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Thread: The Peralta Stones

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  1. #2056
    gb
    Aug 2008
    Lancs
    184
    62 times
    All Types Of Treasure Hunting

    Re: The Peralta Stones

    Hi EB,

    This gets weirder and weirder, as that what you have quoted is associated with the Treasure of Rennes le Chateaue in France and there is believed to be a connection with the Rosicrucian's,

    furness

  2. #2057

    Aug 2004
    1,341
    38 times

    Re: The Peralta Stones

    Quote Originally Posted by Ellie Baba
    Hi All,

    Just made it back home after the photo shoot of Stone Maps at the Superstition Museum in A.J., AZ. Two things I found; 1. Once the horse map is orientated to the correct position in the sun the "8" (eight) can be clearly seen. Inside the museum or sighted from a different position outside the "B" stands out. The left side of the "B" incision is straight as an arrow. 2. The same works for the word "DON" on the back of the Trail Stone Map. We placed the tablet on a north/south direction and turned it slowly to an east/west direction with the "D" end facing east and soon a sun shadow produced the word "DON". Photos will soon be posted from others who attended.

    There are still some who just cannot seem to grasp the logic; therefore we will continue to have disagreements abound concerning these stone maps. That's why we have forums so that we can all try to prove out our own beliefs; right Lamar.

    By the way, what proof do you have that indicates the maps were not made before the 1940's (unless you are referring to the current existing maps)?

    Life is an adventure wherever you live it.

    Ellie Baba
    Dear Ellie Baba;
    You asked:
    By the way, what proof do you have that indicates the maps were not made before the 1940's (unless you are referring to the current existing maps)?
    This is some sort of joke, isn't it? The evidence against the stone maps being carved before the 1940s is pretty much ENDLESS! FOr example:
    The style of the lettering
    The style of caricatures (figures)
    The Bowie knife
    The shape of the heart
    The position of the brand on the horse
    The so-called *Spanish* words used
    The grammar
    The tools used to carve the stone maps

    And on and on. I could fill a book on all of the errors, mistakes and modern connotations associated with the stone maps, but why should I bother? The maps have examined by DROVES of highly respected and VERY highly trained and qualified historians and end result is always the same. The stone maps were carved sometime between the 1940s and the 1960s. Not a single accredited historian is willing to stake his/her reputation and professional credentials by claiming otherwise. To do so would be to invite ridicule and laughter. I am by no means an expert and I could tell the stone maps were produced during modern times, so that should state something in and of itself.
    Your friend;
    LAMAR

  3. #2058

    Aug 2004
    1,341
    38 times

    Re: The Peralta Stones

    Quote Originally Posted by somehiker
    Joe:
    Those who were singing Dies Irae were in a hall one floor above the hall that the Ethiopians were using.The Ethiopian service did include a great deal of chanting by the three priests,the Bishop,and a couple of others who I think were lay brothers.Some of it certainly sounded like latin to me and some was spoken in Ethiopian...even the odd bit of english here and there.It lasted about 5 1/2 hours in total.If they do sing "Dies Irae",I would expect it to be in Latin,but I will ask if you'd like.

    Regards:Wayne

    Dear SomeHiker;
    You stated:
    If they do sing "Dies Irae",I would expect it to be in Latin
    Not necessarily true, my friend. First, Christianity has been a part of the Ethiopian culture since the evangelical journeys of the Apostle St. Thomas, if memory serves correctly. Ethiopia has two major Christian faiths, the Ethiopian Orthodox Church and the Ethiopian Catholic Church. The liturgical Rites of both are identical in most aspects.

    And now, to further confuse matters, the Council of Trent in AD 1570 concluded that any Christian Church which used a Missal for at least two hundred years continiously, prior to the decision of the Council may continue to do so for all time. In short, any Christian Church which had used a Missal continuously from at least AD 1370 had the right to continue using it until today.

    The Ethiopian Christian Church was established around AD 80 and they have used the same Missal without change since that time, therefore the Ethiopian Catholics are permitted to continue celebrating Mass using the Ethiopian Rite, as set forth by the Council of Trent. And this SHOULD be the end of it, however nothing is quite that simple.

    When the Portuguese started the Age of Discovery in the 1500s, they set up and settled along the shores of Ethiopia, thus bringing the Tridentine Latin Mass with them. Thus the Ethiopian Catholic Church can celebrate Mass in either the Western Latin Rite or the Eastern Rite of Ethiopia without fear of reprisals or repercussions. Thus, about 50% of the Ethiopian Catholic Church celebrates Mass in the older Ethiopian Rite and the other 50% celebrates it in the Latin Rite.

