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  1. #121
    us
    May 2011
    88

    Re: Is a certain PSI ability needed or useful for Lrl"s? Dowsing yes.

    EE, the question was addressed to LRL users. Why are you butting in? humble

  2. #122
    us
    Apr 2008
    Central California
    4,016
    8 times

    Re: Is a certain PSI ability needed or useful for Lrl"s? Dowsing yes.

    Quote Originally Posted by humble

    EE, the question was addressed to LRL users. Why are you butting in? humble


    Since LRLs don't work, they cannot be "used." So there are no such people as LRL "users." Therefore the question is not addressed to anyone in particular.

    Besides, I was commenting on your post (note the quote box), and answering the topic question, as I stated in the post, as well.

    So butt out!

    An evil group is comprised of the insane, who, out of fear, imagine that they must conspire to destroy those who are honest and able. A good group is made up of honest people, who could each survive on their own, yet work together openly for betterment for themselves and others.

  3. #123
    us
    The Watcher

    Apr 2004
    Northern Nevada
    Dowsing Rods and a Ranger Tell Examiner
    7,820
    250 times

    Re: Is a certain PSI ability needed or useful for Lrl"s? Dowsing yes.

    ~EE~
    Since LRLs don't work, they cannot be "used." So there are no such people as LRL "users." Therefore the question is not addressed to anyone in particular.
    Besides, I was commenting on your post (note the quote box), and answering the topic question, as I stated in the post, as well.
    So butt out!
    Hey humble..EE is scared to death of LRL users because we know and have proved that he has no knowledge about them. He does not understand that we want to talk to other LRL users and exchange information with them.

    After having a stroke my ability to use rods for Dowsing or the use of rods with a LRL were gone..since that time an operation has cured that problem.

    I use no mental input to do either type of treasure hunting. Of course there is always a chance that I am wrong about that fact... The scientific community is a long way from understanding the human brains power.
    So butt out!
    It looks like EE thinks his name is Marc and owns this web site..Art



  4. #124
    us
    May 2011
    88

    Re: Is a certain PSI ability needed or useful for Lrl"s? Dowsing yes.

    Since LRLs don't work, they cannot be "used." So there are no such people as LRL "users." Therefore the question is not addressed to anyone in particular.
    EE, your logic defies rational explanation. I hope you will explain your rationale to the web site host so he in turn can explain to the rest of us as to why he would create a forum titled "Long Range Locators" (LRL) if no users of LRL existed to post on such a forum, or why you infer that those who claim to being Long Range Locator users are lieing because you say LRL users don't exist?

    Perhaps it's the terminology you are having difficulty with. Would it help you if I referred to myself as a user of Remote Sensing Discrimination (RSD) ? humble

  5. #125
    us
    May 2011
    88

    Re: Is a certain PSI ability needed or useful for Lrl"s? Dowsing yes.

    Art, I am very sorry about the stroke, but I am very happy you are making a recovery. It's a pleasure to read of your personal experience with LRL. Thank you, and keep up your good works. They are appreciated. humble

  6. #126
    us
    Apr 2008
    Central California
    4,016
    8 times

    Re: Is a certain PSI ability needed or useful for Lrl"s? Dowsing yes.

    Quote Originally Posted by humble
    Since LRLs don't work, they cannot be "used." So there are no such people as LRL "users." Therefore the question is not addressed to anyone in particular.
    EE, your logic defies rational explanation. I hope you will explain your rationale to the web site host so he in turn can explain to the rest of us as to why he would create a forum titled "Long Range Locators" (LRL) if no users of LRL existed to post on such a forum, or why you infer that those who claim to being Long Range Locator users are lieing because you say LRL users don't exist?

    Perhaps it's the terminology you are having difficulty with. Would it help you if I referred to myself as a user of Remote Sensing Discrimination (RSD) ? humble


    Just because you and your ilk invented the name "Long Range Locator," doesn't mean that such a device acutally exists, as advertised. The "LRLs" so far marketed are not capable of locating anything, either long or short range. It is a fictional name.

