rates getting better. Next time out it's going to be about a little sample exploring to zero in a little better on the location of better dirt! For now I gotta wait for a little better weather! Mean while, I spray painted the flair with plasti dip and put some low profile ribbed mat on the sheet metal strip that covers the top part of the mat. Oh man, this is addicting to work on your own stuff. Havin' fun making my stuff work better and experimenting. I figure the plasti dip will slow the gold a little and maybe I can see it while sluicing due to the black color. Also, the ribbed matting will maybe give me a little visual capture zone that was just bare metal before. What do you all think? I will probably go out soon so I can get a "fix" lol... You know, the best info was from Doc when he shows how much material should be in a mat. I get it that way so I got mine to be just like what he showed and that gave me the degree of angle that worked best. A little more experimenting by panning the cons and I came up with the right angle for the low/slow waterflow. So, I am including some photos of the material after running the sluice for several hours. Seems no matter how I edit the photos they end up in the wrong orientation. I wonder what the heck is the issue. Oh well, sorry about the sideways views!

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    Last edited by Tahoegold; Mar 08, 2018 at 12:31 PM.
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  14. #44
    RTR
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    us
    Roger

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  15. #45
    Charter Member
    us
    Mine President, XPBC

    Dec 2013
    Arcata, California
    Fisher 1212-x Fisher Gold Bug 2 Whites 4900/SP3 Rocker boxes, Keene sluices, Bazooka sluice, 2.5", 4" lowbankers, highbankers. Witch Sticks.
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    I like various sizes of expanded metal on top of ribbed rubber or carpet, the unbacked veranda carpet on ribbed rubber as Hoser John suggested has worked well. Currently working on a "cleangold" style sluice using magnetic sign material, in another thread someone suggested to purchase a magnetic field viewing card off of the internet to choose and orientate the material, I got mine from amazon for 2 bucks free shipping It a green field with magnetic particles encased in some kind of oil when placed upon a magnetic piece it shows the field lines. The material used for magnetic signs or cheap fridge magnets aren't magnetic across the board, they often are magnetized in lines which blacksand will cling to forming micro riffles.

 

 
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