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Thread: Doc Thorne gold...Is it an easier legend than the LDM

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  1. #121
    us
    Arizona Desert Rat

    Sep 2021
    Chandler Arizona
    Divining rod
    5
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    Knowledge
    There is no mine to be found with Lost Dutchman. A cave. Small opening faces the setting sun. Vast interior. Scrawled just above eye level before kneeling to exit is "el gato 47". Apache trail visible. Shards of broken red clay pot. Trick in the trail is vertical. Stumbled upon around 1995. Much much guano. Vertical stacks of flat stones inside. Many bats heard high above, extremely high. Rattlesnakes between the tricks. Massacre site not too far. Tools with CG mark found not too far opposite direction of massacre. Handles rotted long ago.
    alfonzo likes this.

  2. #122
    Charter Member
    us
    j

    Dec 2012
    wisconsin
    whites mxt, tesoro lobo super trac., monster1000
    416
    890 times
    All Types Of Treasure Hunting
    who found this cave, are there any photos, or would you care to share rough location. thanks in advance

  3. #123

    Nov 2015
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    Wendt, Wouldn't be too sure of that. Pic of the covered mine sunk and the rock house. Make ya rethink that. I'll never open it. So it will sit till the next one to.find it. There was some ore still on the ground can see it in last pic. Click image for larger version. 

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    Last edited by Doc4261; Sep 14, 2021 at 08:33 AM.
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  4. #124
    gr
    Oct 2012
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    What Dr Thorne never saw or imagined, was the fact that while he was at the gold outcrop, he was sitting above the horse head landmark. This landmark it's a critical clue if someone is looking for that gold outcrop, actual LDM. Also this clue was depicted in Julia's map and was told by Herman Petrasch to Ted Cox.
    This landmark it's nothing else than the Cobollo de Santa Fe, depicted in the H/P stone map, and its shape and the cross carved close by on the mountain, validade this.

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    skyhawk1251 likes this.
    Marius

    " There are many doors in and out of the mnts,but none so hidden as the ones in front of you.
    Do you possess the knowledge of the spirit to let you enter them? " NP




  5. #125

    Nov 2015
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    Quote Originally Posted by markmar View Post
    What Dr Thorne never saw or imagined, was the fact that while he was at the gold outcrop, he was sitting above the horse head landmark. This landmark it's a critical clue if someone is looking for that gold outcrop, actual LDM. Also this clue was depicted in Julia's map and was told by Herman Petrasch to Ted Cox.
    This landmark it's nothing else than the Cobollo de Santa Fe, depicted in the H/P stone map, and its shape and the cross carved close by on the mountain, validade this.


    Marius, love most your thoughts. But for me your h/p solve is off. I won't prove it. There is only one h/p solve. One day I'd like to show u my cards. Won't till I know u don't go in anymore. Those that have looked and can't anymore deserve the truth. It's too bad many long dutch hunters have gone recently. I have my regrets on not giving them a ah-ha moment but my research isn't done. Got 13 days in them mntns coming to tie all loose ends and figure out what clues were skewed. One last thought for all , one on the other forum might of been there. He claimed to be given the info as holder of knowledge. I can say I'm a believer from what I've seen. No way he could of been so accurate without being there. The info he had isn't in any story. Hope others take this as a clue. I won't give it all up freely. U gotta still figure it out yourself. If it gets ya out in them majestic mntns for just a day. It's the most beautiful and humbling place Ive ever set my feet on. Ps don't look just for one, the ldm. There is plenty more to the story to appreciate it all.
    skyhawk1251 likes this.

  6. #126

    Nov 2015
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    Quote Originally Posted by Idahodutch View Post
    Jim,
    Of the different versions that I have read or heard, this sounds like maybe a little spice, but not much, and perhaps was on part of Dr. Thorne.
    I wonder if that was extent of interview? My first thoughts were what else was talked about or elaborated about. Maybe that is all there is to the story....

    Those were my first thoughts, but you sound like you have issue with location?
    He really did not say where except south of Mogollon Rim, and maybe near the Salt, and some very red hills ... but that all sounded vague. If he knew where he was, I think he would have found his way back.... but maybe not.

