Need advice, getting very discouraged.

[Kosh]

Hi folks. I have had my detector for 4 months and have done a ton of research. I have found what I think are good 1700s cellar holes that are virgin ground. I have watched all the videos, read articles and even read 2 books on the hobby and how best to go about it.

I bought after much research a Garret 1350 and a garret pin pointer. Now This detector works great if I am on the beach and want to find tons of clad coins at 1-3 inches all day long. Currently I am at my cellar hole, here is the post regarding it http://forum.treasurenet.com/index.php/topic,456767.0.html

So I am at the cellar hole. Every single time I get a strong silver signal and I mean strong, I go over it several times to confirm the reading, get a size and depth via my detector I dig the target and it is ALWAYS a nail. What gives? I bought the detector I did because it was rated as one of the top coin shooter detectors on the market. Why does it always give a false silver reading? After I dig the nail I go over the hole again if the signal is still there I dig and dig and dig using my pin pointer and detector and all I ever find are more dam nails. I have spent at least 3 full days detecting at this site, I have been very diligent, patient and at first was digging every signal. After I dug about 100+ nails and numerous other pieces of trash out of the ground I started to try and discriminate. Nothing changed, every signal that screamed out as a silver coin was dug and there were only nails in the hole.

I have tried adjusting the settings, I have used all the modes. Currently I am in relic mode as it shows every thing other than iron. I have turned the sensitively up and down, neither seems to make a difference. Every time the thing screams silver (usually silver dollar or quarter) I dig and never get anything but iron.

Could my detector be broken or factory defunct in some way? Or is the detector I bought a total piece of well you know?

I don't mean to come off as a killjoy but this digging up nails thing is getting old fast.

 

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[Tom_in_CA]

Can you hook up with a proficient user in your area, take him out to a sample site like this, and trade off signals to compare? See if he can pass iron, yet isolate a few conductive targets. Conversely, when you get your signals that keep fooling you, have him check before, and see how he "calls" it. And once you have side-by-side conductive verses iron signals to listen to, maybe then you can find out what you're doing wrong.

Because your problem may be in what you're interpretting as "dig" vs "don't dig" signals. And no amount of printed text can convey sounds. They have to be heard, and see the swing of what the other person is trying to isolate, or avoid, etc.... Printed text can never do justice to subjects that involve audio.

The beach might be a different non-comparable site, because odds are, there was/is simply no iron where you're getting easy "clad all day". So .... yeah .... go figure, a cellar hole is going to be riddled with iron, when compared to a lot of beaches. Your machine should pass iron, and not give a good signal on it, provided you're operating it right, and interpretting the audio right.

 

[Sandman]

All detectors read the conductivity of the target. Rusty iron is very conductive and will show up on the meter as silver, but as TOM says the sound will be different from a silver coin. There is nothing wrong with your 1350 You are just relating on the screen to much. Celler holes are the hardest to hunt too.

 

[Tom_in_CA]

"Rusty iron is very conductive and will show up on the meter as silver"

Huh? rusty iron is a very poor conductor sandman. Sometimes larger pieces of cast iron, or round looped iron will "bleed through", but otherwise, he should be able to pass iron all day long. The sound of silver should be WAY different from iron.

But of course I don't use a Garrett 1350. I'm just speaking of discriminators in general. Some are weaker with iron-falses than others. But this doesn't sound like the problem, if he's getting 0% conductive targets and 100% nails.

 

[TerryC]

Kosh. I have been hunting for over 40 years. I believe Tom-in-CA has too. Others on this net will soon pipe in. The SOUND is what counts most! Learn the SOUND! I suggest roping off an area at least 6' by 6' then NAIL IT (a pun, ha ha) till NO signals are sounding. THEN do the planting of good targets AND junk in this plot. True, not the real deal but a good way to learn the SOUND. Do you have at least 100 hours.... good hours, not just playing... on the machine? Do a hard reset on the machine... usually accomplished by pressing the ON button along with another... at the same time. Start from ZERO on the controls and work (learn) one knob at a time. Well, the manual should do better than I can explain and as Tom suggested, latch on to a mentor. That is the BEST step.... for starters! We are here to help... DON'T GIVE UP! TTC

 

[Zodiacdiverdave]

I am not sure about the 1350 and I still fairly new to the hobby so no expert here, but I run my AT Pro with Iron Audio on and discrim at 35 and it seems to do a pretty good job at IDing the iron for me but some times I dig up some iron that didn't trigger the Iron audio. It might drive you nuts but try running with no discrim. and you should hear the iron tones. Now you could loose some goodies that way if you do not dig the iron pieces out, it's up to you.
Dig em all or cherry pick?
ZDD

 

[Lakemonster]

old forged or cut nails give me good signals too. Especially if they are bent. Modern cast nails dont for some reason.

