Where do you think the Lost Dutchman mine is?

[Not Peralta]

NP, you posted ---- Its not much only about 45 years worth


Hmjmm let's see 45 + a min of 20 = 65, or practically 30 45 = 75. Ya feeble old bugger, yer in your second childhood. How can any one take you seriously ?? Gum yer coffee down.

Yes, Amigo, and I even survived a stroke 7 years go, and just had bypass surgery last year, should be good for another 20 or 30 years.but treasure
hunting is out, can only walk short distance and can only carry 5 pounds, if I cant carry over 5 pounds of treasure there's no point in going. np

 

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[cactusjumper]

NP,

The only hand I know that might have ridden that ridge, would have been Tom Kollenborn, and he did not make that ride. No cowboy would have stayed off his horse long enough to get up there. Anyone who knows anything about that country, knows that is so. Did you take pictures of the monuments? Did they look anything like this:

Good luck,

Joe

 

[Not Peralta]

Joe, no, they did not look like that, the ones I am talking about were rebuilt , and for sure tom k . was not the only cowboy riding in that area. and the monuments I was talking about are so unusual
that you would know exactly what I am talking about, and the other info you couldn't remember me talking about is on page 8,of this thread, or did you forget, because I actually found it.? np

 

[cactusjumper]

NP,

When did you find them?

Joe

 

[Oroblanco]

Yes, Amigo, and I even survived a stroke 7 years go, and just had bypass surgery last year, should be good for another 20 or 30 years.but treasure
hunting is out, can only walk short distance and can only carry 5 pounds, if I cant carry over 5 pounds of treasure there's no point in going. np

I am glad to hear that you survived a stroke and bypass surgery, sounds like you have had two warning shots across the bow. The fact that you have survived seven years however is a good sign that you are going to be around for a long time to come. I can understand about the physical limitations too - however with your ingenuity I have no doubt you will find ways to keep your hand in the business. Packing out gold is good work for mules after all!

Oroblanco

 

[Real de Tayopa Tropical Tramp]

I second ORO's sentimnts.

 

[Real de Tayopa Tropical Tramp]

But Oro, you know the old cliche' "Only the good go young (90) so Np will prob out last me"

 

[Oroblanco]

But Oro, you know the old cliche' "Only the good go young (90) so Np will prob out last me"

Hmm - a member of my family used to believe that we are not allowed to die until we have paid for our sins in this lifetime, which if true means that some of us have a long road yet to go.

 

[Not Peralta]

Joe, have some
To answer you 1965 or 1966 Just before I went in to the service.
Plus,there's something I want to share, so in the future every one knows.
Treasure hunting has always been a part of my life,Its in my DNA.I was born in a very small mining community,my great grandfather and his brother were miners, prospectors, later treasure hunters.were in and out of the Supe's and the sierra's for years.They started working in the mines when they were around 13 or 14 years old,after a few years they struck out on their own.During this time period they spent about 8 years prospecting and treasure hunting in the Supe's,later in years my great grandfather and my grandfather over about a 5 to 7 year period prospected in the Supe's,
my great grandfather I only knew for about 10 years before he died.we use to sit around and listen to the stories they had to tell. that's what would put the itch in my blood that had to be scratched.my grandfather and I prospected the Supe's for around 3 years together,then I had to go in the service,my grandfather died while I was in Vietnam.my father had no interest at all in the Supe's.when I returned,i went back to the Supe's for peace and quiet off and on over the years,spending months at a time in the mnts.np

 

[Hal Croves]

NP,

The only hand I know that might have ridden that ridge, would have been Tom Kollenborn, and he did not make that ride. No cowboy would have stayed off his horse long enough to get up there. Anyone who knows anything about that country, knows that is so. Did you take pictures of the monuments? Did they look anything like this:

Good luck,

Joe

cactusjumper,
That is an absolutely fantastic image. Cheers!

