Xterra 505 or Vaquero

chinchilla

Full Member
Dec 18, 2009
182
24
Detector(s) used
Tesoro, White's
Primary Interest:
Metal Detecting

atomicscott

Bronze Member
Aug 18, 2011
1,564
1,055
Riverside CA
Detector(s) used
Current: Nokta Makro Simplex+, Teknetics Patriot, Fisher Gold Bug (original), GP Pinpointer (Garrett Clone) Lesche. Owned: Omega 8000, Minelab X-Terra 505, Fisher F2, Tesoro Vaquero, & Compadre, Whit
Primary Interest:
All Treasure Hunting
The Vaquero must be supertuned to get good depth. If you hunt in areas with very little EMI, then maybe it would work for you. If you are looking for deeper silver, the Vaq would NOT be my first choice due to the higher 14.75khz frequency. Others posters have stated that this was their experience as well. Sure it will find silver, but lower frequencies do much better on higher conductivity metals such as silver, brass, copper, etc... Conversely the higher frequency of the V hits harder on low conductivity metals, such as lead, iron, and gold. This is perhaps why the Vaq is considered such a great relic hunter. My 5.9khz fisher F2 has found alot of clad (many 8" dimes) that I missed with the Vaq. But I would never even think of nugget shooting or deep relic hunting with it (the Vaq does excel at this). I really feel like the 505 is more of a 'do-it-all' detector, with the ability to run 3khz: which kills on silver, and does great in iron trash! 7.5khz: great for all-around use but also great on silver and still hot on gold jewelry, or 18.75khz: which is very hot on gold, (nuggets or jewelry) relics, lead, etc...Not many detectors (or any?) have this ability at the $550 price tag. There are 12 coils available for the Xterra's, made by either Minelab or CoilTek (not including other brands, such as NEL). I definitely miss the lightweight of the Vaq, but that reason alone didn't warrant me keeping it over the ML. This was just my own personal experience with the Vaq. One interesting thing though, the 5.75" DD coil on the Vaquero gave me the same depth (on coins at least) as the stock 9 X 8" coil. Weird!
 

Terry Soloman

Gold Member
May 28, 2010
19,422
30,105
White Plains, New York
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Detector(s) used
Nokta Makro Legend// Pulsedive// Minelab GPZ 7000// Vanquish 540// Minelab Pro Find 35// Dune Kraken Sandscoop// Grave Digger Tools Tombstone shovel & Sidekick digger// Bunk's Hermit Pick
Primary Interest:
Metal Detecting
Having used both the X-Terra 505 and the Vaquero extensively, I have to disagree a hair on depth comparisons and sensitivity. The depth and sensitivity to silver on both machines is almost exactly the same, and the Vaq is a hair better on small gold than the 505 with it's stock 7.5kHz(?) coil. The other coils for the 505 have to be bought seperately, and are not cheap. Again, if you want a visual readout, and some customisable discrimination programs, then spend the extra $100.00, but these two machines give basically the same depth and performance.
 

atomicscott

Bronze Member
Aug 18, 2011
1,564
1,055
Riverside CA
Detector(s) used
Current: Nokta Makro Simplex+, Teknetics Patriot, Fisher Gold Bug (original), GP Pinpointer (Garrett Clone) Lesche. Owned: Omega 8000, Minelab X-Terra 505, Fisher F2, Tesoro Vaquero, & Compadre, Whit
Primary Interest:
All Treasure Hunting
Good points indeed Terry, I believe if I was able to supertune without the EMI probs, I would have gotten better depth. However the 505 equipped with the 3khz 6" 'Digger' coil, will definitely hit harder and deeper on silver. The higher frequency 18.75 DD coil should also definitely hit harder and smaller gold than the 14.75khz of the V. I was mainly pointing out that it's nice to have the option of tailoring your detector to your detecting style or preference. This is simply not possible with the Vaq.
 

