Has anyone ever challenged City Hall on the issue of Metal Detecting?

[ashton9]

I have called my city?s Parks and Recreation department about being able to do metal detecting in the city parks. After being put on hold a number of times and talking to a number of different people. The answer was no, they don?t want holes everywhere. I didn?t argue with anyone but I had a good idea that nothing was written down anywhere about the issue of metal detecting. Today I have spent a good amount of time researching the city?s ordinances and regulations. I haven?t found anything about metal detecting in the parks. But the section of code for Vandalism Prohibited, ?no person shall in any manner cut, mar, deface, injure or destroy any growth? would put me in violation of the law. I?m sure it will take a long time to change or add ordnances, but has anyone attempted to do this and what kind of plan or steps did you take along the way?? Thanks!

 

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[coinshooter]

Dude, haven't you ever heard the expression you can't fight City Hall! 8)

 

[trgams]

There is a law locally that prohibits me from doing the same thing. It states that there is no digging allowed, therefore metal detecting would be an excercise in futility. I have often pondered the possibility of opening up a loophole for my favorite hobby...possibly limiting the size of the hole that is dug, or requiring this to be covered back up. Possibly limiting the season when this would be allowed to when the grass is dormant like in the late fall. I guess one way to start this process would be to draft a? petition, stating the wanted changes to the local law, and then to pound the pavement on weekends and evenings, and try to get as many signatures on it as possible. When you have collected a signifigant ammount of signatures, you could take this to your local town mayor, or representative, and see if this starts any action at all. Usually elected officials aren't very interested in their constituancy, but your local mayor might...it's worth a try, and you might make a difference for the next guy. Remember this: your local parks are established for everyone to enjoy, including you! Good-Luck.

 

[richg]

There is alot of nitwits out there. I tried to get permission from a nearby water dam that used to be a resort area in the 1860, After being put on hold I was told to write a letter to the borough and it would be voted on at the council meeting, well of course it was voted down as they said me with my little metlal detector are to much of threat to the water supply. Yet the people that live in the borough are allowed to fish there. I know the code of ethics but I might just go there anyway.

 

[abird]

here in the town of union in broome conty ny, the parks dept says you cant and will chase you out, but ive discovered a way around it,, went down to the town hall and they issue a permit, they still try to kick me out but i just wave the permit, and have had to be a assh le about it with different rangers and park workers. even the people at town hall cant get there stories right, so my advice try,, say if its a city park try looking for a permit at say code enforcement,or some other dept it worked for me.

 

[coinshooter]

Hey trgrams,
That would also be a great way to get permission to hunt other folks yards. You start with your petition and then slowly work your way into talking about their yard and how you bet there even treasure there. Might just work to get you some new hunting spots at the same time and give you a reason to be at their doorstep without feeling too intimidated. 8)

 

[trgams]

Hey trgrams,
That would also be a great way to get permission to hunt other folks yards. You start with your petition and then slowly work your way into talking about their yard and how you bet there even treasure there. Might just work to get you some new hunting spots at the same time and give you a reason to be at their doorstep without feeling too intimidated. 8)

A very good point indeed!!!

 

[ashton9]

Thanks, and keep the info coming. I like abird's permit solution. Why not go and get a special permit if you can, worst case is the city office delcine's the permit. The good old grab a clipboard and poise as a volunteer looks like an excellent idea also.

 

[allyourbase]

abird,

What type of permit were you issued? How long was it good for?
Was it specific to metal detecting?

thanks
ayb

 

[coinshooter]

There is a negative side to the permit thing though. You could put the idea into their head if they didn't have one and they may set up specific rules for it's use and charge you enough of a wage on a yearly basis that it might cramp your style. Kind of like a fishing license. They used to be cheap, but as counties look for new sources of money, they can come up with all sorts of new ideas to steal $ right out of your pocket. Don't give them any new ideas. Haven't you ever heard the saying, "It's better to ask for forgiveness than permission". In the case of a city park, I think this could apply. In the case of a civil war battlefield, this wouldn't. I have a firend who used to hunt a local park quite regularly. He would talk with the gardeners and buy them either a six pack or some doughnuts (depending on the time of day), then would give them his business card and say,"Hey, when you get around to removing or heavily trimming those bushes, give me a call". They did and he found a really nice morgan $ as a result. He has also made friends with a few of the rangers by spending time chatting with them. When another ranger came up to him and told him he couldn't hunt there he said, "Oh really?, I was just talking with Joe Schmoe (the other ranger) and he said it was fine." The first ranger found out that the second one had said it was fine and said, "Well, I guess if Joe said it was fine, then I I guess it is". I've been down there tons of times without ever being hassled. One other way that will help your case is to pick uo (or take with you) some old razor blades or some other dangerous items like a knife, or a sharp piece of metal. When they tell you there is no hunting there, pull out your items and tell them that you are cleaning the park of these dangerous things (don't pick up any needles as they can give you hepatitis just by touching them). Maybe they'll let you stay at this point. 8)

 

[ashton9]

I thought about doing the asking for the forgives idea also Coinshooter. I would bet not to many city park workers are around after 5:00pm. Just avoid the softball games and crowds and such after hours, and I bet nobody will notice.

