Sometimes honesty doesnt seem like the best way

[djm of PA]

Sometimes honesty doesn't seem like the best way

A few weeks back I was approached by someone who wanted me to detect her yard. After hearing about the property I thought WOAH and said Heck Yeah! I spent about 3 hrs there and then left, believing I'd be good to detect there again after a nice rain. I got home, looked at my finds and I honestly debated whether or not to show them all my finds. I took two sets of pics and debated for a good hour before finally deciding honesty was the best policy. Emailed the pics and info on the large cent, mercury dime and wheats that I found. Also gave info about the key and necklace pendant I found. Owner asked for the pendant, which I sent to her, no questions asked and included the old key with name/address on it....just because I thought it would be neat for them to have an old key to their house. A few weeks went by and I emailed again yesterday to see if any day this week would work to get back in there and search now that we have had a soaking rain. Turns out the husband now wants a detector and has decided that he doesn't want me in his yard because I am taking all the good stuff. I truly hope he buys a $100 detector and doesn't find squat
Then when they die off, i'll hit the new owners up and get back on the land

So.....lesson learned on my part.....if they don't ask....I won't tell. I hate being that way but I also won't stand for losing spots out of pure jealousy.
How do y'all handle things like this?

 

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[sniffer]

Re: Sometimes honesty doesn't seem like the best way

you're going to get answers both ways. one thing you have to remember, they allowed you on their property, therefore anything you find is theirs. some people will react the way they did, others won't bother as they think it's a waste of their time. everybody likes to keep what they find, but the thrill of finding something cool or neat gives a real thrill. sometimes people will give you permission and then retract it when you get there, it's happened to me. I'm just happy to md a new place. what would you have done if you didn't find anything? would you go back? would you tell them you didn't find anything? it's all relative to the situation.
I'd just move on and let it roll off.

 

[Lowbatts]

Re: Sometimes honesty doesn't seem like the best way

Yeah you got stung. The hard way too!

Some of the time people will follow you around, wanting to know what you dig and will either:
a. expect it's immediate turn around to their pocket or
b. think it's cool but not give a hoot if you keep it.

Other times it seems they couldn't care less about whether you find something or leave something.

I will show folks what I've found up front at the time, especially the first good find. Then their response dictates whether or not I move on immediately or stick around.

Yep, I too am waiting for couple die-offs or new owners on properties.

 

[Tom_in_CA]

Re: Sometimes honesty doesn't seem like the best way

It depends on whether it was agreed upon ahead of time, that you must turn in all finds (or give them first dibs, etc...). If nothing was said either way, then I don't know that you'd be under any moral obligation to line up your finds for their picking and choosing. But if you *did* tell them ahead of time that you'd be giving them choice on whatever they wanted, then yes, you would be under an ethical obligation to keep your word. You do not say if you guys did, or did not, pre-agree to any such arrangement. So hard to comment on this unless you provide that detail.

If it was agreed to, then my experience is that most often, property and homeowners usually don't greedily take everything anyhow (even if they said beforehand they would). They usually ....... if you ask "can I have that one token for my collection?" or whatever, will generally say "sure". But yes, occasionally there is a property owner who wants it all, and abruptly puts a stop to searches when they think you're gonna get rich in their front yard (because perhaps previously they had images of just a few common pennies and such). I still would not let that stop me from hunting, because it's still fun to hunt, even if you have to turn things in. You can always get pix for boasting priveleges. And as I say, it's rare that anyone is that awkward about it (but yes, sometimes does happen).

 

[TerryC]

Re: Sometimes honesty doesn't seem like the best way

Honesty is ALWAYS the best way. Win, lose, or draw, your reputation is the only thing you can take to the grave with you. Make it something you would want others to remember. TTC

 

[Sandman]

Re: Sometimes honesty doesn't seem like the best way

I agree with Tom of CA on this. I've hunted many yards and things were different way back when. Now with all the TV shows about treasure hunting everyone thinks they might have lots of gold coins buried on their property from them watching all the metal detector advertisements. If they want to go buy a detector and try their luck I say good luck to them. There are lots of land where you can still search and unless your not over lapping sweeps by nearly 50%, your missing stuff anyway. Most owners don't care for taking the items you found even though they might know it belongs to them because it was on their property. They are just curious what you found and hope you didn't dig up any sprinkler heads. As for ever going back you could improve your chances by providing an apple pie or offering to do some chores for the privilege of using their property. I used to do this when deer season came around and farmers are kind of protective of "their" deer.