    You could have a forum section dedicated to discussing Mickey Mouse, but that doesn't mean that he is a real mouse, does it?

    Therefore, asking a question of people who have actually met Mickey, and had lunch with him, is a fictional question. And those who would claim that they did, are merely fantasizing.

    No LRL has ever been proven to the World to actually work. They are totally ficticious.

    What you refer to yourself as, is entirely your own little problem.



    An evil group is comprised of the insane, who, out of fear, imagine that they must conspire to destroy those who are honest and able. A good group is made up of honest people, who could each survive on their own, yet work together openly for betterment for themselves and others.

  7. #127
    us
    May 2011
    88

    Re: Is a certain PSI ability needed or useful for Lrl"s? Dowsing yes.

    EE so far, your posts are circular and you are making no sense. Not even common sense for you to demonstrate you are interested in rational discussion of the subject.

    If you are proclaiming yourself an expert on Remote Sensing methods, please be kind enough to tell us about the Remote sensing methods you have personally field tested that detect Magnetic fields from a distance so there is some common ground for discussion?

    I did not invent the term LRL, but it seems applicable. But, if you don't like to use the term LRL, just say so, and I won't use it when posting to you. Fair enough? Was "you and your ilk" intended to be an insult? I'll accept it as merely a mis-understanding.

    I agree, that competitive advertising often exaggerates to extremes. I remember an ad my friend Charlie Garrett, once ran where he claimed his metal detectors detected objects at "Incredible Depths". Would you agree with that claim? humble




  8. #128
    us
    The Watcher

    Apr 2004
    Northern Nevada
    Dowsing Rods and a Ranger Tell Examiner
    7,820
    250 times

    Re: Is a certain PSI ability needed or useful for Lrl"s? Dowsing yes.

    ~EE~
    Just because you and your ilk invented the name "Long Range Locator," doesn't mean that such a device acutally exists, as advertised. The "LRLs" so far marketed are not capable of locating anything, either long or short range. It is a fictional name.
    http://forum.treasurenet.com/index.p...,431427.0.html
    I Will Prove to the World That My LRL Works!
    http://forum.treasurenet.com/index.p...,428232.0.html
    Can You Scientifically Prove to the World That LRLs Work?
    http://forum.treasurenet.com/index.p...,410862.0.html
    A Dozen Points Proving LRL Fraud
    http://forum.treasurenet.com/index.p...,390641.0.html
    The Questions LRLers Refuse to Answer
    http://forum.treasurenet.com/index.p...,409519.0.html
    Known Facts About LRLs Only---No Insults or Tall Tales
    http://forum.treasurenet.com/index.p...,387205.0.html
    Are LRLs More Than Just Dowsing?
    http://forum.treasurenet.com/index.p...,411065.0.html
    Random Double-Blind Tests for LRLs
    http://forum.treasurenet.com/index.p...,393449.0.html
    What do LRL Promoters Fear the Most?
    http://forum.treasurenet.com/index.p...,389594.0.html
    Different Ways of Testing LRLs
    Thank You EE....You are our best proof.
    You could have a forum section dedicated to discussing Mickey Mouse, but that doesn't mean that he is a real mouse, does it?
    I am sure if there was a treasure hunting tool named Mickey Mouse there would be a section to discuss the tool here on t-net.

    Therefore, asking a question of people who have actually met Mickey, and had lunch with him, is a fictional question. And those who would claim that they did, are merely fantasizing.
    Why?...Your post about LRLs are all fictional so what would be the difference?
    No LRL has ever been proven to the World to actually work. They are totally ficticious.
    They are not fictional to the 61 plus owner operators who have testified here on t-net and the 100s of people on the internet that have testified to how they have worked for them

    What you refer to yourself as, is entirely your own little problem.
    Does that make sense to anyone?...Art

  9. #129
    us
    Apr 2008
    Central California
    4,016
    8 times

    Re: Is a certain PSI ability needed or useful for Lrl"s? Dowsing yes.

    humble---

    Your insult about "a common fallacy" was totally unnecessary. The ideometer effect is a repeatedly documented phenomenon. Your referring to it as a fallacy is a falsehood.