I dig more of them than I care to, but I hate to pass up a silver on edge that gives of a similar signal to those nails.

When Im working an old house location (we dont have cellar holes here), I tend to find the perimeter of the "Iron Minefield" and search outside of it first.

 

[BobinSouthVA]

Now I don't know anything about your machine, but you may want to contact the company for service.

A co-worker bought a whites prizm V that was doing the same thing. Everywhere we would go it would ring out like silver was everywhere while mine was not telling me that and she was digging nothing but nails. She contacted Whites and they sent along instructions on how to crack open the cover and tweak it or reset it.

So just keep in mind, it might be your detector.

 

[Kosh]

Well thank you every one for the advice and words of encouragement. I did to a hard restart on machine and set up some custom settings so I can focus more on the sound instead of relying on the screen. I am a coin collector so I did a bench test with a barber dime, standing lib quarter, silver halves and so on. Now I did notice a distinct sound when these went by. But I then took a piece of junky rusted metal that is part of a 1700s shovel and that also rang out like silver on the first pass, but when it went by the second time (the other way) it sounded off like iron (or similar low tone). So it did not make a consistent tone.

I also took some nails that I had dug, old rusty square, blacksmith made nails and ran them under on the bench test as well (these are some of the nails that were ringing as silver for me). They did not show at all on my custom settings. They showed on the screen as iron and did not ring out as I set the machine up not to read them. BUT will this be different when the nails are in the ground? Especially wet ground?

Another thing I noticed in my bench test was that my platinum wedding band rang out and showed up under the pulltab indicator on my screen. So I added pulltabs to my custom settings. So right now I am set up to see everything from nickle right on up to silver.

I also turned the tone ID on and turned the pitch of the tone UP so it is more distinct. I will experiment with this as I keep plugging way.

Thanks again.

 

[cdv1]

The nails you dug up very well could sound different now they are not in the ground. In the ground, the soil contained rust from the nail being in the ground all those years and your detector no doubt was picking up on the rust halo and nail. You are on the right track now you need to go back out, don't get discouraged and give it another go. As said above, take the time to learn what the detector is telling you. You may have to dig everything until you get a good feel for it but it will happen.

Good luck and HH
Cliff

 

[Tom_in_CA]

Also this may be true of the 1350: When you get suspected iron falses, try momentarily speeding up the swing speed over the exact center of the target (make sure you "x marks the spot" to get the target center). When you momentarily speed up the swing speed, some machines start to give a better response to conductors, and a poorer response to iron. This was more true back in the days before they slowed down the sweep speed with modern marvels. But ...... I notice that even today, if I'm getting some soil that's making rusting bottle caps come alive, that if I put a momentary little "clip" on the swing speed, rusty caps break up, while conductors stay bold. Not sure about the 1350, but it's something you can try. Try it in your air-tests too, and see how swing speed affects target sounds, depth, etc....

 

[DigImust]

These are all useful and well considered bits of advice Kosh. A lot of MDing experience here. However, if after careful trial and error with that 1350 you are still frustrated with nail vs. silver readings, you might want to consider trading up to an E-trac like I did.
Just a friendly suggestion.

 

[TerryC]

A slow swing is best... yet, take a silver dime and pass it past the coil slow then faster. It will sound off "deeper" at the faster speed... go figure! Keep at it! One day, the bulb will light up. Then you will say, "Duh! Why didn't I see that before?" TimC (brother) and I will cover the same area. He will declare it worked out... I will FOLLOW IN HIS FOOTSTEPS... to find silver rings he missed. (Sorry Tim). Just to reiterate... it is the SOUND you must learn. Tape over that display for awhile. Tnx. TTC

 

[goldentruth]

