Stone Tablet Symbols?

[MOtreasurehunter]

Hi!

I was looking at the documentary made about the stone tablets, and as i was watching it i noticed that the map had allot of symbols that i have no idea what they mean but they look like mountains, rivers and such, but the weird thing is is that some of the symbols look allot like Spanish treasure symbols, and the stone map itself resembles what the Spanish would draw up on boulders or other rocks to locate treasures they have hidden, and they were made specifically to confuse every one who saw them and only the Spanish people who knew how to read them could find the treasures, it was a law that the King of Spain made that all treasures had to be hidden this way, and i was looking at the big heart in the middle and it probably represents something like gold and whatnot, but hearts in many different designs were actually used by the Spanish too, they were not a good omen though, yes they did mean you were very close to large amount of treasure but what they really meant was that you were very close to a boobytrap, only the large Spanish treasures had symbols that meant you were near a booby trap cuz only the large caches of treasure were protected this way, and since these tablets are supposed to be for Montozuma's treasure i would not be the least bit surprised if were ever this treasure is located, that it is very very heavily boobytrapped in every way, because even though the ancient Mexicans weren't Spanish people, they did probably learn how do hide there treasure in this way, just my two cents.

thanks for reading everyone!

Evvan

 

Amazon Forum Fav 👍

Treasure of Victoria Peak - Grab it through Amazon!

[MOtreasurehunter]

sure, well, here is a link to the "official" myspace page made about the documentary, it even has a vid clip from the documentary, well, here it is!

http://www.myspace.com/stonetablets

Evvan

 

[the blindbowman]

that was very interesting Mo i have known about that dvd and had yet to get a copy but i did not say i beleive this is where my new site fills in the blanks ,... they took Montezuma's treasure and " threw it back in the hole it came from .." kino knew it would be many years before it would be found ,and he could change the history of the spanish take over of that area by telling the indains this and i beleive that just what they did ..yes i beleive Montezuma's treasure is at the bottom of my large hydrothermal vent discovery ..

good post MO !

 

[MOtreasurehunter]

well i have 2 questions Blindbowman, my first one is, who is Kino? and my second is this, wasnt the Montozuma treasure made up of mostly gold and silver? and if it was/is, and if it is at the bottom of a geothermal vent, isnt it possible that it has melted over the past hundreds of years? geothermal vents can get to be very high temperatures and some can get to a couple thousand degrees and melt skin from bone in an instent, if this vent was one with very high temperatures is it possible for the gold, silver, and other metals to be decresed back to there elomental state over a great period of time?

 

[the blindbowman]

1701. Eusebio Francisco Kino. Passage by land to California. Discover'd by Father Eusebius Francis Kino, a Jesuit; Between the Years 1698 & 1701: Containing Likewise the New Missions of the Jesuits. E. Bowen Sc., London, 1762. Map 24 x 21 cm. Scale ca, 1:5,100,000. From Jesuits, Letters from Missions, Travels of the Jesuits, by John Lockman. 2d ed. corr. London, 1762, vol. 1, opposite page 395. [G4301 S1 1762 K5].
702X800 | 527X600

This is a 1762 engraving in English of Kino's ca. 1701-1702 manuscript map. The map was first published in 1705 in French in Lettres Edifantes..., Paris. This small map is a great monument in the unfolding of the mysteries of the West. It includes discoveries made along his overland route to California which enabled him finally to dispel the theory of California as an island. Pimeria and Sonora appear for the first time as distinct regions, as do many placenames in the region, including Mission San Xavier as "S. Francis Xavier du Bac". Tucson is located by its earlier village name "S. Augustin". The Colorado River first appears by its modern name. Six other manuscript maps of the region are known to have been produced by Fr. Kino: 1683, 1685, 1695- 96, 1696-97, 1702, and 1710. Fr. Kino (1644-1711) was the great figure of the late seventeenth and eighteenth centuries in the far northwestern reaches of New Spain. He was a Jesuit missionary assigned in 1687 to the Pimeria, Viceroyalty of Mexico, and as leader of Jesuit missionaries in that region, he labored not only to minister to the Indians but to explore and make known the land. By 1687 Fr. Kino had established missions in what is now Sonora, but the northern region between the Altar and Gila Rivers remained largely unexplored. In 1691, with Fr. Salvatierra, Kino entered what is known today as Arizona and discovered notable sites such as the Casa Grande ruin. During a 1701 journey, Kino reached the mouth of the Colorado River and proved--to his own satisfaction, at least--that California was not an island.


your secound question depends on the active level of thermatics of these vent at this piont we have no data that says they are active but in most cases we must asume it is posable for safity reasons ..and you are correct MO ...you piont out a true fact the montezuma treasure could be no more then a blub of melts metal at this piont .it could also be a matter of how deep these vents are ...

my take on one of the pima legend . this one in fact !

"Pima (southwest Arizona):
After the earth had become peopled, the great eagle told a seer in the Gila valley, on three occasions, to warn the people about a great flood that would soon come, but the seer ridiculed him and ignored his warnings. Scarcely had the bird gone for the third time when a tremendous clap of thunder was heard. When morning came, the earth trembled, and a great green wall of water roared down the valley and destroyed everything in it. Szeukha, son of Chiowotmahke (Earth maker), saved himself by floating on a ball of pine resin. When the water receded somewhat, he landed on a mountain above the Salt River; his cave and tools can still be seen there. Szeukha made a ladder that reached into the clouds and went to fight the great eagle, whom he thought had caused the flood. They fought long, but at last he killed the eagle. He found the bones and corpses of the people which the eagle had abducted and returned them to life. He also rescued a pregnant woman and her child. The eagle had stolen her and taken her for his wife. She became the mother of the Pima people. [Erdoes & Ortiz, pp. 473-475; Gaster, p. 115]