 

[jeff of pa]

Re: Sometimes honesty doesn't seem like the best way

I'd Write it off as 1 in a hundred.
this world is made up of all kinds.

Of course you could have offered to teach him to use
his detector when he buys one.
just tell him they are only $1500 for a good one

 

[m bryan]

Re: Sometimes honesty doesn't seem like the best way

Honesty is ALWAYS the best way. Win, lose, or draw, your reputation is the only thing you can take to the grave with you. Make it something you would want others to remember. TTC

Well said Terry......

 

[djm of PA]

Re: Sometimes honesty doesn't seem like the best way

Thanks for the replies all............to answer the question of a few. The owner never asked to see anything I found, in fact, she invited me over to hunt while they were away. Permission to hunt the land was given, therefore anything found belonged to me according to an attorney and the treasure trove law(friend of mine....I asked him the PA law prior to ever getting a detector), unless of course it would have been significant, in which case I could never not give 50% to the site owner. That would only be fair. The law says: Treasure trove goes to the finder, unless the finder is trespassing. If the finder
is trespassing, it goes to the locus owner.
I sent the email with pics as a courtesy, one which I will no longer extend unless asked by the land owner.

In a shocking twist of events, I received a call last night from my taxidermist and on the same day I lost a very nice site, I gained a MUCH better one. House built in 1748 or so, housed high ranking soldiers near the Fort Halifax area in PA prior to the war and the owner has turned down dozens of detectorists over the years. Great big yard, carriage houses, monster sized main house, 2 acres. Turns out my taxidermist's cousin owns the house and we've become close, so he figured he do me a solid and get me on the land. Supposed to call the owner tonight and setup the terms. Thus far the only terms are no one else allowed on and no holes left unplugged.

karma? I'd like to think so

 

[diggummup]

Re: Sometimes honesty doesn't seem like the best way

Thanks for the replies all............to answer the question of a few. The owner never asked to see anything I found, in fact, she invited me over to hunt while they were away. Permission to hunt the land was given, therefore anything found belonged to me according to an attorney and the treasure trove law(friend of mine....I asked him the PA law prior to ever getting a detector), unless of course it would have been significant, in which case I could never not give 50% to the site owner. That would only be fair. The law says: Treasure trove goes to the finder, unless the finder is trespassing. If the finder
is trespassing, it goes to the locus owner.
I sent the email with pics as a courtesy, one which I will no longer extend unless asked by the land owner.

In a shocking twist of events, I received a call last night from my taxidermist and on the same day I lost a very nice site, I gained a MUCH better one. House built in 1748 or so, housed high ranking soldiers near the Fort Halifax area in PA prior to the war and the owner has turned down dozens of detectorists over the years. Great big yard, carriage houses, monster sized main house, 2 acres. Turns out my taxidermist's cousin owns the house and we've become close, so he figured he do me a solid and get me on the land. Supposed to call the owner tonight and setup the terms. Thus far the only terms are no one else allowed on and no holes left unplugged.

karma? I'd like to think so

http://forum.treasurenet.com/index.php/topic,420548.0.html Maybe a suggestion?

 

[djm of PA]

Re: Sometimes honesty doesn't seem like the best way

I thought the same thing, but the cousin said the owner is adamant that no one else is allowed on. He apparently isn't "thrilled" about me being there, but owes his cuz a favor and this is it. I'm going to work on him tonight. would be an amazing place to take Nahabit, no doubt about it.

 

[maipenrai]

Re: Sometimes honesty doesn't seem like the best way

I have never had this problem, simply because I have never asked a private property owner if I could detect, just hunt public land, but of course that time will come around when searching for a cache.

I am also a scuba diver, and many times, while inspecting a boat or ship, someone will come around and ask if I can do a quick of their boat, or untangle their anchor. I always say "sure, but this is my job, and I will bill you for it. I have spent too much money on equipment and training to it for free.

I know this isnt quite the same a metal detecting, but there are a lot of people that ask for your service, or you offer your service, and for free. Thats up to you, but I feel I have a lot of time and money invested in this hobby, and do not feel that I "Owe" someone this service. And when you think about it, its not a "win-win" situation at all. You ask for permission to search a property, do your search, and find nothing, so you are disappointed, and the owner thinks you pocketed "his" treasures, so he is disappointed, and no matter what you offer him, he will still think you got more than you are showing. I have seen many of this post, and the only conclusion is that the owner thinks you have kept the best stuff, so now he will go down to Wall Mart and get a detector, and keep all the treasure for himself.