    And "skeptics" very seldom post anything on this board. If you are referring to those who post facts showing that LRL are fraudulent, then your calling them "skeptics" is a misnomer and an insult.


    Your statement that facts posted which disprove LRLs, do not account for "mystery" devices and some alleged, yet unproven, "sense of feel," is merely confusing the real question of topic, with rumor and fantasy.

    Big J asked a simple question, and rather then replying with a simple, straightforward answer, you just had to take a few shots at those who merely post the truth. Not very nice, and not suitable to your username, either.


    Quote Originally Posted by EE THr
    Quote Originally Posted by humble

    Judy, a common fallacy presented by the Skeptic organization is that LRL's only work when a target is visible to the operator, or a hand held L-Rod can only be physically moved in the direction of a target via a mentally influenced ideomoter muscle reflex.

    Their argument does not account for several privately owned electronic LRL's that have been invented, tested, and used successfully during the past 30 years using electronic metering & audio to detect buried targets.

    Neither does their argument take into account non-electronic LRL's that utilize the operators sense of Feel, to lock on to the field of a target, even while blindfolded. humble

    Yes, if anyone could get a currently marketed "LRL" to reliably locate anything, some kind of non-empirical ability would be necessary, because their pseudoelectronics circuitry does nothing in that regard.

    There is no evidence that any privately invented "super" LRLs exist, except for some ridiculous claims by a couple of sub-amateur pseudoelectronics wannabes.

    And a "non-electronic" LRL would be a dowsing device, by definition.



    As I have said before, I have no reason to doubt that someone, somewhere, might be able to find stuff with an LRL, but not because of their so-called "electronic" components.

    Lately I have added that I do have reason to believe that none of the LRLers posting on here have ever found anything with an LRL.

    I might add that, although there are measurable electromagnetic radiation waves emanating from brains, and measurable electricity inside brains, the same is true for other cells throughout human and animal bodies, and in vegetation.

    Also, the electromagnetic energy radiating from cells is of very short range. Using the observations that thoughts can affect others over very long distance spans, to support the idea that cell emanations travel long distances, even though their range has been proven to be short, is a misapplication of logic. There is no reason to conclude that physical "energy" must be responsible for "paranormal" abilities, unless it is being promoted that the soul does not exist, such as with the mantra of Eugenics. None of the "mind is in the brain" claims have ever been scientifically proven, simply because that is not the case.

    And that is why an "electronic" device cannot enhance whatever abilities for dowsing a person might have. Because so-called PSI phenomenon do not occur within the physical realm (which includes energy), but they can affect the physical.

    I won't argue the existence of the soul, because I am not trying to "convince" anyone about it, but rather I am merely answering the question of the topic title. People can certainly think for themselves on this matter, so trying to convince anyone is not of much help.

    But that's my answer....



    My answer was pertinent to the topic title, to Big J's question, and also to your post.

    So, now you want to mess up the thread, and Big J's question/discussion, by trying to start an irrelevent argument with me? Tisk-tisk. Call Big J's thread police! Or maybe a whaaaaaaaaaaambulance!

    An evil group is comprised of the insane, who, out of fear, imagine that they must conspire to destroy those who are honest and able. A good group is made up of honest people, who could each survive on their own, yet work together openly for betterment for themselves and others.

  10. #130
    us
    Apr 2008
    Central California
    4,016
    8 times

    Re: Is a certain PSI ability needed or useful for Lrl"s? Dowsing yes.

