New site?...with different clue versions?

[somehiker]

How did the original clue of an old foundation that one would pass by near the end of their journey to the mine, AND where he buried one cache at a corner of the foundation......become a "house ruin" ?
Which would imply and likely have searchers looking for standing walls of some kind.
Or a roofless two room house in a cave, where Waltz would sometimes stay, become anything more or less than that ?
If you read the four pages relating to "clues" at their "new site", most will notice other adjustments in various clues.....like where the saddle in which Waltz had said he cached his tools and tethered his animals while he worked the mine, now becomes the "horse's saddle".
Lots of other problems with the historical narrative as well IMO.

 

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[azdave35]

How did the original clue of an old foundation that one would pass by near the end of their journey to the mine, AND where he buried one cache at a corner of the foundation......become a "house ruin" ?
Which would imply and likely have searchers looking for standing walls of some kind.
Or a roofless two room house in a cave, where Waltz would sometimes stay, become anything more or less than that ?
If you read the four pages relating to "clues" at their "new site", most will notice other adjustments in various clues.....like where the saddle in which Waltz had said he cached his tools and tethered his animals while he worked the mine, now becomes the "horse's saddle".
Lots of other problems with the historical narrative as well IMO.

at the south end of the supers there is the ruin of a very old rock house..not far from the milk ranch and north of elephant butte...when i was a youngster all the old timers said the dutchman used to stay in this rock house...there isn't much left of it and it is hidden in the trees...

 

[arcana-exploration]

Wayne what in the sam hell are you talking about half the stuff you are saying I wrote has nothing to do with what I actually wrote. Clue nine I never said anything about tethering animals up in ( I said on ) the Horses Saddle, we have been there, and you cannot get a miniature pony up above the horses to saddle so why would I infer. they had tethered animals up there. I have not written anything yet about where they tethered most of the animals, that is offsite and away from the mine. Wayne, I think you are getting senile, all the other stuff you are talking about does not match to anything I wrote. Everyone, please read clue 9 does it match Waynes VERSION OF WHAT I WROTE, TAKE ME TO THE PILOT! WITH ALL RESPECT Jeff.
Also, Oro and Markmar are you posting back and forth between different sites, because I believe the question put to you was about your source on your post about Walt'z taking gold from the Thunder God shrine?

.

 

[markmar]

How did the original clue of an old foundation that one would pass by near the end of their journey to the mine, AND where he buried one cache at a corner of the foundation......become a "house ruin" ?
Which would imply and likely have searchers looking for standing walls of some kind.
Or a roofless two room house in a cave, where Waltz would sometimes stay, become anything more or less than that ?
If you read the four pages relating to "clues" at their "new site", most will notice other adjustments in various clues.....like where the saddle in which Waltz had said he cached his tools and tethered his animals while he worked the mine, now becomes the "horse's saddle".
Lots of other problems with the historical narrative as well IMO.

I believe the roofless two-room house ruin from Waltz clue is the same with the old fundation or like others saw it as a corral or aztec ruin. Was at the end of Waltz and Wisner journey to the mine but only as a camp in the shallow cave behind the ruin from where they should go around the peak above in regards to reach the mines.
I believe also how after the death of Wisner, Waltz camped in the brush/trees at the east side of the small valley where the mines were ( from John Reed's story ).
Waltz gave the stone house ruin clue and the horse head landmark with the three pines in line clues from Julia's map, as points of reference because without these signs the mines could be never find.

What sounds wrong to me in the Arcana research is when they have two attempts to approach the stone house ruin and failed. Make me wonder how Waltz with his mule have not that much truble to go there.

 

[arcana-exploration]

STONE HOUSE

I believe the roofless two-room house ruin from Waltz clue is the same with the old fundation or like others saw it as a corral or aztec ruin. Was at the end of Waltz and Wisner journey to the mine but only as a camp in the shallow cave behind the ruin from where they should go around the peak above in regards to reach the mines.
I believe also how after the death of Wisner, Waltz camped in the brush/trees at the east side of the small valley where the mines were ( from John Reed's story ).
Waltz gave the stone house ruin clue and the horse head landmark with the three pines in line clues from Julia's map, as points of reference because without these signs the mines could be never find.

