New Metal Detector Design Requirement Wish List

[docweiser]

Around October - November time line I will be seriously looking at several BRAND NEW designs for a new detector that I will design and bring to market. I am looking for any input as to requirements, a wish list. Please only reasonable requests / ideas if you don't mind. I am doing this for YOU as my prospecting parameters are already met bar a few bells and whistles in the new designs. There will be at least 2 -3 designs based on similar technology but I want to make the main design with YOUR input in mind.

You can see my post about patent concerns here http://www.treasurenet.com/forums/tech-talk/533504-enough-single-frequency-vlf-machines.html although this is just a reply to another member and does not go into great detail concerning my understanding of patents and the ability to work around same.

As long as your wish is reasonable then no request will be considered stupid. All requests will be documented and considered.

Fire at will.....

 

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[malenkai]

I saw someone mention GPS, most of us have a smartphone with built in GPS, so why spend money on incorporating it into the machine when you could use an app.

I mentioned onboard GPS and here's why I prefer it to a phone, and quite simply its because I don't take my phone when I detect. That is because

a) I prefer to spend as much time off the grid as possible, as my day job involves too much on the grid time
b) A phone is one more thing to carry, and I'd rather not
c) Everything I carry when I detect gets really dirty. My phone and its case are in great shape, and I'd like them to stay that way
d) I could easily see losing my phone while detecting
e) I don't want to take my gloves off every time I want a GPS fix

I know some people are tethered to their phones, and one wonders how they got by before the invention of the smartphone. I'm the exact opposite; I just got my first phone 2 years ago, and only because it was expected by my employer that I be able to receive text messages. I hate having a phone, tho I'll admit I must be in the vast minority.

Minelab though enough of the GPS idea to put one on the CTX 3030; I don't know exactly how it works as I have not used that machine, but I envision 1 button push to store GPS location, and USB or bluetooth download of waypoints into kml or some other easy to process format on a desktop app (in my case, I would probably use google earth, but the options are endless here, depending on what you are doing).

I didn't feel like springing for a CTX 3030 when the E-Trac works just fine IMO, so I do this the old fashioned way, with paper and compass, then enter it by hand in google earth. Works great if you are working a huge field over several years (as I do), and want to remember exactly where you were. GPS would make this easier, tho.

 

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[roygpa]

If you need a field tester who nobody has ever heard of and and whose opinion will be respected by few, and who is a casual silver coin detectorist, I think I am your man.

P.S. and I don't have any issues signing an NDA.

And if you want what I'd like to see on a dream machine, if would have a screen similar to fish finding sonars that incorporate side imaging like:


-Roy

 

[smokeythecat]

Let me know when we get closer and I'll get you the disclosure agreement. I have over 50 years experience - but still don't know the math on these things!

 

[XLV]

Where i hunt VLF is a waste of time any PI that WP and discriminates good that machine i look forward to

 

[jeff of pa]

Feather Weight, 1 Lb or Less, Maximum Depth , Max Sensitivity, super Stability in all Grounds , and a Cross hair or Number Meter. & Under $300.00


No Words like Gold Coin to Lie about that Can Tab or Vice/Versa

I'll know what it is when I see it & Have fun Guessing from the Little Info Given

 

[docweiser]

Weight is definitely high on the list especially with current technologies, very easy to design around this drawback.

But more interestingly is your comment about identification. We have the technology now to identify individual metals it just hasn't been applied correctly yet. So, if you were certain the machine was not wrong would you still prefer it just says, dig here? This question may be very important, at some point I will try to find a scientific method of asking the question to see how it goes but we have such a great forum maybe just a poll? Please respond as this is very high on our list!

 

[Technomage]

I like the idea of selecting individual metals, and I also wondered why nobody has applied the technology. Basically my garden is a victorian rubbish dump, so I would love to be able to specify a particular metal and only look for that, there are Roman villas nearby and a Roman road about 200ft away. Sadly there is so much iron in the ground it is difficult to find anything. My current detector just isn't good enough!

