Million ounces <--- Say what????

Springfield

Silver Member
Apr 19, 2003
2,850
1,381
New Mexico
Detector(s) used
BS
I must respectfully disagree amigo, and take the polar opposite position, that most reasonably sane people, WOULD want to tell the world about having found a bonanza. In fact it has appeared in the headlines over and over again, someone finds a great treasure hidden in an old barn or managed to retrieve a sunken treasure. It is human nature to wish to share good news, and finding a great treasure, or a great gold mine, is most usually good news. Keeping it totally secret is the rarity...
Oroblanco

Well, at least you're right about one thing - people are finding treasures and we're seeing their happy faces on the news. They rejoice in telling their stories - post hole banks from Grand dad's farm, recovery of the sunken Atocha treasures, even a dog who led his master to several jars of gold coins in California a couple months ago. Yes, we heard all about these folks' fortunate discoveries - months afterwards when the legal groundwork was set and the finds were protected. Keeping this type of news secret is certainly NOT a rarity, it is SOP, then and now. Again, what would YOU do?

Waltz was in the mining game most of his life. He knew the ropes. The reason he didn't file on his 'mine' is because he didn't HAVE a mine - he had an ill-gotten cache of ore, either stolen, high-graded or from some other means that he had to cover up by inventing the famous phantom mine that nobody can find. Sure, he knew the mountains well enough to provide 'directions' vague enough to frustrate, but not specific enough to locate the site.
 

Springfield

Silver Member
Apr 19, 2003
2,850
1,381
New Mexico
Detector(s) used
BS
Can't make a matchbox like that out of placer gold, that's for sure.
That is a fact, c de o. But where did that ore come from - AZ, CO, NM, MX? Lots of picture rock was available in those days. If you label it 'LDM ore', it's worth a fortune to some folks. Like a shard from the True Cross. Caveat emptor.
 

OP
OP
ConceptualizedNetherlandr
Apr 17, 2014
1,973
1,259
Tartarus Dorsa mountains
Primary Interest:
Other
Amigo Oroblanco, The very idea that LDM exists and/or it has vast know reserves (10^6 oz.) IS what you find in the dictionary if you look up speculation.

Makes a good story, but doesn't pan out.

World peace would be easier to obtain.
 

Oroblanco

Gold Member
Jan 21, 2005
7,837
9,813
DAKOTA TERRITORY
Detector(s) used
Tesoro Lobo Supertraq, (95%) Garrett Scorpion (5%)
Well, at least you're right about one thing - people are finding treasures and we're seeing their happy faces on the news. They rejoice in telling their stories - post hole banks from Grand dad's farm, recovery of the sunken Atocha treasures, even a dog who led his master to several jars of gold coins in California a couple months ago. Yes, we heard all about these folks' fortunate discoveries - months afterwards when the legal groundwork was set and the finds were protected. Keeping this type of news secret is certainly NOT a rarity, it is SOP, then and now. Again, what would YOU do?

Waltz was in the mining game most of his life. He knew the ropes. The reason he didn't file on his 'mine' is because he didn't HAVE a mine - he had an ill-gotten cache of ore, either stolen, high-graded or from some other means that he had to cover up by inventing the famous phantom mine that nobody can find. Sure, he knew the mountains well enough to provide 'directions' vague enough to frustrate, but not specific enough to locate the site.

As to your repeated question, asked and answered.

Your statement, quote

The reason he didn't file on his 'mine' is because he didn't HAVE a mine - he had an ill-gotten cache of ore, either stolen, high-graded or from some other means that he had to cover up by inventing the famous phantom mine that nobody can find.

now do you put this forth as statement of fact, or your opinion?

ConceptualizedNetherlandr wrote
Amigo Oroblanco, The very idea that LDM exists and/or it has vast know reserves (10^6 oz.) IS what you find in the dictionary if you look up speculation.

Makes a good story, but doesn't pan out.

World peace would be easier to obtain.

Good luck working on world peace.
 

Springfield

Silver Member
Apr 19, 2003
2,850
1,381
New Mexico
Detector(s) used
BS
... now do you put this forth as statement of fact, or your opinion? ...

It's my opinion, based on the facts, which are sorely lacking with this 'legend'.

Not that there aren't dozens of expert books available and a roster of unfortunates who lost their lives due to a manic belief in unsubstantiated hearsay over the decades. The bigger the lie, the more who believe it. The most important tool in your box is a working knowledge of human nature.

That said, it's also my opinion that there is a very large valuable cache in the Gila/Salt vicinity - date and ownership unknown. Whether Waltz had any knowledge of it is an open question.
 

Last edited:
Nov 8, 2004
14,582
11,940
Alamos,Sonora,Mexico
Primary Interest:
All Treasure Hunting
G'dmorning Charlie, coffee? I have no idea just how old you are, but normally as one ages their wants lower. Waltz apparently had enough for his immediate wants, remember he spent quite a bit of time in effective primitive living,so a period in the city would be living very well indeed, regardless of the normal city standards on which side of the tracks he lived on.. What were his physical and psychological wants./ needs ?