    Quote Originally Posted by aarthrj3811
    ~EE~
    Just because you and your ilk invented the name "Long Range Locator," doesn't mean that such a device acutally exists, as advertised. The "LRLs" so far marketed are not capable of locating anything, either long or short range. It is a fictional name.
    http://forum.treasurenet.com/index.p...,431427.0.html
    I Will Prove to the World That My LRL Works!
    http://forum.treasurenet.com/index.p...,428232.0.html
    Can You Scientifically Prove to the World That LRLs Work?
    http://forum.treasurenet.com/index.p...,410862.0.html
    A Dozen Points Proving LRL Fraud
    http://forum.treasurenet.com/index.p...,390641.0.html
    The Questions LRLers Refuse to Answer
    http://forum.treasurenet.com/index.p...,409519.0.html
    Known Facts About LRLs Only---No Insults or Tall Tales
    http://forum.treasurenet.com/index.p...,387205.0.html
    Are LRLs More Than Just Dowsing?
    http://forum.treasurenet.com/index.p...,411065.0.html
    Random Double-Blind Tests for LRLs
    http://forum.treasurenet.com/index.p...,393449.0.html
    What do LRL Promoters Fear the Most?
    http://forum.treasurenet.com/index.p...,389594.0.html
    Different Ways of Testing LRLs
    Thank You EE....You are our best proof.
    You could have a forum section dedicated to discussing Mickey Mouse, but that doesn't mean that he is a real mouse, does it?
    I am sure if there was a treasure hunting tool named Mickey Mouse there would be a section to discuss the tool here on t-net.

    Therefore, asking a question of people who have actually met Mickey, and had lunch with him, is a fictional question. And those who would claim that they did, are merely fantasizing.
    Why?...Your post about LRLs are all fictional so what would be the difference?
    No LRL has ever been proven to the World to actually work. They are totally ficticious.
    They are not fictional to the 61 plus owner operators who have testified here on t-net and the 100s of people on the internet that have testified to how they have worked for them

    What you refer to yourself as, is entirely your own little problem.
    Does that make sense to anyone?...Art


    Uh-oh, here she comes...

    Click image for larger version. 

Name:	Thread Police 2.jpg 
Views:	332 
Size:	68.4 KB 
ID:	583072

    Watch out, boy---she'll chew you up!

    An evil group is comprised of the insane, who, out of fear, imagine that they must conspire to destroy those who are honest and able. A good group is made up of honest people, who could each survive on their own, yet work together openly for betterment for themselves and others.

  11. #131
    us
    The Watcher

    Apr 2004
    Northern Nevada
    Dowsing Rods and a Ranger Tell Examiner
    7,820
    250 times

    Re: Is a certain PSI ability needed or useful for Lrl"s? Dowsing yes.

    Quote Originally Posted by EE THr
    Quote Originally Posted by aarthrj3811
    ~EE~
    Just because you and your ilk invented the name "Long Range Locator," doesn't mean that such a device acutally exists, as advertised. The "LRLs" so far marketed are not capable of locating anything, either long or short range. It is a fictional name.
    http://forum.treasurenet.com/index.p...,431427.0.html
    I Will Prove to the World That My LRL Works!
    http://forum.treasurenet.com/index.p...,428232.0.html
    Can You Scientifically Prove to the World That LRLs Work?
    http://forum.treasurenet.com/index.p...,410862.0.html
    A Dozen Points Proving LRL Fraud
    http://forum.treasurenet.com/index.p...,390641.0.html
    The Questions LRLers Refuse to Answer
    http://forum.treasurenet.com/index.p...,409519.0.html
    Known Facts About LRLs Only---No Insults or Tall Tales
    http://forum.treasurenet.com/index.p...,387205.0.html
    Are LRLs More Than Just Dowsing?
    http://forum.treasurenet.com/index.p...,411065.0.html
    Random Double-Blind Tests for LRLs
    http://forum.treasurenet.com/index.p...,393449.0.html
    What do LRL Promoters Fear the Most?
    http://forum.treasurenet.com/index.p...,389594.0.html
    Different Ways of Testing LRLs
    Thank You EE....You are our best proof.


    You could have a forum section dedicated to discussing Mickey Mouse, but that doesn't mean that he is a real mouse, does it?
    I am sure if there was a treasure hunting tool named Mickey Mouse there would be a section to discuss the tool here on t-net.