The Creator, Earth Doctor, made the mountains, the waters, the plants; he made the sun and moon in their courses. Then he made all kinds of birds and creeping things, and he made clay images and commanded them to become living humans. They obeyed him, multiplied, and spread over the earth. In time, as sickness and death were still unknown, the population outran the available sustenance, and people faced ever-increasing famine. The Creator resolved to destroy the creatures he had made, so he pulled down the sky, crushing to death all living things. Then he restored the world and made humans again. The earth gave birth to one known as Siuuhû or Elder Brother. He spoke harshly to the Creator, and the Creator feared him. Elder Brother shortened people's lives so that they didn't multiply out of control as before. He resolved further to destroy mankind entirely with a great flood. He created a handsome youth to go among the Pimas, wed their women, and beget children, staying with each wife only until his first child was born. The first wife gave birth four months after marriage and conception, and the gestation periods became shorter with each successive wife, until the last child was born at the time of the marriage. (The people were amazed and frightened by the powers shown by Elder Brother and his agent during these years.) This last child's screams shook the earth, and it was he who caused the flood. Meanwhile, Elder Brother had begun fashioning, out of black gum, a jar in which to save himself, and he announced his purpose to the Creator. The Creator called the people together and warned them of the nearing flood. He thrust his staff into the ground, boring a hole all the way through the earth. Some people took refuge in the hole. Other people appealed, futilely, to Elder Brother. Elder Brother did tell coyote to find a big log on which to float safely on the flood. Elder Brother closed himself in the jar, known as Black House, and the flood came. The jar bobbed on the waters until it came to rest near the mouth of the Colorado River. It may be seen there today; it is called Black Mountain. The Creator survived the flood by enclosing himself in his reed staff and floating. The coyote survived on his driftwood. Only five sorts of birds survived, including the flicker and vulture, by clinging to the sky with their beaks until a god took pity on them and let them make nests from their own down and float in them. Some people survived in the hole which the Creator had made. Others survived in a similar hole made by a powerful person called South Doctor. Others appealed to the Creator, who told them to try to find refuge on Crooked Mountain, and he directed South Doctor to help them. South Doctor led the people to the summit and, with his enchantments, four times raised the mountain and arrested the rising waters, but then his powers were exhausted. He threw his staff into the water, where it cracked loudly. He sent a dog to see how high the tide had risen, and when the dog reported that the water was very near the top, the people were transformed into stone. You may see them there today. [Frazer, pp. 283-287]

Because someone displeased the gods, a heavy rain began pouring down, and water gushed from the broken ground, swelling the rivers. For the first time, the wise Se-eh-ha (Elder Brother) did not know what to do. Some people ran up Slanting Mountain (Superstition Mountain) and prayed to the Great Spirit to stop the flood, but when the water threatened to swallow them up, they turned into rocks in fright. Se-eh-ha and his brother Juvet-Makai (Earth Medicine Man) hurriedly made canoes and rode out the flood in them. Coyote used his magic to turn himself small and crawl into his bamboo flute, in which he floated. Some birds, including the swallow, buzzard, raven, oriole, and hummingbird, clung to the sky with their bills. The flood rose high enough to drench their tails, leaving them drenched-looking for all time. The flood lasted four days, and Se-eh-ha, Juvet-Makai, and Coyote were tossed in different directions. Coyote landed on a high mountain near the Colorado River; his flute was tightly stuck in the rocks, so he left it there. He left to look for Se-eh-ha and Juvet-Makai, finding them at Slanting Mountain surveying the desolated land. Elder Brother rubbed some dust off his chest onto the ground, where it turned into ants. The ants began scattering the dirt, making it drier, and Elder Brother said that is what he wants ants to do. The three of them began making images to replace the lost people. Elder Brother scolded Earth Medicine Man for making his images so different, with one leg and one arm, and Earth Medicine Man angrily threw away his images and sank into the ground to find a place to live on the other side of the earth. Elder Brother and Coyote placed their images in a warm mud hut and waited for them to speak. Coyote's images began laughing first; this displeased Elder Brother, so he sprinkled cold water on them and threw them to the cold north, where they became the Apaches. Coyote was angered and disappeared as Earth Medicine Man had. After four days, Elder Brother's images began laughing and talking. They became the River People and repopulated the Gila valley. (Later, Elder Brother became greedy and evil and led Juvet-Makai's people to conquer the River People.) [Shaw, pp. 1-14]

Papago (Arizona):
Back when the sun was closer to the earth, Coyote foresaw the coming of a flood, gnawed down a great tree, entered it, and sealed the opening. Montezuma, who was the first person created by the Great Mystery, took warning from Coyote and prepared a dugout canoe for himself atop Monte Rosa. Only they survived the flood, which covered all the land. They met again on the top of Monte Rosa, which rose above the flood waters. To ascertain how much dry land was left, the man sent Coyote to explore. Coyote reported that there was sea to the west, south, and east, but seemingly endless land to the north. The Great Spirit, with the help of Montezuma, restocked the earth with men and animals. Montezuma, with Coyote's help, taught them and led them. Montezuma later became prideful and rebelled against the Great Mystery, thus bringing evil into the world. The Great Mystery raised the sun to its present height and, with an earthquake, destroyed the tower that Montezuma was building into the heavens, in the process changing languages so that people could no longer understand animals or other tribes. [Erdoes & Ortiz, p. 487-489; Gaster, pp. 114-115]

Hopi:
The people repeatedly became distant from Sotuknang, the creator. Twice he destroyed the world (by fire and by cold) and recreated it while the few people who still lived by the laws of creation took shelter underground with the ants. When people became corrupt and warlike a third time, Sotuknang guided the ones who had retained their wisdom to Spider Woman, who cut down giant reeds and sheltered the people in the hollow stems with a little water and food. Sotuknang caused a great flood with rain and waves, and the people floated in their reeds for a long time. Finally, they came to rest on a small piece of land, and Spider Woman unsealed their reeds and pulled them out by the tops of their heads. They still had as much food as they started with. They sent out birds to find more land, but to no avail. They grew a tall reed and climbed it, but they saw only water. But guided by their inner wisdom (which comes from Sotuknang through the door at the top of their head), the people traveled on, using the reeds as canoes. They went northeast, finding progressively larger islands. The last of these was large and fruitful, and people wanted to stay there, but Spider Woman urged them on. They went further northeast, paddling hard as if going uphill, until they came to the Fourth World. The shores were rocky with seemingly no place to land, but by opening the doors at the tops of their head, they found a current that took them to a sandy beach. Sotuknang appeared and told them to look back, and they saw the islands, the last remnants of the Third World, sink into the ocean. [Waters, pp. 12-20]

Spider Clan, Blue Flute Clan, Fire Clan, Snake Clan, and Sun Clan traveled together on the Hopi migrations. On their northward journey, they were blocked at the Arctic Circle by a mountain of ice and snow. This was the Back Door of the Fourth World, which Sotuknang said was closed to them. Spider Woman and the Spider Clan, however, urged them to go on, and all the clans used their powers to try to melt and bread down the mountain. They tried four times but failed. Sotuknang told Spider Woman that if they had succeeded, the melted snow and ice would have flooded the world. He punished her by letting her grow old and ugly, and Spider Clan became breeders of wickedness. [Waters, pp. 39-40]

here is one of the other legends i believe is of interest ...

"Some Apaches believe that the hole leading down into the lower world is located in the Superstition Mountains. Winds blowing from the hole are supposed to be the cause of severe dust storms.["

there is another story about

"THE STORY OF PAHTAHNKUM
AND when they came to their journey's end the wife of Kaw-koin-puh had a baby, which grew up to be a fine boy, but the mother cried all the time, wherever she went, on account of her husband's death.

And the people, after they had settled down, used to go rabbit-hunting, and the children too, and this boy, Paht-ahn-kum, used to watch them wistfully, and his mother said: "I know what you are thinking of, but there is nothing for you to kill rabbits with. But I will send you to your uncle, my brother, whom I am expecting will make a bow and arrows for you."

And the next morning, early, the boy went to his uncle, who said: "Why do you come so early? It is an unusual thing for you to come to see me so early instead of playing with boys and girls of your own age."

