A question of ethics - old abandoned graveyards

[DeepseekerADS]

I'm aware of a long abandoned graveyard, dating probably back to the early 1800's. There are as many as 50 grave sites featuring only ground stones as markers. Many of these are probably relatives of my family.

As a person of faith and ethics, I'm not a grave robber.

But then this is so very tempting.

Any thoughts on this?

 

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[Peyton Manning]

Loved ones have left things on gravestones in memory of the dead,
I would not want to be the person to take those

 

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[gunsil]

I live in a very old area where there are many churches going back to the early 1700s. Many of these churches have ancient graves right on the church grounds. When I began hunting in 1970 I went to many of these old churches and asked permission to hunt the church grounds. EVERY pastor or minister (no early Catholic churches here) told me to hunt away, have fun, and said the grave area was OK to hunt around in too since they knew I was only looking for old coins and artifacts and that my detector would not hit much below eight inches. I have not been struck down by lightning and have no remorse, and I did find a lot of large cents. Back in the day folks picnicked at churches and kids played among the graves, people weren't uptight about hanging around the graves or letting their kids play there. Nowadays I think some people might get the wrong idea when seeing a person MDing in an old cemetery so it could stigmatize our hobby but if one is way back in the thicket where you won't be seen by the public I see no harm in it. There are many on this forum who have some inane disapproval of this practice. I have heard people here claim coins were left on grave markers but I have NEVER seen one and I used to clean a lot of cemeteries in the Boy Scouts and have visited a lot more and nobody in my family or any of my friend's families have ever done or heard of this practice. I think when it is my time my marker will have written on it "feel free to detect here, it doesn't bother me". Usually threads about this seem to get closed quickly.

 

[BigWaveDave]

The fact that you posted this, must give you some pause....
There have been many threads about this here on Tnet, and you’ve been around here long enough to know what the general opinion is....
If you really thought it was ok, you would have already done it by now.

 

[Hawks88]

I asked and got permission to do the parking area around the cemetery where my parents are buried. There is an old church on the property that has been decommissioned. I was told by the grounds keeper who now is restoring the grounds and the church that I have no limitations around the parking area or around the church. I spent 2 hours detecting and found a lot of nails, aluminum siding pieces, pull tabs and beer bottle caps. I did find 16 cents in clad. I kept everything in my pouch to show anyone with questions about what I was doing. I was cleaning up the trash. I wanted to do this parking area because a lot of weddings also took place here. It’s fairly close to the road and out in the country but every vehicle that drove by would slow down and look at what I was doing. No hassles from anyone. I did not go on the cemetery grounds. I know most people in the area and I have many family members buried here. No regrets.

 

[Kace]

The graveyard is very close to me on a hilltop and heavily forested - thus long forgotten. My ancestors settled this holler around sometime early to mid 1700's.

There's no way in the world I'd even consider detecting on the graves themselves - though it was custom in the early days here to place a coin on the grave of a loved one. What I was considering is the area around the graves and not in the immediate yard itself where people would have crowded for the funerals.

Here's a pic of a marker with coins on it for you. There's always been old coins on his and his family's markers. Whenever I'm up there I'll pick any of them up off the ground that have fallen or been knocked off by the grounds keeper and put them back.

It's a custom in some SWMO cemeteries to put coins on markers too.

My thoughts on Detecting cemeteries is No, because I consider all burial land to be hallowed ground.

I don't think there is anything wrong with Detecting parking areas though on the outside of old cemeteries.

JMO,
Kace

 

[mindcrime1988]

I can see both sides of the conundrum. Me personally, I would not go digging around grave sites unless you are well outside of the area. Think about it this way, if you saw folks digging around one of your loved ones grave, would you get upset? Probably, so this is why I would stay away. There are plenty of other areas to go detecting.

 

[DeepseekerADS]

The fact that you posted this, must give you some pause....
There have been many threads about this here on Tnet, and you’ve been around here long enough to know what the general opinion is....
If you really thought it was ok, you would have already done it by now.

Thanks Dave, you really took it down to the basics.

You are right my friend. Tested as I was, I really can't do this. I am quite willing however to walk around the area with my detector listening to chirps.

 

[Ammoman]

Actually people do leave money at grave stones. My first encounter with this was in japan where money and food is left at family shrines. My first and only encounter with money being left at a grave here in the united states was a couple years ago when my son and i were out in the woods. He found a family cemetery. He did not take the money but put it back on the marker, tried to straighten up the flowers a bit and then left.

Fast forward to around the 4 min mark and you can see the graves and what he did.

 

[Hillbilly Prince]

I lived in SW MO since 1970 and been in a few cemeteries. I have never seen a coin on a grave but maybe I wasn't looking. You know why pepple did that? I have a book about Ozark magic,superstitions, and folklore. I need to check it.

 

[cudamark]

I can see both sides of the conundrum. Me personally, I would not go digging around grave sites unless you are well outside of the area. Think about it this way, if you saw folks digging around one of your loved ones grave, would you get upset? Probably, so this is why I would stay away. There are plenty of other areas to go detecting.

It wouldn't upset me any more than someone running a lawn mower or weed whacker over the grave......or even the area being dug up to be resodded. Like I mentioned before, my loved one is 6 feet under ground, not barely under the surface.

