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Thread: WANTED: Hikers to help document the conclusion of the Peralta Stone Maps

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  1. #196
    us
    Nov 2011
    Jamestown ND
    Garrett 2500
    1,049
    862 times
    Old Jesuits and Spainish Mines
    Quote Originally Posted by azdave35 View Post
    pretty close to the junction of labarge and boulder canyons
    Why that's right by worser's claim,

    babymick1

  2. #197
    us
    Dec 2008
    1,517
    3440 times
    Quote Originally Posted by wrmickel1 View Post
    Why that's right by worser's claim,

    babymick1
    wrmickel1 likes this.

  3. #198
    us
    Dec 2017
    Ash Fork, AZ and NE PA
    Tesoro
    86
    247 times
    All Types Of Treasure Hunting
    Quote Originally Posted by sgtfda View Post
    Horse Mesa area. Your not going to find gold in this stuff.
    Sarge, Mick,

    I don't know if this is of any help or not, but Paul posted earlier about a conversation on another channel...I went over there and looked, very informative....
    Click image for larger version. 

Name:	Bark Mine on Salt.JPG 
Views:	59 
Size:	82.7 KB 
ID:	1548397
    This article goes into the geology of Bark/Chuning's mine on the Salt...
    wrmickel1 and 393stroker like this.

  4. #199

    Feb 2004
    Mesa Arizona
    2,020
    2903 times
    Jim that describes the area to a T. The Salt is now Apache Lake in that spot. The granite starts on the other side of the lake. I have a friend that does very well in areas with decomposed granite. She uses a detector.
    PotBelly Jim likes this.

  5. #200

    Feb 2004
    Mesa Arizona
    2,020
    2903 times
    Jim I've not traveled into that area. I was on a jeep ride in the area with the mountain historian who also has a degree in geology. He pointed it out as a gold area along with the history.
    PotBelly Jim likes this.

  6. #201
    us
    Dec 2008
    1,517
    3440 times
    4 peaks has alot of potential for mining..too bad they made it wilderness and closed it off
    PotBelly Jim likes this.

  7. #202
    us
    Feb 2006
    New Hampshire - USA
    Fisher CZ21, Teknetics T2 & Minelab Sovereign GT
    2,641
    1649 times
    All Types Of Treasure Hunting
    Banner Finds (1)
    Quote Originally Posted by PotBelly Jim View Post
    Sarge, Mick,

    I don't know if this is of any help or not, but Paul posted earlier about a conversation on another channel...I went over there and looked, very informative....
    Click image for larger version. 

Name:	Bark Mine on Salt.JPG 
Views:	59 
Size:	82.7 KB 
ID:	1548397
    This article goes into the geology of Bark/Chuning's mine on the Salt...
    I read a couple hiking trip logs to Alder Creek. Most of the folks took a kayak from the Apache Lake Marina area to the creek and then hiked up to Brown's Cave. It sounds like there are some cairned trails around that area, but just about all the trip logs mention how tough it quickly gets when you get off the trail - THAT'S where I would want to explore
    somehiker and PotBelly Jim like this.
    "There is no getting away from a treasure that once fastens upon your mind" - Joseph Conrad (Nostromo)

  8. #203
    us
    Dec 2017
    Ash Fork, AZ and NE PA
    Tesoro
    86
    247 times
    All Types Of Treasure Hunting
    Sarge, Dave, Paul, Everyone,


    I’m trying to get a handle on where Bark/Chuning’s original mine on the Salt is actually located. In the Bark notes, Bark says Horse Mesa looms above in almost a straight cliff for over 2000 feet. This leads people to think he’s on the south bank, but to me it reads like he’s standing on the north bank, looking across the river and up at Horse Mesa. He also says Horse Mesa Dam is about a half mile below (down river) the mine location.
    I’ve looked over all the mining claims he filed in the area. To me, it looks like they’re all on the north bank of the river.