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rainyday101

rainyday101

Hero Member
Dec 1, 2012
779
346
Peshtigo, Wisconsin
Detector(s) used
Tesoro Tejon, Tesoro Silver uMax, Tesoro Tiger Shark
Primary Interest:
Metal Detecting
Fella, you are not being a Negative Nancy. You are just stating reality and facts. I have often thought just what you have said, but the only way to know is to go deeper and be sure. Besides, it never hurts to have another detector!

Longhair, to get optimum depth from a silver umax you have to buy a bigger coil and because of the preset/fixed ground balance of this detector you have to send it to Tesoro to be tuned to the detector. Now a lot guys do not do this and still get excellent results. This is what you get with no adjustable ground balance, but in mild soil like mine it is usually not a concern. Also the areas I find the goods in are extremely trashy. In some areas you cannot go two inches in any direction without hitting trash. The silver umax's strength is when you slow down the sweep in these areas it has excellent target separation and lightning fast recovery allowing you to pick the coins from the trash. I'm not bragging about it, but it amazes me every time I go through a trashy area. My best finds are in these areas and I assume that is because other detectors have not done as well at separating trash from coin. So in the end I want a deeper detector yet still want great target separation and fast recovery. I feel fairly confident the Vaquero would do this, but I look at the 505 and it's features for the price are absolutely great! I just question if it has the depth and target separation/recovery speed. It would be easy to say, well just buy the Vaq. then, but I really like the 505 also. If I could afford it I would just get them both.
 

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rainyday101

rainyday101

Hero Member
Dec 1, 2012
779
346
Peshtigo, Wisconsin
Detector(s) used
Tesoro Tejon, Tesoro Silver uMax, Tesoro Tiger Shark
Primary Interest:
Metal Detecting
Terry and atomicscott, I guess if all things are equal or close to equal on these two great detectors it will just come to a matter of personal preferences and features for the new detector. I really appreciate the unbiased opinions from both of you seeing you have used both detectors. I do like the thought of interchangeable coils, but like Terry said they are not cheap. I know the stock 505 coil would do well at 7.5 Khz and really question whether the 3 KHZ coil would give you enough of a gain to justify the cost. I question whether the 4.5 Khz difference is enough to be significant without seeing some test data. With the 505 I would probably just stick to the stock coil.

Having used both of these machines how do you guys feel the 505 and Vaq do at target separation and recovery time? Does one have an advantage?
 

atomicscott

Bronze Member
Aug 18, 2011
1,564
1,055
Riverside CA
Detector(s) used
Current: Nokta Makro Simplex+, Teknetics Patriot, Fisher Gold Bug (original), GP Pinpointer (Garrett Clone) Lesche. Owned: Omega 8000, Minelab X-Terra 505, Fisher F2, Tesoro Vaquero, & Compadre, Whit
Primary Interest:
All Treasure Hunting
Terry and atomicscott, I guess if all things are equal or close to equal on these two great detectors it will just come to a matter of personal preferences and features for the new detector. I really appreciate the unbiased opinions from both of you seeing you have used both detectors. I do like the thought of interchangeable coils, but like Terry said they are not cheap. I know the stock 505 coil would do well at 7.5 Khz and really question whether the 3 KHZ coil would give you enough of a gain to justify the cost. I question whether the 4.5 Khz difference is enough to be significant without seeing some test data. With the 505 I would probably just stick to the stock coil.

