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Thread: Oak Island: Was something even there.

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  1. #181

    Mar 2007
    Salinas, CA
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    Quote Originally Posted by b3y0nd3r View Post
    ... Show me the studies that prove such behaviors.....
    I just did. That was a case example. I don't know what you mean by (or what qualifies as) "studies". Haven't you seen it for yourself ? I can give you case after case after case of the "telephone game" and "treasure fever" at play, but you will say they don't qualify as "studies" ?

    Ok ? Anyone know of any "studies" done (in university double-blind scientific "studies") that shows the human inclination to trend towards such things ? eg.: Loch ness monster "proofs", treasure "proofs, UFO and/or conspiracy "proofs" , etc....
    Last edited by Tom_in_CA; Jan 11, 2017 at 12:23 PM.
    Metal detecting is my one worldy vice!

  2. #182

    Mar 2007
    Salinas, CA
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    Quote Originally Posted by Raparee View Post
    ... , with "markings" at ten foot intervals. The story then evolved into there being platforms at ten foot intervals. ....
    Well OF COURSE the later interpretations that "markings" were/meant "platforms", is simply logical sense. What don't you understand ??
    Raparee likes this.
    Metal detecting is my one worldy vice!

  3. #183
    us
    Loki

    Dec 2014
    Traverse City, Mi.
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    Quote Originally Posted by ECS View Post
    What about the timbers at various levels and the coconut fibers?
    The coconut fibres; They were carbon dated to the late 1100s (more or less, I don't remember the error factor) by Woods Hole, but the fibres were handed to them and not retrieved by the Woods Hole staff. Using this fact detractors have said the fibers were not from Oak Island, but from somewhere else. The problem with this line of thinking is how and why would somebody go out and find coconut fibres have them tested for dating until they found the date they wanted then give them to Woods Hole? The other question was raised about ocean water effecting the dating. But this is only a significant factor if they are at a great depth. So IMHO, the Woods Hole C-14 dating should be taken seriously.
    There was also an earlier C-14 dating that produced similar results which I don't have in front of me right now.
    Than there was the Carbon dating the Lagina's had done also producing results of between 1200 to 1400ad.
    Cheers, Loki

  4. #184

    Mar 2007
    Salinas, CA
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    Quote Originally Posted by b3y0nd3r View Post
    Please site your evidence showing the discrepancy in the stories.
    Woah woah, ok, .... so if it were shown to you, that there was an evolution of "marking" evolved to "platforms", would you THEN believe ? Or would you dismiss this and be off to something else ?

    There has been evolution-of-the story recountings posted here before. Linking studies by authors documenting every single factoid , and when it appeared historically in print record. Tracing back to the earliest origins of any said factoid. And when looking at that, you will indeed see that the story did "evolve" in that aspect.

    I'll leave it to someone else to link, highlight the sentences, and so forth. But first, you gotta admit to us all, that once/if you see that, you will join the skeptic's side. Agreed ?
    Metal detecting is my one worldy vice!

  5. #185
    us
    Loki

    Dec 2014
    Traverse City, Mi.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tom_in_CA View Post
    Woah woah, ok, .... so if it were shown to you, that there was an evolution of "marking" evolved to "platforms", would you THEN believe ? Or would you dismiss this and be off to something else ?

    There has been evolution-of-the story recountings posted here before. Linking studies by authors documenting every single factoid , and when it appeared historically in print record. Tracing back to the earliest origins of any said factoid. And when looking at that, you will indeed see that the story did "evolve" in that aspect.

    I'll leave it to someone else to link, highlight the sentences, and so forth. But first, you gotta admit to us all, that once/if you see that, you will join the skeptic's side. Agreed ?
    In some cases, not all of course, there is also much disinformation from the detractors. Such as seawater significantly effects C-14 dating results. Although it does effect the process it is only significant if the object tested has spent a large amount of its time in deep water.
    I'll be one of the first though that considers much of the Oak Island story a hoax, but not all of it!
    Cheers, Loki
    Last edited by lokiblossom; Jan 11, 2017 at 12:39 PM.

  6. #186

    Mar 2007
    Salinas, CA
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    Quote Originally Posted by Raparee View Post
    Top Ten Money Pit Myths

    I'm waiting for source documentation from Joltes.
    Raparee, we can dismiss all 10 of the points in your link. Because:

    a) all we have to say, following each point, is "prove it". And then set the bar as what qualifies as "proof" increasingly higher (ie.: "move the goalposts") And to propose crazy (yet not "impossible") scenarios as to how some such objection could be overcome. Thus meaning it most certainly happened. Right ?

    b) not valid because the person who assembled that list was a nonbeliever. Hence biased. And biased notions are "biased", and hence to be dismissed.

    Got any other proof ?
    Metal detecting is my one worldy vice!

  7. #187
    ca
    Feb 2016
    Nova Scotia
    367
    309 times
    All Types Of Treasure Hunting
    Quote Originally Posted by Tom_in_CA View Post
    Raparee, we can dismiss all 10 of the points in your link. Because:

    a) all we have to say, following each point, is "prove it". And then set the bar as what qualifies as "proof" increasingly higher (ie.: "move the goalposts") And to propose crazy (yet not "impossible") scenarios as to how some such objection could be overcome. Thus meaning it most certainly happened. Right ?

    b) not valid because the person who assembled that list was a nonbeliever. Hence biased. And biased notions are "biased", and hence to be dismissed.

    Got any other proof ?
    Frustrating, isn't it.
    For a number of people, treasure at Oak Island, or Templars in Nova Scotia, or whatever, is a religion. It gets their backs up when the facts contradicting their faith are pointed out.

