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Thread: New site?...with different clue versions?

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  1. #16

    May 2019
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    Quote Originally Posted by deducer View Post
    And this site lost a legendary fabricator, a contriving storyteller of the first degree. Many have tried but none shall equal him in sheer skill and talent when it comes to concocting.
    thank

    Thank you Deducer you post I have seen a lot of your post and they are always solid as are Wayne's, so I would think your thoughts on him are valid. Wayne that is interesting I had he impression he was dead, I have to leave here in a few minutes, but I post later tonight I had just a couple of Questions about him and then move on. As always great guys, wish I lived in Mesa. Thanks Jeff.
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  2. #17

    Jul 2017
    texas
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    Jeff, I enjoyed reading your new site. Good story and pics

  3. #18

    May 2019
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    All Types Of Treasure Hunting
    [QUOTE=lunatic;6202882]Jeff, I enjoyed reading your new site. Good story and pics

    Thank you, Lunatic, for the kind words glad you are enjoying it. Check next week we will be sharing the best entities so far. The next couple post should raise some eyebrows. The most conclusive information I will have to hold until after our next trip, that is not an excuse, it necessary for security reasons, that being said the things we will be sharing will be plenty good I assure you. Thanks Jeff.
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  4. #19
    um
    Nemo me impune lacesset

    Jan 2005
    DAKOTA TERRITORY
    Tesoro Lobo Supertraq, (95%) Garrett Scorpion (5%)
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    Quote Originally Posted by ORO18 View Post
    there is an account or version that talks about waltz (taking gold From the Shrine at the home of the thunder god’sAttachment 1714785 mountain) Dosent say specificly His mine was there.
    Can you recall where you found this version? Thanks in advance,

    SUPPORT THE BEEF INDUSTRY - EAT BEEF
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  5. #20
    gr
    Oct 2012
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    Quote Originally Posted by Oroblanco View Post
    Can you recall where you found this version? Thanks in advance,

    Oro

    I believe is about the clue which says Waltz buried two of his caches close to the house ruin, which later took them out and left the third bigger cache in the mine across the ravine from the house ruin.
    The only mention the two rooms house ruin to be a church, was written by me in different threads along the Waltz and stone maps topics.
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    Marius

    If your true to your heart,you will never go wrong.The truth is the truth,no matter how you look at it,and in every treasure story and legend there is a grain of truth . It's up to your spirit and heart to know the difference. NP





  6. #21
    ca
    May 2007
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    Post

    How did the original clue of an old foundation that one would pass by near the end of their journey to the mine, AND where he buried one cache at a corner of the foundation......become a "house ruin" ?
    Which would imply and likely have searchers looking for standing walls of some kind.
    Or a roofless two room house in a cave, where Waltz would sometimes stay, become anything more or less than that ?
    If you read the four pages relating to "clues" at their "new site", most will notice other adjustments in various clues.....like where the saddle in which Waltz had said he cached his tools and tethered his animals while he worked the mine, now becomes the "horse's saddle".
    Lots of other problems with the historical narrative as well IMO.
    Last edited by somehiker; Jun 02, 2019 at 07:17 AM.
    Hell,you ain't never too old to look!

  7. #22
    us
    Dec 2008
    2,184
    4976 times
    Quote Originally Posted by somehiker View Post
    How did the original clue of an old foundation that one would pass by near the end of their journey to the mine, AND where he buried one cache at a corner of the foundation......become a "house ruin" ?
    Which would imply and likely have searchers looking for standing walls of some kind.
    Or a roofless two room house in a cave, where Waltz would sometimes stay, become anything more or less than that ?
    If you read the four pages relating to "clues" at their "new site", most will notice other adjustments in various clues.....like where the saddle in which Waltz had said he cached his tools and tethered his animals while he worked the mine, now becomes the "horse's saddle".
    Lots of other problems with the historical narrative as well IMO.
    at the south end of the supers there is the ruin of a very old rock house..not far from the milk ranch and north of elephant butte...when i was a youngster all the old timers said the dutchman used to stay in this rock house...there isn't much left of it and it is hidden in the trees...

  8. #23

    May 2019
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    All Types Of Treasure Hunting
    Wayne what in the sam hell are you talking about half the stuff you are saying I wrote has nothing to do with what I actually wrote. Clue nine I never said anything about tethering animals up in ( I said on ) the Horses Saddle, we have been there, and you cannot get a miniature pony up above the horses to saddle so why would I infer. they had tethered animals up there. I have not written anything yet about where they tethered most of the animals, that is offsite and away from the mine. Wayne, I think you are getting senile, all the other stuff you are talking about does not match to anything I wrote. Everyone, please read clue 9 does it match Waynes VERSION OF WHAT I WROTE, TAKE ME TO THE PILOT! WITH ALL RESPECT Jeff.
    Also, Oro and Markmar are you posting back and forth between different sites, because I believe the question put to you was about your source on your post about Walt'z taking gold from the Thunder God shrine?