And the boy replied: "My mother said she was expecting you to make me a bow-and arrows."

And his uncle said; "That is an easy thing to do. Let us go out and get one." And they went out and found an o-a-pot, or cat-claw tree, and cut a piece of its wood to make a bow, and they made a fire and roasted the stick over this, turning it, and they made a string from its bark to try it with; and then they found arrow-weeds, and made

p. 174

arrows, four of them, roasting these, too, and strengthening them; and then they went home and made a good string for the bow from sinew.

And then the boy went home and showed his mother his bow and arrows.

And the next morning the children went hunting and little Pahtahnkum went with them to the place of meeting.

And they found a quotaveech's nest near them, with young ones in it, and one of the men shot into it and killed one of the young ones, and then the children ran up to join in the killing. And when Pahtahnkum came up, one of the men threw him one of the young birds, and said: "Here, take it, even if your mother does not wish to marry me."

And the little boy ran home and gave his game to his mother, and when she saw it she turned her back on it and cried. And he wondered why she cried when he had brought her game and was wishing she would cook it for his dinner.

And his mother said: "I never thought my relatives would treat you this way. There is an animal, the caw-sawn, the wood rat, and a bird, the kah-kai-cheu, the quail, and these are good to eat, and these are what they ought to give you, and when they give you those, bring them home and I will cook them for you." She said, further; "This bird is not fit to eat; and I was thinking, while I was crying, that if your father were living now you would have plenty of game,

p. 175

and he would make you a fine bow, and teach you to be as good a hunter as there is. And I will tell you now how your father died. We did not use to live here. But beyond this mountain there is a river, and beyond that another river still, and that is where we lived and where your father was killed by the people called Apaches, and that is why we are here, and why we are so poor now.

I am only telling you this so you may know how you came to be fatherless, for I know very well you can never pay it back, For the Apaches are very fierce, and very brave, and those who go to their country have to be very careful; for even at night the Apaches may be near them, and even the sunshine in their country feels different from what it does here."

And the little boy, that night, went to his uncle, who asked: "Why do you come to me in the night?"

And the little boy said: "I come to you because today I was hunting with the bow and arrows you made me, and someone gave me a little bird, and I was bashful, and brought it right home for my mother to cook for me, and she cried, and then told me about my father and how he died. And I do not see why you kept this a secret from me. And I wish you would tell me what these Apaches look like, that they are so fierce and brave."

And his uncle said: "That is so. I have not

p. 176

told you of these things because you are just a baby yet, and I did not intend to tell you until you were a man, but now I know you have sense enuf to wish to learn. There is nothing so very different or dangerous about these Apaches; only their bows, and their arrows of cane, are dangerous."

And the little boy went on to another doctor, who said: "Why do you come to me?: are you lost? If so, we will take you home." But the little boy said to him: "No, I am not lost, but I want you to tell me one thing--Why the Apaches are so dangerous--are they like the har-sen, the giant cactus, with so many thorns?" And the doctor answered: "No, they are men like we are, and have thoughts as we have, and eat as we do, and there is only one thing that makes them dangerous and that is their bows and their arrows of cane."

So the little boy went to the next doctor, and this doctor also asked him if he were lost, and he said: "No, but I want you to tell me just one thing--why the Apaches are so dangerous. Are they like the mirl-hawk, the cane-cactus, with so many branches all covered with thorns?" And the doctor replied: "No, they are human beings just as we are, and think just as we do, and eat as we do, and the only things that make them dangerous are their bows and their arrows of cane." And the little boy said: "I am satisfied."

But he went yet to another doctor and asked

p. 177

him also why the Apaches were so dangerous, were they like the hah-nem, the cholla cactus? but the doctor said no, and gave the same answer as the others had done, and the little boy said: "I am satisfied then," and went back to his uncle again and began to question him about how people did when they got ready for war, and what they did to purify themselves afterward, and his uncle said: "It is now late at night, and I want you to go home, and tomorrow come to me, and I will tell you about these things."

So the little boy went home, but very early in the morning, before sunrise, he was again at his uncle's house, and came in to him before he was yet up. And his uncle said: "I will now tell you, but we must go outside and not talk in here before other people."

And he took the little boy outside. and they stood there facing the east, waiting for the sun to rise, with the little boy on the right of his uncle. And when the sun began to rise the doctor stretched out his left hand and caught a sunbeam, and closed his hand on it, but when he opened his hand there was nothing there; and then he used his right hand and caught a sunbeam but when he opened his hand there was nothing there; and he tried again with his left hand, and there was nothing, but when he tried the second time with his right hand, when he opened it, there was a lock of Apache's hair in his hand.

p. 178

And he took this and put it in the little boy's breast, and rubbed it in there till it all disappeared, having entered into the little boy's body.

And then he told the little boy to get him a small piece of oapot or cat-claw tree, but no, he said, I will go myself; and he went and got a little piece of the oapot, and tied a strip of cloth around the boy's head, and stuck the little piece of wood in it, and then told him to go home to his mother and tell her to give him a new dish to eat from.

And this stick which the doctor had put into the boy's hair represented the kuess-kote or scratching stick which the Pimas and Papagoes used after killing Apaches, during the purification time; and the doctor had made it from cat-claw wood because the cat-claw catches everybody that comes near, and he wanted the boy to have great power to capture his enemies.

And his uncle told the boy to stay at home in the day time, lying still and not going anywhere, but at night to come to him again. "And before you come again," he said, "I will make you something and have it ready for you."

And the little boy kept still all that day, but at night he went to his uncle again, and his uncle had four pipes ready for him, made from pieces of cane, and he said, "Now tonight when the people gather here (for it was the custom for many people to come to the doctor's house in the evening) they will talk and have a good time, but

p. 179

after they are thru I will roll a coal from the fire toward you, and then you light one of the pipes and smoke four whiffs, and after that slide the watch-kee, the pipe, along the ground toward me, as is the custom, and I will smoke it four times and pass it to my next neighbor, and he will do the same, and so the pipe will go all around and come back to you. And even when it is out, when it comes back to you, you are to take it and stick the end that was lighted in the ground.

So that evening the people all assembled as usual, and told all the news of the day, and about the hunting as was their custom. And when they were thru, and had quieted down, the uncle moved to the fire and rolled a coal toward Pahtahnkum, who took it and lit one of the pipes, and smoked it four times, and then slid it slowly (the pipe must be slid slowly because if it were slid rapidly the enemy would be too quick and escape, but if it is done slowly the enemy will be slow and can be captured) along the ground to his uncle. And his uncle took the watchkee, the pipe-tube, and smoked it also four whiffs, and passed it on, but saying: "Of course you are all aware that if any man among you has a wife expecting to have a baby soon, he should not smoke it, but pass it on without smoking to his neighbor, for if you smoke in such case the child will not be likely to live very long."

