Where is the gold and why is it hiding?

[somehiker]

Geologists and other experts claim that there are no significant gold deposits in the Superstitions.If you disagree and have any ideas or pet theories to share,feel free to post them here.I have been working on one or two thoughts which I will post over the weekend.
SH.

 

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[MesaBuddy]

I'll bite , there is much gold around the Supers and any one that really knows their P's and Q's knows it is , DEEP VERRRY VERRRRRRY DEEP , the gold that is , oh and S M , there's an old saying "Gold is where you find it" and I might add that there is much Silver around there to
MB

 

[somehiker]

Assuming that the present environmental state of the Superstitions(in fact most of the Southwest)and the Sonoran desert are relatively unchanged and that water has been a scarce commodity for many millennia,how might this determine where to look?
First,to provide some insight to my reasoning,and where it's taking me.
http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/nova/megaflood/scablands.html

Many of the erosionary results in the Scablands are very similar to what we see here in the region.Geologist originally scoffed at the idea that the Scablands or other spectacularly formed areas could have been created by anything more than millions of years of slow erosion.They now have a new outlook that even questions the geological history of the Grand Canyon.I believe that,although the root cause of massive short-term flooding may be different than the ice dam failures cited for the Scablands formation,that short-term flooding and drainage may have played a part in forming what we see today.This flooding could have been a byproduct of the caulderic explosions and the rapid (initially) drainage of a saturated ash dump.
Could the collapsed caulderas have behaved like a coffee perculator for a time before cooling,further eroding the ash in some areas and depositing mineralized mud in others?Since the eruptions it is evident that the more sedate processes of wind and water erosion,as well as the hot/cold cycle of exfoliation have taken over,but I believe that rain runoff is the least of these.I still have a great many questions that I need answers for,so this is still a work in progress.

One of the things that makes the Superstitions very interesting for me is the endless number of "caves".I know that most believe that they were formed solely by wind and water erosion.I have a different opinion.I believe that most,not necessarily all,were originally gas or air pockets in the ash/mud layers,which then became exposed by faulting or the rapid erosion of post-cauldera runoff.How many could remain unexposed?How many could have water flowing in and out and thus have deposits of minerals within.I have stood on the top of one mesa after a heavy rain and watched a large pool of water suddenly disappear like a flushing toilet complete with whirlpool.Spooked the hell out of me because I was detouring around it at the time and it started to shoot a mini geyser into the air for a couple of seconds first.Disappearing creeks are pretty common,at least where the flow is not great.If there was placer in the creek beds,would it not make sense that the heaviest fragments could be found in these rock and gravel covered sumps.Embedded within the volcanic tuff,both soft and cemented,there are vast amounts of more ancient rock,granite,basalt,limestone etc.,in the form of pebbles,cobbles,and boulders.The smooth and rounded ones were formed on ancient lake and river bottoms only to be cast skyward in the eruptions,falling back to embed themselves in the blanket of ash.Some are even cracked in two or more pieces from the heat of the ash,yet the tuff holds them together.Many have eroded out and cover the canyon and ravine bottoms.Likewise many pieces of rock broken by the explosions and sharp edged or in slab form are also embedded.Could any of these contain veins of rich ore? Could the same heat of the ash that cracked boulders as big as cars have melted the gold and put it somewhere below,where no one would think to look? A lot of questions and few answers.
Regards:SH.

 

[MesaBuddy]

SH , this could hold some interests for you , they are discussing how much water tables have dropped and scroll down and you will see some discussion on the Supers
http://www.azgs.az.gov/vol28no1.htm
And of course this....
The two hundred and forty-two square miles of rugged terrain found in the Superstition Wilderness makes it a difficult task to systematically search or prospect the region. Most professional geologists will insist there is little geological evidence to suggest a rich gold deposit could exist in these volcanic mountains. Jacob Waltz, the alleged owner of the Dutchman's Lost Mine, claimed his mine was located where no other miner or prospector would search for gold. A recent US Geological Survey could possibly support this clue Waltz left behind. The application of the mercury vapor test over the Superstition Wilderness Area found the region to be highly mineralized. The report is indicative of deep seated mineral deposits. Who knows for sure, maybe one of those highly enriched mineralized bodies reached the surface by way of an intrusion. This report could explain why a man would devote his entire life to searching for gold in this land of barren ash and basalt.