 

[jeff of pa]

Weight is definitely high on the list especially with current technologies, very easy to design around this drawback.

But more interestingly is your comment about identification. We have the technology now to identify individual metals it just hasn't been applied correctly yet. So, if you were certain the machine was not wrong would you still prefer it just says, dig here? This question may be very important, at some point I will try to find a scientific method of asking the question to see how it goes but we have such a great forum maybe just a poll? Please respond as this is very high on our list!

The surprise is important to Me. I Suppose in a Dump or other super Trash Site,
a machine that was 100& Accurate would be a Plus.

Howeveer

Tokens can be Aluminum

and a Cache can be in a Tin Box.


a Gold coin can be under a large concentration of nails that were Dropped at a Later Date

so unless it can have Xray vision of what is in & Under the Trash There is no way to have

Perfect ID.

& Even if there was, I'm not sure I Personally would enjoy detecting as much.

 

[docweiser]

Exactly the answer I was expecting, thank you! If that perspective is dominant among say, 90% of those here, then this becomes a very important part of design strategy.

 

[TheGreenBoy]

To determine composition of the target is important, to see it's shape is even more important. Heaving it both is a winner.
And no, i would not dig every time, sometimes a target appers to be just too deep.

 

[XLV]

Joke ....greenboy this is the 21th century not the 22th century ....I be happy if it could tell gold from steel 1 kilo target or bigger accurately

 

[jeff of pa]

I only avoid Deep targets if the ground is like concrete, I'm in someones Yard, or other well manicured place,
Or I'm being watched.

 

[XLV]

I find this really funny after reading these posts ...After seeing at least a dozen holes over 30 feet deep and some holes with the same amount of water pumped out to dig to these depths for totally no good reason by hand .....will your machine detect down to 100 feet on a drum size target and tell if it steel or gold accurately if not i have no buyers where am at

 

[jeff of pa]

I find this really funny after reading these posts ...After seeing at least a dozen holes over 30 feet deep and some holes with the same amount of water pumped out to dig to these depths for totally no good reason by hand .....will your machine detect down to 100 feet on a drum size target and tell if it steel or gold accurately if not i have no buyers where am at

Except in water, I Have never heard of a Recovery 100 feet deep.

Not saying they Don't exist, If dropped down a deep Crevice, Or Drums of Chemicals Bull dozed over.

But Personally, Anyone who would dig a 100 Feet to Bury something,
Is mighty Scared of that something imo . & It should stay there.

Just saying My opinion on deep is 3 Feet.
Or Maximum, Would be the Depth of the Average hand Dug well. for Cache Hunting.

But seriously, I Wouldn't expect to Ever Dig a Quarter at 2 Foot,
Unless the Ground was Worked.
However , If the detector could give a Nice loud tone on a Freshly Buried Silver Quarter,
at 3 Feet, You could be assured If there is an Old Quarter on Edge at 15" & You swing over it.
You'll hear it


It's like having a Car that can go 150.
You know that car will Glide up the Steepest Mountain at 55.

and a car that could barely reach 60 MPH on the Level,
Probably won't get up that Mountain.

in other words, Crazy Deep Depths mean More sensitivity on Crazy Tiny Gold & Silver

 

[XLV]

Thegreenboy what the deepest find you have made the deepest real find i know of was about 6 to7 feet deep probably a half dozen japanese troops took turns the big find in san carlos funny thing a guy dug 2x 50 foots holes even large steel cased the holes pumped the water i think i seen the pictures on treasure net if he only knew the history of the troop movement in the area that treasure was found in 1972 at 3 feet on the beach ...The troops were waiting there on word of surrender i know the spot early september 1945 ....Always look in the areas of surrender know were these spots are watch the videos and photos 1945 count the shovels ...Two sites they dug the holes with coconut shells they had no shovels less then 2 feet deep ...Marco treasure was ground level in that mine no shovels used ...Ravine book of map story no shovels used treasure placed on top of the soil ...And to jeff the ones 100 or more feet are in mine shafts or caves ,,,,So when i see people digging and or pumping water (AKA water trap ) more then 3 feet with water or 10 feet without water i just laugh