What sounds wrong to me in the Arcana research is when they have two attempts to approach the stone house ruin and failed. Make me wonder how Waltz with his mule have not that much truble to go there.

Hello, Markmar Thanks for your comments, the stone house my guys could not get up to is the not the same stone house waltz and his partner might have stayed at. The one my guys could not get up two is at the head of the main, farther down in the main canyon is a smaller main canyon step ravine that is where the mine is and we have been up there. The main canyon is frigen *****, the side is dangerous for different reasons, but the main canyon is even more difficult to get up, keep in mind there have been landslides and earthquakes. And the main canyon ruins are just four stone walls sitting on a ledge. Waltz or nobody could ever get a horse up there. Before the earth, the Quake and the path were intact and you could get a couple of small burros up the side canyon but not now.
I do not want to give to much on-site physical description and give away the location but respectfully, you are talking about two completely different areas. On our next trip, we have secured two expert mountain climbers who have climbed Mt Everest amongst, mountains, in New Zealand, and around the World to make sure my guys can reach areas without getting killed. Markmar this place was dangerous 150 years ago and it even more so today Markmur I assure you nobody not even Trevor Brazile is getting an animal up to these places. In the movie, LONELY ARE THE BRAVE, WITH Kirk Douglas (his favorite movie), 3 STUNTMEN were killed doing the scene going up the mountain with Douglas and his horse, think of that part that would be easier than going up to the Spanish ruins in the main canyon. Markmar yoy are talking about something completely different. I need to go back to work cheers and thank you for your interest. Jeff.

 

[somehiker]

Wayne what in the sam hell are you talking about half the stuff you are saying I wrote has nothing to do with what I actually wrote. Clue nine I never said anything about tethering animals up in ( I said on ) the Horses Saddle, we have been there, and you cannot get a miniature pony up above the horses to saddle so why would I infer. they had tethered animals up there. I have not written anything yet about where they tethered most of the animals, that is offsite and away from the mine. Wayne, I think you are getting senile, all the other stuff you are talking about does not match to anything I wrote. Everyone, please read clue 9 does it match Waynes VERSION OF WHAT I WROTE, TAKE ME TO THE PILOT! WITH ALL RESPECT Jeff.
Also, Oro and Markmar are you posting back and forth between different sites, because I believe the question put to you was about your source on your post about Walt'z taking gold from the Thunder God shrine?

.

Not senile at all....."If you read the four pages relating to "clues" at their "new site", most will notice other adjustments in various clues.....like where the saddle in which Waltz had said he cached his tools and tethered his animals while he worked the mine, now becomes the "horse's saddle".

I quote from your site " 9. Waltz said he camped up above where the Mexicans camped on the Horse’s Saddle. Yes! He also said he hid his tools there when he left. It would be a safe place if you are alone—you have the high ground."

So what I am pointing out here, is that on your website you have claimed that Waltz said "Horse's Saddle".....which is what I mean by an "adjustment".

One of the sources for Waltz's mention of a "saddle" is that from the "German Clues" which were published in Helen Corbin's "Bible".

" From my camp in it's (a or the) saddle, you will see a peak in the distance with a hole. ( in it,or through it )"

Note....there's no mention of a "horse"

Further reference to the saddle is this...

" I hid my tools (outfit) above the saddle."

Note....above the saddle and once again there is no mention of a horse.

 

[arcana-exploration]

Not senile at all....."If you read the four pages relating to "clues" at their "new site", most will notice other adjustments in various clues.....like where the saddle in which Waltz had said he cached his tools and tethered his animals while he worked the mine, now becomes the "horse's saddle".

I quote from your site " 9. Waltz said he camped up above where the Mexicans camped on the Horse’s Saddle. Yes! He also said he hid his tools there when he left. It would be a safe place if you are alone—you have the high ground."

So what I am pointing out here, is that on your website you have claimed that Waltz said "Horse's Saddle".....which is what I mean by an "adjustment".

