WAS GENERAL GEORGE B. McCLELLAN INVOLVED WITH THE K.G.C.?

[L.C. BAKER]

George B. McClellan - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


It could explain his actions, and the lack of actions taken. It could explain why he was insubordinate to Abe Lincoln. It could explain why he chronically overestimated the strength of enemy units and was reluctant to apply principles of mass, frequently leaving large portions of his army unengaged at decisive points. It could explain retreats away from attacks by General Robert E. Lee's smaller Army of Northern Virginia and an unfulfilled plan to seize the Confederate capital of Richmond. It could explain why he allowed Lee to eke out a precarious tactical draw and avoid destruction, despite being outnumbered.
It could also be why Lincoln removed him from command, first as general-in-chief, then from the Army of the Potomac. He had failed to maintain the trust of Lincoln, and proved to be frustratingly derisive of, and insubordinate to the President.
Most of all it would explain why McClellan was the Democratic Party nominee opposing Lincoln in the 1864 presidential election, when he repudiated his party's anti-war platform, which promised to end the war and negotiate with the Confederacy.
After the war, Ulysses S. Grant was asked to evaluate McClellan as a general. He replied, "McClellan is to me one of the mysteries of the war."

If "Copperheads were poisoning the political offices, isn't it likely that the C.S.A. had a snake in the ranks of the Union Army?? Like a paid off fighter taking a dive?

Think about it L.C.

 

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[10claw]

looking at McClellan's military photos on the net shows him with his hand in his bosom. i would say yes, he was involved in kgc activities.

 

[Peyton Manning]

napoleon had his hand in his bosom as well!

 

[L.C. BAKER]

The hand sign is debatable. The mans record speaks for it's self.

L.C.

 

[Rebel - KGC]

PROBABLY Copper-Head/OAK; Copper-Heads were PEACE DEMOCRATS...

 

[ECS]

Jefferson Davis knew George B McClellan during their time at West Point and served in the Mexican-American War together,as well as many others who fought in the Civil War,both North and South.When Davis was US Sec of War during the Pierce Administration,Davis became a mentor to McClellan,giving him prime surveying missions and asignments.McClellan disliked Lincoln long before the 1860 election,supporting Douglas in that election,and by his own admission was a racist-"I confess to a prejudice in favor of my own race..."(the rest of that quote is very derogatory),and believed that slavery was right under the US Constitution.When he ran against Lincoln,his platform was written by Ohio Copperhead Clement Vallandigham,which called for the end of the War and a settlement with the Confederacy.
McClellan may not have been a member of the KGC,but because of his beliefs,may have been used as a patsy.As a Union General,he was good at training an army,but was reluctant to engage an enemy force,lacking the steel will of a Grant,Sherman,or a Lee and Jackson.
Keep in mind that those who took part in the Civil War on both sides,be it in the governments or military,knew each other from previous service in the US government and had many interelated contacts from that service,that many false KGC connections can be made from speculation.or trying to make the evidence fit a pet theory.

 

[L.C. BAKER]

There are cats and there are dogs. There is also a CATDOG, thats all i am saying.
You gotta start thinking like a criminal to catch one...........
Thanks for the info, very informative as always,
L.C.

 

[L.C. BAKER]

Jefferson Davis knew George B McClellan during their time at West Point and served in the Mexican-American War together,as well as many others who fought in the Civil War,both North and South.When Davis was US Sec of War during the Pierce Administration,Davis became a mentor to McClellan,giving him prime surveying missions and asignments.McClellan disliked Lincoln long before the 1860 election,supporting Douglas in that election,and by his own admission was a racist-"I confess to a prejudice in favor of my own race..."(the rest of that quote is very derogatory),and believed that slavery was right under the US Constitution.When he ran against Lincoln,his platform was written by Ohio Copperhead Clement Vallandigham,which called for the end of the War and a settlement with the Confederacy.
McClellan may not have been a member of the KGC,but because of his beliefs,may have been used as a patsy.As a Union General,he was good at training an army,but was reluctant to engage an enemy force,lacking the steel will of a Grant,Sherman,or a Lee and Jackson.
Keep in mind that those who took part in the Civil War on both sides,be it in the governments or military,knew each other from previous service in the US government and had many interelated contacts from that service,that many false KGC connections can be made from speculation.or trying to make the evidence fit a pet theory.

This is all just guilt by association and a large amount of circumstantial evidence. Very convincing though. Keep up the hunt and you will prevail!