    In the attached document, I’ve attempted to point out what I think are the upper and lower boxes in the canyon and the possible mine locations. This is based on it being about a half mile from the dam, and he said his arrastra/water wheel was on a little “promontory” sticking out into the river.


    What do you guys think? In one of his mining claims, he references Alder Creek specifically (sounds like you were spot-on Sarge). If anyone wants copies of all these mining claims let me know, it took forever to download them all, don’t want anyone to have to go through that just to look at them.

    Click image for larger version. 

Name:	Bark Salt River Mine.pdf 
Views:	37 
Size:	203.9 KB 
ID:	1548542
    somehiker, txtea, deducer and 1 others like this.

  9. #204
    us
    Dec 2008
    1,517
    3440 times
    Quote Originally Posted by PotBelly Jim View Post
    Sarge, Dave, Paul, Everyone,


    I’m trying to get a handle on where Bark/Chuning’s original mine on the Salt is actually located. In the Bark notes, Bark says Horse Mesa looms above in almost a straight cliff for over 2000 feet. This leads people to think he’s on the south bank, but to me it reads like he’s standing on the north bank, looking across the river and up at Horse Mesa. He also says Horse Mesa Dam is about a half mile below (down river) the mine location.
    I’ve looked over all the mining claims he filed in the area. To me, it looks like they’re all on the north bank of the river.


    In the attached document, I’ve attempted to point out what I think are the upper and lower boxes in the canyon and the possible mine locations. This is based on it being about a half mile from the dam, and he said his arrastra/water wheel was on a little “promontory” sticking out into the river.


    What do you guys think? In one of his mining claims, he references Alder Creek specifically (sounds like you were spot-on Sarge). If anyone wants copies of all these mining claims let me know, it took forever to download them all, don’t want anyone to have to go through that just to look at them.

    Click image for larger version. 

Name:	Bark Salt River Mine.pdf 
Views:	37 
Size:	203.9 KB 
ID:	1548542
    jim...from what i have seen most of the mining was done on the north side of the river...there are no roads on the north side and they used to have a cable stretched across the river to transport ore and equipment from one side to the other....
    Last edited by azdave35; Feb 10, 2018 at 12:00 AM.
    PotBelly Jim likes this.

  10. #205

    Feb 2004
    Mesa Arizona
    2,020
    2903 times
    Paul I know where your heading on your next visit! It's very nice now. About 80 every day. Personally Im bored digging up gold and have been following historical legends. Most proving to be bull. Case in point. If there was so much gold in the volcano why was everyone up Alder Creek area back in the day. Well not everyone. A lot of Dutch hunters know nothing about prospecting. But they have the clues down pat.
    393stroker and Cubfan64 like this.

  11. #206
    us
    Apr 2009
    233
    449 times
    Jim,

    My image of the location of the Bark/Chuning arasrta was on the south side of the Salt river. Now that I think about it, I’m not sure why.

    This was my understanding of the “original” Bark/Chuning mine near the Salt, and it was done years ago!

    Greg Davis furnished much of the information and I don’t recall for sure if I was working with the actual claim documents in all cases.

    Bark and Chuning did the location work and Bark went to Phoenix and on November 19, 1895, filed a Claim under the name DEFENDER GOLD MINE (On the Salt River above present day Horse Mesa Dam) in both he and Chuning's names

    Between November 1895 and August 1896, Bark & Chuning built the burro powered arastra and began processing ore. Later they would build a water wheel arastra. According to Bark, he and Chuning had dug out about 30 tons of “ore”.

    The arastra site was probably very near the hard rock?? mine but I don’t know where the actual DEFENDER GOLD MINE was located and from what type of terrain the ore was being taken.

    Later;

    On August 14, 1896 Bark and Chuning located a mine called the PURITAN, very near their initial mine. Bark filed the location on October 12, 1896. On the same day Bark also filed a placer mine claim near the mouth of Alder Creek (North side of the Salt River) which they called CURIOSITY

    Frank Criswell, Bark’s partner, and his family and friends did file numerous claims mostly on the north side of the Salt in the fall of 1896.