Having used both of these machines how do you guys feel the 505 and Vaq do at target separation and recovery time? Does one have an advantage?
Well for me it was a whole different ballgame. I don't use disc on the Xterra so it picks up EVERYTHING under the coil. I was amazed at just how much stuff is under the coil! The Vaquero would pop and click as it was disc'ing out the iron, or foil, etc. The Xterra breaks these items down into 19 different tones (with corresponding ID#s). This way if there is a silver dime next to a piece of iron, next to of a piece of foil, it will give 3 different tones (& ID#s). This lessens the chance of the iron masking the dime, as it is picking up both the iron and dime (& foil). It was a bit overwhelming at first for me after coming from the single tone of the Vaquero. It actually sounds like its singing a tune, it is so responsive. This is why the Xterras should be run at a moderately slow speed of 2-3 seconds per swing, if you really don't want to miss anything. There is a constant threshold hum (like the all-metal hum of the Vaq) so you can tell right away if a disced out item is under the coil as the threshold will drop out (or null). Of course you can also use 4, 3, 2, or even 1 tone if you desire, I just prefer to hear all the different items under the coil. Something about the Xterras that isn't mentioned often is the visual pinpoint. It works with the audio pinpoint to help narrow the target down quickly and easily. It is very accurate.
 

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Longhair

Hero Member
May 26, 2012
781
418
Backside Of Nowhere In Mid-Michigan
Detector(s) used
Fisher F2,
Fisher 1280X,
MineLab Xterra 705,
MineLab Explorer SE
Primary Interest:
All Treasure Hunting
Longhair, to get optimum depth from a silver umax you have to buy a bigger coil and because of the preset/fixed ground balance of this detector you have to send it to Tesoro to be tuned to the detector. Now a lot guys do not do this and still get excellent results. This is what you get with no adjustable ground balance, but in mild soil like mine it is usually not a concern. Also the areas I find the goods in are extremely trashy. In some areas you cannot go two inches in any direction without hitting trash.
Precisely why I mentioned trash density and mineralization in my post as qualifiers. I only sought to save you some $ if you hadn't considered the option of coil changes already.
The silver umax's strength is when you slow down the sweep in these areas it has excellent target separation and lightning fast recovery allowing you to pick the coins from the trash. I'm not bragging about it, but it amazes me every time I go through a trashy area. My best finds are in these areas and I assume that is because other detectors have not done as well at separating trash from coin. So in the end I want a deeper detector yet still want great target separation and fast recovery. I feel fairly confident the Vaquero would do this, but I look at the 505 and it's features for the price are absolutely great! I just question if it has the depth and target separation/recovery speed.
atomicscott is right about the 3kHz Digger. Just as with your Silver, slowing down is key to success in heavy trash. I've used my 6" 3kHz everywhere from celler holes, to recently re-modeled and re-roofed old homes, to busy trashy public parks & schools, and it's ability to separate coins from trash is remarkable.

You can read my review of it here.
Coiltek Manufacturing - Metal detector coils and accessories
 

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rainyday101

rainyday101

Hero Member
Dec 1, 2012
779
346
Peshtigo, Wisconsin
Detector(s) used
Tesoro Tejon, Tesoro Silver uMax, Tesoro Tiger Shark
Primary Interest:
Metal Detecting
Dam, you guys have such GOOD input it really makes the decision hard. What Atomicscott described with the Vaq pop and crackles in trashy areas is just what the silver uMax does. Items being partially discriminated out give the clipped signal, pop, crackle, and pop until you cross the coin and then amongst all that noise you get a nice sweet clean sounding tone. So when you start getting all these partially discriminated signals you know you are in a trashy area and slow down to get the coins. The concept with the 505 using all tones sounds similar except the pop and crackles are replaced by multiple tones and a numeric ID. Same concepts just different ways of conveying the information.

The truth is that I am sure either of these detectors is fully capable of meeting my needs. Part of me says hey you are already used to and skilled at the Tesoro language, stick with what you know. The other part of me says gee multi-tones would be nice and a display wouldn't hurt either, plus you could specialize the detector a bit by changing coils. Also when you look at the 505 reviews it is almost impossible to find anyone who has something bad to say about them. The few I have found were written by novices or idiots. Some negative reviews (not many) can be found on the Vaq., but again they are coming from people who were raised on a TDI display and jumped onto the single tone bandwagon and did not take the time to learn the machine. Tesoro users that tried the Vaq love it, but again they are used to the Tesoro way.