One of the sources for Waltz's mention of a "saddle" is that from the "German Clues" which were published in Helen Corbin's "Bible".

" From my camp in it's (a or the) saddle, you will see a peak in the distance with a hole. ( in it,or through it )"

Note....there's no mention of a "horse"

Further reference to the saddle is this...

" I hid my tools (outfit) above the saddle."
that will be clesr in the book and i ma not going to lay out that informmation wille nelle here.
Note....above the saddle and once again there is no mention of a horse.

Wayne you are correct I and only I said horse and I stand by that as only my observation. However, I did not say" tethered", I did not say what you said I said. Please clarify, I understand this Dutchman stuff is very complexe and truly mean that. Also I am staing what we see on the ground and alot of what is actally there will not match up to the hundreds of versions of any one given enity

 

[somehiker]

at the south end of the supers there is the ruin of a very old rock house..not far from the milk ranch and north of elephant butte...when i was a youngster all the old timers said the dutchman used to stay in this rock house...there isn't much left of it and it is hidden in the trees...

Ok. I'll buy into the possibility that what Waltz was talking about may have been more than just a "foundation".....especially since I can't find my source for the "foundation" description at this time, but DO have a number which also refer to it as a "house" somewhere close to the mine itself.....ie: you can see the house, but not the mine. But as you know, there are a number of ruins out there which fit the bill, and where Waltz could have camped out on his way into the range.

 

[PotBelly Jim]

Wayne you are correct I and only I said horse and I stand by that as only my observation. However, I did not say" tethered", I did not say what you said I said. Please clarify, I understand this Dutchman stuff is very complexe and truly mean that. Also I am staing what we see on the ground and alot of what is actally there will not match up to the hundreds of versions of any one given enity

And there's the problem with "clues". Interesting to consider, but the various "sources" of these clues are problematic at best.

No wonder people pick and choose what clues they think are valid, in order to justify their own search, or site. At any rate, best of luck in your search, and thanks for posting.

Take care, Jim

 

[somehiker]

Wayne you are correct I and only I said horse and I stand by that as only my observation. However, I did not say" tethered", I did not say what you said I said. Please clarify, I understand this Dutchman stuff is very complexe and truly mean that. Also I am staing what we see on the ground and alot of what is actally there will not match up to the hundreds of versions of any one given enity

I didn't say YOU said anything about where Waltz tethered his animals. That came from another source where, as I recall but will have to look through some more of my files, it was claimed the Waltz said he tethered his animals in a saddle above the mine, because there was good grass there and also because he could not bring them in closer to the mine.
The legend IS very complex, as history tends to be, especially when it comes to the Sups. and everything that went on out there.
It can take years to even get a sense for the lay of the land, and even longer to understand which clues could be relevant in the first place.
I'm an amateur in comparison to many of those who have been interested in the LDM all of their lives, and who have grown up with the legend as part of their local lore. But I have been traveling down there since 1995, less two years where I couldn't make it. So that's 24 years, during which I have probably averaged around 10-12 days per year on the hunt, or at least with an eye out for most of what the old timers spoke and wrote about in their day. These last 8 or 9 years, with 4 weeks of paid vacation, I've upped the anti to as many as three trips to Phoenix and those moutains in a single year of up to 14 days each. So I've paid my dues I think as far as that goes.

 

[somehiker]

And there's the problem with "clues". Interesting to consider, but the various "sources" of these clues are problematic at best.

No wonder people pick and choose what clues they think are valid, in order to justify their own search, or site. At any rate, best of luck in your search, and thanks for posting.

Take care, Jim

Here's just one list of clues I saved some time ago....with original sources listed.

