FYI ;TX unlawful detecting areas

[Dimeman]

FYI:

One of the new posters on this forum,Ufester, has posted on another forum, that he has been fined and his new detecting equipment taken from him.
His 2nd time out detecting he went to a city park in Harris County,Texas in Precinct 4, and started detecting.Most parks have a rules and regulations sign post at the entrance, this particular park had such a sign but did not have anything about NO Metal Detecting.So he started detecting.

Within a few minutes a park employee and County Constable had
approaced him and told him he was in violation of the law, and then was quoted the section of the law.In Harris County in Precinct 4 it is unlawful to metal detect in park areas. He was going to pack up and leave and the Constable wrote him up.
He was fined, and his equipment confiscated.

He has contacted legal help and hopes to get his equipment returned.

Here is a list of Harris County,Texas parks in the Precinct 4 that it is against the law to use metal detectors....the other 3 Precincts have no such law against detector useage.

http://www.hcp4.net/Parks/Parks-list.htm

Click on the list on the left to read Park Policies where it states about metal detecting, and also read Rules and Regulations.


I thought park areas were for ALL people to enjoy ALL types of recreational activties.



The Dimeman

 

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[midnightcaller]

Did he, or is he going to contact THE FMDAC? Where do they stand on this stuff? DO they back us up? What dose the FMDAC do?

Midnightcaller

 

[Tom_in_CA]

That is utter cr*p ('scuse my language). I bet he'll have no fines, and stuff returned to him, with an apology. I simply can't believe that a cop, aware that it is not posted, would do that. I've been booted from parks, and never had anything more than a "scram". There is absolutely no excuse for this, unless he was night sneaking a historic monument or something.

I heard of a case where a newbie was arriving at a national park to go camping. He asked the ranger at the kiosk "is metal detecting allowed here?" The ranger asked the fellow, "do you HAVE a metal detector?" The guy says "yeah, it's in the back with my camping gear, why? Can I use it or not?" The ranger repeats, "you mean you have a metal detector right here, with you, now, in the car?". The driver repeats, "yes, why, what's the problem?" The guy had his detector confiscated, and was written up a ticket, and read the riot act, for merely being "in possession" of a detector. The guy fought the ticket, and had the ruling reversed. The judge ended up scolding the park ranger for doing this to a guy who honestly didn't know, and was just in the asking stage, and hadn't even pulled it out of his truck. He got a big apology from the ranger's office.

 

[Tin Nugget]

You know one of the muckety mucks in precinct 4 had something to with that deal.

 

[HotTexas]

I just sent Mr. Jerry an email

Told him I pay taxes just like every one else, and his detector laws is over the top.

but in a nice way

send him one, Thats the only thing we can do is let them know that there out of line.

But Be NICE about it.

Johnny

 

[RUDY2003]

It is strange that Mr. Eversole would not allow responsible MD'ers to hunt the parks here.
I too have just sent Mr. Eversole an email asking him to give us some thought. Using Piggman's latest attempt with Austin, I was also inspired....

Keep safe

 

[John (Ma)]

Seems like there is more and more of this lately.

 

[midnightcaller]

I took a radio into a indain casino ( long interesting story ) they took it away from me but could not give me a fine or press charges.

Per my lawer it has to be posted for them to enforce it. got the radio back,after 6 weeks

they would also take away your cell phone if they saw you using it inside the casino. I had to ask how thye could legally do that if they don't have it posted? that was back in 1998.

they gave me a perment ban but my lawyer says that is only good for a year ( I could careless ) I went back in 2006 after 10 yrs and every body had a cell phone so I don't know if they can enforce that any more or if thye just gave up
Midnightcaller

 

[diggerfororo]

I don't know about Texas for sure but I think this would apply to all states. Municipal gov. pass ordinances, counties and states pass laws. laws do not have to be posted but ordinances DO. If The city or any local goverment has an ordinance prohibiting metal detecting on park property it must be posted at the site to be enforcable. I got in trouble for drinking beer in a local park. The officer who was going to site us was told by another officer that this area was not posted even though the city had an ordanance so he could not give us a ticket. Sounds like Someone need to feel the POWER

 

[Rob66]

All I know is... if you take my machine, I will have you number and fight you till there was no tomorrow.I hope he got all the party names and badge #.....What a bum wrap!!!! Feel really bad for the guy.

I might had to pulled a,

"I have this incurable and highly contages skin condition" for you on warning and saftly........ but go ahead and take my stuff it's all yours......."

 

[teverly]

Hate to see it happen..and even thought i do not agree with happened to him,they should have just let him pack up and leave.
You must always check the laws.I do not think that that an ordinance has to be posted to be enforced.Almost every city has noise ordinances that are enforced and they do not post signs.
Law or ordinance it can be enforced..and ignorance of the law will not be an excuse.
Having said that i also agree that they are city parks and as long as you are not doing any damage you should be allowed to detect.