I am not ready to purchase here today but will in the very near future. As usual and as I have done for my other detectors I will get analysis paralysis from over analyzing everythinfg. I do this a lot, but in the long run I ended spending my money wisely. I guess that is why we come to good forums to get others opinions because we are not rich and want to get it right the first time. After all you don't see many rich people metal detecting! Oh, and by the way, I do value eveyones opinion that has posted here and thank you for taking the time to do so. If there was one perfect detector that suited everyone's needs we would all buy it and life would be boring.

If anyone has anymore opinions I am all ears. I will probably flip a coin and decide seconds before I buy either new from Tom at Miller MDZ or another sponsor or forum classifieds or that big auction place.

Whichever I decide I will become an expert using just as I have with my Silver uMax and Tiger Shark. These things talk and I listen. It takes time, patience, and persistence and I have got most of those.
 

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dieselram94

Gold Member
Jun 17, 2011
9,174
6,675
Mid Coast Maine
Detector(s) used
Xterra 705, Tesoro Sand Shark, Garrett Pro Pointer (mine). Fisher F2 my son's
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Beach & Shallow Water Hunting
To me the biggest reason to purchase a Tesoro is to get the lifetime guarantee. That being said I have not heard of any problems with the 505 other than the coil ears cracking.
 

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rainyday101

rainyday101

Hero Member
Dec 1, 2012
779
346
Peshtigo, Wisconsin
Detector(s) used
Tesoro Tejon, Tesoro Silver uMax, Tesoro Tiger Shark
Primary Interest:
Metal Detecting
Thanks Fella but the Vx3 is too complicated of a hunter for me. I like simple with just a few variables.
 

christo000

Silver Member
Mar 17, 2013
3,765
812
mass North Attleboro
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Xp Deus,m-6 pinpointer, technetics t2ltd (had, whites v3i,minelab xterra 705,atpro,prism 4,sunray probe minlabe profind,garret propointer, f75ltd and many more)
Primary Interest:
All Treasure Hunting
Thanks Fella but the Vx3 is too complicated of a hunter for me. I like simple with just a few variables.

Actually it may look complicated but the vx3 actually is more both expereinced & beguinner ready with real good choice programs all ready set to go & u get the benefits of color screens graphs, & I beleive wireless headphones. The one i have v3i is a little more Advanced & can b intimidating the spectras r like a few detectors in one package
 

christo000

Silver Member
Mar 17, 2013
3,765
812
mass North Attleboro
Detector(s) used
Xp Deus,m-6 pinpointer, technetics t2ltd (had, whites v3i,minelab xterra 705,atpro,prism 4,sunray probe minlabe profind,garret propointer, f75ltd and many more)
Primary Interest:
All Treasure Hunting
And ull get 3,frequencies working at the same time rather then just 1. 22.5khz, 7.5khz, 2.5khz
 

chinchilla

Full Member
Dec 18, 2009
182
24
Detector(s) used
Tesoro, White's
Primary Interest:
Metal Detecting
The pops and cracks of the vaquero can be dealt with a good set of headphones and considering that: high volume cracks= can be iron; low volume cracks= can be deep targets.
If you want to dig less get the xterra or another VDI machine, if you what to find what was left get the Vaquero.
 

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rainyday101

rainyday101

Hero Member
Dec 1, 2012
779
346
Peshtigo, Wisconsin
Detector(s) used
Tesoro Tejon, Tesoro Silver uMax, Tesoro Tiger Shark
Primary Interest:
Metal Detecting
Thanks chinchilla. Right now I am thinking about getting the Vaq along with the 5.75" coil and that would come out to the cost of a 505. Post I have read indicate little to no loss of depth with the smaller coil and you get better target separation. At least that is what I am thinking at the moment. When I go to areas that have been hunted I need an advantage to get what others have missed. Virgin spots are becoming far and few between, but I have found some. Old Boat landings are good!