101 clues to the Lost Dutchman Mine

1) There are three big peaks above the mine to the west. (Bark to Spangler)

2) A north running canyon. (Waltz to Petrasch)

3) The north running canyon is filled with potholes. (Gassler)

4) There is a stone wall in a shelving cave near the mine. (Mitchell)

5) The rays of the setting sun will shine into the tunnel mouth when the mine is open. (Mitchell)

6) The vein runs 400 feet down the mountainside. (Waltz)

7) Look for the shadow of Weavers Needle at 4 pm during the winter solstice. (Various)

8) No cowboy will find my mine. (Waltz)

9) Near the head of the gulch is an old stone cabin foundation directly opposite the mine. (Mitchell)

10) The trail is monumented with two stones, one on top of the other. (Bark)

11) Its high up, yet you have got to go down. (Deering to Chunning)

12) Look for 3 boulders shaped like wickiups high up on the side of a mountain. (Apache woman to Scholey)

13) Theres a spirit that sleeps near the mine 4 hours a day. (Apache Jack)

14) A funnel-shaped pit (Various)

15) There is a waterfall in the vicinity. (Robert Jacobs)

16) Say John, you have to go through a hole. (Deering to Chunning)

17) There is a symbol near the mine that contains a triangle, circle and crescent. (Diaz)

18) I marked the place with a frying pan placed on the middle peak. (Waltz to Petrasch)

19) There is a double pack horse trail that leads right up to the tunnel. (Herman Petrasch)

20) One needs to climb up about 40 feet to see Weavers Needle to the south. (Waltz)

21) Above the mine was a grassy ridge where we could leave the animals. (Waltz)

22) There is a cross cut into the side of the ravine above the mine. (Robert Jacobs)

23) Waltz covered the mine. He was afraid someone would notice it from the trail below or on the ridge across. (Aylor)

24) The shaft was 75 feet deep made in the Mexican style with flailing walls. (Bicknell)

25) Mine is on a well-terraced hill. Terraced like rice-paddies. (Peck)

26) Dutchman is 69 steps back and down in a ravine only about 50' wide and 200' long shaped like a "Y". (Williams)

27) Waltzs mine had an opening no bigger than a barrel. (Peck)

28) Two pits at the mine about 75 feet deep and a like distance across the top . (Bark)

29) Near the mine, perhaps covering the entrance, is a square rock with one elongated corner. (Peck)

30) Look for a triangle of Rocks. (Jacobs)

31) Just to one side of the mine is a square rock waist-high. (Williams)

32) The gravestone was located 250-300 feet due south of the mine itself and designated a specific crevasse between large boulders that one has to pass to locate the mine. (Petrasch to Synbad)

33) Three stones by themselves are the key to the mine. (Flores)

34) There is a line between two peaks that bisect the shaft. (B Holmes)

35) The hole is small and high up. (Yocum to Morrow)

36) The mine is a rat hole. (Walter Dixon to Dwyer)

37) Mine is on a little knob about 50 feet high at the very end of a peninsula. On this hill is a pile of rocksabout 10 feet away from the opening. (Erwin Ruth to Richard Peck)

38) The soldiers reported the mine as being a very small open cut or trench. (Chuck Aylor)

39) Go up out of a brushy canyon, over a flat and down into a pit. (Al Morrow)

40) Cave near headwaters. Needed rope to get in. (Geronimos great-grand daughter)

41) Tunnel opens onto a caynon floor. (Erwin Ruth)

42) When you find the mine you will be lying on your belly like everyone else who was ever there. (Smitty to Richard Peck)

43) All the old landmarks are still there. You can almost peek into the mine where the entrance has settled. The cave of hidden gold. (San Carlos Apaches 1965)

44) Dutchman was getting gold from a creek bed. There was a shaft in the bottom of the wash. (Clay Worst to Richard Peck)

45) Waltz described his mine as being high up, in an arroyo, and hidden by the natural contours of the land. From over the top of a low ridge you could see down the far side where there was a small clearing, an open hole and a mine dump. (Herman Petrasch)

46) The mine is so cunningly concealed that one could walk within a few feet and miss it. (Waltz)

47) On the steep slope 100 feet above them they spied two Indians breaking rock. (Waltz to Julia Thomas)

48) I had to climb up a small hill from the mine entrance to see the Needle. (Waltz)

49) Its less than two miles from Weavers Needle toward the Salt River. (Phipps to Storm)

50) Weavers Needle was nearby in plain sight. (Apache boys to Barry Storm)

51) Weavers Needle, Four Peaks, a river and the horses head could be seen from the mine. (Al Morrow)

52) The mine was on a twelve foot high ledge, the mine was an open hole and the mine was on the apex of a ridge.