    Not tons of traffic lately, if you feel like expounding some, i would read it
    Russ
    It's south of the salt and not in the wilderness. There was a show that showed a mineralized area by where I believe it is. Had Mr. Tuttle in it. Give a general area. The sierra Anchas has a significant meaning to a map by the Jesuits. Highest point on the way to NM. Let's leave it at this, why is Aztec peak named what it is...Also why no one can deny the Jesuits were above the Salt.

  7. #127

    Nov 2015
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    When u find this mine. U can see what they were following. Your in the area of the lost Thorne mine. And a pic of the ore crushed. Click image for larger version. 

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    Since. Im in the giving mood bout to call it a night. Find this spot. Guarantee this place is fire. Hella quartz dike system. In the damnest place. Can see the trail run across the top of the pic. So it's doable if ya got the stamina.
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    Last edited by Doc4261; Sep 14, 2021 at 10:32 PM.
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  8. #128
    us
    Nov 2018
    Kingman, AZ
    151
    280 times
    Prospecting
    "What Dr. Thorne never saw or imagined, was the fact that while he was at the gold outcrop, he was sitting above the horse head landmark. This landmark is a critical clue if someone is looking for that gold outcrop, actually the LDM. Also, this clue was depicted in Julia's map and was told by Herman Petrasch to Ted Cox. This landmark is nothing else than the Cobollo de Santa Fe, depicted in the H/P stone map, and its shape and the cross carved close by on the mountain validate this." -- markmar
    Very interesting photo. I see the cross, and what looks like a rock structure, below and to the right.

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    markmar likes this.
    I only tell the truth half of the time. You decide where that half starts and ends. -- JACOB WALTZ

  9. #129
    Charter Member
    us
    Sep 2020
    Dumas,AR
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    Quote Originally Posted by superstitionsexplorer View Post
    The Lost Dutchman Mine has had many false experts, and clues...Is the simple story of Doc Thorne easier? Fewer stories mean more truth. The story of Doc Thorne is easier to follow and has less maps. So maybe if we could find historical evidence of this we could all be closer to an answer. We should also look into the lost Dragoon pistols. There has only been one story on those lost Dragoon pistols...and I am looking for historical evidence...If we cannot find the Lost Dutchman Gold mine, maybe with military records, we can find those lost crate of pistols...Lets find them
    Welcome to Tnet from Lower Arkansas.Good luck on your quest,may you find it.

  10. #130
    gr
    Oct 2012
    White's Spectrum XLT
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    Quote Originally Posted by skyhawk1251 View Post
    Very interesting photo. I see the cross, and what looks like a rock structure, below and to the right.



    At the Horse site it's the Neverland, so to speak. There the fantastic joins the reality and the legend becomes truth. Very few people have had the privilege to enter that magic land, and very few have had the ability to recognize it. The most of the privileged people never left the land again, many because of the greed and others because of the rituals or accidents caused by mysterious phenomena.
    That place doesn't want to be find, and at this time you have the privilege to see it only through my photos. I doubt someone else could find it under normal circumstances, but who knows, maybe one day someone else will hear the calling and will be able to see trough the magic curtain.
    Last edited by markmar; Sep 16, 2021 at 01:45 PM.
    skyhawk1251 likes this.
    Marius

    " There are many doors in and out of the mnts,but none so hidden as the ones in front of you.
    Do you possess the knowledge of the spirit to let you enter them? " NP




  11. #131
    us
    Nov 2018
    Kingman, AZ
    151
    280 times
    Prospecting
    "At the Horse Site it's the Neverland, so to speak. There the fantastic joins reality and the legend becomes truth. Very few people have had the privilege to enter that magic land, and very few have had the ability to recognize it. Most of the privileged people never left that land, many because of greed and others because of rituals or accidents caused by mysterious phenomena. That place doesn't want to be found, and at this time you have the privilege to see it only through my photos. I doubt if someone else could find it under normal circumstances, but who knows, maybe one day someone else will hear the calling and will be able to see through the magic curtain." -- markmar
    Yes, we are truly privileged to see "that magic land" through your photos, markmar. I doubt if anyone can match your knowledge and insight "to see through the magic curtain." Please honor us by sharing more photos of that place where "the fantastic joins reality."
    Last edited by skyhawk1251; Sep 16, 2021 at 03:15 PM.
    markmar likes this.
    I only tell the truth half of the time. You decide where that half starts and ends. -- JACOB WALTZ

