Sandman's trouble with State Park policies.

[Sandman]

Here is an article that was run in the Oakland Press about me detecting in state parks. It was to bring attention to the rules of restricting the use of metal detectors in Michigan State Parks.



Pontiac metal hunter kept out of park



Tuesday, October 14, 2008 5:02 AM EDT
By CAROL HOPKINS
Of The Oakland Press
Dennis C. Rahn Sr. of Pontiac enjoys taking out one of his 13 metal detectors to look for coins and jewelry.

“I go out every chance my knees let me,” the 66-year old said. “People think we’re digging up all this money, but you can make more by working at a (fast-food restaurant) part-time.” Nonetheless, there is one local spot Rahn wishes he could explore — Dodge Park No. 4 in Waterford.

“At Dodge Park, we cannot even look for lost coins in the grass for extra money to buy a coffee on the way home.” Metal detecting is recognized as a legitimate recreation activity by the state when it is conducted in ways that don’t damage natural and cultural resources in the state parks or violate applicable state statutes, according to state officials. The Department of Natural Resources asks that items found must be reviewed by park staff and may be retained for further investigation.

Five of the 98 state parks allow metal detecting. Dodge Park is not among them.
Oakland County Parks are open to metal detecting, said officials. County rules state, “Metal detectors will be allowed in the picnic, campground and general park area. With permission from the park supervisor, metal detectors will be allowed in the beach area when the beach has been closed to the public. The use of metal detectors in the water will be done by a group of volunteers approved through the Commission’s Chief of Parks Operations.”

Rahn has found money, rings and many pull tabs, he said.

He would like to be able to explore beach areas because “people in the water have slippery fingers.”

Rules connected with metal detecting changed in the state parks a few years ago.

“We had most parks open for metal detecting years ago, but then we were contacted by the state archaeologist who said we were in violation of the state antiquities act,” said Harold Herta, Department of Natural Resources chief of resource management.

After that, Natural Resources staff conducted a two-year analysis — between 2003-04.

“We talked with metal detecting groups and archeologists, and then created maps and posted everything on the Web.

“Some parks are open, some are partially open and others are closed,” Herta said.

“We tried to appease state archaeologists, but still allow for recreational use of metal detectors.”

The five parks that are open — none in Oakland County — have no cultural or historic areas, he noted.

Herta pointed out many states close every park to metal detecting, and that no metal detecting is allowed in national parks.

“It would have been easier to say that here,” he said.

“We’re trying to find that middle ground. (The current policy) is a compromise solution.”

The state parks that are partially open allow metal detecting in parking lots — areas that don’t yield much, Rahn noted.

He wishes the state would change the rules.

“If I find enough for a cup of coffee, I am a happy camper,” he said.

“With pennies costing three cents apiece to mint now, I read somewhere, I would think someone would be happy that metal detectorists are finding lost coinage and putting it back in circulation.

“It is the only hobby that many seniors can do that doesn’t cost an arm and a leg.”

On the Web

The rules about metal detecting in Michigan’s state parks and a complete list of parks where people can use metal detectors can be found at http://www.michigan.gov/dnr/0,1607,7...7922--,00.html.

[MichiganRob]

Good for you Dennis There are State Parks here on my side of Michigan I'd like to hunt too.
The States are just plain getting too obnoxious about their power and rights at the expense of the People's rights. The article calls attention to this problem and this helps.

HH
MichiganRob

PS I know a State Representative personally, known her for years, and at our next meeting I intend to bring this issue to her.

[bbqbull]

Great article and this being an election year, that law might be changed.

Mike

[Planet1mars (mike)]

i really think if some of the people who did detecet ,and messed up the land makes it harder for us as well. i have seen some places where there was holes and i felt if some one seen me thy think it was me doing it so i fill the holes in.. double the work with out anything...

[fistfulladirt]

What a joke! Alowed to hunt the "parking lot." Well, I hope they aren't paved.
I checked out the DNR map for sites around me, the parking lots are the only places to hunt.
Also keep in mind that when you do leave a park after detecting, your holes may be opened up by those danged tree rats, and roaming dogs will also do it. I know because i've gone back to places and found holes uncovered.

[The.Boomer]

Every one should learn to coin pop so holes won't be an issue. Also everyone should write letters to the editor, and if your letter doesn't get published keep on writting them until you do, then move on to another paper. Also write your local T.V. stations, ask them to do a spot on the hobby. Better yet do your own spot on video and shop it around to the local news. If you keep the pressure on the media they'll pressure the legislatures. Never forget who really runs our country, big money and the Media !