53) The mine is close to a cave and is high up on a ledge. Petrasch spent years searching the canyons looking for a cave or an opening high up. (Richard Peck)

54) Waltz mine is on a twelve foot high shelf. (Synbad)

55) Near the mine is a face that looks right at the mine. (Storm)

56) A Sphinx overhangs and dominates the mine area. (John Reed)

57) Waltz told of a natural stone face sitting upon the end of a canyon below his mine. (Storm)

58) Up above the mine was a cliff like a horses head with one ear laid back. (Storm)

59) The mine was in a northerly direction from a sharp peak. (Aaron Mason)

60) The mine is right out in the open,. You could walk right over it and not know you were there. (John Spangler)

61) About 20 steps above a spring is the Dutchmans mine. ( Williams)

62) Mine is located near three natural water tanks in a canyon, one below the other, a short distance from the mine. (Indian to B Holmes)

63) Mine is near the head of a gulch. There is a small spring there with sufficient water for household use. (Aylor)

64) 39 steps to agua. 69 stepd to the mine. (Ruths Eagle Head Map)

65) Mine is in a draw that is well hidden. (Jacobs)

66) The mine lies in the middle of two oblong outcrops that run north south and are above the waterfall. (Stevens)

67) The mine is located in a ravine on the side of a canyon wall. (Conatser)

68) In a steep climbing arroyo high on a mountainside. (Morrow)

69) The mine is in a cave, but the entrance is sealed. (Diaz)

70) Gold buried in a cave in the Superstitions. (Geronimo to soldier at Ft Sill)

71) Indians always spoke about a cave. Mention the mine and they would say, no, the cave. Cave at base of cliff in a little canyon. (Peck)

72) Ruth described the junction of two canyons, one running north south flanked by high cliffs on either side. The other was brushy and came in from the east. Above this canyon junction Ruth expected to find a Spanish marker which would show him the trail. (Storm)

73) If you pass the three red hills you have gone too far. (Waltz)

74) There is a tunnel on the side of the hill and a pit above past the three red hills. (John Kochera)

75) The mine is above a brushy boulder choked little canyon. (Walter Gassler)

76) Trail goes up past a long draw from west end of the south side of the range, down past a cliff into a canyon leading to the river. Take the first right hand canyon out on a flat area, then climb to the pit. (John Walker)

77) Mine is on a steep slope under the lip of a cliff. (Tommy Wise)

78) Mine was on a hillside. (Sims Ely)

79) The logs covering the shaft were set at an angle to conform to the slope of the terrain. (Walter Dixon)

80) The ruins of the rock house did not have a roof. (Weiss)

81) There are four spires above the mine, three tall ones and one smaller. (Spangler)

82) The tunnel entrance is supposed to be shaped like a bell. (Waltz to Thomas)

83) You cant approach the mine from above or below, but have to enter from the side. (Waltz)

84) No miner will find my mine. (Waltz)

85) Theres a trick in the trail. You have to go through a hole. (Joe Deering)

86) I placed a monument near the mine and then placed four similar monuments in the canyon below. (Deering to Chunning)

87) You have to work your way down a water crevasse. The approach to the mine is dangerous. (Weiser)

88)There was a dangerous foot path down to the mine. (Peralta)

89) The area where the mine was located was all broken up. (Ballesteros)

90) 200 feet across from the cave. (Adolph Ruth)

91) Deering said the hole you go thru was "in a rock". (Chunning to Barkley)

92) Mine was a volcanic vent . (Sims Ely)

93) Salazars survey objective was to find a cave with a wall and three red hills. (Livingston)

94) One went down on a rope or ladder, the other two stayed up above. (Granillo)

95) When asked about landmarks from the mine entrance Brownie Holmes hesitated and said "You will see nothing. Only space."