 

[Dimeman]

Hate to see it happen..and even thought i do not agree with happened to him,they should have just let him pack up and leave.
You must always check the laws.I do not think that that an ordinance has to be posted to be enforced.Almost every city has noise ordinances that are enforced and they do not post signs.
Law or ordinance it can be enforced..and ignorance of the law will not be an excuse.
Having said that i also agree that they are city parks and as long as you are not doing any damage you should be allowed to detect.

A noise ordinance would be like a disturbing the peace. It usually bothers people.
Can detecting be disturbing the peace if you aren't making noise and NOT bothering anyone?

It wasn't on the "Rules" sign which every park has the same sign...in all the precincts. On the website for Precinct 4 under "Park Policies" is shows-- no detecting. So if someone gets fined under a disobeyed "Rules and Regulations" code.....which actually isn't UNDER Rules and Regulations, it is under Park Policies........who was in the wrong??

I read on some posts where some cities you can't even detect in the totlots, because of the holes that some detectorists have left. In these cities,have you ever seen kids in totlots digging in the gravelstones or the dirt?? They don't fill up their holes, why don't they get ticketed or fined?

And yes the Constable should have said "you can't detect in the Precinct 4 parks, you should leave" and also tell the guy if he sees him detecting again, he will then be in trouble.

All I know is... if you take my machine, I will have you number and fight you till there was no tomorrow.I hope he got all the party names and badge #.....What a bum wrap!!!! Feel really bad for the guy.

I might had to pulled a,

"I have this incurable and highly contages skin condition" for you on warning and saftly........ but go ahead and take my stuff it's all yours......."

That is a good one.........that dreaded very contaigious disolving skin disease.....

 

[teverly]

There have been threads posted several times about asking permission,checking the laws ect......the point is regardless if it is noise,weeds,or whatever they can enforce them.
Even though i do not agree with what happened,if there is an ordanance it does not matter..they being the city or the constable,or whomever decide what they will enforce i guess.
And i agree that you see kids digging holes or peoples dogs digging holes that are left open,and nothing is done about it....and it seems they just want to pick on detectorist for some reason......

 

[Dimeman]

There have been threads posted several times about asking permission,checking the laws ect......the point is regardless if it is noise,weeds,or whatever they can enforce them.
Even though i do not agree with what happened,if there is an ordanance it does not matter..they being the city or the constable,or whomever decide what they will enforce i guess.
And i agree that you see kids digging holes or peoples dogs digging holes that are left open,and nothing is done about it....and it seems they just want to pick on detectorist for some reason......

On the Houston City website, there is nothing at all about no detectors in city parks,even in the parks section of the website..so if I look on the city website and it does NOT say anything about no detecting and I detect in a city park, because I looked ON the website and it showed nothing about detecting in city parks..and had NO specifics about any precincts.

How can a Constable fine someone and confiscate their equipment, when the detectorist is in a city park Why don't they go ticket some of old ladies walking too fast in the malls :P

 

[Tom_in_CA]

No Dimeman, they can't do that. It's utterly unjustified, on several counts: 1) As you say, it's not on the books, not even addressed, mentioned, etc.... Ie.: if you approach an intersection, and there's no signs forbidding U-turns, then you can assume you can make a U-turn. 2) It's not posted on a sign at the park.

Now I'm not saying that a cop couldn't make an individual decision, in the absence of a law, to boot someone from detecting. Like maybe he's making a mess or whatever. They DO have the liberty to interpret the laws to fit situations (otherwise everyone would be arguing semantics all the time), BUT they should've given him a warning, PERIOD.

Teverly, you say "Almost every city has noise ordinances that are enforced and they do not post signs". I can speak from experience on this, since I own a street sweeper company: We have run afoul of noise ordinances all the time, d/t our back-pack blowers in the middle of the night We only get warnings, but one time, DID get a ticket (of course, nothing is posted about this, you're right). We merely responded to the court date, told the judge we had rescheduled the shopping center on our route to an earlier time, so he dismissed it. Point is, for a thing like noise ordinance, which isn't posted, nothing is confiscated, and there are no fines. Now if I had not responded to the ticket, or had gone out and done repeat noise violations there, THEN I would have gone past the warnings to actual fines. So I do think that noise violations can't be compared to what happened to this guy. I believe it DOES have to be posted, or else you have to be given a warning, before something legal. At all parks I've been to, there's a sign at the entrance (that no one reads), which has stuff to the effect of "no alcohol, dogs on leashe, .... " etc...

 

[diggerfororo]

Hi Dimeman:

Like I said in an earlier post. Before they can fine you or take your equipment they would have to have it posted. But that dosen't mean they can't try. It would not stand in court, but who wants to go to court for nothing. It sounds like this officer wanted you to know "HE" was incharge. Sometimes we just have to bite our tongues and go on.

Les