In my oppinion, good advice is to be determined. Stay with it, the more time you put in the more you will get out especially when many have good tips from: "TerryC.", "Chukers", "Sandman", "Kgun" and others. When I started a year and a half ago I dug everything! I payed attention to what I found and tryed to remember what sound it made for that type of item. I figured out the swing speed. My Tesoro is a VLF (Very low frequency) 18KHZ, I found it has to be moving to signal a sound for this type of MD. I phoned the Tesoro tech for advice on settings, he was very happy to share that I put the dual settings on the Nickle/pull tab metal range and settings to accept all metals. I was informed "Nickle setting" will pick up gold jewlery, as gold jewlery will sound as nickle! This way I wont pass up jewlery.
Each target sound I hit makes me excited to see what I found. I dont care it many "Hits" are not gold etc. the real treasure for me is the HUNT! Any valuable items are a bonus. I just keep thinking positive to some time hit some silver dollars or $1, $5, or $10 Gold coins from the 1800's times of past in our old town.
Keep up the good work and have fun, it's a great hobby to be in. Have a great day my friend.

 

[TerryC]

Another hint: WHEREVER people gather... Park benches.... vacant carnival grounds (ask the "old folks")... The American Legion Post #1, Halifax County, NC, gave up a total of $128 to me over a summer's hunt... along with my buddy's totals, a goodly amount... on a 3 acre lot! If a 9 inch paper plate was placed where each coin (clad) was found, you could walk from one end to the other without touching dirt. Only thing that marred the summer was one of my friends was cutting a circle the size of a dinner plate and WHACKING it on his thigh till the coin dropped out. EVERY spot he cut came up the first time the lot was mowed! Ouch! Be gentle. (Ah... 3 acre lot PLUS parking area) TTC

 

[davidfl]

i have been fooled by nails from time to time, not a steady diet of getting fooled but it happens. one thing i have noticed with nails that read good targets is, they pinpoint different than they sound off as x'ed. the nails show up when i cant find the good target, then start to open up my search area, presto, i find the nail a few inches away from where i thought the target should be. my advice would be, slow down be patient, dig repeatable good tones. good finds will come. hope this helps. david

 

[Charlie P. (NY)]

With my F75 detector a faster sweep is usually better at identifying trash (usually gives better depth, too). Nails "bip" at each end if they are horizontal when you "X" over the target and the numeric ID bounces around.

Another trick is to lift the coil as you go back over to pinpoint. Coins fade out gradually while holding the numeric display #, while nails, foil, etc. drop off quickly and sound and display differently as you change coil height.


Aluminum roofing nails? Good luck. Again, they read differently from different sweep angles and, unless vertical, the display hops around.

 

[Sandman]

"Rusty iron is very conductive and will show up on the meter as silver"

Huh? rusty iron is a very poor conductor sandman. Sometimes larger pieces of cast iron, or round looped iron will "bleed through", but otherwise, he should be able to pass iron all day long. The sound of silver should be WAY different from iron.

But of course I don't use a Garrett 1350. I'm just speaking of discriminators in general. Some are weaker with iron-falses than others. But this doesn't sound like the problem, if he's getting 0% conductive targets and 100% nails.

I should have made myself more clear about iron nails reading as silver. I meant most rusty nails have a halo that detector shows as a higher target and it takes a trained ear to tell them as nails. Good headphones will help with this too. Two or more nails in the coils field will be seen as one target.

 

[Michigan Badger]

Back in the old BFO and early TR days we dug everything. That's still a good policy for cellar holes.

As for sounds, you can't count on them. Targets are masked with iron and/or ground mineralization.

We all use discrimination settings/tonal responses at places where digging must be limited but when possible dig it all.

One of my best gold bracelets came out of the ground where my expensive detector sounded and read trash metal. I was bored and dug it anyway. Boy was I shocked!

Don't bank on meters or audio circuitry.

 

[goldentruth]

Kosh, I forgot to mention, I picked up a good magnet at home depot for 10 Bucks, it has a long broom wood type handle. When I get a iorn signal and loose'n up the soil I rub this magnet thru and If It picks up the iorn nails, wire, staple trash, I then identify it quick and move on. Mostly I work not on a lawn type area, I am at the sides of a stream where camp miners once worked. By the way, If the magnet does not pick up the "Target Signal" THEN this gets interesting and I check more into it. (The Magnet is a nail pick-up tool for contractors, mine is a 3 inch diameter x 1 inch.) Many times it saves me from bending down too. Good Luck.