L.C. Baker

 

[Rebel - KGC]

Jefferson Davis knew George B McClellan during their time at West Point and served in the Mexican-American War together,as well as many others who fought in the Civil War,both North and South.When Davis was US Sec of War during the Pierce Administration,Davis became a mentor to McClellan,giving him prime surveying missions and asignments.McClellan disliked Lincoln long before the 1860 election,supporting Douglas in that election,and by his own admission was a racist-"I confess to a prejudice in favor of my own race..."(the rest of that quote is very derogatory),and believed that slavery was right under the US Constitution.When he ran against Lincoln,his platform was written by Ohio Copperhead Clement Vallandigham,which called for the end of the War and a settlement with the Confederacy.
McClellan may not have been a member of the KGC,but because of his beliefs,may have been used as a patsy.As a Union General,he was good at training an army,but was reluctant to engage an enemy force,lacking the steel will of a Grant,Sherman,or a Lee and Jackson.
Keep in mind that those who took part in the Civil War on both sides,be it in the governments or military,knew each other from previous service in the US government and had many interelated contacts from that service,that many false KGC connections can be made from speculation.or trying to make the evidence fit a pet theory.

AGREE; OR... Copper-Heads (Yanks for STATE RIGHTS) or OAK. Even Gen. Robert E. Lee (CSA) was CAPT. Robert E. Lee (USA)... in the MEXICAN WAR!

 

[L.C. BAKER]

I have found that people changed throughout their lives. Some supporters changed their parties and then dropped that party and became something else. There is always a faction of sheep in any party that tend to go with the flow. It has been evident in many of these gentlemens pasts. I have identified whigs that became democrats, and democrats that became republicans. The ones that I seem to find in the "Copperhead" area, usually all became republicans until Lincoln was gone, then they became Democrats again. The Mexican War is a good implication of Southern Thoughts. It didn't mean much to the Yanks, so not many of them participated.

L.C.

 

[ECS]

... The Mexican War is a good implication of Southern Thoughts...

When President Tyler annexed Texas as a part of the United States,diplomatic relations were immediatly broken off between Mexico and the US.In 1845,President Polk tried to renew them by sending John Slidell of New Orleans to adjust the Mexican claims and the Texas boundary,and offer Mexico 30 million dollars for New Mexico and California.Slidell was refused an audience with the Mexican government.
John Slidell was a KGC member in New Orleans,along with other members of the MYSTIC KREWE OF COMUS.mainly Albert Pike and Judah P Benjamin,who met at the Pickwick Club.The Mexican-American War was highly supported by the Southern Democrates,and could be considered as an attempt to start building the GOLDEN CIRCLE.
It is interseting to note those who fought in this war,who later fought for the South,including Lee,Jackson,and Jefferson Davis,whose first wife was the daughter of Zachary Taylor,who also fought in the Mexican War and later became President after Polk.
Slidell's nephew in law,August Belmont was connected to the Rothschilds Bank,and Belmont paid for Franklin Pierce's 1852 Presidental Campaign.
There are many connections within connections,and plots and schemes within schemes and plots behind closed doors that led to the Civil War,with states rights as the issue.

 

[ECS]

In 1848,US SEN(MS)Jefferson Davis,proposed and called for a vote to add an amendment to the TREATY OF GUADALUPE HIDALGO to annex most of northeasten Mexico to the United States.It failed to pass,44 against,11 for.Want to guess which states the Senators who voted for,represented?
During the same session,Sen Davis said this concerning Cuba,"It must be ours to increase the number of slaveholding constituencies".
Right out of the KGC playbook.

 

[Rebel - KGC]

Well... it ALL goes back to the Thomas Jefferson-Aaron Burr conflict of 1803 or so... A. Burr (VP when Jefferson was Prez) wanted his own EMPIRE (Southern, with slaves & plantations in the SW USA); AB wanted to be KING! Check it OUT!

 

[L.C. BAKER]

Well... it ALL goes back to the Thomas Jefferson-Aaron Burr conflict of 1803 or so... A. Burr (VP when Jefferson was Prez) wanted his own EMPIRE (Southern, with slaves & plantations in the SW USA); AB wanted to be KING! Check it OUT!

Lewis Cass turned Burr in for treason to President Jefferson over trying to filibuster the area (by deed not force). But when william walker took nicaragua over Cass had no problem with it, nor did president Franklin Pierce. In fact cass had the man in charge of landing the marines in nicaragua removed from his position for removing Walker from nicaragua! The K.G.C. wanted that empire, and they were not going to let aaron burr have any of it!!! Thanks for bringing that up Rebel, it is a good indicator of Lewis Cass and Franklin Pierce being members of the K.G.C. It's that kind of circumstantial evidence that cushions the hard evidence against them!

L.C.

 

[L.C. BAKER]

From 1857 to 1860, Lewis Cass served as Secretary of State under President James Buchanan. He was sympathetic to American filibusterers and was instrumental in having Commodore Hiram Paulding removed from command for his landing of Marines in Nicaragua and compelling the removal of William Walker to the United States. this to me is a sign of his true Knights of the Golden Circle affiliation.