    One sure-fire to assure that the Church is Ethiopian Catholic and not Ethiopian Orthodox is to listen to prayer requests during the Mass. If there is a prayer for the Pope, then you may rest assured that the Church is indeed Catholic. It is part of Ethiopian Catholic dogma to publicly pray for the Pope on ordinary Sundays in order to *prove* that they are indeed in full communion with the Bishop of Rome (the Pope). The Vatican in no way requires this from the Ethiopians, however it is looked upon as a very nice gesture on the part of the Ethiopian Catholics.

    And Dies Irae can be chanted (never actually *sung*) in the Gregorian manner in all languages, including Ethiopian and no matter what language it's chanted in, it remains one of my all-time favorites.
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dlr90...aynext_from=ML
    Your friend;
    LAMAR

  4. #2059
    us
    Mar 2005
    Laveen, AZ
    Tesoro Lobo
    527
    52 times

    Re: The Peralta Stones

    My Friend Lamar,

    Would you consider that the stone maps may have been produced at the turn of the century. Lets say 1903 to 1910? There is a thirty year difference to consider, and it fits into my time frame for this edition of the stone maps that we currently refer to. How could anyone believe that this set of stone maps could be any older than the site that they are referring to?

    Have a great week everyone!

    Ellie Baba


  5. #2060

    Aug 2004
    1,341
    38 times

    Re: The Peralta Stones

    Quote Originally Posted by Ellie Baba
    My Friend Lamar,

    Would you consider that the stone maps may have been produced at the turn of the century. Lets say 1903 to 1910? There is a thirty year difference to consider, and it fits into my time frame for this edition of the stone maps that we currently refer to. How could anyone believe that this set of stone maps could be any older than the site that they are referring to?

    Have a great week everyone!

    Ellie Baba

    Dear Ellie Baba;
    No, I do not feel that the stones were carved earlier than the 1940s however I did make one rather curious observation, but I tend to not mention it as it would only serve to further cloud the issue.
    Your friend;
    LAMAR

  6. #2061

    Aug 2004
    1,341
    38 times

    Re: The Peralta Stones

    Dear Ellie Baba;
    Instead of me pointing out the curiosity to everyone, I would first like to know how sharp everyone's sense of observation is, therefore I will refrain from stating the anomaly at this particular moment. I've never read of anyone discovering this anomaly before, so I may be a first, but then again I may not be. There is an anomaly between two of the stones and it should be fairly obvious after looking at them for a few moments each.
    Your friend;
    LAMAR

  7. #2062
    us
    Feb 2006
    New Hampshire - USA
    Fisher CZ21, Teknetics T2 & Minelab Sovereign GT
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    Banner Finds (1)

    Re: The Peralta Stones

    Lamar, it's a bit condescending and arrogant to assume to "notice" something quickly about the stones maps that nobody else has noticed, and then "test" everyone to see if anyone else can see it.

    How bout just coming out and telling us what you noticed and those interested can discuss it?

    If it's something that apparent, you may be surprised at how many other folks have noticed it. Just out of curiosity, do you know how many stones there are total?
    "There is no getting away from a treasure that once fastens upon your mind" - Joseph Conrad (Nostromo)

  8. #2063
    ca
    May 2007
    3,905
    5279 times
    All Types Of Treasure Hunting

    Re: The Peralta Stones

    Hi Lamar:
    As I mentioned in the post,the Ethiopians are using a hall in a Jesuit Loyola Training Center for their services.The hall that they were using was in the basement or "first floor" of a wing of the main building.I was invited to the service in order to receive a blessing from the Bishop for having made a bell for the local congregation,the Priest of which happens to be a co-worker.The bell also received a blessing.I heard "Dies Irae" coming from a floor above the Ethiopians.It was not the Ethiopians who were chanting/singing it.It sounded like a fairly large group,and I liked it,so I asked an older gentleman in a black suit,who was headed that way ,what it was.I did not ask if they were mormons....

    Regards:SH.
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    Hell,you ain't never too old to look!

  9. #2064

    Dec 2005
    Arizona
    7,749
    5322 times

    Re: The Peralta Stones

    Wayne,

    Liked the tone and color of your pictures, so I thought I would post a few of my own. Nothing to do with the stone maps, but I could add some petroglyphs as well. Posted them on another contentious topic here.