96) The Mexicans always posted a sentry in a brushy canyon below the mine. He could not see, but could always hear, the miners.

97) There was a little bit of brush on the slope above the mine. (Reed)

98) We will throw a stick of dynamite into the opening because of the trap. (B Holmes)

99) Once the rock house was found one would go back down the canyon checking the west side of the canyon wall. Once he found the ___________ he would then find the ___________ and .......................

I can't really vouch for any of them.....but who knows ?

 

[PotBelly Jim]

SH,

Let's add to that list

There are almost 160 pages of clues in Treasure Tales of the Superstitions (Dr. Glover)

I know you're familiar with it, just posting for people who haven't seen it. Undoubtedly the most in-depth discussion of LDM clues I've seen ever, anywhere. Included is a similar list of clues/sources to the one you've posted above, but that particular list only covered about 3 pages of 160.

Take care, Jim

 

[somehiker]

Nope.....don't have that one.
I've probably seen the list at one time or another though, since I used to borrow the odd book about the LDM from the local library. Even though I've never been caught up in that legend as much as others have been.
Don't have very many in my collection for reference, since I was always more inclined to spend my cash on being out there, rather than reading about others who had .

 

[arcana-exploration]

And there's the problem with "clues". Interesting to consider, but the various "sources" of these clues are problematic at best.

No wonder people pick and choose what clues they think are valid, in order to justify their own search, or site. At any rate, best of luck in your search, and thanks for posting.

Take care, Jim

Potbelly Thank you for that input, Waltz may not have said that exactly, but I believe I have seen that in one of 42 books I have read, I will see if I can find which book that was. I will address that on our site. I understand what saddle refers to as far as a formed feature on a ridge or mountain top. So I will correct that on our site. However, if you take the things he may have stated no one really knows for sure. But I will state we are seeing what is there and how the clues have come to us over the years and many are pieces of a bigger picture that plays out before you when you are on the site. What I am trying to say is I read that clue and the different versions and I am stating what we said and I must have said, not what fits our narrative. You will see next year when the book comes, Jim please remember this conversation and feedback next year when the book comes out and you will understand only then why I might have subconsciously written it that way. I stand by what we are seeing at the site he and that Waltz would have camped above a horses saddle, I will say no more about that but will make a correction in an upcoming post and change the exact wording. We stand by he camped above the horse's saddle.(only we are stating that) also in the last three years, we have been on the mountain for 46 days. As you hike down the canyon floor other than not falling into cactus and deep sand in your boots it is not too bad, but as soon as you start to go up it is the worst piece of dangerous scarry gnarley place and the 2x that. Thanks, Jeff.

 

[PotBelly Jim]

Potbelly Thank you for that input, Waltz may not have said that exactly, but I believe I have seen that in one of 42 books I have read, I will see if I can find which book that was. I will address that on our site. I understand what saddle refers to as far as a formed feature on a ridge or mountain top. So I will correct that on our site. However, if you take the things he may have stated no one really knows for sure. But I will state we are seeing what is there and how the clues have come to us over the years and many are pieces of a bigger picture that plays out before you when you are on the site. What I am trying to say is I read that clue and the different versions and I am stating what we said and I must have said, not what fits our narrative. You will see next year when the book comes, Jim please remember this conversation and feedback next year when the book comes out and you will understand only then why I might have subconsciously written it that way. I stand by what we are seeing at the site he and that Waltz would have camped above a horses saddle, I will say no more about that but will make a correction in an upcoming post and change the exact wording. We stand by he camped above the horse's saddle.(only we are stating that) also in the last three years, we have been on the mountain for 46 days. As you hike down the canyon floor other than not falling into cactus and deep sand in your boots it is not too bad, but as soon as you start to go up it is the worst piece of dangerous scarry gnarley place and the 2x that. Thanks, Jeff.

Jeff, not saying what you do is right or wrong...just pointing out that separating the wheat from the chaff when it comes to clues, and comparing them to your site/theory is going to be a difficult if not impossible task. You will probably find yourself validating or invalidating clues based on your own standards and observations.