And so the pipe passed around, and the boy, when the pipe came to him again, buried it as

p. 180

he had been told, and then he began to make this speech:--

"I am nothing but a child, and I go around where the people are cooking and when they give me something to eat I generally suffer because it is so hot. And there was a hunt, and you gave me nothing but a little quotaveech, and stuck it under my belt as if it were something good to eat: and when I took it home to my mother, and dropped it down by her, she turned her back upon it and began to cry. And when she had done crying she told me of all that had happened before, about my father's death, and the story entered my heart; and I went for help to a respectable person, a doctor, one to whom a child would not be likely to go, and he kindly assisted me, and told me what I asked of him.

And I wanted to be revenged on the slayers of my father, and in imagination a day was appointed for the war, and I went; and the first night I feared nothing and felt good, and the second night, too, I feared nothing and felt good, but the third night I knew I was in the land of the Apaches, an enemy with shield and club, and I did not feel good, and it seemed to me the world was shaking, and I thought of what my mother had said, that the land of the Apaches was different from ours.

And the fourth day I went on and came to the mountain of the Apaches, and I found there the broken arrows of my father's fight; and I sat

p. 181

down, for it seemed to me the mountains and the earth were shaking, and shook my knees, and I thought of what my mother had said that the land of the Apaches felt entirely different.

And the next day I went on and came to the water of the Apaches. And my hair lay over the water like moss. And I looked and found my skull, and I used it for a dipper, and parted the hair with it, and dipped up the water and drank it. And when I drank from the skull I felt as if I were crazy, and clutched around with my hands at things that were not there.

And from there I went on to another water, and that was covered with the white war-paint of my hair, which lay like ashes on the water, and I looked around and found my skull, and drank from that water, and it smelled strong to me like the smell of human flesh and of black war-paint.

And all this was caused in my imagination by the thought of my dead father, and of how the Apaches had gone along rejoicing because they had killed him.

And the next place was a great rock, and I sat down under it, and it was wet with my tears; and the winds of the power of my sadness blew around the rock four times, and shook me.

In the far east there is a gray cousin, the Coyote, and he knows where to find the Apaches, and he was the first I selected to help me and be my comrade, and he took my word, and joined me; and stood up and looked, and saw the Apaches

p. 182

for me and told me; and I had my band ready, and my boys captured the Apaches, who had no weapons ready to injure them.

And after killing then, I took their property, and I seemed to get all their strength, all their power. And I came home, bringing all the things I had captured, and enriched my home, strengthening myself four times, and the fame of my deed was all over the country.

And I went to the home of the doctor, taking the child I had captured, and when we were there the blue tears fell from the eyes of the child onto my boys and girls.

And all of you, my relatives, should think of this, and be in favor of the war, remembering the things we have captured, and the enemies we have killed, and should make your singing all joy because of our past successes."

And after the speech was done, feeling it the speech of a child, the people were silent, but at length Toehahvs said: "I like the way of the child, because I am sure he is to be a powerful person, perhaps stronger than any of us, and I respect him, and that is why I am kind to him, and I want that we should all take a smoke, and after that you will get over your feeling of his insignificance."

And then they all smoked again, and began to talk about the war, and of the things they lacked, but the boy wanted them to get ready in four days, telling them that was plenty of time. And

p. 183

so they all began to get ready for the war, making and getting ready shields, clubs, bows, arrows, shoes, and whatever was needed.

And so the people departed for the war, and the very day they left, the mother of Pahtahnkum went and got clay to make the new dishes for the men who should kill Apaches, for she foreknew that many would he killed, and so she sang at her work. And a few of the people were left at home, and one of these was an old man, and he passed near where the mother (whose name was Koel-hah-ah) was making her pottery, and heard her singing her song, and he said to the people: "It is very strange that this woman who used to cry all the time is singing now her boy has gone to the war. Perhaps she is like some wives, who when their time of mourning is over are looking out for another man."

And the war-party went by near where Tawtsitka (Sacaton) now is, around the mountain Chirt-kee, and west of the Sah-kote-kee, (Superstition) mountains, and there they found tracks of the Apaches, and paused, and the boy, Pahtahnkum, told them to wait there while he went forward and found where the Apaches were.

And Toehahvs said: "I will go with you, so we can help each, other and be company, and you will feel that you have some strength, and I will feel the same."

So Pahtahnkum and Toehahvs went out on their scout, and went up an arroyo, or washout

p. 184

valley, in the mountains, and in making a turn came suddenly upon some Apache children playing in the sand, and the children saw them and ran up the valley to where the Apache houses were. And the two scouts stood and looked at each other and said: "What shall we do now! for if we go back the people will blame us for letting the Apaches see us first."

And Pahtahnkum said: "You go back and step in my tracks, and I will turn into a crow and fly up on this rock." And this was done, and when the Apaches came they could see only the coyote tracks, and they said: "There are no human tracks here. It must have been a coyote the children saw," and they went back home. And then Pahtahnkum flew to where Toehahvs was, and came down and took his human shape again.

And the band had been anxious about them, because they were gone so long, and had followed their tracks, and now came near, and when Pahtahnkum saw them, instead of going back to them, he and Toehahvs turned and ran toward the Apaches, and all the band rushed after them, and they took the Apache village by surprise, and conquered and killed all the men, and then killed all the women, and scalped them all.

And because Pahtahnkum had been so brave, and had killed many, the people brought all the scalps to him, and all the baskets, and bows and arrows, and other things they had taken, and laid them around him; and then they all stood around

p. 185

him in circles, the oldest in the middle next the boy, and the others, in the order of their age, in circles outside. 1 And then Pahtahnkum began to yell, he was so rejoiced, and he threw the scalps of the Apaches up into the air, and then, after them, the other things, the bows and arrows, and all things captured, because he wanted to make a cloud; for when an Apache is killed it will rain.

And while this was happening, his mother was rejoicing at home, knowing all that was happening her boy.

So the people took everything the Apaches had, and a good many children as captives, and they returned by the same road, and before they got home they sent a messenger ahead.

And when they got home they presented all the property taken, and all the weapons and all the captives to the mother of Pahtahnkum.

Now when the neighbors of those Apaches heard of this they formed a big war-party, and followed Pahtahnkum's trail, but when they came to the place called Taht-a-mumee-lay-kote they stopped, because they did not know where to find water, and so they turned back, tho from there they could see the mountains where Pahtahnkum lived.

And after Pahtahnkum had gone thru the prescribed purifications, and the war-dances and


p. 186

rejoicing proper to the occasion, he again formed a war-party, and again took the trail after the Apaches, only this time he went to the other end of the Superstition Mts. And there they saw the lights at night on a peak, where the Apaches lived, and went up there and killed them, except the children, whom they took for captives.

And then they went down into an open place in the desert, and there placing Pahtahnkum and Toehahvs in the center, they again formed the circles, with the older ones nearest the middle, and again brought all their trophies to Pahtahnkum and Toehahvs, who threw them up with rejoicing, as before.