You are right about high volume cracks, they have always been iron. I have to dig and see just out of curiosity.
 

chinchilla

Full Member
Dec 18, 2009
182
24
Detector(s) used
Tesoro, White's
Primary Interest:
Metal Detecting
Thanks chinchilla. Right now I am thinking about getting the Vaq along with the 5.75" coil and that would come out to the cost of a 505. Post I have read indicate little to no loss of depth with the smaller coil and you get better target separation. At least that is what I am thinking at the moment. When I go to areas that have been hunted I need an advantage to get what others have missed. Virgin spots are becoming far and few between, but I have found some. Old Boat landings are good!

You are right about high volume cracks, they have always been iron. I have to dig and see just out of curiosity.

that 5.75 coil sounds a good addition, I love that thing on my compadre, but better you find a prospector cup or a real good pinpointer because it kills on very small targets
 

atomicscott

Bronze Member
Aug 18, 2011
1,564
1,055
Riverside CA
Detector(s) used
Current: Nokta Makro Simplex+, Teknetics Patriot, Fisher Gold Bug (original), GP Pinpointer (Garrett Clone) Lesche. Owned: Omega 8000, Minelab X-Terra 505, Fisher F2, Tesoro Vaquero, & Compadre, Whit
Primary Interest:
All Treasure Hunting
The pops and cracks of the vaquero can be deal with a good set of headphones and considering that high volume cracks= can be iron; low volume cracks= can be deep targets. If you want to dig less get the xterra or another VDI machine, if you what to find what was left get the Vaquero

If something pops and cracks, you shouldnt have to dig it! That was my problem, if its popping and cracking, I assume its a trash target. The 505 hits a solid tone with almost no popping, or cracking. Try placing a large nail next to a dime, and discing out the iron. My Vaq would mask the dime out everytime. A quarter would pick up at about 4-5" then it would be masked by the nail. The 505 will hit a dime tone, then bounce to an iron tone, so you KNOW the dime is there next to the iron. The ID#s correspond with each of the 19 tones, so the display is nearly as accurate as the tones are. The technology is quite amazing. I really believe digital software is a huge advancement in detector electronics. I was just not happy with guessing everytime I get a solid tone on the Vaq. I thumb the disc, cool it's a quarter! Not. Just a rusty bolt. To each his own, let us know how the Vaq works out for ya! HH
 

chinchilla

Full Member
Dec 18, 2009
182
24
Detector(s) used
Tesoro, White's
Primary Interest:
Metal Detecting
If something pops and cracks, you shouldnt have to dig it! That was my problem, if its popping and cracking, I assume its a trash target. The 505 hits a solid tone with almost no popping, or cracking. Try placing a large nail next to a dime, and discing out the iron. My Vaq would mask the dime out everytime. A quarter would pick up at about 4-5" then it would be masked by the nail. The 505 will hit a dime tone, then bounce to an iron tone, so you KNOW the dime is there next to the iron. The ID#s correspond with each of the 19 tones, so the display is nearly as accurate as the tones are. The technology is quite amazing. I really believe digital software is a huge advancement in detector electronics. I was just not happy with guessing everytime I get a solid tone on the Vaq. I thumb the disc, cool it's a quarter! Not. Just a rusty bolt. To each his own, let us know how the Vaq works out for ya! HH

again, it all depends on the user, subtle faint signals are worth of digging no matter what machine you use, for some users like me there is no escape. It is possible that your vaquero was not working properly, because I have done several coin and nail tests and my vaquero had good results. I don't want to put down the mxt (another detector I like a lot) but the vaquero with the stock coil did best on that test than the mxt with the 950 and 6x10dd coil.
Maybe the 505 is your detector (I mean "The One") and there's no problem with that, but the Vaquero is not inferior.
 

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