 

[Gray Mouser]

facts trump.circumstantial anything everytime

Here are a few actual facts to add to your circumstantial "evidence" (more like opinions than evidence)

1. Virtually every civil war general posed with either hand in that position including Grant. It was a Napoleonic lose so why shouldn't the young Napoleon pose like that?

2. Mcclellan won the first substantial land battles of the war and secured west Virginia.

3. The proposed attack south of the James river rwas first proposed by Mcclellan in early February 1862. This is the route Grant used because Halleck was in no position to over rule him. Mcclellan didn't have that luxury.

4. Mcclellan supervised the fortifications around Washington that kept Lee and Early from raiding or occupying the city.

5. Mcclellan proposed fortifying Maryland Heights. Halleck ignored him so McClaws took the heights and with it Harper's Ferry.

6. Mcclellan did not have control of either the transports being used to bring his men from Fort Monroe to Alexandria (Halleck did) nor did he have control over fortress Monroe. This led to huge delays.

7. Mcclellan specifically disavowed the democratic platform when he accepted the presidential nomination in 1864.

8. Neither Vallindighan or Pendleton were Mcclellan supporters.

9. Mcellan supported military emancipation. Read his Harrison Bar letter. He disagrees with politically freeing slaves since it was unconstitutional. Something Lincoln agreed since he stressed the need for an ammendment to circumvent the risk of the emancipation proclamation being pronounced void and unconstitutional. He actually says this several times.

If this isn't enough facts you guys are a lost cause all your own.

Research goes a long way.

 

[L.C. BAKER]

Here are a few actual facts to add to your circumstantial "evidence" (more like opinions than evidence)

1. Virtually every civil war general posed with either hand in that position including Grant. It was a Napoleonic lose so why shouldn't the young Napoleon pose like that?

2. Mcclellan won the first substantial land battles of the war and secured west Virginia.

3. The proposed attack south of the James river rwas first proposed by Mcclellan in early February 1862. This is the route Grant used because Halleck was in no position to over rule him. Mcclellan didn't have that luxury.

4. Mcclellan supervised the fortifications around Washington that kept Lee and Early from raiding or occupying the city.

5. Mcclellan proposed fortifying Maryland Heights. Halleck ignored him so McClaws took the heights and with it Harper's Ferry.

6. Mcclellan did not have control of either the transports being used to bring his men from Fort Monroe to Alexandria (Halleck did) nor did he have control over fortress Monroe. This led to huge delays.

7. Mcclellan specifically disavowed the democratic platform when he accepted the presidential nomination in 1864.

8. Neither Vallindighan or Pendleton were Mcclellan supporters.

9. Mcellan supported military emancipation. Read his Harrison Bar letter. He disagrees with politically freeing slaves since it was unconstitutional. Something Lincoln agreed since he stressed the need for an ammendment to circumvent the risk of the emancipation proclamation being pronounced void and unconstitutional. He actually says this several times.

If this isn't enough facts you guys are a lost cause all your own.

Research goes a long way.

Well I guess you answered the question Gary! Great R and I. Thanks for posting it. I had no evidence to support the theory that he may have been K.G.C., nor have I linked him to any of the men that we have identified.

Thanks, L.C.

 

[Gray Mouser]

Thanks. I'm writing a book about the civil war so I find it interesting what others think of the war.

While McClellan wasn't a great general, he was certainly a good one (or Lincoln would have never reinstated him). His record against Lee speaks for itself when analyzed objectively. Lee said he was the best General he faced and he wasnt known for lying. He was probably the third most responsible person behind Grant & Lincoln for the Union winning. It's unfortunate politics garble so much of history but McClellan was quite pompous so he didnt help his cause.

 

[senior deacon]

Think that the men love McClellan but as you have stated he being pompous grated the nerves of the political leaders. Meade and Grant turned the tide with victories in Gettysburg and Vicksburg. Grant was much disliked by most. Grant could bring home the bacon for Lincoln. For a loser that had failed in almost everything he proved to be a General that was head and shoulders above all the other officers. Sherman might have been his equal but we will never know for Grant was the head of the army. Lee thought that McClellan was a able opponent. Grant was the general to end the war and reunite the nation. McClellan to lead the state of New Jersey.

As far as him being a Copperhead No!!!!!!!!! and not a part of the K.G.C. for sure.


Senior Deacon

 

[L.C. BAKER]

Speaking of general Grant.....What about the railroad money that fluffed his political carrier? Where do you think that began flowing from and when? If he was mediating between Thomas Durant and General Dodge before Grant was even President. Could it have had anything with the abrupt turn South as soon as the tracks left Omaha before they turned back West?

Ulysses S. Grant and the Union Pacific Railroad ... - The Civil War Parlor

And lets not forget his possible involvement in the Black Friday scandal...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Black_Friday_(1869)