    Quote Originally Posted by cactusjumper
    This topic could use a peacful break, so here are some pictures I took last week on a pontoon ride up the river. The land critters were taken from a moving boat at around 150-200 yards:








    I have a few bikini shots, but figure the blood preasure in this topic is already high enough.

    Take care,

    Joe
    Hopefully, these will keep me out of trouble:



    This one is the "money" shot:


    It don't get any more LDM than a sunburst etched into the side of a rock.

    Take care,

    Joe
    " Hell, I was there!" Elmer Keith
    "There is an ancient proverb that says a man can never forgive you for a wrong he has done you." From a wise friend.

  10. #2065
    mx
    Nov 2004
    Alamos,Sonora,Mexico
    14,603
    11819 times
    All Types Of Treasure Hunting

    Re: The Peralta Stones

    Mind yer own '8*575888' business joe, and post away!! Who am I to deny the Lords finest work that he did just for me?

    Don Jose de La Mancha
    "I exist to live, not live to exist"

  11. #2066

    Dec 2005
    Arizona
    7,749
    5322 times

    Re: The Peralta Stones

    Don Jose,

    I realize the pictures are not up to some of the high standards that have been set in the LDM section of the Forum, but realize I am pushing the envelope by posting pictures so far removed from the topic. To try and edge a little closer to some of the conversations, I probably should post some of the Native American stuff.

    Take care,

    Joe
    __________________________

    Well......I did post the rock art above, but figured I should include one shot of some other Native American artwork:



    Satisfied?

    Joe

    " Hell, I was there!" Elmer Keith
    "There is an ancient proverb that says a man can never forgive you for a wrong he has done you." From a wise friend.

  12. #2067
    ca
    May 2007
    3,905
    5279 times
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    Re: The Peralta Stones

    Nice photos,Joe:
    A couple more from the service.The smoke from the pots swung by the priests at different times in the ceremony makes some of the photos hazy.
    The second pic is one of the "blessing of the children".I am invited back for a "fireside' celebration in September.

    Regards:SH.
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    Hell,you ain't never too old to look!

  13. #2068
    us
    Sep 2009
    158
    84 times

    Re: The Peralta Stones

    Quote Originally Posted by lamar
    Dear Ellie Baba;
    Instead of me pointing out the curiosity to everyone, I would first like to know how sharp everyone's sense of observation is, therefore I will refrain from stating the anomaly at this particular moment. I've never read of anyone discovering this anomaly before, so I may be a first, but then again I may not be. There is an anomaly between two of the stones and it should be fairly obvious after looking at them for a few moments each.
    Your friend;
    LAMAR
    Hello Lamar
    If you are talking about, what has been called the Peralta trail stone, heart inlay? The Heart stone is much older then the trail stone, and there is a trail line on the left side of the trail stone inlay that is not continued on the heart.
    The knife is Apache because it looks like theres, and the "A" on the handle with an arrow on the hilt.
    Lamar you have never answered any of my questions in the past, and I would not think of asking you any now.
    FEMF

  14. #2069
    us
    Fortune Favors the BOLD, while Karma Favors the Wise!

    Jan 2006
    Arizona Vagrant
    Modded SD2000 / White's Goldmaster 4B / Fisher FX-3 / Fisher Gemini / Schiebel MIMID
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    Re: The Peralta Stones

    FEMF,

    I put Lamar on "IGNORE" a while back because I found myself having to repeat the same proofs over and over and over. At first, he added a lot to the conversations and kept us on our toes. He then degenerated into acting offended at some inconsequential remark so he wouldn't have to address the subject at hand when he was proven wrong. Further debate with him became very frustrating and did nothing to further any knowledge.

    I guess you must have some inside knowledge that proves the heart insert is older than the trail stones. Have you ever seen the Stone Maps in person? Yesterday was my third time. First time hands on (see pic). The heart is made from a different type of stone than the trail maps. I can't say that it is any older or younger.

    The symbol on the handle of the dagger is not necessarily an "A". Please compare the symbol to every other "A" on the maps. It actually more closely resembles another symbol somewhere else on the maps.

    Best-Mike
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    "You wouldn't like me when I'm mad, because I back up my rage with hard facts and logic!" - The Credible Hulk

    ............... ALWAYS REMEMBER: When you make a typo, the errorists win...................Aloha Snackbar!

  15. #2070
    us
    Aug 2008
    49
    39 times

    Re: The Peralta Stones

    Fantastic photos Joe

 

 

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