I need some serious help here!

[jmilewis]

Hello everyone!
I would really appreciate any help I can get from all of you experienced treasure hunters! Here's the deal. I have wanted a metal detector since I was about 7. Now i find myself in a good place financially and plan to travel the country soon and would love a great metal detector to take with me. Unfortunately I know little to nothing about what to get. I find myself scouring internet sites, all claiming to be the best in quality, value, and durability. They can't all be telling the truth... right? So this is where you wonderful folks come in. What do you feel is the best metal detector for newbies? Are there Md's that can detect what metal is below? This is the criteria I feel is important for me.

-Easy to use. I don't want too many knobs and buttons that will intimidate me and confuse me.

-Durability. As I said before, this will need to travel with me and I want to feel confident that a bump or two wont damage my MD.

-Overall usefullness. I am not in this to get rich quick or anything. I am just interested in what lies below. I would be pleased with coins, jewelry, artifacts, etc. I'm not picky. However, I'm not too interested in beer bottle caps, so one that can also weed out junk.

-Good Bargains. I have noticed the less expensive ones seem simpler to use, but does that mean they are of lower quality? Probably. I went to Cabella's recently and saw a Bounty Hunter for about $500 but judging by what I have read here, they just aren't quality detectors.

Obviously i need some real help here. PLEASE impart your wisdom on to me!

 

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[Bigcypresshunter]

Here is the F2. Nice looking unit and 2 coils. $199.95. Does it have the same belltones as the Ace?

 

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[Bigcypresshunter]

F2 vs. Ace 250. http://forum.treasurenet.com/index.php/topic,123817.msg909529/topicseen.html#new

 

[erikk]

Blinky, somehow you missed my point.

I HAVE NO OPINION.

Opinions don't belong in deciding how to spend $99 to $125,000 on metal detectors. People who offer "opinions" only cause some other people to blow their wad on something that is not the best deal, or is junk, and personally I wish people would leave their "opinions" out of these places. Opinions belong in chosing facial preferences, or tastes of food, or fantasies, etc, but not in these types of decisions. A metal detector costs MONEY, not ideology or preferences.

The FACT is, that the F-2 is a better deal than the Ace, ANY Ace. And as regard to 2" difference on detectors? There has been about 2" difference on nearly ALL VLF detectors for the last 30+ years, so why even ask that question?

I'm very glad that you like the Ace, but the F-2 is a better detector. And incidentally, anybody knows that detector ownership changes hands frequently anyway, including Garrett, which is now run by other members of the family, plus stockholders. Even Ferrari is now owned primarily by Fiat, yet people still buy those wonderful beautiful cars, don't they?

Again, it is NOT my opinion that the F-2 is clearly a better deal than the Ace, it is a FACT, and most people know it by now too.

EasyMoney

100% Correct!!! The new F series Fishers are definitely worth a second look

 

[hsjrev]

The F-2 is almost as capable and powerful as the F-4 and the F-4 is so close to the capabilities of the F-75 that it is almost shocking. There isn't more than 2" depth difference between the three either, not in the ground.

The F-4 has a very tiny bit more depth with the DD coil but also cost around twice as much, however, in it's price class it's the best of that world too.

I notice the F4 has a ground balance knob that the F2 lacks. Seems like that would make a big difference in minerals or especially on saltwater beaches.

[edit] after looking at the F4 manual, it seems the ground balance only works for the all-metal autotune mode. When you are in disc mode, the GB is preset just like the F2. Makes it hard to justify paying twice as much for the F4 unless you plan to hunt a lot in all-metal mode. Also makes the F2 look like even more of a bargain...

 

[ivan salis]

the F2 and Ace 250 are both great less costly machines that offer great bang for the ---the ace 250 cost about $ 212.46 shipped with a few goodies from kellyco (plus tax if you live in fla) --- the F2 is a newer model and looks to be a real contender and currently has a two coil and machine deal (stock and a 4 in sniper coil model) for about $ 199 plus shipping -- both are solid choices for easy to use beginner type machines --- a bit more costly but a fine easy to use better grade machine the M6 at about $600 is also a very good and popular choice --- the choices are of course up to you ---the M6 is a bit heavier --- the ace 250 is light and easy to handle and very popular --- the F2 was designed to go head to head with it -- good luck hope this helps

 

[Willy]

I had the Ace 250 and it was a nice little detector.. until it ran up against a problem that I could see the F2/F4 experiencing too.. preset GB in disc. hampering the detector in bad ground. I got rid of the Ace right quick after hunting in an area where I was lucky to get 2" on a coin. Other areas it got wonderful depth (for what it is). I can see the same thing happening with the 2 new Fishers. They will work great great until they get to an area that requires GB'ing in disc. .. then they'll be hooped. yup, could hunt in all-metal with the F4.. NOT!! I have better things to do than assault my ears with thousands of trash signals and keeping my eyes glued to the screen. There are other detectors on the market which don't have this problem. yup, I don't have to get an F2/F4, and I won't; just want to explain why and how all 3 detectors (Ace,F2/F4) share a common shortcoming. Isn't that WONDERFUL? It's like.. sniff.. they're really one happy little family. ..Willy.