    .
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  9. #24
    gr
    Oct 2012
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    Quote Originally Posted by somehiker View Post
    How did the original clue of an old foundation that one would pass by near the end of their journey to the mine, AND where he buried one cache at a corner of the foundation......become a "house ruin" ?
    Which would imply and likely have searchers looking for standing walls of some kind.
    Or a roofless two room house in a cave, where Waltz would sometimes stay, become anything more or less than that ?
    If you read the four pages relating to "clues" at their "new site", most will notice other adjustments in various clues.....like where the saddle in which Waltz had said he cached his tools and tethered his animals while he worked the mine, now becomes the "horse's saddle".
    Lots of other problems with the historical narrative as well IMO.
    I believe the roofless two-room house ruin from Waltz clue is the same with the old fundation or like others saw it as a corral or aztec ruin. Was at the end of Waltz and Wisner journey to the mine but only as a camp in the shallow cave behind the ruin from where they should go around the peak above in regards to reach the mines.
    I believe also how after the death of Wisner, Waltz camped in the brush/trees at the east side of the small valley where the mines were ( from John Reed's story ).
    Waltz gave the stone house ruin clue and the horse head landmark with the three pines in line clues from Julia's map, as points of reference because without these signs the mines could be never find.

    What sounds wrong to me in the Arcana research is when they have two attempts to approach the stone house ruin and failed. Make me wonder how Waltz with his mule have not that much truble to go there.
    Last edited by markmar; Jun 02, 2019 at 12:34 PM.
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    Marius

    If your true to your heart,you will never go wrong.The truth is the truth,no matter how you look at it,and in every treasure story and legend there is a grain of truth . It's up to your spirit and heart to know the difference. NP





  10. #25

    May 2019
    71
    64 times
    All Types Of Treasure Hunting

    STONE HOUSE

    Quote Originally Posted by markmar View Post
    I believe the roofless two-room house ruin from Waltz clue is the same with the old fundation or like others saw it as a corral or aztec ruin. Was at the end of Waltz and Wisner journey to the mine but only as a camp in the shallow cave behind the ruin from where they should go around the peak above in regards to reach the mines.
    I believe also how after the death of Wisner, Waltz camped in the brush/trees at the east side of the small valley where the mines were ( from John Reed's story ).
    Waltz gave the stone house ruin clue and the horse head landmark with the three pines in line clues from Julia's map, as points of reference because without these signs the mines could be never find.

    What sounds wrong to me in the Arcana research is when they have two attempts to approach the stone house ruin and failed. Make me wonder how Waltz with his mule have not that much truble to go there.
    Hello, Markmar Thanks for your comments, the stone house my guys could not get up to is the not the same stone house waltz and his partner might have stayed at. The one my guys could not get up two is at the head of the main, farther down in the main canyon is a smaller main canyon step ravine that is where the mine is and we have been up there. The main canyon is frigen *****, the side is dangerous for different reasons, but the main canyon is even more difficult to get up, keep in mind there have been landslides and earthquakes. And the main canyon ruins are just four stone walls sitting on a ledge. Waltz or nobody could ever get a horse up there. Before the earth, the Quake and the path were intact and you could get a couple of small burros up the side canyon but not now.
    I do not want to give to much on-site physical description and give away the location but respectfully, you are talking about two completely different areas. On our next trip, we have secured two expert mountain climbers who have climbed Mt Everest amongst, mountains, in New Zealand, and around the World to make sure my guys can reach areas without getting killed. Markmar this place was dangerous 150 years ago and it even more so today Markmur I assure you nobody not even Trevor Brazile is getting an animal up to these places. In the movie, LONELY ARE THE BRAVE, WITH Kirk Douglas (his favorite movie), 3 STUNTMEN were killed doing the scene going up the mountain with Douglas and his horse, think of that part that would be easier than going up to the Spanish ruins in the main canyon. Markmar yoy are talking about something completely different. I need to go back to work cheers and thank you for your interest. Jeff.
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  11. #26
    ca
    May 2007
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    4493 times
    All Types Of Treasure Hunting
    Quote Originally Posted by arcana-exploration View Post
    Wayne what in the sam hell are you talking about half the stuff you are saying I wrote has nothing to do with what I actually wrote. Clue nine I never said anything about tethering animals up in ( I said on ) the Horses Saddle, we have been there, and you cannot get a miniature pony up above the horses to saddle so why would I infer. they had tethered animals up there. I have not written anything yet about where they tethered most of the animals, that is offsite and away from the mine. Wayne, I think you are getting senile, all the other stuff you are talking about does not match to anything I wrote. Everyone, please read clue 9 does it match Waynes VERSION OF WHAT I WROTE, TAKE ME TO THE PILOT! WITH ALL RESPECT Jeff.
    Also, Oro and Markmar are you posting back and forth between different sites, because I believe the question put to you was about your source on your post about Walt'z taking gold from the Thunder God shrine?

    .
    Not senile at all....."If you read the four pages relating to "clues" at their "new site", most will notice other adjustments in various clues.....like where the saddle in which Waltz had said he cached his tools and tethered his animals while he worked the mine, now becomes the "horse's saddle".

    I quote from your site " 9. Waltz said he camped up above where the Mexicans camped on the Horse’s Saddle. Yes! He also said he hid his tools there when he left. It would be a safe place if you are alone—you have the high ground."