And again the Apaches formed a war-party, and pursued them; and again they, when they came to the low mountains south west of where Tawtsitka now is, were frightened, as they looked over the desert, and said: "This country is unknown to us, and we do not want to die of thirst," and again they abandoned the pursuit, and returned home. And because the place where they made fires was found, these mountains are called Aw-up Chert-taw to this day.

And again everything was given to Koelhahah, as before.

And once more, after the purification, Pahtahnkum formed a war-party; and this time they went to the east, and there again found Apaches at the place called Oy-yee-duck, or The Field, because there the Apaches had cultivated fields,

p. 187

and here they fought the Apaches, and defeated them; but they had hard work to kill one Apache, who was very brave, and who kept his wife before him and his child behind him, and as the Papagoes did not want to kill these they could not get at the man. But finally Pahtahnkum killed a man near him, and some one else killed the woman, and then Pahtahnkum killed this man and took the little boy captive.

And again they went out to an open place, and formed the circles, and rejoiced as before.

And a party of Apaches pursued them again and again were discouraged, and turned back at the red bluff to the eastward, where they dug a well, which place is still called Taw-toe-sum Vah-vee-uh, or the Apache's Well.

And again, in due time, a war-party was formed, and this time it went far east, and there was found a single hunter of the Apaches, and this man they killed and cut up and mutilated as had been done with Pahtahnkum's father, putting his flesh out as if to jerk it. And they went south-east from there and again found a single hunter; and him they scalped and placed his scalp like a hat on a giant-cactus, for which reason the place is still called Waw-num, which means a hat.

And Pahtahnkum walked behind, for he was very sad, thinking of his father.

And then Pahtahnkum returned home, having revenged his father, and this was the last of his wars.

p. 188

And once more the Apaches followed him, but stopped at a place near the Superstition Mts. where, as there had been rain and the ground was wet, they stopped to clean a field, See-qua-usk, or the Clearing, but they gave it up and returned, not even planting the crop.

And his mother made a large olla, and a small flat piece of pottery, like the plates tortillas are baked on. And she put all the Apache hair in the olla, and placed the flat plate on top to cover it with grease-wood-gum to seal it up tight. And then she went and found a cave, and by her power called a wind and a cloud that circled it round.

And then she returned to her people, and, placing the olla on her head, led them to the cave, and said. "I will leave this olla here, and then when I have need of wind, or of rain, I can form them by throwing these up, and so I shall be independent."

And after this Pahtahnkum was taken ill, and the people said it was because he had not properly purified himself.

And he went to the tall mountain east of Tucson, and from there to other mountains, seeking the cool air, but he got no better, and at last he came to the Maricopa Mts., and died there, and his grave is there yet.

And his mother died at her home.


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Footnotes
185:1 The reason why the older people went inside the circle was to protect the younger ones from the impurity of anything Apache, and they went inside as more hardened to this. i believe if you make and even mix of white histroy and indain histroy and take into acount the variations of how the stroy is told and by who told it you get a somewhat clear picture of the truth ..

 

[the blindbowman]

i am sorry about the long post of data but i wanted to explan how small peices of data may relate to each yet hiden in diffrent legends . take the wording


"He thrust his staff into the ground, boring a hole all the way through the earth. Some people took refuge in the hole. "

"Some Apaches believe that the hole leading down into the lower world is located in the Superstition Mountains. Winds blowing from the hole are supposed to be the cause of severe dust storms.["

"THE STORY OF PAHTAHNKUM" add this story and you begain to see a pattern ,

if you know the two brothers are lightning and thunder you can see how the indain saw these events take place ...

now take this statement out and lets look at it by it self ..."Winds blowing from the hole are supposed to be the cause of severe dust storms.[" in 1801 the southern midrid faultline showed dozens of sand blowout some as high as 2ooft , and they coverd the sky when it was windy out . thus this could explan the apache statement ...it could to them from their piont of veiw be fact ...

look at this statement

"He thrust his staff into the ground, boring a hole all the way through the earth."

now here they state the hole is up right ,if you hear it the way they say it ... and they tell us how deep it is . to them it has no bottom . maybe mintues after they give up waiting to hear the rock hit bottom ,they walk away and then the rock dose hit bottom after they are gone .. this hole could be miles deep by that acount or at lest thousands of ft deep maybe hunderds we just can only try to under stand what they saw and herd , i guess from this statement they did not hear the bottom .. if you found a hole like this would you not make it secerd to your people . would you surounded by a great flood and the waters were still riseing and you were high up on a mt and had no where else to go would you jump in the hole or try to go down into the hole and hope to find a cave somewhere down in the earth , this may relate to the catacom legends of trying to find a way to live threw the great flood ...

these were prode people and they were smart as we are they just had a more simple life style ... there complex art and faiths were not for show they lived what they were . they did not need the chruches their chruch was within them always as is mine ..

they did how secerd some place and they were much as i have pionted out here , works of nature and gods ..

add the THE STORY OF PAHTAHNKUM and you can see how the apache may have vanished and the secerd place was lost when there tribes where killed off ...or broken up ..

i hope this helps some of you under stand a very small part of my research patterns

 

[Oroblanco]

Greetings Evvan and everyone,

The stone tablets are quite a mystery and have fascinated many people since their discovery in the 1940's. Whether they are real or fake is a major question and even if genuine, what ever treasure(s) they might have led to could be already recovered, which would explain why the maps could be found in one place together.

I would suggest that you decide for yourself whether they are genuine or a hoax, and not assume them to be either based on the say-so of any one individual. There have been several threads of discussion on the stone maps here on T-net, with a great deal of information available, plus a good deal more on the internet in other sites.

As for gold or silver melding back into the elements, it depends. Silver will oxidize over time, (slowly) and degrade into the soils, especially in acidic or alkaline environments - however gold is very inert (chemically inactive) and does not degrade over time unless in the presence of strong acids or extreme heat. This is why gold items buried with King Tut look as shiny and beautiful as the day they were buried, even though thousands of years have elapsed. It is also why we can find gold in the eroded alluvial material, intact, even though the stone in which the gold was originally deposited has been dissolved by the actions of weathering, acidic soils, etc.

Thank you Blindbowman for posting the Indian legends. I have read several of these, and has it not struck you, how many parallels you can find to Biblical tales in the various Amerindian legends? The great flood is one of the most striking, however many others seem to be related. (Note the survivors of the flood sent out birds to find land, just as we find in the biblical Noah account, and is paralleled in the Epoch of Gilgamesh.) It truly makes one wonder about the Ten Lost Tribes, however far fetched it might be.

Good luck and good hunting to you (everyone) I hope you find the treasures that you seek.