    Anyway, do your mining claims match up with this story and timeline or do I have something messed up? Were the claims you have found indicate placer or hard rock?

    The access to the mine in Bark’s period was difficult. I also got the impression that the materials had to be shipped to some location above the mine and floated a few miles down the Salt to reach Bark’s operation.

    I guess it's all underwater now!

    Garry
    PotBelly Jim and deducer like this.

  12. #207
    us
    Dec 2008
    1,517
    3440 times
    Quote Originally Posted by Garry View Post
    Jim,

    My image of the location of the Bark/Chuning arasrta was on the south side of the Salt river. Now that I think about it, I’m not sure why.

    This was my understanding of the “original” Bark/Chuning mine near the Salt, and it was done years ago!

    Greg Davis furnished much of the information and I don’t recall for sure if I was working with the actual claim documents in all cases.

    Bark and Chuning did the location work and Bark went to Phoenix and on November 19, 1895, filed a Claim under the name DEFENDER GOLD MINE (On the Salt River above present day Horse Mesa Dam) in both he and Chuning's names

    Between November 1895 and August 1896, Bark & Chuning built the burro powered arastra and began processing ore. Later they would build a water wheel arastra. According to Bark, he and Chuning had dug out about 30 tons of “ore”.

    The arastra site was probably very near the hard rock?? mine but I don’t know where the actual DEFENDER GOLD MINE was located and from what type of terrain the ore was being taken.

    Later;

    On August 14, 1896 Bark and Chuning located a mine called the PURITAN, very near their initial mine. Bark filed the location on October 12, 1896. On the same day Bark also filed a placer mine claim near the mouth of Alder Creek (North side of the Salt River) which they called CURIOSITY

    Frank Criswell, Bark’s partner, and his family and friends did file numerous claims mostly on the north side of the Salt in the fall of 1896.

    Anyway, do your mining claims match up with this story and timeline or do I have something messed up? Were the claims you have found indicate placer or hard rock?

    The access to the mine in Bark’s period was difficult. I also got the impression that the materials had to be shipped to some location above the mine and floated a few miles down the Salt to reach Bark’s operation.

    I guess it's all underwater now!

    Garry
    hi garry...i was up at apache lake when they drained it for maintenance a few years back......i didn't see any evidence of an arrestra ..they may have used the arrestra already in existence down river by mormon flat
    PotBelly Jim likes this.

  13. #208
    us
    Dec 2017
    Ash Fork, AZ and NE PA
    Tesoro
    86
    247 times
    All Types Of Treasure Hunting
    Quote Originally Posted by Garry View Post
    Jim,

    My image of the location of the Bark/Chuning arasrta was on the south side of the Salt river. Now that I think about it, I’m not sure why.

    This was my understanding of the “original” Bark/Chuning mine near the Salt, and it was done years ago!

    Greg Davis furnished much of the information and I don’t recall for sure if I was working with the actual claim documents in all cases.

    Bark and Chuning did the location work and Bark went to Phoenix and on November 19, 1895, filed a Claim under the name DEFENDER GOLD MINE (On the Salt River above present day Horse Mesa Dam) in both he and Chuning's names

    Between November 1895 and August 1896, Bark & Chuning built the burro powered arastra and began processing ore. Later they would build a water wheel arastra. According to Bark, he and Chuning had dug out about 30 tons of “ore”.

    The arastra site was probably very near the hard rock?? mine but I don’t know where the actual DEFENDER GOLD MINE was located and from what type of terrain the ore was being taken.

    Later;

    On August 14, 1896 Bark and Chuning located a mine called the PURITAN, very near their initial mine. Bark filed the location on October 12, 1896. On the same day Bark also filed a placer mine claim near the mouth of Alder Creek (North side of the Salt River) which they called CURIOSITY

    Frank Criswell, Bark’s partner, and his family and friends did file numerous claims mostly on the north side of the Salt in the fall of 1896.

