Appalachian Mountains Passes

[Ken S.]

Doing R & I on old roads/trails/traces from Virginia into Kentucky... "google" Wilderness Road/Fincastle Turnpike, then: Wilderness Road/Frontier Trail. HH! Good Luck! Have FUN!

Very interesting !! I would think the Indians knew a route possible through present day W. Va. to the Ohio. Possible along New river down to the Kanawha and then to Shawnee town. Probably traveled by some of the first settlers and long hunter into W. VA. and Ky. The Mary Ingles story would support a theory of that I would think. Or maybe through Pound Gap and down the Levisa/Louisa to the Sandy to the Ohio.

 

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[Rebel - KGC]

Doing R & I on old roads/trails/traces from Virginia into Kentucky... "google" Wilderness Road/Fincastle Turnpike, then: Wilderness Road/Frontier Trail. HH! Good Luck! Have FUN!

Don't forget Turn-pikes, Toll-roads...

 

[Rebel - KGC]

Very interesting !! I would think the Indians knew a route possible through present day W. Va. to the Ohio. Possible along New river down to the Kanawha and then to Shawnee town. Probably traveled by some of the first settlers and long hunter into W. VA. and Ky. The Mary Ingles story would support a theory of that I would think. Or maybe through Pound Gap and down the Levisa/Louisa to the Sandy to the Ohio.

Back then, W.Va. was part of OLD Virginia...

 

[KY Hiker]

I would imagine each tribe or subgroup/clan would have their own preferred routes based on sacred landmarks, war sites, burial places and carvings they found sacred. After finding the trail tree in Copperas Creek and then backtracking it up an old impression back up the hill I came across a series of arches within a 60-80ft area along a narrow ledge... the trail then opened up again above that. It was as if the trace went past those arches on purpose...we have to remember these people were much more in tune with their surroundings than we are. The hunt was sacred, I would think their journeys were as well. It is impossible to get inside their head and think as they did, but like Ken had said in another thread, almost every creek, stream and river had some sort of game trail or trace along it.

 

[Ken S.]

Don't forget Turn-pikes, Toll-roads...

Great R and I Rebel !!! The article on James River Kanawha turnpike is confirmation on what I suspected about the Indian trail through present day W. Va. The Route 60 mentioned come all the way to Kenova/Catlettsburg Area. From there it would be a easy trip on to Lower Shawnee Town on the Sciota. Here is a link

https://www.wvencyclopedia.org/articles/978

 

[Ken S.]

Is Bluefield one of those cities that is in 2 states, like Kansas City

Yep R&I says it is.

 

[KY Hiker]

I could see them getting to the East bank of the Kanawha...just how they crossed is my question. The Indians would 'sink' dug out canoes where needed (where no ford was possible). I cannot see them building rafts to cross though.

 

[Ken S.]

Indians probably swam the Kanawha and Ohio. Indians had a different mind set to what people do today. They were a much tougher people back then, even the white men of that era was tougher than todays people.

 

[franklin]

Yep R&I says it is.

Bristol, Tennessee is also in two states.

 

[Ken S.]

Tug Fork Runs From around Bluefield along present day W.Va. and Ky. border. Bluefield is probably 25/30 miles S west of the New River gap. This would have been another good route for the Indians/explorers to of made their way into Ky./W. Va. During the 1700's . Tug would have been easy to cross most any where especially on horseback. Given the fact Swift was wanting to stay under radar so to speak it would have been a good route I would think.

 

[Rebel - KGC]

It IS! "Line" right down da STREET... WOW!

 

[Rebel - KGC]

Tug Fork Runs From around Bluefield along present day W.Va. and Ky. border. Bluefield is probably 25/30 miles S west of the New River gap. This would have been another good route for the Indians/explorers to of made their way into Ky./W. Va. During the 1700's . Tug would have been easy to cross most any where especially on horseback.

Bluefield is on the Va./WVa. border...

 

[Rebel - KGC]

Tug Fork Runs From around Bluefield along present day W.Va. and Ky. border. Bluefield is probably 25/30 miles S west of the New River gap. This would have been another good route for the Indians/explorers to of made their way into Ky./W. Va. During the 1700's . Tug would have been easy to cross most any where especially on horseback.

New River Gap WAS the route taken... from the Frontier Trail of the Wilderness Road (West-side of Virginia). Almost certain that MANY Trails/Roads went WEST into Kentucky from there; West Virginia was VIRGINIA back then...

 

[Ken S.]