    Therefore, asking a question of people who have actually met Mickey, and had lunch with him, is a fictional question. And those who would claim that they did, are merely fantasizing.
    Why?...Your post about LRLs are all fictional so what would be the difference?
    No LRL has ever been proven to the World to actually work. They are totally ficticious.
    They are not fictional to the 61 plus owner operators who have testified here on t-net and the 100s of people on the internet that have testified to how they have worked for them

    What you refer to yourself as, is entirely your own little problem.
    Does that make sense to anyone?...Art


    Uh-oh, here she comes...




    Look out, man---she'll chew you up!

    Thank you EE for answering my questions...This is the biggest insult of all..I am sure that Judy will agree with me..Art

  12. #132
    mx
    Nov 2004
    Alamos,Sonora,Mexico
    11,213
    2383 times

    Re: Is a certain PSI ability needed or useful for Lrl"s? Dowsing yes.


    EE where did you get Judy's picture?

    Don Jose de La Mancha
    "I exist to live, not live to exist"

  13. #133
    mx
    Nov 2004
    Alamos,Sonora,Mexico
    11,213
    2383 times

    Re: Is a certain PSI ability needed or useful for Lrl"s? Dowsing yes.

    Good evening: this post can rightly fit into dowsing and lRL's sections.

    In the 60's a gentleman in California, Cameron (?) was one of the most continuously successful practitioners of dowsing, for anything, but especially H2o.. In his postings of his extensive research he finally developed a dowsing device that was suspended by springs inside of a glass cage in such a way that the user could not move the indicator to point no matter how the box was turned, all that he could do was to cause it to vibrate. Yet when mentally programed, it would definitely 'point' in the direction of the subject looked for.

    It worked inside of car and a light aircraft..

    He died shortly after and his remote device was lost. It sits in some garage or whatever, a forgotten giant step for Mankind.. It needed a human operator to mentally fix an image of what was being sought for to respond.

    I was in correspondence with him for a bit and talked to others that witnessed his box working. The operator did not have to be holding it.

    It reminded me of a Checkslovakian researcher that discovered how to charge up devices with the energy of 'looking and concentrating' at the device and cause them to move or indicate.. I believe they are called psionic devices. Fascinating.


    Don Jose de La Mancha
    "I exist to live, not live to exist"

  14. #134
    us
    May 2011
    88

    Re: Is a certain PSI ability needed or useful for Lrl"s? Dowsing yes.

    humble---

    Your insult about "a common fallacy" was totally unnecessary. The ideometer effect is a repeatedly documented phenomenon. Your referring to it as a fallacy is a falsehood.

    You are funny! If you are not a Skeptic why do you find my reference to self proclaimed Skeptics as an insult to you. That doesn't make sense.

    I certainly didn't mention anything about the ideoMETER effect. You may be referring to the Ideomotor effect. The Skeptics have informed this, and other forums that the Ideomoter is something that cannot be seen, touched, feel, taste, can not be electronically metered, sensed, or measured, Therefore there is no absolute way to prove it, yet with all the unknown factors they claim that gravity, or a Ideomotor controlled muscle reaction is the only force that will cause a hand held L-rod to move. These are Skeptic beliefs, and not proven facts.

    Certainly, a trained Ideomotor response is no doubt utilized in the art of Dowsing, but as I stated in my answer to Judy's question, no psi ability is necessary to learn to use a LRL. It is not Psychic Dowsing


    And "skeptics" very seldom post anything on this board. If you are referring to those who post facts showing that LRL are fraudulent, then your calling them "skeptics" is a misnomer and an insult.

    Then why do those members refer to themselves as "Skeptics". I am not insulting them by referring to them by the title they wish to be called. Aren't you aware that Skeptics are a very powerful organization and proud of it?
    I'm not trying to be insulting but you seem to be oblivious to the facts.


    Your statement that facts posted which disprove LRLs, do not account for "mystery" devices and some alleged, yet unproven, "sense of feel," is merely confusing the real question of topic, with rumor and fantasy.

    I apologize, for it has not been my intent to confuse you. I have not seen any facts you have posted that dis-prove mine, or anyone's successful use of LRL's.

    Big J asked a simple question, and rather then replying with a simple, straightforward answer, you just had to take a few shots at those who merely post the truth. Not very nice, and not suitable to your username, either.

