wanted to bring everyones attention to this

[Monolyth]

Hello,

As probably many of you do when not detecting or involved in other activities I like to read or get involved in forum posts for entertainment, learn something new or check out others finds. I post on this forum and others as well. This was of particular interest to me posted on another forum, I think it should be of interest to you to as it deals with what could be the future of this hobby we share.

I will post the content made by original poster and a link to it if you would like to see the discussion that followed:
thread link; http://metaldetectingforum.com/showthread.php?t=34857

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So, i have been posting adds of craigslist to get permission to detect peoples property. i have gotten several hits, but today i got an email that im not quite sure how to take. anyways. what are your thoughts. i almost feel like i have been scolded.

Here is the craigslist add

I am lookin for new spots to use my metal detector. I prefer yards or lots, and will remove all trash I uncover. I am mainly interested in older coins and tokens. Almost every yard or grass strip holds coins and relics that are just waiting to be found. I don't leave holes and will leave all sites in as found or better condition. So if you have a lot or yard older than the 1950's and don't mind, I would love the privilege to metal detect your place. This is purely my hobby. I will answer all emails. I prefer the Bellingham/Everson area but will travel if my schedule permits. Thanks for lookin!


Here is the email i got today

Greetings,

We recently noticed your advertisement on Craigslist. Though we have not heard from you directly, as the state agency tasked with protecting archaeological sites and resources for the inspiration and enrichment of the citizens of Washington, we felt it would be productive to contact you directly.


It is our understanding that you are interested in metal detecting lots or yards over 50 years old to find coins, tokens, or relics. Items over 50 years old, produced or modified by humans, below the surface of the ground and submerged under water, are archaeological objects. Archaeological objects, and archaeological sites and resources, are protected resources under state statutes.

In addition, per RCW 27.53.060, a permit is required for any person to knowingly and willfully remove, alter, dig into, excavate or remove an archaeological object or site in the state of Washington.

This statute applies to both public and private lands. Even with landowner permission, a permit from DAHP is required. The permit processes requires a research design, a plan for care and cleaning of the recovered objects, the commitment to write a professional, technical report, and appropriate curation of the artifacts and data recovered. The permit process also requires DAHP to afford interested parties an opportunity to comment on the proposed excavation project, prior to its commencement. These parties typically include affected Indian Tribes, local government, historical societies, landowners, and archaeological peers. Permit application forms are available on our website at http://www.dahp.wa.gov/pages/Archaeology/Permitting.htm.

Failure to obtain such a permit, or failure to comply with any permit conditions, can result in civil penalties in an amount up to $5000 per violation, restoration costs and investigative costs. Furthermore, if burials, cairns, or glyptic records are involved, RCW 27.44 allows the affected Indian Tribe to file claims for damages and emotional distress.

Excavation permits are granted to professional archaeologists who meet the requirements of that definition under RCW 27.53.030(8). While we understand metal detecting is your hobby, much damage has been done to the state’s archaeological resources by hobbyists.

There are legal ways to experience the excitement of discovery of our historic past. The Forest Service operates a program entitled “Passport in Time.” This program affords volunteers the opportunity to participate in real archaeological excavations with professional archaeologists. This includes historic period sites as well as prehistoric. The website link is: http://www.passportintime.com/.

There are some Washington State Parks that are open to metal detecting. Please see the following link for more information: http://www.parks.wa.gov/activities/

Please do not hesitate to contact me if you have any questions about the content of this letter. You can find additional information about archaeology in Washington, as well as the laws regarding archaeological excavations on our website at www.dahp.wa.gov.

Sincerely,



Stephenie Kramer
Assistant State Archaeologist
(360) 586-3083
Stephenie.kramer@dahp.wa.gov
__________________

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[Sandman]

That was typical Archie talk. We support these blood suckers with our tax money as each state thinks they have to have a State Archaeological Office with untold staff. Technically you are not supposed to dig a hole to plant a tree on your own property.

[lafatlife]

How can they say on private land as well. If you own the land then you own what is in it as well.

[Sandman]

How can they say on private land as well. If you own the land then you own what is in it as well.

No you don't........If you read your deed it does not give you the mineral rights, and alot of other things. You have no right to things of an archeology nature as these belong to the state.