    Anyway, do your mining claims match up with this story and timeline or do I have something messed up? Were the claims you have found indicate placer or hard rock?

    The access to the mine in Bark’s period was difficult. I also got the impression that the materials had to be shipped to some location above the mine and floated a few miles down the Salt to reach Bark’s operation.

    I guess it's all underwater now!

    Garry

    Garry, you are correct in the timeline above...the only thing I would add is that the Defender was posted on the ground on 19 NOV 1895, and filed on 27 JAN 1896.

    Glad you are taking a turn on this, I hope everyone with something to add does so, but especially you...that's the intent in posting the map here...Dave is looking at the claims to see if he can help...I know I need to establish a timeline, I'm in no way done with the map (I need to date it and put a version on it as it changes). I'm not done with the timeline yet, so I may be wrong, but it looked like the water wheel lined up with the Puritan...after seeing what you posted, maybe it was all done only for the Defender ... I might be totally wrong at this point, hope everyone understands this is a work in progress. I suspect, and it's a suspicion only at this point, that there was more than one hard-rock claim on the Salt near the river's edge, even though the Bark Notes reads like it was only one.

    If you would like me to email the claims for perusal, PM me with an email address. It looks like Bark had well over 30 claims of various types in Maricopa Co alone, but there are only 5 or 6 documents (some with multiple mining claims) on the Salt or Alder Creek area, so e-mailing just the Salt River ones is manageable. Is it all of them? I think so, but it's possible some didn't survive or get digitized, so it would be very, very helpful if you feel like comparing them to any info you have from Greg D.

    I'm planning on marrying up the river bottom map with a USGS topo...so I have some graphics work to do before I can get to the timeline...I plan on using the info you guys posted on the other channel to help with the timeline, as most of the story is already there...the intent is to plot not only the river bottom claims, but the other ones that seem to be higher up, the road they built, and the route they took from the "hill" over Fish Creek.

    Thanks, Jim
    deducer likes this.

  14. #209
    us
    Dec 2017
    Ash Fork, AZ and NE PA
    Tesoro
    86
    247 times
    All Types Of Treasure Hunting
    Quote Originally Posted by azdave35 View Post
    hi garry...i was up at apache lake when they drained it for maintenance a few years back......i didn't see any evidence of an arrestra ..they may have used the arrestra already in existence down river by mormon flat
    Dave, they built the arrastra right next to the mine shaft, on a little "promontory" that stuck out into the river (Bark's notes)...Also, as an aside, I know there's disagreement over what side of the river the mine was on, but the contour lines on the map I posted looks like there wasn't much room on the south side (it was really steep) while on the north side there looks like there's some promontory's like Bark described. Did you get the claims I sent?

    EDIT: Bark says the water wheel got swept away soon after it was built, so I would imagine the arrastra got the same treatment during flooding after they left the mines and before the dam was built.
    Last edited by PotBelly Jim; Feb 10, 2018 at 02:37 PM.

  15. #210
    us
    Dec 2008
    1,517
    3440 times
    Quote Originally Posted by PotBelly Jim View Post
    Dave, they built the arrastra right next to the mine shaft, on a little "promontory" that stuck out into the river (Bark's notes)...Also, as an aside, I know there's disagreement over what side of the river the mine was on, but the contour lines on the map I posted looks like there wasn't much room on the south side (it was really steep) while on the north side there looks like there's some promontory's like Bark described. Did you get the claims I sent?

    EDIT: Bark says the water wheel got swept away soon after it was built, so I would imagine the arrastra got the same treatment during flooding after they left the mines and before the dam was built.
    hi jim...i didnt get the claim papers..i sent you an email...just reply to it and include the papers.....if the mines were on the north side of the river it would have to be east of goat mountain..probably closer to the old military camp called waterdog..there was also some mines across from burnt corral campground.....maybe greg will chime in and shed some light on the subject
    PotBelly Jim likes this.

 

 
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