 

[against the wind]

I guess you guys never saw "The Night of The Living Dead"
I wouldn't go alone.

 

[Reanm8er]

Aside from the karma aspect, there's the sanitation threat. I was told as a small child that Cholera stays alive in the ground pretty much forever. That's why the law insists on vaults even if they're made of plywood or styrofoam. My sister and I were playing around in an abandoned cemetery adjacent to a wildwood cemetery of our ancestor's. My mom went nuts and made us get out of there right away. When folks buried the dead in shallow graves the coffin and everything rotted so a depression formed in front of the stone. Breaking a leg was a real possibility but also the threat of disease. My mom told me a story about a lady that was a friend of the family during the depression. She found a trunk in the attic of the house she rented and got out a blanket and wrapped her baby in it. The child died of cholera and it started a major outbreak. I'd like to think that's a folk tale but I know better.

 

[A#1]

I'm only here because of the thread title.....A question of ethics - old abandoned graveyards

I know what yer sayin. Just made me think.

How could a graveyard full of people, ever be abandoned?

 

[dts52]

As for me - Not a chance. Even if it was my family plot. Just outside the plot where they tied up their teams to attend the burial? Absolutely fine. Inside? Say a prayer, wish your ancestors well and move on. JMHO.
HH
dts

 

[Kace]

I lived in SW MO since 1970 and been in a few cemeteries. I have never seen a coin on a grave but maybe I wasn't looking. You know why pepple did that? I have a book about Ozark magic,superstitions, and folklore. I need to check it.

Hillbilly.. If your question is for me...My family, friends and kin always left pennies when visiting any graves.. my gGrandparents, Grandparents, Aunts,Uncles and Parents all did that except on Holidays like Memorial Day, Veterans Day, Easter and Christmas and then at all the graves everyone that visited a grave left a quarter...after the holidays, the cemetery caretaker would collect all the coins and they went into the cemetery fund for expenses. The pennies stayed usually til they just got to be too much and then they were collected too. I've seen some stones where people leave a rock, usually kind of heart shape-ish or round. Just as a memorial and to show they were there.

I'm speaking about the family and country cemeteries mainly..although my folks always left a penny at any grave they visited.

I have a long unused cemetery like Deep is talking about on my property...Right in the middle of the woods. There used to be a Church there and when it was moved a new cemetery was established next to it leaving this one only used by surviving spouses of folks already buried there. I don't think there's been any burials there since the late 1800's. I just maintain it since most everyone is ancestors and I hate to see cemeteries neglected or forgotten. Scouts come once a year for a big clean up.

If your interested, you might look up the meanings of different denominations of coins left on veteran's markers and see what they signify especially if left by a fellow soldier.

What part of SWMO are you in?

Kace

 

[cudamark]

I guess you guys never saw "The Night of The Living Dead"
I wouldn't go alone.

If I decided to do it, that wouldn't stop me! I would do it at midnight on Friday the 13th or on Halloween if need be. Superstitions crack me up!

 

[redcobra8u]

Stuff there wasn't lost so I would say no

 

[Nitric]

I just read the first post and jumped to the end. I know this topic is always .....mixed.

I see no problem with it. I haven't done it, but may one day because of some coins that I pushed in the ground above my brothers grave when we opened a coin shop at the time. Now that years have passed? I kind of changed my mind about leaving them there to rot away or for someone else to find. But at that time it was what made me feel a little better.. If that makes any sense at all. haha

I know some people freak out about the subject, but to me it's not doing anymore damage than the riding lawn mowers that drive all over some of these areas. It's in the first few inches of soil, a grave should be feet down. I honestly don't know what the big deal is. If I walked up on someone detecting my brothers grave? I'd be a little annoyed that maybe they will find what I put there, but....Maybe I shouldn't have put it there! And for me it has served it's purpose already, it made me feel better at the time I did it. He doesn't need it!!

I don't see it as grave robbing. The only thing that would make me a little uneasy is...It is kind of "private land" spots were payed for by someone and are owned. If it's a family type graveyard? Then I guess I wouldn't see an issue at all. If I saw someone detecting a graveyard I wouldn't have a bad thought about it at all, I'd think the same thing as seeing someone detect anywhere else...."Wonder if they found anything good?"

 

[mikebourgeois]

I would have to say no. And in answer to those who say that you're not digging to the coffin but rather the top 6 to 12 inches... I say it really doesn't matter whether you're digging the surface or the depths... you're in a graveyard. Whether it's no longer in service or deliveries every day... it's a graveyard.

If you want to tidy the site then great... but as someone said I believe this shows your respect... (and then you detect away cause hey.... look at me... I showed respect for the dead before I desecrated their final resting site... yay me) if you're stooping to subterfuge to cloak your deeds then you should really be looking hard at your moral compass.

Just me... and yes I feel strongly about it. Too much of my history in the ground for me to want someone to come and poke around in it.

 

[DeepseekerADS]

Not into the sleep mode tonight - get that way sometimes....

I'd not thought of this before. This site may contain the remains of our original settler ancestor. I think the idea of cleaning up the site is spot on. We did not know the site existed, stumbled upon by my closest neighbor's son very recently.

I've a lot to think about on this.