 

[cactusjumper]

Joe, have some
To answer you 1965 or 1966 Just before I went in to the service.
Plus,there's something I want to share, so in the future every one knows.
Treasure hunting has always been a part of my life,Its in my DNA.I was born in a very small mining community,my great grandfather and his brother were miners, prospectors, later treasure hunters.were in and out of the Supe's and the sierra's for years.They started working in the mines when they were around 13 or 14 years old,after a few years they struck out on their own.During this time period they spent about 8 years prospecting and treasure hunting in the Supe's,later in years my great grandfather and my grandfather over about a 5 to 7 year period prospected in the Supe's,
my great grandfather I only knew for about 10 years before he died.we use to sit around and listen to the stories they had to tell. that's what would put the itch in my blood that had to be scratched.my grandfather and I prospected the Supe's for around 3 years together,then I had to go in the service,my grandfather died while I was in Vietnam.my father had no interest at all in the Supe's.when I returned,i went back to the Supe's for peace and quiet off and on over the years,spending months at a time in the mnts.np

NP,

We thank you for your service and........welcome home brother.

Joe Ribaudo

 

[Real de Tayopa Tropical Tramp]

yer my kinda guy NP.

 

[Not Peralta]

ALL I CAN SAY ISTHANK YOU ALL. NP

 

[Not Peralta]

What would be the point.?
If you leave a map giving some one else directions,you want to make sure they can actually follow your instructions.
The person making the map will make sure there are identifying markers used,they want to make sure you find whatever
it is,If not what would be the point.? make sure you can easily identify the starting point.with most old maps or verbal
instructions there were no games being played,what would be the point.? they want you to be able to find whatever it is.
that's why they left a map or verbal instructions to start with,the whole Idea is to make everything simple. Today you should
not try to make everything so technical in your thinking,keep it simple."IF" they were verbal instructions,why would they
not give the best and most understanding instructions they could for you to find whatever it is they want you to find ,
Isn't that the point.?NP

 

[cactusjumper]

Greg,

You used to post on a regular basis on Peter's now defunct site. Your comments were concise and informative. I notice that you are on this site quite often, without participating in the conversations. Can't really blame you most of the time, as we do seem to stretch credulity now and again.

TNet seems like the perfect place to inject some questions or comments that would stimulate new and possibly pertinent information for your collection.

Hope all is well with you.

Take care,

Joe

 

[Not Peralta]

Good Morning
Have some .Here is something to keep the week end in conversation.
It's amazing that some one named Jacob Waltz " the Dutchman " who was supposed to have a very rich secret gold mine
and gold under his bed. who knew that he was dying , gives a set of directions to his mine, and after 100+years, and thousands of people
looking and following his only directions he had given supposedly wanting to make it easy for some one to find, no one can find it.so what
should that tell you? I know what it tells me.NP

 

[Oroblanco]

Good Morning
Have some .Here is something to keep the week end in conversation.
It's amazing that some one named Jacob Waltz " the Dutchman " who was supposed to have a very rich secret gold mine
and gold under his bed. who knew that he was dying , gives a set of directions to his mine, and after 100+years, and thousands of people
looking and following his only directions he had given supposedly wanting to make it easy for some one to find, no one can find it.so what
should that tell you? I know what it tells me.NP

I see nothing at all illogical in what you describe, when one realizes that those who searched for the mine, were mixing together information from several different mines located in the same general area, in the belief that they must all be the same mine. It is not like there were giant billboards put up to mark the way after all, and the two closest to Waltz clearly did not pay attention to what he was trying to tell them.

"Reiney you better listen! That mine is hard to find, even when you know where it is!" --Jacob Waltz

"You will wish you had listened better when I am gone." --Jacob Waltz

Waltz seems to have had a monumented trail that would lead to the mine, which unfortunately many monuments have been destroyed, altered, and fake ones put in the Superstitions so any hope of trying to follow that trail of stone monuments is now gone.

Whole cities have remained lost for centuries, millennia even, so a small gold mine, that the owner had concealed, located in a remote wilderness area, is not hard to understand why it has not been found. Then too 200+ people all claim to have found it in 200 different places. They are finding something, which can not be done if one decides it is all a fiction and stays home.