In researching about W. Va. Trails saw where some of the Indian supposedly called part of W.Va. Kantuk. Just something I read that stuck in my mind. Guess anything West of the Blueridge/Alleghanies could have been called Kantuck. Seems I've read somewhere the name kantuk/Kentucky was related to hunting grounds.

 

[Rebel - KGC]

It was... HAPPY Hunting Grounds.

 

[KY Hiker]

Indians probably swam the Kanawha and Ohio. Indians had a different mind set to what people do today. They were a much tougher people back then, even the white men of that era was tougher than todays people.

Not likely at all! Especially in the colder months and through Spring...no flood control back then. They 'hid' dug out canoes by sinking them with rocks and lashing them to trees so they would not wash down stream in a flood condition. This also preserved them by keeping them under water. Now what did the Swift crew do? ... most likely shallow fords to get their pack animals across. There is a ford just South of Charleston that the buffalo and Indians probably used, but the other rivers I am having trouble finding crossing points...maybe above 'falls' if those rivers have them.

 

[KY Hiker]

Tug Fork Runs From around Bluefield along present day W.Va. and Ky. border. Bluefield is probably 25/30 miles S west of the New River gap. This would have been another good route for the Indians/explorers to of made their way into Ky./W. Va. During the 1700's . Tug would have been easy to cross most any where especially on horseback. Given the fact Swift was wanting to stay under radar so to speak it would have been a good route I would think.

Probably, but my first task is to figure out the route from Ft. Pitt in the Spring time down along the Ohio and to the Sandy's West bank with pack animals...this was the first trip to the mines according to some journals, other trips took some different routes...this is a process of elimination...if there were no traces to get them there, did it happen? or was it added later? If they came along the Ohio river, surely they would have mentioned the mounds around Moundville? Some obvious things don't add up or were not mentioned, like crossing around the mouths of those rivers emptying into the Ohio River, quite a task with a 1,000lb animal. Remember these aren't those shallow streams you see in old westerns that cowboys cross and the horses never get water up to their bellys.

 

[Ken S.]

If memory serves me right they left Ft. Pitt and went to the head waters of the Wheeling creek. on their first trip.

 

[KY Hiker]

From your wiki link in another thread...
"The Appalachian Mountains form a natural barrier to east–west travel. From New York to Georgia there are only five ways to travel to the west, with only three natural interior breaks allowing animal powered travel without great engineering works. These were the Gaps of the Allegheny and the several ways such as the Kittanning Paths in Pennsylvania, the Cumberland Narrows in northwestern Maryland host to Nemacolin's Path, and the Cumberland Gap in the four-state region of North Carolina and Virginia on the east side and through the gap, Tennessee and Kentucky. While late 19th and 20th century technologies would later bridge the mountain chain in other places, these all required significant civil engineering works to make a road bed past the barrier range geologist classify as the ridge-and-valley Appalachians. Settlers from Pennsylvania tended to migrate south along the Great Wagon Road through the Great Appalachian Valley and Shenandoah Valley. "
... once in the Shenandoah your choices are limited as far as the western direction.

Many of these other 'gaps' were fine for foot travel but much too severe for horse/mule and/or wagons. This leads me to believe the journals that mention following the creek bottoms to make more sense and have more reason.

 

[Ken S.]

From your wiki link in another thread...
"The Appalachian Mountains form a natural barrier to east–west travel. From New York to Georgia there are only five ways to travel to the west, with only three natural interior breaks allowing animal powered travel without great engineering works. These were the Gaps of the Allegheny and the several ways such as the Kittanning Paths in Pennsylvania, the Cumberland Narrows in northwestern Maryland host to Nemacolin's Path, and the Cumberland Gap in the four-state region of North Carolina and Virginia on the east side and through the gap, Tennessee and Kentucky. While late 19th and 20th century technologies would later bridge the mountain chain in other places, these all required significant civil engineering works to make a road bed past the barrier range geologist classify as the ridge-and-valley Appalachians. Settlers from Pennsylvania tended to migrate south along the Great Wagon Road through the Great Appalachian Valley and Shenandoah Valley. "
... once in the Shenandoah your choices are limited as far as the western direction.

Many of these other 'gaps' were fine for foot travel but much too severe for horse/mule and/or wagons. This leads me to believe the journals that mention following the creek bottoms to make more sense and have more reason.

Who Ever Wrote that part of Wiki must not have realized there was a river that runs from N. Carolina to Gauley Bridge, W. Virginia. Here is a couple of links with Info about the 2 major ways west in the time frame of Swift.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Braddock_Road_(Braddock_expedition)
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wilderness_Road

From the way wiki describes the Wilderness road, it wasn't much more than a foot path through Cumberland Gap at Ky. Tenn. border.