Best Regards ,
MB

 

[somehiker]

I don't believe that there is any possibility of creating your own volcanic eruption scene.The water disappeared into a crack which I assume was temporarily blocked by dirt.I'm sure that the geyser was caused by escaping air.Other than a single hot spring,reported to have existed just below Roosevelt Dam and now submerged by Apache Lake,I'm not aware of any geothermal activity and according to USGS data,we are not likely to experience any soon.
Regards:SH.

 

[cactusjumper]

SH,

Well put.

Joe

 

[somehiker]

Has anyone here ever panned Pranty Creek,or the tanks of Peter's Canyon?It seems to me that detecting the bottoms of some of the deeper tanks might give interesting results.Just speculating--I guess.
Regards:SH.

 

[Real de Tayopa Tropical Tramp]

[the blindbowman......................
... he knew that no miner could get to the mine with a mule or his mineing equiment... its impossable
***********

If no miner could --------------- etc., how did he, as an older man, do it? Just curious.

Don Jose de La Mancha

 

[somehiker]

Care to elaborate on the geology and contents of the"glory room"---the phrase seems to indicate a common description for a specific formation similar to what I described as a possibility.
SH.

 

[somehiker]

The geology of the "glory room",rock type,approximate dimensions,flat floor or bowl,angular or rounded,etc. And what sort of geological process created it,if known?
Regards SH.

 

[somehiker]

It appears from your description that the room is located in either an alluvial fan or possibly a breccia deposit,and was considerably enlarged by mining activities.Both formations frequently contain large gold deposits as well as many other minerals.Many mines worldwide are located in similar formations,also covered by later stage volcanic deposits.
Regards-SH.

 

[somehiker]

And from which came a few nuggets big enough to fill any Tifosi's garage.

SH.

 

[somehiker]

I know of one such area well into the sups,and it may have been mined at one time,possibly with pointed tools such as deer antlers.It's a mix of river rock,coarse sand and clay still wet in areas easy to dig.I will have to have a closer look at this site and the surroundings and get more pics.Should be interesting.
Regards:SH.

 

[cactusjumper]

B,

"If your area IS similar, and you can cut back the dirt some, to see the layers, you might want to specifically check the layer that has the rounder rocks..."

SH said the area was "well into the sups". Your advise is a little dicey. Metal detectors,
I have heard, are still a "grey area" in the laws. Perhaps that might be a better first step.

Looking at that "room" must have taken your breath away. Great story.

Joe

 

[somehiker]

Joe:
Indeed,the troving laws for all wilderness areas severely restrict what we are allowed to do in the pursuit of answers to our questions.Metal detector use is generally accepted in picnic areas,parking lots,beaches etc.if searching for contemporary pocket change and the like.Use one anywhere else and you may have to answer some tough questions or invoke the fifth.The same goes for digging or panning with even rockhounding being a grey area where precious stones or minerals are concerned."GRAB SAMPLES" are legal,apparently,but I'm not sure what the size or weight limit could be.
Regards:SH.

 

[somehiker]

Randy:
Lets see now,a 200 pound nugget and a can of brown spray paint=16x200x $661.20= ----wow
SH.

 

[somehiker]

No wonder I thought I was getting screwed down at the pawn shop.
SH.

 

[Zephyr]

Randy:
Lets see now,a 200 pound nugget and a can of brown spray paint=16x200x $661.20= ----wow
SH.

I'd recommend using a can of primer instead, then maybe a 2nd coat of paint with some fine sand thrown on before it dries to give it some texture....

 

[somehiker]

A true(possibly) and interesting tale of something lost to time and lore,then found......http://www.theoutlaws.com/indians2.htm.
Enjoy this story about dreams,apparitions and an old Eagle Shaman.
Regards:SH.