Claiming in reclaimation areas

[blackchipjim]

Good evening to all, I'm curious as to if a person can file a claim in an area of reclaimation. I was researching an area and clicked on the BLM land status tab and reclaimation color came up. There is a claim near the area I wanted prospect but it also falls in the area. Am I not understanding some about the rules in Arizona ?

 

Amazon Forum Fav 👍

Minelab PRO-FIND 35 Waterproof Pinpointer Metal Detector for Experts with Tone ID & Adjustable Sensitivity - Grab it through Amazon!

[blackchipjim]

I guess I should rephrase the question. If I understand this correctly land under mineral withdrawal is not claimable but recreational prospect is allowed. I can't seem to get a good understanding of the difference.

 

[Clay Diggins]

Land under mineral withdrawal is not claimable.

Under most types of mineral withdrawal you can still prospect. You need to read the withdrawal notice to know whether prospecting is included in the withdrawal.

There is no such thing as "recreational prospecting" in the law. Perhaps by "recreational prospecting" you mean looking for a colorful bouncy castle, a good movie or driving the sleazy areas of town in search of cheap companionship? That would be recreational prospecting.

Land managed by the Bureau of Reclamation specifically forbids prospecting or valuable mineral collection. Even possessing a working metal detector is a criminal offense. Once you know that, the difficulty is in figuring out whether the land is actually managed by the BOR or if they just have an overlay interest.

More specific questions get more specific answers.

Heavy Pans

 

[winners58]

Might get a lease or use permit, it all depends on the location and not interfering with other uses.
one of the BOR's goals is providing its lands for recreation, where they might allow gold panning but
from what I've heard metal detector's are a no no https://www.law.cornell.edu/cfr/text/43/423.29
If you chose your words carefully, like casual mineral exploration not disturbing natural formations etc...
applying for use here; form 7-2540 but might just be wasting your $100 application fee
https://www.usbr.gov/lands/AuthorizedUses.html

I go to BOR areas when the water levels drop to pan & sluice, I haven't been run off yet, but all they will say is to stop

 

[Clay Diggins]

I think the first part of CFR 43 423.29 that winners posted pretty much describes the response you will get if you want to look for valuable minerals or even cool looking rocks.

§ 423.29 Natural and cultural resources.

(a) You must not destroy, injure, deface, remove, search for, disturb, or alter natural resources or cultural resources, including abandoned buildings or structures, on or in Reclamation facilities, lands, or waterbodies except in accordance with § 423.29(g) and other applicable Federal, State, and local laws.

You could ask for a permit and see what happens. I'm not sure what good a gold collecting permit would do you if you can't roll rocks, use a metal detector, disturb grass or remove dirt. Maybe it's worth a shot?

Heavy Pans

 

[winners58]

Research, research, research, some lands listed as BOR are actually easements or lands withdrawn for various reasons.
they also over time change the land management agency so check that you are looking at the most recent map or plat information
lots of withdraws end if not renewed, laws change, I have a mining claim that is in a powersite withdrawal, the area
is not being used the way it was originally planned, might look for survey notes, master title plat, even property tax maps.
not sure if this covers your area of interest look under surveys; https://glorecords.blm.gov/default.aspx
If you find a lot of gold and cant claim it, don't tell anyone...

 

[winners58]

If you did find some place on BOR land that you might want to mine there is a process to petition the lands to be restored to mineral entry.
especially if the lands were not used as planed or don't interfere with other uses, and have valuable mineral potential...

https://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/43/154
The authority of the Secretary to open withdrawn lands is conferred by the Act of April 23,
1932, 43 U.S.C. § 154 (1982), which reads, in pertinent part:
Where public lands of the United States have been withdrawn for possible
use for construction purposes under the Federal reclamation laws, and are known or
believed to be valuable for minerals and would, if not so withdrawn, be subject to
location and patent under the general mining laws, the Secretary of the Interior,
when in his opinion the rights of the United States will not be prejudiced thereby,
may, in his discretion, open the land to location, entry, and patent under the general
mining laws, reserving such ways, rights, and easements over or to such lands as
may be prescribed by him and as may be deemed necessary or appropriate,
including the right to take and remove from such lands construction materials for
use in the construction of irrigation works
https://www.oha.doi.gov/IBLA/Ibladecisions/096IBLA/096IBLA379.pdf

 

[blackchipjim]

I appreciate the information Clay and Winners58. I guess getting to the point of question would be easier. There is areas in the Lake Pleasant area that as far color of map on land matters says is BOR land. Placer claims are in and around the area in question. They are active claims and there are some that are closed. So really simply put I didn't understand the reclaimation area rules or really understand the meaning of reclaimation land in this sense. I do appreiciate the humor Clay.

 

[Clay Diggins]

Specifics are helpful. History has the clue to what you are seeing today.

The Lake Pleasant dam was originally a self financed private farmer association project that didn't use government funds. When it was completed in 1928 it was named Carl Pleasant dam after the designer. It was the largest dam of it's type in the world at the time and provided the valley farmers with plenty of water to turn Arizona into the worlds largest producer of long fiber cotton and citrus. Most of what is considered the Phoenix metro area today was planted in citrus and pima cotton for decades before Phoenix even qualified as a city. That was all due to the dam and the farmers group that built it.

The original Lake Pleasant had good gold and many producing placer mines surrounding it. It was mostly public lands open to location so mining claims covered much of the area around the lake. I mined there quite successfully through the 1970's to mid 80s.

In 1976 the federal government was in the process of building the largest most expensive water project they had ever undertaken - the Central Arizona Project (CAP). The CAP is a huge canal project to bring Colorado river water to Arizona desert farmers.

The Feds needed somewhere to store all that canal water from the CAP uphill from Phoenix. The feds decided to seize the farmers irrigation dam, build a new larger dam 1/4 mile downstream and flood the old Carl Pleasant dam along with all those mining claims with water from the CAP.

The Bureau of Reclamation (BOR) was put in charge of the CAP and ended up managing the Lake Pleasant water. As a minor concession to the farmers group they rebuilt the old Beardsley canal that was named after the guy who put the original farmers group together and got financing for the original Carl Pleasant dam.

Several large commercial gold operations are now buried beneath the new, much larger, Lake Pleasant. New mining claims were prohibited by the BOR withdrawal designation. The remaining valid mining claims that were not flooded or taken over for construction were grandfathered in. The very few left of those grandfathered mining claims are the active status mining claims you see today in the BOR managed area.

You only had to ask.

Heavy Pans

 

[blackchipjim]

Thank you once again Clay I do appreciate your input in my many questions of prospecting. I see a patchwork of claims in the area and wondered about the whole area.