 

[Bart@Big Boys Hobbies]

Re: Sometimes honesty doesn't seem like the best way

Honesty is ALWAYS the best way. Win, lose, or draw, your reputation is the only thing you can take to the grave with you. Make it something you would want others to remember. TTC

 

[ZR2guy]

Re: Sometimes honesty doesn't seem like the best way

I have always wondered about the possible "situations" that could arise from hunting someone's private property. I have to admit that if I had someone approach me about metal detecting my old homestead, I would wonder about the value of the possible finds and should I ask for a percentage. Actually , how do you approach a homeowner about hunting their property when you know that items of value could be found? I am not saying to be deceiving but I am sure that some if not most owners may ask ; "what will you do if you find something of value on my property?" I mean, we all like to keep everything we find but at the same time you do want to show your appreciation for the permission to hunt private poperty.

 

[maipenrai]

Re: Sometimes honesty doesn't seem like the best way

That is the whole problem. What is fair for everyone. But if you go up to someone and ask to detect their property, the first thing that might come to their mind, is: Whats he really looking for, is there a treasure here? After all, it is THEIR property, and THEIR stuff you are finding. I would not hunt someones property, just for the fun of it, and give everything to the owner. How would you feel, after 3 hrs of digging, and only finding a dollar in clad, then the owner says "thank you, I knew I lost that last year" If you brought a pre written contract for them to sign, that would also get their suspicions up. And anyway, would this contract be legal, or would you need a witness also? Its not like on the beach, in neutral territory, and someone ask you to find their ring, then its easy to make an agreement, although even then, if you dont find the ring, they might think you found it and just put it in your pocket.

Im sure the situation is not as bad as I imagine, but that would sure ruin my day if I did find something very valuable, and the owner wanted it all. You dont find a cache every day, this might be the only one in a lifetime.

 

[djm of PA]

Re: Sometimes honesty doesn't seem like the best way

maipenrai, that is the reason why we have the treasure trove laws. I am not forced to give ANYTHING back if I so choose as long as I was not trespassing. Not that I could be that way, but if someone really wanted to get ignorant, I'd have that right. That is the main reason why I always gain email contact with the person before going to their property.....written and legally binding contract showing proof that I was not trespassing

you are right, I don't and won't do this for free, however if there is a family heirloom or obviously inscribed item that belongs to the family or prior generations of their family, by all means I will hand it over without question. Same if I was brought there to find an item specifically.
In this instance I was ASKED to do the yard because they just wanted to know what was there. Personally I think they expected me to strike out which is why they didn't even bother being home while I was there.

In the end, I've been the bigger person and have offered to give the man lessons if he does indeed buy a detector, and as stated earlier, sent them 2 items that I found and thought they would like. Lesson learned, experience noted and another largie for my collection. It won't make me shy away from any other private properties in the future, just will change how outgoing I am in the end unless asked.

 

[tomjiggy]

Re: Sometimes honesty doesn't seem like the best way

I'd say you came out pretty well in an ok situation. Yes, you didn't get to keep it all, and it sux that they denied any future access to the yard. You know it isn't finished and will probably produce more. I hope, for your sake, that the guy buys some cheap detector and has no luck with it. I hope he also ticks his wife off by digging up the front yard in his endeavors and she tells him he can't dig in it ever again other than to get proffessional landscaping done to make it look better(would serve him right for thinking it's as "easy" as you probably made it look). And, finally, I hope that he eventually invites you back to at least share in your hunt in his yard.
All in all you were able to add an LC to your collection, and we(particularly myself) can't all say we've done that recently. I need to get out more....really getting the itch now.

 

[Lakemonster]

Re: Sometimes honesty doesn't seem like the best way

Honesty is the best policy..... how you use it is your prerogative.

When it comes to metal detecting, Ive found that "shoot, shovel and shut up." works well.

So... when I find a Walker half, 2 merc dimes and 4 Indian heads. Well, I can be honest in saying I found .74 cents.

Lets face it, if you got permission to fish a private lake.... is it right to then be told to leave your catch on the way out once they see what you have?

 

[calisdad]

Re: Sometimes honesty doesn't seem like the best way

Honesty is ALWAYS the best way. Win, lose, or draw, your reputation is the only thing you can take to the grave with you. Make it something you would want others to remember. TTC

 

[froggy38383]

Re: Sometimes honesty doesn't seem like the best way

I usually make some kind of agreement with the landowner prior to detecting. In many instances here people tell me "keep what you find".

Depends where you live who you deal with, every instance is different.