    The answer to Judy's question was very straight forward. I will repeat "NO PSI ABILITY IS NEEDED TO USE A LRL".

    As far as my user name being unsuitable, that's entirely possible but most of the good names have been taken. I looked at your user name and my first impression was that EE may stand for Electronics Engineer, and since most expensive LRL's around the world are manufactured by electronics people, you would be well versed to know what you are talking about. So what does the EE stand for?
    humble

  15. #135
    us
    Apr 2008
    Central California
    4,016
    8 times

    Re: Is a certain PSI ability needed or useful for Lrl"s? Dowsing yes.

    Quote Originally Posted by humble
    humble---

    Your insult about "a common fallacy" was totally unnecessary. The ideometer effect is a repeatedly documented phenomenon. Your referring to it as a fallacy is a falsehood.

    You are funny! If you are not a Skeptic why do you find my reference to self proclaimed Skeptics as an insult to you. That doesn't make sense.

    I certainly didn't mention anything about the ideoMETER effect. You may be referring to the Ideomotor effect. The Skeptics have informed this, and other forums that the Ideomoter is something that cannot be seen, touched, feel, taste, can not be electronically metered, sensed, or measured, Therefore there is no absolute way to prove it, yet with all the unknown factors they claim that gravity, or a Ideomotor controlled muscle reaction is the only force that will cause a hand held L-rod to move. These are Skeptic beliefs, and not proven facts.

    Certainly, a trained Ideomotor response is no doubt utilized in the art of Dowsing, but as I stated in my answer to Judy's question, no psi ability is necessary to learn to use a LRL. It is not Psychic Dowsing


    Sorry I didn't check the spelling. The whole idea of ideomotor response is that it is not a conscious action, so it cannot be trained. But yes, it can be proven, by the fact that dowsers can "find" the target when they already know where it is, but not when they don't.

    I don't want to go off topic by talking about dowsing in the LRL forum, but water dowsers are the largest group of people claiming this ability; but their problem is that water is all over the place underground. It's known as the water table. Dig just about anywhere, and you will eventually hit water.



    And "skeptics" very seldom post anything on this board. If you are referring to those who post facts showing that LRL are fraudulent, then your calling them "skeptics" is a misnomer and an insult.

    Then why do those members refer to themselves as "Skeptics".

    They don't call themselves skeptics. I am not a "skeptic," and I don't know of anyone posting currently who calls themself a skeptic.

    I am not insulting them by referring to them by the title they wish to be called. Aren't you aware that Skeptics are a very powerful organization and proud of it?

    I don't know of anyone from any "skeptic organization" who posts on here.

    I'm not trying to be insulting but you seem to be oblivious to the facts.


    Your statement that facts posted which disprove LRLs, do not account for "mystery" devices and some alleged, yet unproven, "sense of feel," is merely confusing the real question of topic, with rumor and fantasy.

    I apologize, for it has not been my intent to confuse you. I have not seen any facts you have posted that dis-prove mine, or anyone's successful use of LRL's.

    Then you haven't been paying attention. A Dozen Points Proving LRL Fraud These points have never been rationally refuted.

    Big J asked a simple question, and rather then replying with a simple, straightforward answer, you just had to take a few shots at those who merely post the truth. Not very nice, and not suitable to your username, either.

    The answer to Judy's question was very straight forward. I will repeat "NO PSI ABILITY IS NEEDED TO USE A LRL".

    I was talking about all the BS about skeptics and your fantasies about "LRLs."

    As far as my user name being unsuitable, that's entirely possible but most of the good names have been taken. I looked at your user name and my first impression was that EE may stand for Electronics Engineer, and since most expensive LRL's around the world are manufactured by electronics people, you would be well versed to know what you are talking about. So what does the EE stand for?
    humble
    An evil group is comprised of the insane, who, out of fear, imagine that they must conspire to destroy those who are honest and able. A good group is made up of honest people, who could each survive on their own, yet work together openly for betterment for themselves and others.

 

 
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