 

[TheGreenBoy]

Deepest dig 3m. Detector test runs at max. 8m, hole made in the side of the hill, 1.5x1.5m aluminum sheet used for testing. About the depth, think about underground bunkers and storage places, maybe the type Hitler built.

 

[docweiser]

Like this conversation and hope it continues not only on depth but other parameters. Let me add some meat to the table and see how it is digested.

Our plan is to build a machine that can do what at least 90 % wish they could have but also am including as much of a wish list as technically feasible. That said:

We can (have) build a machine that can "see" 10 feet down, when I say "see" I mean it will show on the display an actual image of the buried object(s) fairly clearly. This is great if you have a car to tow the device AND pretty much know what you are looking for e.g. "I want to see if concrete under-footing has steel rebar in it before I dig" OR " I am looking for a landmine and have a fair idea of its size and shape", this is know in the industry as Ground Penetrating Radar and it is another area of science that needs much more work.

We can also build a machine that will spot that quarter at 8 inches but with one extra ping also spot a 55 gallon drum at 25 feet.

Our plan is more around the latter as we feel it is more in tune with the audience and their objectives. This discussion is really about depth and design parameters to meet the challenge.

Identification is also more geared to the latter. If a list is made (and it is being made) of all of the items found or being searched for, it is not that hard to process the received data to give really accurate identification. Someone touched on it already but if the machine claims "silver" it would help if we can provide the user with information as to size and shape.

We can't say much more without revealing our idea before the patent is filed and all legal but trying to provide food for thought as you ponder what you would like.

There is also the opportunity to cross breed, the military is already using some forms of this in that they can hold a handheld device (but bulky) against the wall of a building and count body's (human) on the other side of the wall.

Main point is that some of these things can be made a optional on a machine just by flipping a switch and we would like to incorporate as many of these as feasible in a small, light weight piece of machine real estate.

We've already made the decision that for the 1st run we need to provide at least two machines. The 1st one we will call "Cygnus_X-1" that will absolutely tell the user if there is anything worth digging in an apparent pile of garbage. The other will be more geared toward this type of discussion.

The name "Cygnus_X-1" was offered by one of our NDA signers and we like it a lot! Have to research to make sure it is not trademarked and such but this decision is made and we will leave it to this person as to whether he wants to reveal his name.

This is great stuff all!

 

[roygpa]

So it will have a display similar to what I was wishing for in my post about the imaging on the screen. Maybe I do want "in" on this one.

We can (have) build a machine that can "see" 10 feet down, when I say "see" I mean it will show on the display an actual image of the buried object(s) fairly clearly. This is great if you have a car to tow the device AND pretty much know what you are looking for e.g. "I want to see if concrete under-footing has steel rebar in it before I dig" OR " I am looking for a landmine and have a fair idea of its size and shape", this is know in the industry as Ground Penetrating Radar and it is another area of science that needs much more work.

 

[Technomage]

I like the idea of seeing an image of the item before you dig it up. I was looking at the Nokta Makro Invenio Pro which does that, but it's a lot of money! I like that it detects tunnels too because we have a lot of them around here.

 

[TheGreenBoy]

I would really love to see the target ID capability and how deep it would still be reliable - that's definately something worth haveing.

A litle dissapointed about target imageing, i thought that is the next think - take a look at Invenio and it's only a VLF, pale version of real military stuff.

About the depth, i am not impressed, have had better for last 15 yeares even without SQID sensors

And oh yes, voids and tunnels, voids and tunnels - without sticking 10.000 conductivity probes...man i am dreaming....