Don Jose de La Mancha
 

Nov 8, 2004
14,582
11,940
Alamos,Sonora,Mexico
Primary Interest:
All Treasure Hunting
Interesting my friend, Concept---, coffee?? and just how does one broker a deal on an unproven property?

I have a nice lil mine which has never been core drilled or anything, yet the only response is what do your drilling tables say?? Assays are available but unaccepted.

The property has some 80 acres, titled, and hosts many outcropings, the general ore runs over $ 2,000 a ton yet I cannot get anyone to even consider looking at it?? What most want can easily go over $60,00 in expenses before they will even read any reports.

So just what would you suggest within reason?

Don Jose de La Mancha
 

OP
OP
ConceptualizedNetherlandr
Apr 17, 2014
1,973
1,259
Tartarus Dorsa mountains
Primary Interest:
Other
Interesting my friend, Concept---, coffee?? and just how does one broker a deal on an unproven property?

I have a nice lil mine which has never been core drilled or anything, yet the only response is what do your drilling tables say?? Assays are available but unaccepted.

The property has some 80 acres, titled, and hosts many outcropings, the general ore runs over $ 2,000 a ton yet I cannot get anyone to even consider looking at it?? What most want can easily go over $60,00 in expenses before they will even read any reports.

So just what would you suggest within reason?

Don Jose de La Mancha

First I'd have to admit I am not sure what you are on about with that ^

But I think this "just how does one broker a deal on an unproven property? " drives home the big discrepancy.

A million ounces of gold just laying about in plain sight would hardly be 'unproven'.

All he would have had to do is gather up reputable investors. Have an attorney over see the drafting of a corporation or partnership or whatever, where he keeps 51% and control. The deal is predicated on his filing a claim and the others putting up the cash/labor/protection/whatever to get the mine into production. Once the money is securely in escrow (not all that much needed for this part) and the new partnership is physically ready to implement to everyone's satisfaction, JW takes his investors to the claims office and a claim is made in the name of the partnership. Everybody has a fully vested interest, and no one is at financial risk. Then they go see the mine and implement.

From that day forward they are financially secure enough to protect their interests from the wild west. No need to killing off each other or any such.

The only problem being there never was 10^6 ounces of gold.
 

markmar

Silver Member
Oct 17, 2012
4,113
6,243
Primary Interest:
All Treasure Hunting
Conceptualized

Waltz never said how " his mine has a million ounces of gold " . He said how " his mine could make 20 men millionairies " .

The clue about one million ounces is fake , and was made by those who believed how the stone trail leads to the LDM . ???
 

OP
OP
ConceptualizedNetherlandr
Apr 17, 2014
1,973
1,259
Tartarus Dorsa mountains
Primary Interest:
Other
Conceptualized

Waltz never said how " his mine has a million ounces of gold " . He said how " his mine could make 20 men millionaires " .

The clue about one million ounces is fake , and was made by those who believed how the stone trail leads to the LDM . ???

Are you serious ??? Explain how those 20 were going to become millionaires. In fact that is a higher burden than 10^6 ounces because it implies net take home $.
 

coazon de oro

Bronze Member
May 7, 2010
1,622
3,849
texas
Primary Interest:
All Treasure Hunting
Conceptualized

Waltz never said how " his mine has a million ounces of gold " . He said how " his mine could make 20 men millionairies " .

The clue about one million ounces is fake , and was made by those who believed how the stone trail leads to the LDM . ???

Howdy Marius,

It's the same clue just rounded off. Twenty million dollars divided by $20.65 an ounce is 968,523 ounces.

Homar
 

Oroblanco

Gold Member
Jan 21, 2005
7,837
9,813
DAKOTA TERRITORY
Detector(s) used
Tesoro Lobo Supertraq, (95%) Garrett Scorpion (5%)
Ah, fallacy of proving a negative. I can't prove that there isn't a toaster orbiting Neptune either, but there isn't. Trust me.

Ah, but no one has made any statement about any toasters orbiting Neptune either. Trust no one. We can not say that ANY clue concerning the LDM is false, until and when the mine is found, then we can weed out the false.
 

Springfield

Silver Member
Apr 19, 2003
2,850
1,381
New Mexico
Detector(s) used
BS
"Trust no one." That's a crippling paranoid approach to most of our lives' relationships, Oro, but it's probably a healthy foundation when applied to the world of 'lost mines and hidden treasures'. Seriously, how can one possibly accept a total stranger's account of his alleged knowledge of the whereabouts of a great fortune? Or believe that the hearsay available in a publication hasn't been hopelessly obfuscated?
 

markmar

Silver Member
Oct 17, 2012
4,113
6,243
Primary Interest:
All Treasure Hunting
Howdy Marius,

It's the same clue just rounded off. Twenty million dollars divided by $20.65 an ounce is 968,523 ounces.

Homar

You know what I meant . But you statement could be the right .
 

OP
OP
ConceptualizedNetherlandr
Apr 17, 2014
1,973
1,259
Tartarus Dorsa mountains
Primary Interest:
Other
The concept of ~10^6 ounces is not just another clue. It is the entire basis for LDM being worthwhile to find. Otherwise everyone is just out looking for another has-been played out tiny hole. Without THAT supposed treasure, what is all the fuss about?
 

Top Member Reactions

Users who are viewing this thread

Top