 

[abird]

No its a metal detecting permit,,good for one year,,got it at the town offices not the parks office,,park says i cant,,town give me a permit that says i can. try to find a way around your problem

 

[angeltrash1]

well i went yesterday and spoke with the director of the parks in deer park,texas - he was nice and said to go ahead and detect all i wanted but just don't dig no 6 ft. holes - as soon as i get free from work i'm heading out there.

 

[ashton9]

Thanks AngelTrash & ABird, good info. Let us know if you get harassed AngelTrash. I still like ABird's written paper. Wave that permit!

 

[diggummup]

Here's a funny one,Broward co. parks&rec.dept..1st.e-mail,you are permitted to use metal detector in county parks.2nd.e-mail you can use metal detector but you are not allowed to dig.Gee thanks,well at least this is florida,alot of sand,"what do you mean officer,i'm not digging i'm brushing the sand out of the way."HA-HA-HA-HA-HA-HA-HA-HA

 

[ashton9]

I guess I'll carry some Tulip Bulbs with me and say Gee Officer, I'm just beatifying the park.

 

[Lowbatts]

One thing you can bet on when talking to any bureaucrat or administrative personnel, if you ask for any permission you will not get it w/o a tit-for-tat. Encountered city engineers while hunting in the park where work was ongoing over the years. In this town 2 out of 3 that approached were curious and showed no negative response and were positively influenced by my interaction with them. One approached and was mildly abusive but I informed him on the history of public service in America and his role as a public servant, not a public master. He relented when I offered to let him carry off the broken glass, nails, aluminum shards and mish-mash in my junk pouch.

On another occassion the kid and I were being filmed by a park district official during a carnie cleanup and I approached him in a friendly manner and the more kindness I showed him, the more power he assumed until, blaming me for all the divots in the ground, even the holes made by the carinval rides and attractions, he crossed my line. So I let him have it. We were surface hunting, not digging anything. But I threw (figuratively speaking) five pounds of everything from the shredded cans to the SHARP-PONTED curtain hangers (that carnies leave behind in the hundreds) at him, along with the drug -use items including syringes, crack pipes from the carnies and gave him the public service message. He relented, apologized and the nearby local P.D. watched in amusement.

Moral of the story, don't fight city hall, wait until they come out their rat holes and face off with them in public, watch them scurry off like the roaches they are. DO NOT get timid with public servants unless you enjoy the concept of living in some People's Republic where only approved activities are allowed.

All this said, if it says no trespassing or is behind a fence, respect that, also recognize that city hall is a very local thing where people worry about local attitudes, make sure your's is bigger than those who want to deny you. The Feds however are a very different story, STAY AWAY!!! The State also takes much more understanding on our part and you must become familiar with those laws that affect us and respect those you cannot change or work around.

While I enjoy my self-described status as a militant metal detectorist, I won't give anyone an excuse to nail me. It just don't make sense to take something fun and make it criminal. Always be prepared to demonstrate the positive side of your hobby! I have a five gallon bucket in the trunk that gets emptied when full of the broken glass, razor blades, screws, nails and other dangerous items that I routinely recover, rather than attempt to discrimnate out. Those items you discrimante out may just serve a higher purpose in the end than that one great coin or piece of jewelry you find. Especially when those are things you most commonly share with your local elected reprehensibles!

Good Luck and Happy Hunting!

 

[diggummup]

Putnam co.,Tn. Cookeville area :I spoke with the senior v.p. at the chamber of commerce.I was told she could not find any local statutes preventing the use of metal detectors.She then told me to enjoy my stay in Cookeville and told me to call her if I need any further assistance.Then, I had her e-mail me, her statements and info.ownloading a copy to bring with me, just in case I do get hassled by anyone.wish me luck!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[Lasivian]

I've been toying with the idea of a detectorist "code of conduct".

Have some cards printed up listing what we do, and how we do it.

If we could hand them out when we get hassled folks might get a different idea, that there are "good" and "bad" detectorists.

 

[Lowbatts]

Hey Lasivian, are there god and bad bureaucrats?!? Hmm... I always refer to the lawman. If he says it's ok, and he is after all the one who has to enforce it, then it's ok! No matter what your hobby or endeavor, asking city hall if it's ok is like telling them there's something people are doing that hasn't been taxed yet!