[ivan salis]

that is the "new wave" archie ideal --that the state owns all things over 50 years old IN THE GROUND of the entire state (of washington) --no matter if its in public or private land --- any "natural item that has been altered by man (arrowheads ,ect) or any man made type items in the ground (old coins , relics ,ect) is the "states" property ---the state employee archies call everything 50 years old or older "artifacts" to "legalize" this "grab" -- even a plain ole mere wheat cent --since they were last made in 1958 * is "by the 50 year old rule" illegal to find and keep on your own land --its a "artifact" now --in a few years all the 1964 and before silver coins will be "artifacts" as well---

so say your looking for ***modern coins ***--- those less than 50 years old --because IF YOUR LOOKING FOR COINS "OVER" 50 YEARS OLD --you need PERMITS --YADA ,YADA,YADA --SO DO NOT LOOK FOR "OLD" COINS --- look for "NEW COINS" -- BECAUSE THERE ARE NO PERMITS REQUIRED FOR THAT . yet thank god .

on non dated items -- how can one tell how old a item is ? I have no ideal of how old that 3 ringer bullet is --- because gee I'm not a "trained archie like you are" -- me so stupid , me no know how to figger dates of "stuff" duh. -- prove "i know" its --50 years or older --( one person can not "prove" what another knows --unless the first agrees that they know it --- duhhhh I do not even know my name hardly) --they want to treat me like I'm a drooling idiot --fine -- I'll be one. --duh.

[sniffer]

I personally wouldn't worry about it. it sounds like a do gooder fresh out of college with a new job trying to make a splash
if they actually pressed any charges for digging up an old penny or dime, the DA would be looking for a new job because he was dumb enough to try to prosecute this and cost his district big bucks for an old dime

[thrillathahunt]

Question to Washington State archaeologist:

While detecting in one of your beautiful Washington State Parks that are "open" to metal detecting, what is one to do when one unearths a 1959 Lincoln Memorial cent while engaging in one's hobby?

1. Put it back where one found it?
2. Bring it in to your local office for cataloging?
3. Put it in one's pocket and walk away feeling like a common criminal?

Just wondering?

[sniffer]

no, let spend around 10,000 dollars to clean it, preserve it, and then put it on display likes it's a vanishing species

[Shambler]

Get everyone in WA to send her Wheat Pennies and Mercury Dimes COD. She can curate them.

[Woodland Detectors]

That was typical Archie talk. We support these blood suckers with our tax money as each state thinks they have to have a State Archaeological Office with untold staff. Technically you are not supposed to dig a hole to plant a tree on your own property.

she must be bored

[ford7379trucks]

lol give them a call. I think they think your digging big. I'm not sure about your state but i believe unless your excavating the sight or find something over a certain value your fine.

[vayank54]

Some jurisdictions will prosecute for detecting, even your own property. I've mentioned it before but the city I used to live in in northern VA had an ordinance against metal detecting. A friend of mine was arrested and fined for digging on his own lot. I was detained for digging a construction site even though I had the owner's permission. The only way I got off was I knew the police chief and he heard it when the called my name in on the radio. I got off with a warning but was told if I got caught again I would be arrested.

[marinedad]

sounds like you opened a big can of worms over there. when i detect i try to draw as little attention as possible. its too bad big brother feels that way about 50+year old stuff, what about my well water, do they own that too? its a crazy world we live in now.

[ivan salis]

those vile spawn of the devil * zinc cents came out in 1983 --so in 2033 a mere 23 years from now --they will be 50 year old "artifacts" -- that need "professional preserving" by your state archies --so start saving those "wonderful" zinc cents for the "future" now --so you can "carpet bomb" them with em.

[bigtim1973]

I would just reply to her email and tell her to kiss your ass!!! How is she going to know who you are out the detecting anyway? Besides you will be looking on private property not state parks or nature preserves!!!! How is she even going to find out? Tim

[jmaryt]

That was typical Archie talk. We support these blood suckers with our tax money as each state thinks they have to have a State Archaeological Office with untold staff. Technically you are not supposed to dig a hole to plant a tree on your own property.

you wouldn't be a representative of that office!..would you?
(hot damn!)..never imagined not owning what's in the ground on me own land!

(h.h!)
j.t.

[geo4472]

so does that mean if the land has been in someones family for lets just say 150 yrs and their great great grandfather burried a chest full of money or an old clay pot full of money you get fined and they take what is rightfuly yours sounds like a buch of bs and i thought communism was dying out

[vayank54]

so does that mean if the land has been in someones family for lets just say 150 yrs and their great great grandfather burried a chest full of money or an old clay pot full of money you get fined and they take what is rightfuly yours sounds like a buch of bs and i thought communism was dying out

In the case of where I used to live, Yes.. They had a couple" ordinance officers" that rode or walked around just looking for any violations. In my case the city manager saw me and called the police. Yes I agree it's B.S. but they were doing it and as far as I know still are.

[Montauk3]

Wouldn't it be interesting if there were a lot of archies bones found and displayed in museums?

We are sounding more and more like the moroons in england every day. 1776 part two is needed.

[wwace]

Yep, typical archie bs. I would take a copy of the email and approach your city council. They cannot claim ownership of every man made or altered object that is buried. Metal detecting in areas not associated with known archeological sites does absolutely no harm as long as we follow guidelines. Or take all your old bottle caps and pull tabs and send them to her as they are state property and you wouldn't want to wrongfully take something that was so valuable to the state. Washington has certainly gone downhill since I left. Regardless I would take action of some sort to protect your rights to pursue your hobby.