Oroblanco

 

[the blindbowman]

do you take something to make you that smart ...?
birds . no they do not mean brids as the white languages under stands the trem . birds means feathers . feathers are braves . flocks are groups within a tribes, clan are tribes of diffrent villieages or diffrent groups of numbers
.to send out birds , translates into . sending out small waring parties if you will, to seek land , trem birds in this case would led me to beleive, to send birds meaning ,sending feathers but even more then a few feathers , this was over seen ,(one of many feathers , a chiff or soon to be a chiff . each had a amont of braves or feathers that he guided in their learning . and these were not just feathers they were some of the best or they would not have been sent with the bird these would have been proven feathers not just braves ...you stated birds . their was more then one group sent , this tells me the old bird is directing this event .thus the owl i know these trems . i am a hawk not a full blooded mohawk . just a hawk ...dont let my common nature fool you . i can fly faster and higher then the wind and the stars and vanish and appear at will...i can be the raven or the owl any time i will it ...with in my senses .....

IMHO that is what the statment means ...great birds were sent out to find land and this was not a signial messenger, most likely the owl would have send them into the day and night , do you know this term , it means that they stand in wait to serve their great white hair . and every passing of the hour he send a bird in another dirrection on till he has coverd the full 360 degrees around him .. we for the most part never under stand these things because it is unknown to us the higher skills that were used by the indain chiffs of the passing sands ...

to me this is what that means ....but i am only part indain but my blood is just as red ...and it is the river that runs within my spirit ...

diffrent triabes would read it diffrently but the main idea is that IMHO ...it is a simple nature with a complex wisedom to guide it ...

when i was correcting this for spelling , i noted the owl is not seen . maybe he has past in the great flood and his flocks are young with out his wisdom , this could also be under stood from the stroy by other chiffs , it would be an unspoken under standing , much like the peralta stones ... maybe the words were added to the stones ...

 

[Oroblanco]

Re: Stone Tablet Symbols? (LONG reply)

Greetings Blindbowman,

I was struck by the very mention of the use of birds to try to locate dry land, which is a common thread in a great many of the ancient Flood myths. I use the term "myths" only loosely here because I am convinced that the flood myths are based on real events which occurred at the end of the last Ice Age, when sea levels rose dramatically and quite suddenly all over the globe.

The reason I find the story of using birds to locate land as striking is because that is a quite ancient method of searching for land by mariners. So how did a tribe of Amerindians, with no known history of ever being a seafaring people, end up with a quite nautical method of locating land in their myth? Plus this is a VERY ancient method of finding land, dating back literally thousands of years! I find that point to be very curious, especially considering that historians claim that all Amerindians trace their ancestry to people who supposedly crossed into the Americas via the Bering Straits land bridge, a land bridge which existed during the Ice Ages but which does not exist today due to our higher sea levels.

Now this probably has little or nothing to do with the LDM story, at least it has little that I can discern, but perhaps it does - in a very veiled, almost occult way. There are very ancient petroglyphs and pictograms in the Superstitions, which were created by ancient Amerindians and are difficult to learn the meaning of to our civilization-dulled minds. Is there something hidden here in these ancient pictures, that is directly related to the LDM?

Thank you for the kind words mi amigo (assuming it was not purely in jest! ) and yes I do take something to help my feeble mind - that highly addictive "potion" - coffee! I probably drink way too much of the stuff, but am hopelessly addicted to it and cannot even think of cutting back on the consumption! In fact to me, there is almost nothing so good as a cup of freshly brewed java, brewed over a cheery campfire, somewhere far off the beaten track; sipped while discussing the Elk tracks found up on the ridge earlier, or the number of gold "colors" that panned out from the samples dug out of the gulch, or even just reminiscing or listening to tall tales. (I am referring to Mrs Oro's infamous Sock Coffee here, something that has to be tasted to be believed! :P )

My apologies for digressing so far off the subject, the discussion has given me new ambition to get working on my own writing projects. I now reside a great distance from the haunting Superstitions and cannot afford to make the trip to join the Rendezvous, but wish I could be there with note-pad in hand! It is sure to be a great meet, a chance to meet some of the nice folks we have been 'talking' with here and to hear from experts.

That interpretation of the "birds" as feathers/warriors could well be the true meaning hidden in parable; perhaps there are still more hidden meanings within the myth as well?

Oroblanco

 

[the blindbowman]

i agree 100% coffie is GOD's best work , and i agree with the indain translation being in part lost to our modern word . i started out trying to sense what they did next i knew my senses and skills were so strong i found my self speaking in tounges and not knowing what the word mean ....i have the feelings that go with them and could sense the path of their spirits before me . know i just think of what they are and my laguage changes with out me even knowing it . i start talking about their past and i become one with them , the old ones , the Anceint ones , they speak threw me as if i was their wind carried to this reality in this world , or i share both worlds ...i reread this and beleive i can explan it a little better then i did ...
AP is astro projection thats where you send your spirit out away from your body . in this case i shape shift in to two places at the same time . part of my sense focus in their reality and part conditions it self within me , to relate a path between their demintion and mine , once this path is made . i can focus to ether demintion or two both at the same time ,
but let me say this . this takes great powers of the mind and spirit and the spirit can only sense what is in the other demintion , thus any danger or fear that is seen causes a reaction to your spirit and it react by returning to where it knows it is safe , home to where the heart beats soft and safe . but the spirit can be conditioned to step free of this safity .but the person doing this rish far more then they know ... it can cause shock and disorintation to the confused spirit if not conditioned to the level they find them selfs in at the time ...all things have a spirit or chi . as the rock is the rock so can i be the rock , if we sense and share its chi togather as one ..

yet you are you and i am me to be as one you must open your windows of your soul and i can not in danger your being or you will return to your level of safity and close your window your being or spirit in this case reacts as a refleces of the mind and body ...

in my case those spirit or engeries from long ago have lost their earth world and now inhabbit the spirit world or reality , thus their heart beats in that demintion and not this one so they see it their as we see their world in their spirit realities here . its like stepping into the waters reflection . into their demintion and becomeing one of that worlds beings . yet your heart beats in this reality ...


if their are shaman out there they know what i am saying


in my case i have been doing this all my life from the age of 7 when i drown... i can send my spirit to any object any where in any demintion at any time . i have not found a structure that can not be shared , some are not as nice as others ....and some take conditioning to be even close to ... others welcome me , they have been lost to time and the Anceint ones welcome me smileing ,it has been a long time and they have seen few cross over as i do ...

i am a golden spirit to them and they see me as that ...many ask me to tell their love ones they are all right , yet it makes me sad . for i under stand their love ones have lived and died many moons and season ago and they do not relate to the diffrent time spans for their demintion between theirs and ours ,,,7 secound to 7 hours to 7 days to 7 moons to 7 year to 7 seasons ,to 7 ways

what feels to be 7 mintues to them could be 7 years here ...so if a hour has past there , i think you get the idea ...this is why when you dream time slows down for the being sense vissions and matter from the other world and thus their time is slower then ours and you fall deep into sleep letting your safity guides down this lets your being collect data from their relaity and thus your spirit relates and slows its patterns down to under stand the vission it is seeing at the time of the vission ,
i am sorrow i am a great master of my shama chi.. saddly i am one of few left that can still cross over threw the night and day ..