Whether or not you get the clues "exactly right" when posting about them is something I'd encourage you to try to get right, and if not, to correct them, as you have done.

I like reading about treasure hunters and their searches (I'm not a TH, just like reading about actual searches, and stories from the old-timers). One thing I've observed is TH'ers make one, or at most a few, big finds in an entire life of searching. Most guys don't find what they're looking for. I like reading about those searches too.

SH: Point taken. EDIT: (Yes that's me)

Take care, Jim

 

[arcana-exploration]

Jeff, not saying what you do is right or wrong...just pointing out that separating the wheat from the chaff when it comes to clues, and comparing them to your site/theory is going to be a difficult if not impossible task. You will probably find yourself validating or invalidating clues based on your own standards and observations.

Whether or not you get the clues "exactly right" when posting about them is something I'd encourage you to try to get right, and if not, to correct them, as you have done.

I like reading about treasure hunters and their searches (I'm not a TH, just like reading about actual searches, and stories from the old-timers). One thing I've observed is TH'ers make one, or at most a few, big finds in an entire life of searching. Most guys don't find what they're looking for. I like reading about those searches too.

SH: Point taken. EDIT: (Yes that's me)

Take care, Jim

THANKS

Thanks, Potbelly your an alright guy. One thing I do in the book, but do not overdo is tell about our team and the guys and as unlikely as it is our story how 5 everyday guys end up in the Superstition Mountains, and in that chapter cover some the Dutch hunters past and present but more from a personal, point of view not who found what but what they found in life that the Supers gave them along the way. Have a great week Potbelly. Thank you Jeff.

 

[arcana-exploration]

STONE hOUSE cLUES

THANKS

Thanks, Potbelly your an alright guy. One thing I do in the book, but do not overdo is tell about our team and the guys and as unlikely as it is our story how 5 everyday guys end up in the Superstition Mountains, and in that chapter cover some the Dutch hunters past and present but more from a personal, point of view not who found what but what they found in life that the Supers gave them along the way. Have a great week Potbelly. Thank you, Jeff.

 

[azdave35]

THANKS

Thanks, Potbelly your an alright guy. One thing I do in the book, but do not overdo is tell about our team and the guys and as unlikely as it is our story how 5 everyday guys end up in the Superstition Mountains, and in that chapter cover some the Dutch hunters past and present but more from a personal, point of view not who found what but what they found in life that the Supers gave them along the way. Have a great week Potbelly. Thank you, Jeff.

i've said this 450,000 times before but here it is once more..nobody really knows what waltz said....all of these clues floating around probably came after waltz death...the only person that might (and i said might) have known what waltz said was herman petrash....and to my knowledge he only told one person what he knew....

 

[arcana-exploration]

STONE hOUSE cLUES

THANKS

Thanks, Potbelly your an alright guy. One thing I do in the book, but do not overdo is tell about our team and the guys and as unlikely as it is our story how 5 everyday guys end up in the Superstition Mountains, and in that chapter cover some the Dutch hunters past and present but more from a personal, point of view not who found what but what they found in life that the Supers gave them along the way. Have a great week Potbelly. Thank you, Jeff.

Thanks, AZDAVE, That is is a great point never the less, but I need to be spot on when talking about clues as the wording is beat know. Subconsciously being capable of seeing what he actually was looking at I put the known interpretation into the brain and came out with mostly might have said. And I stand by the wording saddle above the horse. However, that was brain slip and I should not have said that way unless I clarified it. So I will address that on our site. One very important thing I have not mentioned and that is actually the icing on the cake to our knowledge that we have the correct location is the Peralta Stones and at least 2 of the most credible maps that they actually take you there and it is not some wiggly lines on the horizon but rather, odd physical features at the site that at first I did not understand, and they will not peoples socks off because there can be absolutely no mistake of there intent. Please do not ask which ones other than the Stones which I already mentioned.

Thanks ARZDV.

 

[somehiker]

Has your team been able to make the 5th trip back to Arizona and your site location yet ?
As I believe you have said was your plan.