 

[Not Peralta]

Oroblanco, Amigo.
You and others have always misunderstood my true meanings most of the time, I am not saying don't hunt for what you believe , just believe in what your hunting.
there is a great joy in the finding,theres a greater joy in the long run in the actual hunting.In the finding there are no more expectations to look forward to, look for the simplicity in this, the directions are there, even if your sitting at home on the computer,nothing changes, because the directions that are given are the same.the real directions can never change. NP

 

[cactusjumper]

I see nothing at all illogical in what you describe, when one realizes that those who searched for the mine, were mixing together information from several different mines located in the same general area, in the belief that they must all be the same mine. It is not like there were giant billboards put up to mark the way after all, and the two closest to Waltz clearly did not pay attention to what he was trying to tell them.

"Reiney you better listen! That mine is hard to find, even when you know where it is!" --Jacob Waltz

"You will wish you had listened better when I am gone." --Jacob Waltz

Waltz seems to have had a monumented trail that would lead to the mine, which unfortunately many monuments have been destroyed, altered, and fake ones put in the Superstitions so any hope of trying to follow that trail of stone monuments is now gone.

Whole cities have remained lost for centuries, millennia even, so a small gold mine, that the owner had concealed, located in a remote wilderness area, is not hard to understand why it has not been found. Then too 200+ people all claim to have found it in 200 different places. They are finding something, which can not be done if one decides it is all a fiction and stays home.

Roy,

Something to take into consideration here, is that many, many people have convinced others that they knew exactly where the LDM was. Two from my own family, Chuck Ribaudo and Obie Stoker. Guess that's why I was never all that excited to go looking for it. With Obie it was a crapshoot. With Chuck, he was a highly intelligent straight shooter.

On a daily basis you will see people trying to convince others to join an expedition with the LDM at the end of the trail. Some will continue that effort for a lifetime. Obie was such a person. Chuck finally ended it. The fact that Holmes kept at it as long as he was physically able and Waltz swore to it on his deathbed are no indication that any of it was true. In their minds it may very well have been true........Uncle Obie.

I believe Waltz did have......something. It just may not have been exactly what he was stating, or exactly what he was remembering. Then again, it may not have been remembered exactly as it was heard by Julia and Holmes.....assuming Holmes actually ever heard anything. I have serious doubts about that.


Take care,

Joe

 

[Oroblanco]

Oroblanco, Amigo.
You and others have always misunderstood my true meanings most of the time, I am not saying don't hunt for what you believe , just believe in what your hunting.
there is a great joy in the finding,theres a greater joy in the long run in the actual hunting.In the finding there are no more expectations to look forward to, look for the simplicity in this, the directions are there, even if your sitting at home on the computer,nothing changes, because the directions that are given are the same.the real directions can never change. NP

So what do you hold to be the 'real directions'? I used the quotes not to mean as doubtful, but to mean specifics. Thanks in advance;

Cactusjumper wrote

Roy,

Something to take into consideration here, is that many, many people have convinced others that they knew exactly where the LDM was. Two from my own family, Chuck Ribaudo and Obie Stoker. Guess that's why I was never all that excited to go looking for it. With Obie it was a crapshoot. With Chuck, he was a highly intelligent straight shooter.

On a daily basis you will see people trying to convince others to join an expedition with the LDM at the end of the trail. Some will continue that effort for a lifetime. Obie was such a person. Chuck finally ended it. The fact that Holmes kept at it as long as he was physically able and Waltz swore to it on his deathbed are no indication that any of it was true. In their minds it may very well have been true........Uncle Obie.

I believe Waltz did have......something. It just may not have been exactly what he was stating, or exactly what he was remembering. Then again, it may not have been remembered exactly as it was heard by Julia and Holmes.....assuming Holmes actually ever heard anything. I have serious doubts about that.


Take care,

Joe

Well you know actions speak louder than words, and in the case of Holmes, it looks like he was acting on information he had gathered elsewhere, not from Waltz's deathbed. Or maybe a mix of sources with some from Waltz himself, but it is notable that he did not follow his own directions. As to Julia and Reiney, based on their actions, the quotes from Waltz, and the story of the fight between the Petrasches later, neither of them paid much attention when Waltz was trying to tell them out to find the mine and they ended up using information from what was in circulation already perhaps combined with things they remembered from Waltz. In contrast, other sources don't include all those dramatic details which may well not actually apply to Waltz.

I hope all is well with you and Carolyn, don't forget an extra treat for Smoky for no reason too.
Roy