can we not under stand all of creation if we are to become it ......?


to the modern under standing this is crazy talk . to me i find no other way to explan it .. how can a person speak a 6000 year old laguages with out knowing it ...?

thing god i have some controll over this gift it makes a odd debeat when you start bitchen in a laguage no one knows ..

it is also hard to find anyone that still knows this tounge . i have not found anyone to date that speaks this dielact...

and as you see one word or simbolic can be read over and over in diffrent ways and any time it is put beside other words and simbolics it changes and so dose those other words

it is a senses of path and pattern that guide the shamans wisedom ever truely under stand ....

if you find this in your path send me and email i would welcome the chance to translate it for you if i can . the sad part is this laguage can not be rushed , it takes a state of mind and conditioning and has to be read many time like this to find the true meanings and senses relate to each word or set of wordings ..or simbolics

i dont even know if this could be learn by eveyone ...

some may be able to read it and other find it much like ESP ...lol

 

[Oroblanco]

Greetings Blindbowman,

Thank you for trying to explain your experiences, I think I begin to understand – you mentioned astral projection for instance. I first read of astral projection about thirty years or so ago, when some paranormal organizations were studying the phenomenon. The theory they had (if memory serves) was that it was an act of projecting one’s soul to the site desired, remaining “tied” to the body by a "silver thread" that supposedly was tied to the bellybutton. In more recent years, the US Army got involved with this, though referring to it by quite another name – “remote viewing”. Their experiments in spying and searching for lost or missing persons etc had some surprising successes, and though the program is supposedly shut down the rumor has it that it is still going on. Your shamanistic methods sound very similar to what the Army intelligence officers were doing, though using slightly different terminology. Some have theorized that what native shamans are doing with "spirit walks" is very much the same as what the Army experiments were doing, just by different names - though many native shamans also relied on the use of mind-altering substances, which the Army did not use. (At least not officially.) I know that if I were trying to remote-view something, I would not want any kind of mind-altering drug not even alcohol, I would want my mind to be as clear as possible. (Which is pretty fuzzy at best! )

When I was younger I learned a supposedly “secret” way to become “invisible” and when I practiced it, it seemed to work. (You were not really “invisible” but become very “low profile” in the surroundings, so that people tend not to see you.) While it was fun and interesting, and did improve my hunting ability, if I were to tell someone about it the reaction is usually quite incredulous – so I don’t tell people about it. I see a similar reaction when you post about your own remote viewing, using native terminology, many people are confused and/or incredulous.

Your practice of remote viewing or astral projection might well be providing you with information that could help you to locate the LDM or other lost treasures – or it might be just wrong – the only way to find out is to get into the field and check with your eyes and hands on your next expedition. Remote viewing/astral projection is a little-researched field, and equally little understood. The human mind appears to be capable of many feats that cannot be easily explained by science. Wouldn't it be great if it worked to help find lost mines and buried treasures! 8) For anyone curious, Wikipedia has a better explanation than I posted here:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Remote_viewing

Blindbowman wrote:

it is also hard to find anyone that still knows this tounge . i have not found anyone to date that speaks this dielact...

Have you tried searching through some of the online dictionaries? Some ancient languages are online (including Phoenician now, a pleasant surprise) perhaps you could ID which language it is by recognizing some of the words? In some cases this would require saying the words out loud as they are written, to see if it actually matches or is just close. Here is a site with several "guessers" that might be able to identify the language:
http://www.yourdictionary.com/morph.html#guessers
Failing these, and if you are fairly certain it is an Amerindian language, there are experts who can be of assistance, at least on a basic level, as they have the "root" languages fairly worked out.

Good luck and good hunting to you, I hope you find the treasures that you seek.

Oroblanco

 

[cactusjumper]

Oro,

The Apache would pull the grass up and hold it in front of their face. Another trick, was to stand on one foot with their arms akimbo.....in front of a forest of Joshua trees. Becoming one with those things around you is the trick.

The Apache would believe they were the grass and the Joshua tree.

Joe

 

[MOtreasurehunter]

well BB i went on the net to look up what wered "shama chi" derives from, its not native american, south american, or mexican, its actually a muslem word,here is the links so you guys dont think im full of crap.

http://www.khyberwatch.com/forums/archive/index.php?t-1161.html

http://www.khyberwatch.com/forums/archive/index.php?t-1161.html

what language you speek of is not a lost language as you can see, but actually a language used by many millions of people around the world, sorry dude,...

 

[the blindbowman]

well BB i went on the net to look up what wered "shama chi" derives from, its not native american, south american, or mexican, its actually a muslem word,here is the links so you guys dont think im full of crap.

http://www.khyberwatch.com/forums/archive/index.php?t-1161.html

http://www.khyberwatch.com/forums/archive/index.php?t-1161.html

what language you speek of is not a lost language as you can see, but actually a language used by many millions of people around the world, sorry dude,...

shama chi is a word i made up to lable my type of AP . what you found is not my art .... the word is made up of the words shaman and chi
thus shama chi
it stands for the birth of shamanisum & chi as one , it has nothing to do with muslem. what so ever ...sorry

 

[the blindbowman]

Greetings Blindbowman,

Thank you for trying to explain your experiences, I think I begin to understand – you mentioned astral projection for instance. I first read of astral projection about thirty years or so ago, when some paranormal organizations were studying the phenomenon. The theory they had (if memory serves) was that it was an act of projecting one’s soul to the site desired, remaining “tied” to the body by a "silver thread" that supposedly was tied to the bellybutton. In more recent years, the US Army got involved with this, though referring to it by quite another name – “remote viewing”. Their experiments in spying and searching for lost or missing persons etc had some surprising successes, and though the program is supposedly shut down the rumor has it that it is still going on. Your shamanistic methods sound very similar to what the Army intelligence officers were doing, though using slightly different terminology. Some have theorized that what native shamans are doing with "spirit walks" is very much the same as what the Army experiments were doing, just by different names - though many native shamans also relied on the use of mind-altering substances, which the Army did not use. (At least not officially.) I know that if I were trying to remote-view something, I would not want any kind of mind-altering drug not even alcohol, I would want my mind to be as clear as possible. (Which is pretty fuzzy at best! )

When I was younger I learned a supposedly “secret” way to become “invisible” and when I practiced it, it seemed to work. (You were not really “invisible” but become very “low profile” in the surroundings, so that people tend not to see you.) While it was fun and interesting, and did improve my hunting ability, if I were to tell someone about it the reaction is usually quite incredulous – so I don’t tell people about it. I see a similar reaction when you post about your own remote viewing, using native terminology, many people are confused and/or incredulous.

Your practice of remote viewing or astral projection might well be providing you with information that could help you to locate the LDM or other lost treasures – or it might be just wrong – the only way to find out is to get into the field and check with your eyes and hands on your next expedition. Remote viewing/astral projection is a little-researched field, and equally little understood. The human mind appears to be capable of many feats that cannot be easily explained by science. Wouldn't it be great if it worked to help find lost mines and buried treasures! 8) For anyone curious, Wikipedia has a better explanation than I posted here:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Remote_viewing

Blindbowman wrote:

it is also hard to find anyone that still knows this tounge . i have not found anyone to date that speaks this dielact...