  12. #132

    Nov 2015
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    Quote Originally Posted by markmar View Post
    At the Horse site it's the Neverland, so to speak. There the fantastic joins the reality and the legend becomes truth. Very few people have had the privilege to enter that magic land, and very few have had the ability to recognize it. The most of the privileged people never left the land again, many because of the greed and others because of the rituals or accidents caused by mysterious phenomena.
    That place doesn't want to be find, and at this time you have the privilege to see it only through my photos. I doubt someone else could find it under normal circumstances, but who knows, maybe one day someone will hear the calling and will be able to see trough the magic curtain.

    that pic would be def harder to find, just off top of my thoughts, Squaw valley or Bluff springs mntn. That pic is def an older GE pic. Could be off though.
    skyhawk1251 likes this.

  13. #133

    Nov 2015
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    Quote Originally Posted by Doc4261 View Post
    that pic would be def harder to find, just off top of my thoughts, Squaw valley or Bluff springs mntn. That pic is def an older GE pic. Could be off though.
    Also markmar, that cross isn't really there. Can see in the pic that the cross was caused by pixilation.
    dredgernaut likes this.

  14. #134
    gr
    Oct 2012
    White's Spectrum XLT
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    All Types Of Treasure Hunting
    Quote Originally Posted by Doc4261 View Post
    Also markmar, that cross isn't really there. Can see in the pic that the cross was caused by pixilation.
    Like I wrote, all the scene isn't really there.
    Marius

    " There are many doors in and out of the mnts,but none so hidden as the ones in front of you.
    Do you possess the knowledge of the spirit to let you enter them? " NP




  15. #135
    us
    Dec 2017
    819
    2595 times
    Quote Originally Posted by PotBelly Jim View Post
    Here's the original Doc Thorne gold story by Spring, that Greg referred to above.

    Attachment 1929775
    Life's been getting in the way of my participating on this forum. As most of you will recall, I'd posted the above some time ago (page 2 of this thread), and there was some discussion on how many thought John Spring's version of the Doc Thorne story was more believable than the others. I share that view, that it sounds more believable than the others.

    I've done considerable research on the Doc Thorne story, and in the course of that have encountered incontrovertible proof that the story as it's been handed down, just can't be true. I'll post most of that evidence as time allows. I'll say up front, that I believe the core of the story is most likely true...that Doc Thorne saw what he believed was a rich deposit of gold somewhere to the east of Ft. McDowell...and thus, I believe it's worth investigating the story...but some level of fact must be discerned from the stories before anyone has any hope of finding it...assuming there's any detectable gold left on the surface, at this late date.

    Back to John Spring and his article. Spring wrote many such articles for a veteran's newspaper, and I believe he knew most of what he was writing was campfire BS. Most of the old-time AZ storytellers, of which Spring was one, did this all the time. His articles were pure entertainment, a lot of truth to them, but yarns nonetheless. He was trying to entertain folks, and provide fodder for newspapers and magazines so they could sell papers and increase their advertising revenue.

    Was Spring telling the truth about meeting Doc Thorne in Sonora, and that's how he came by the story? No, he wasn't telling the truth about that. Spring copied most of his article, sometimes almost word for word, from an earlier article (1890). I doubt anyone can truly confirm that the 1890 article was the very first time this particular info had appeared in a newspaper, but it's the earliest I can find.

    It's clear to me that John Spring copied most of his story from the earlier article... again... sometimes word for word... and then passed it off as something he had heard from Doc Thorne himself. Here's the article, for those who are interested. Compare it to Spring's article, line by line.

    Doc Thorne 1890 AZ Enterprise story.pdf

 

 
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