 

[ivan salis]

nope their lower end preset GB units units *(below $300 bucks)-- bad ground requires higher end units that have manual GB ability (say $600 bucks M6) --- many places are not "bad ground" and can be happily hunted with cheaper model preset GB type units --- on some preset GB type units (like the bounty hunter knob type tracker IV and quick draw II machines) if you hit "bad ground " type conditions often times backing off the sen/power and uping the disc can make them usible --- (agreed at a shallower depth of course -- but usible none the less) on the ace 250 easing up on the sen level will work say 2 to 3 bars in wet sand and 3 to 4 bars in dry sand at the beach -- Ivan

 

[Willy]

Problem with backing off the sensitivity and upping the disc. is that detectors with notch-only disc. can disc. out too much, especially when hunting ferrous based coins or tiny/thin jewelry. If a person has the old style progressive disc. (higher resolution) it's somewhat easier to reach that balance between disc.'ing targets and handling the ground. This doesn't, however, address the AM channel, which would still not be GB'ed (unless it was something like the F4, Cortez, etc.). I don't know how the disparity between the 2 channels would affect the detector. ..Willy.

 

[JOE(USA)]

I just want to weight in on some things that I see happening here on this post. Perhaps 95% of the time when a novice asks a question about differences in metal detectors, the response is a users opinion on a detector and it's always about the detector that he or she uses. That form of response is useful up to a point. What is MOST valuable is FACT.
Easymoney knows more FACTS about detectors than any five of us old timers out here put together. Easymoneys answers to posts are accurate, well articulated, and to the point. The smart beginner as well as the Pro in this hobby is advised to listen closely to what he has to say. Joe

 

[Willy]

Actually, I use 2 at present and have had up to 6 in my possession at one time. Sometimes, a person ends up with a specific detector (or plural) for a very good reason and might have tested out many others to arrive at their present state of affairs. Hey! That puts me in the 5 percentile.. where's my signet ring and show me that secret handshake. ..Willy.

 

[EasyMoney]

Thanks for the kind words Joe.

I have to admit that I have been around so many detectors that it takes up a bit too much of my time some days though. If I was still married she would soon leave me because of how much time I fool with these things..

Tesoros are real strange animals, they work very, very well in really bad ground WITHOUT manual ground balance. In fact, they work BETTER than with manual GB. In more neutral ground there doesn't seem to be that big of distinction though. What this means is that somewhere in the midwest a manual GB would help, but not as much in worse soil. But that is Tesoro, not Minelab or Garrett, etc.

The speed of retune (the short +/- of the sine wave) voltage is the combination that does the trick with Tesoros. Other detectors operate in many other different ways. For example, I installed an aftermarket GB pot on my one Compass, but it really is not needed at all. I experimented with it and found that the manual vs the auto super-fast retune to GB null gave me the same results no matter where I searched with it. Yes, I can turn it off and only use automatic GB if I want to. Al, I have to do is to tune it to negative, and it still operates just as well and just as deep.

On another Compass though, that was not true at all. In fact it NEEDED the combo manual and super-fast retune to null to get it's amazing depth, but it has an additional setting where it even retunes much faster than the first one. . The first one though has no (audio) null, and that caused it to get less depth than the second one WITH an audio null. What this means is that a detector with an audio null and super-fast retune will work better than one without an audio null and faster auto-retune, in MOST situations, but not all. It will normally get more depth too, and operate much smoother and find things MUCH smaller, but not in all cases.

Most people forget that there are many more things going on inside a detector besides it's speed of retune, it's frequency of operation, it's type of ground balance, etc., gain, sensitivity, or it's band of discrimination, etc.