Have you tried searching through some of the online dictionaries? Some ancient languages are online (including Phoenician now, a pleasant surprise) perhaps you could ID which language it is by recognizing some of the words? In some cases this would require saying the words out loud as they are written, to see if it actually matches or is just close. Here is a site with several "guessers" that might be able to identify the language:
http://www.yourdictionary.com/morph.html#guessers
Failing these, and if you are fairly certain it is an Amerindian language, there are experts who can be of assistance, at least on a basic level, as they have the "root" languages fairly worked out.

Good luck and good hunting to you, I hope you find the treasures that you seek.

Oroblanco

hearing what you have to say is like a the wisman on the mt top .. thank you Oro ...

it was not just the Army and it was not just AP or RV . there was about 35 diffrent test in that group, i know frist hand . they release most because they found out they could condition them to hypresensitive levels but there was no way to shut it off .. most went insane , they wanted to see how far they could go but "we" were exspendable ...

and it was done by families bloodlines ....

there is a very good chance no one well ever know the truth . and few of those tested are coherent... those test were still being done in 1981...

who cares .. no one cared then . i try to forget like the others

 

[Oroblanco]

Thanks for the kind words buddy. I am no wise man, if I were it would not have taken me so long to finally figure out what it is that you have been doing in your search through the Superstitions.

The Army testing was still on-going at least as recently as 1996, which is only a bit more than ten years - who knows if they are still doing it or not? It seems doubtful that such a secret program would be announced publicly, if still on-going.

Greetings mi amigo Cactusjumper - those Apaches were renowned for being able to "melt" into the countryside, both before and after an attack. Even such simple things as assuming a pose (like mimicking a Joshua tree as you cited) that is not what the human eye expects to see a human being in, is surprisingly effective in becoming "invisible". Many deer hunters already practice this type of "invisibility" whether using camouflage or not, in the familiar "stand" hunting, which is simply remaining as motionless as possible while keeping watch for game - sort of becoming a "stump" or short tree to any passing deer.

This discussion of "invisibility" may seem to our readers to be totally off-topic, however if we remember the story of Waltz is that he concealed the mine by camouflage to so closely resemble the surrounding terrain that it was virtually "invisible" - and this holds true for the caches of rich ore as well. How does this relate to the Stone Tablets? Well IF the tablets are genuine, and any treasure(s) they relate to remain un-recovered, the treasure would almost certainly be concealed very, very well - which necessitated the use of maps to relocate the treasure.

Oroblanco

 

[cactusjumper]

Roy,

"Well IF the tablets are genuine, and any treasure(s) they relate to remain un-recovered, the treasure would almost certainly be concealed very, very well - which necessitated the use of maps to relocate the treasure."

The Stone Maps are real, and they do lead to treasure. One such treasure was removed from the mountains years ago. That would be Harry LaFrance's cave of gold bars. A few people have been to that cave since it was cleaned out, and they will all tell you it is marked on the Stone Maps.

For me, the only real questions are: Where did the gold originally come from and who created the maps? What is located, or was located, at the other Xs on the maps? Was the circle in a circle also a treasure cache?

There are a number of things about the Stone Maps that point to Anglo's as the creators, not the least of which are the words and misspelling, the drawings, and the use of the X to mark the spot. Others have differing opinions, but that only shows they have not been on the Stone Map Trail......looking for those cache's.

Take care,

Joe

 

[the blindbowman]

yes vanishing and appearing without being seen as real in this reality but you miss under stand the spirt walking is that a gost or was that me ,can you under stand how are we free ......


it is not to play dead for all things have a chi and all chi has a sequence to it structure and all structure moves as it move ,find its ath and see its sequence, know it sequence and act as it dose and you to will vanish to the out side world ...

mind over matter , who sees it and how .....

yes the test are still happening ...once like a baby given candy as a reward only to have it taken away so they could cut the cord ...

reward and pain . so they were no more , it was all lost somewhere along the path . forgot in time ...i remember ...

as for the stones ...yes they are real hiden with in are many levels and many treasures ... how far you read a book is that from cover to cover . dont stop reading and sooner or later you will find the end of the story ...


i ask you all once a question and no one replied . you still have nt ...


thye killed them and they did not have a chance . they knew what they were doing and yet they did it to protect their secerd place ..know what they tryed to protect is here and theymust pay for what they have done ...


the decoy was found and two more remain . is that funny or just insane ...?

i know where all those crosses are and i know what they mean , there is no misspelling on the stones .

why look for what you have already found ?

 

[Oroblanco]

Greetings friends,

Cactusjumper those are possibly more difficult questions you pose, than "where is the Lost Dutchman?" - for with the case of LaFrance, we have not even a photo of the bars, which might be of some help in trying to ID their origin. (That is, IF the bars have/had any kinds of makers marks on them.)

Blindbowman wrote:

i ask you all once a question and no one replied . you still have nt ...

My apologies for not at least attempting some kind of reply, and to be honest I don't recall the question - perhaps it was posted while I was not able to get online or I just did not know the answer, anyway I would appreciate if you would re-post the question, and I will attempt some kind of answer.

Blindbowman also wrote:

why look for what you have already found ?

To this, I would reply...

Jesus said, "Know what is in front of your face, and what is hidden from you will be disclosed to you. For there is nothing hidden that won't be revealed." (Gospel of Thomas, 5)


A parting thought:
Isaiah 45:3

Oroblanco

 

[cactusjumper]

Oro,

The only marks on the gold ingots were five dots and five lines. The lines and dots were not connected, but were placed in such a manner as to create a crown.

There are many stories which are created for reasons that are not obvious. The Harry LaFrance story may be such a case. However, the existence of the gold bar is not something I question. Anyone who knows me will tell you that I question everything.

The first person to tell me the LaFrance story was my Uncle Chuck. He was in the original 13-man expedition and got to know LaFrance well. Chuck also described the gold bar to me, and said he held it in his hands. Not one person in that search had any doubts about Harry's story. They had all held the gold bar.

Others in that group have all told me the same story, without variation. As far as I know, only one of them is still alive. It is said that the pictures that were taken.....one camera, were destroyed in a fire up in New River.

There is nothing on the LaFrance gold bars that would "help to ID their origin". While I would not bet my life on the testimony of the others, I would bet it on the truthfulness of what my uncle told me. I have no doubt that the story that LaFrance told was (mostly) truthful, which is why the gold bars are gone.

"That is, IF the bars have/had any kinds of makers marks on them."

If you picture the crown as I have described it, you will be seeing everything inscribed on the gold bars. I believe there is a reason for the lack of any other markings. I would guess that no one has ever seen a marking like that on a Spanish ingot.

Take care,

Joe