    So what I am pointing out here, is that on your website you have claimed that Waltz said "Horse's Saddle".....which is what I mean by an "adjustment".

    One of the sources for Waltz's mention of a "saddle" is that from the "German Clues" which were published in Helen Corbin's "Bible".

    " From my camp in it's (a or the) saddle, you will see a peak in the distance with a hole. ( in it,or through it )"

    Note....there's no mention of a "horse"

    Further reference to the saddle is this...

    " I hid my tools (outfit) above the saddle."

    Note....above the saddle and once again there is no mention of a horse.
    Last edited by somehiker; Jun 02, 2019 at 01:47 PM.
    Hell,you ain't never too old to look!

  12. #27

    May 2019
    71
    64 times
    All Types Of Treasure Hunting
    Quote Originally Posted by somehiker View Post
    Not senile at all....."If you read the four pages relating to "clues" at their "new site", most will notice other adjustments in various clues.....like where the saddle in which Waltz had said he cached his tools and tethered his animals while he worked the mine, now becomes the "horse's saddle".

    I quote from your site " 9. Waltz said he camped up above where the Mexicans camped on the Horse’s Saddle. Yes! He also said he hid his tools there when he left. It would be a safe place if you are alone—you have the high ground."

    So what I am pointing out here, is that on your website you have claimed that Waltz said "Horse's Saddle".....which is what I mean by an "adjustment".

    One of the sources for Waltz's mention of a "saddle" is that from the "German Clues" which were published in Helen Corbin's "Bible".

    " From my camp in it's (a or the) saddle, you will see a peak in the distance with a hole. ( in it,or through it )"

    Note....there's no mention of a "horse"

    Further reference to the saddle is this...

    " I hid my tools (outfit) above the saddle."
    that will be clesr in the book and i ma not going to lay out that informmation wille nelle here.
    Note....above the saddle and once again there is no mention of a horse.

    Wayne you are correct I and only I said horse and I stand by that as only my observation. However, I did not say" tethered", I did not say what you said I said. Please clarify, I understand this Dutchman stuff is very complexe and truly mean that. Also I am staing what we see on the ground and alot of what is actally there will not match up to the hundreds of versions of any one given enity

  13. #28
    ca
    May 2007
    3,511
    4493 times
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    Quote Originally Posted by azdave35 View Post
    at the south end of the supers there is the ruin of a very old rock house..not far from the milk ranch and north of elephant butte...when i was a youngster all the old timers said the dutchman used to stay in this rock house...there isn't much left of it and it is hidden in the trees...
    Ok. I'll buy into the possibility that what Waltz was talking about may have been more than just a "foundation".....especially since I can't find my source for the "foundation" description at this time, but DO have a number which also refer to it as a "house" somewhere close to the mine itself.....ie: you can see the house, but not the mine. But as you know, there are a number of ruins out there which fit the bill, and where Waltz could have camped out on his way into the range.
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  14. #29
    Charter Member
    us
    Dec 2017
    419
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    Quote Originally Posted by arcana-exploration View Post
    Wayne you are correct I and only I said horse and I stand by that as only my observation. However, I did not say" tethered", I did not say what you said I said. Please clarify, I understand this Dutchman stuff is very complexe and truly mean that. Also I am staing what we see on the ground and alot of what is actally there will not match up to the hundreds of versions of any one given enity
    And there's the problem with "clues". Interesting to consider, but the various "sources" of these clues are problematic at best.

    No wonder people pick and choose what clues they think are valid, in order to justify their own search, or site. At any rate, best of luck in your search, and thanks for posting.

    Take care, Jim

  15. #30
    ca
    May 2007
    3,511
    4493 times
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    Quote Originally Posted by arcana-exploration View Post
    Wayne you are correct I and only I said horse and I stand by that as only my observation. However, I did not say" tethered", I did not say what you said I said. Please clarify, I understand this Dutchman stuff is very complexe and truly mean that. Also I am staing what we see on the ground and alot of what is actally there will not match up to the hundreds of versions of any one given enity
    I didn't say YOU said anything about where Waltz tethered his animals. That came from another source where, as I recall but will have to look through some more of my files, it was claimed the Waltz said he tethered his animals in a saddle above the mine, because there was good grass there and also because he could not bring them in closer to the mine.
    The legend IS very complex, as history tends to be, especially when it comes to the Sups. and everything that went on out there.
    It can take years to even get a sense for the lay of the land, and even longer to understand which clues could be relevant in the first place.
    I'm an amateur in comparison to many of those who have been interested in the LDM all of their lives, and who have grown up with the legend as part of their local lore. But I have been traveling down there since 1995, less two years where I couldn't make it. So that's 24 years, during which I have probably averaged around 10-12 days per year on the hunt, or at least with an eye out for most of what the old timers spoke and wrote about in their day. These last 8 or 9 years, with 4 weeks of paid vacation, I've upped the anti to as many as three trips to Phoenix and those moutains in a single year of up to 14 days each. So I've paid my dues I think as far as that goes.
    Hell,you ain't never too old to look!

 

 
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