In fact one of these two Compasses here has the same identical circuitry as the other, with only a couple of add-on alterations, and one has a slightly slower capacitive change. The second one has a mere single switch that enables it to get back to square #1" so fast that the ground bothers it less than the other, and that alone gives it more depth and it's audio null gives it even more depth on top of it. . The one (with the add-on retune pot) is a bit slower though because of it's capacitance difference, and it was designed that way because that setup gives it a bit of an edge when using it's notch modes, inclusive, or exclusive, manually set or preset. A slower retune works best for this and a faster retune (recovery) null helps tremendously in searching for extremely tiny objects like gold flakes. In fact the manual GB on the latter setup gains another 2-3 inches in air, and as I said earlier, the basic circuitry is still basically the same between both detectors. This includes the fact that both have 3 filters too and the meters are identical and interchangable. The coils are interchangeble too, with no loss in performance at all..

So we have more than just GB that makes a detector work well in bad ground. In fact, the LST has perhaps THE best auto GB on the planet, and it behaves beautifully anywhere it is used. Minelabs do very well too, but not (quite) as well as the LST. It's because they use slower processors and that is the very reason that they need to be operated more slowly and why some can't even locate a pea-sized object if they are swung too fast..

The short spikes taking GB to null on Tesoros plus the best fast +/- capacitive voltage cycle is what makes them work so well in the really crappy soil, manual GB or not. Tesoro is the only detector company that uitilizes this combination. I believe they have a patent on it too. My early Silver and Golden Sabers handle this absolutely horrible bad ground here like a mean stepfather whupping his redheaded freckled-faced stepson with a broom handle. Only other Terosos can do this too. Others need not apply.

The newer Fishers are almost as fast, but not quite. Maybe a hair bit slower, but that's all. The F-2's handle bad ground better than an Ace, but not quite as well as a Silver uMax. The Ace talks and moans all the time here, but I didn't see that with the F-2.

The soil here reads a 1-3 on a Fisher GB scale, and in the midwest about a 6. Soil with no minerals at all (an air test) reads clear up to a 10.

You all have a good one tomorrow. I'm going to Alaska for 2 weeks. Too much snow for detecting, but snowmobiling will be fun

 

[hollowpointred]

jmilewes, based on your needs as you stated in your original post, i would look at the Tesoro detectors.

 

[muleskinner]

 

[Bigcypresshunter]

5 Plus it can tell the difference between a nickel and a pulltab due to it's numerical system,
which an Ace 250 or 150 cannot.

Thats good Easymoney, but can it tell the difference between a pulltab and a gold ring? Does it have the same 3 belltones that the Ace has? Im asking because I may purchase one.

 

[nc-joe]

For ease of use, little to no learning curve and good value with high quality:

Garrett Ace 250
Fisher F2
Fisher F4
White's Prizm V


The F2 and F4 would most likely need to be bough new, since there are not a whole lot of used ones on the market now, but the ACE 250 and Prizm V can be bought at a very good price used. (Side note: If you buy the ACE 250 be sure to buy the larger 9x12 coil too.)

 

[Murph]

Since you are going to be traveling around the country you will likely need more than one detector to deal with all of the different conditions.

For beach (where targets can be pretty deep), mineralized areas or areas where targets are reasonably spread out like civil war relic hunting I would suggest one of the Minelab sovereigns. You can usually find a used one in good condition on the auction sight. All models are good (sx, sx2a, elite, gt). Built like tanks, self ground balancing, multi tone ID, stable even in difficult soil conditions/wet saltwater sand and pretty much turn on and go.

For trashy areas like parks, sports fields etc. I would suggest something with a fast recovery speed and a variable notch discrimination. Any of the less expensive VLF detectors with these features will do. Ace 250, whites prizms and I am sure there are others but IMO they all pretty much perform the same. The variable notch discrimination will allow you to disc out a wider variety of items so you are not bombarded with constant tones and the quick recovery speed will help to keep bad targets from smearing out the good. This will come with a sacrifice in depth and possibly some value targets, especially gold, so whenever possible I would use the sov.

If you find a good deal on one of the sovereigns you could probably buy a new ace or prizm and still keep things in the 500 to 600 dollar ball park and if one detector does develop problems you have a back up.

 

[Bigcypresshunter]

Read this comparing Ace250 to Fisher F2.
http://www.findmall.com/read.php?37,629213,page=1

 

[Ricardo_NY1]

Sounds like the F2 has alot of support out there. I have never used one, but it may have the same limitation the 250 has........No Manual Ground Balance. I don't think the original poster could go too wrong with either. The 250 is a good machine nonethless. My best bet would still be with a used Minelab Explorer, specially with about $500 to play around with.

 

[Willy]

They've deleted the string.. didn't brown-nose enough. ..Willy.

 

[bavarianminister]

I would hate to live in a world where i had to buy 1 detector. Stay with a major brand and you'll be O.K.! My suggestion is to buy more than one when money allows. I have always found advantages and disadvantages with all detector brands. MOSTLY ADVANTAGES with a name brand.