[fistfulladirt]

Every one should learn to coin pop so holes won't be an issue. Also everyone should write letters to the editor, and if your letter doesn't get published keep on writting them until you do, then move on to another paper. Also write your local T.V. stations, ask them to do a spot on the hobby. Better yet do your own spot on video and shop it around to the local news. If you keep the pressure on the media they'll pressure the legislatures. Never forget who really runs our country, big money and the Media !

That's a good idea about coin popping, but some of us don't hunt clad, the old coins are 5" deep or better.

[jeff of pa]

good article Sandman

What it comes down to was said right here.


“We had most parks open for metal detecting years ago, but then we were contacted by the state archaeologist who said we were in violation of the state antiquities act,” said Harold Herta, Department of Natural Resources chief of resource management.

as long as nobody is willing to fight the archaeologists and their act they
will continue to walk all over us.

Forget the Middle Ground, They want it all unless it's been
dug out and filled with rock

[The.Boomer]

Every one should learn to coin pop so holes won't be an issue. Also everyone should write letters to the editor, and if your letter doesn't get published keep on writting them until you do, then move on to another paper. Also write your local T.V. stations, ask them to do a spot on the hobby. Better yet do your own spot on video and shop it around to the local news. If you keep the pressure on the media they'll pressure the legislatures. Never forget who really runs our country, big money and the Media !

That's a good idea about coin popping, but some of us don't hunt clad, the old coins are 5" deep or better.

Your gonna have to give up something and old coin hunting in state parks is definately one of them. Most states parks would throw a horse shoe if they see someone walking in with a garden shovel looking to dig deep holes, just think of the liabilty issues if some one trips in a hole, real or fake.


P.S. When it comes to fighting state Archies there's a technique you MDers of Michigan state must do. Band together, file a lawsuit against the state archies office for non performance. They have an obligation to the people of the state of Michigan to act in a reasonably swift manner to retrieve all artifacts of historical value as soon as Identified. You guys can ask for a time limit on how long they have to perform this obligation, after which a private entity may, Acting in an appropriately contientous manner retrieve said artifacts in accordance with accepted practices for historical preservation. You'll also need to clarify what exactly qualifies as a historically significant find. With so many other dating methods available to them in this day and age, when they reach for the coin date as site specific dating method slam them with all the possibilities for this method to be innaccurate. Then compare and contrast with other dating methods and their accurracy vs inaccurracy.

[lonesomebob]

someone please define "coin poping" Please.

[Great Lakes]

From Tesoro's Website


METHOD 1: “PROBE AND DRIVER”

Used in less moist lawns where targets are not so deep (one to four inches) and the “Plugging” method is objectionable. The Probe and Driver method requires more practice but is much less damaging to grass than Method 2.

The probe used can be a non-metallic probe such as a modified fiberglass fishing rod or a metallic probe such as a blunted ice pick. A non-metallic probe will be the least damaging to the target.

After pinpointing target, use the probe to locate target depth (Fig. 1A). Next, insert eight-inch screwdriver on center just above target and rotate slightly to open ground (Fig. 1B). Now insert screwdriver just under target at an angle and lever target to surface (Fig. 1C). Brush all loose dirt back in the hole and close by exerting pressure all around opening (Fig. 1D).

[fistfulladirt]

Lol! And the coin you've just "pryed" out of the ground with a screwdriver happens to be a 1916D merc. With a gash across miss Liberty's face. Good luck!

[Great Lakes]

That's for sure, I never use this method just answering a question. Seems like this would be a very tedious way to recover a target.

[chirper97]

Thanks for the great article SandMan! You did well with the interview....they nearly always distort the information to fit their agendas, but apparently not in your case.

[Giant056]

There are acres and acres and acres of woods in Yankee Springs area state land that are off limits just because it's state land. There is no significant historic land on probably 99% of the land except the coins in the soil that people may have dropped because they were walking in the woods. There are also many things left behind by loggers that is just rusting in the ground (I never see archaeologists digging for anything in the woods). I always put back dirt even in the woods. I figure some people just don't like people that metal detect and I do run across people in the woods that are about as friendly as a badger. In many ways our laws are really stupid as far as I'm concerned. My brother and I were asked to leave a woods/old swimming area a few years ago on state land by a ranger and at the time I didn't know that all state land was off limits unless designated specifically for metal detecting. I guess we were lucky he didn't confiscate our stuff.

[chirper97]

There are acres and acres and acres of woods in Yankee Springs area state land that are off limits just because it's state land. ..............................

Thanks for your post.

The irony of "state land" being inaccessible to the citizens of the state reminds me of the old soviet union.

The People's land, except the 'people' can't use it without the commissar's permission.