  8. #188
    us
    Jan 2017
    Pennsylvania
    47
    45 times
    All Types Of Treasure Hunting
    Quote Originally Posted by b3y0nd3r View Post
    I understand and thanks for your input.

    If you look you can find a number of stories on Oak Island and the beginning of the mystery but will find that most tell different recollections with some similarities. The biggest problem is none of the documentation or proof exists today, if ever... especially when a verbal story is repeated, it lacks even more credibility... Physical proof can also be explained away most of the time... Short of pulling out gold bars or a historic relic you will never be able to prove anything.

    Even if gold does not exist, This island has more reasons than not to have had a deep history and some evidence left behind by our earliest explorers/settlers and some mysteries to still solve.

    Your Bud Aurum
    Roadhse2 and petetherocker like this.

  9. #189

    Mar 2015
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    Here is another question that, while there can be no proof for, is one to consider...If you really want to start at the beginning

    Why was THIS island, out of so many, chosen to be the spot to place a treasure, at the great lengths to hide it that were supposedly taken when it is in a known area that was being regularly fished by commercial fisherman from different nations?

    These fisherman based out of Cuba plied these waters on a continuous basis from the 1580's forward. That the nearby coast was being explored in the mid 1600's with settlement not far behind.

    Even if we say all of this is true, Money Pit, flood tunnels, finger drains, cofferdams...all of it...these activities would be very apparent to anyone that happened to pass by, and noted. The length of time it would take to accomplish this in relative secrecy, and also cover your even having been there to begin with, would almost insure that you would be found out.

    There are many more islands in out of the way places they would have known of in this era of ocean exploration that would have been more suitable.

    So if you really want to start at the beginning, show me anything that would make THIS island the one that had to hold a treasure.

  10. #190
    ca
    Jan 2015
    Canada
    72
    63 times
    All Types Of Treasure Hunting
    ^ exactly.

    though some will undoubtedly provide proof of Ley Lines/Celestial Maps/Codes supposedly found in Shakespear's work, etc...

    As Colonel Potter of M.A.S.H would say: "Horse Hockey" or "Horse Feathers"
    Roadhse2 and Tom_in_CA like this.

  11. #191

    Mar 2007
    Salinas, CA
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    Quote Originally Posted by Raparee View Post
    Frustrating, isn't it.
    For a number of people, treasure at Oak Island, or Templars in Nova Scotia, or whatever, is a religion. It gets their backs up when the facts contradicting their faith are pointed out.
    Here's the comeback line I like, whenever some portion of the story is dis-proved and finally put to rest:

    "much of the Oak Island story a hoax, but not all of it!". And that's usually followed with something like: ".... therefore it's just a matter of sorting fact from fiction".

    But this sort of presumes there's some treasure there in the first place ? If there's no treasure there, then it WON'T MATTER how much "fact from fiction" one sorts out , eh ? Whether or not salt can be dried, or how you spell the 13 yr. old boy's middle name, or whether or not a genius way of digging a pit with hand tools *could* have been done, or whether or it was "marks" or "platforms", etc.... All of that becomes a moot point, if there was no treasure in the first place.
    Metal detecting is my one worldy vice!

  12. #192

    Mar 2015
    376
    365 times
    All Types Of Treasure Hunting
    Hey Tom in CA.....

    Just to note...the salt drying deal has nothing to do with treasure, or not, on the island...

    It only has to do with a use for the cove and drains that the fishing company that owned the island in 1753 could have put in since they needed the salt...

    IF....big if...any treasure is ever found it still won't have anything to do with the drains or cove since no tunnel was found when the drain area was dug out...just a 24' deep well/sump they all dumped into with a blind stop bottom.

    Carry on.....
    Tom_in_CA and petetherocker like this.

  13. #193
    us
    Loki

    Dec 2014
    Traverse City, Mi.
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    Relic Hunting
    Quote Originally Posted by Tom_in_CA View Post

    Yes we've eaten at Crabby Jim's . What brings you to Monterey ? Next time you're here , drop me a line !
    I may just do that, I just found out I might have to be in Placerville this spring. Not to close but like I said I always seem to end up near Monterey.
    Cheers, Loki

  14. #194
    ECS
    ECS is offline
    us
    Mar 2012
    Ocala,Florida
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    Quote Originally Posted by Raparee View Post
    Coconut fibers were found and were dated to approx. 1100AD by the Woods Hole Institute. They also stated that there were a number of factors that could have influenced the dating (weather, salt water, etc...). It should also be noted that the sample of coconut fiber that was tested was handed to Woods Hole by the landowner, so there was no way for Woods Hole to verify provenance.
    Coir was used in Asia in shipbuilding for many centuries before 1100AD, when the Arab ships began using coir on their trading vessels down the east coast of Africa and into the Indian Ocean.
    Yes the Templers may have had knowledge of coir from their time in the East, but, coir use in European shipbuilding or even for cargo packing, came several centuries later.
    The coconut fibers, coir, are, as many aspects of Oak Island, are quite suspect.
    What was their purpose, have they always been there since the Pit discovery, and, where was their origin?
    The New World, or Old?

  15. #195
    us
    Seriously?

    Mar 2008
    WA
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    Quote Originally Posted by Roadhse2 View Post

    IF....big if...any treasure is ever found it still won't have anything to do with the drains or cove since no tunnel was found when the drain area was dug out...just a 24' deep well/sump they all dumped into with a blind stop bottom.
    That wouldn't be a bad place to hide a treasure, actually.

    In 2167, people will be arguing about whether or not the Odd Fellows were hiding crosses in the salt mine on Oak Island. That's how these stories develop. You heard it here first.
    Roadhse2 likes this.
    Avatar taken from "The Biting Pear of Salamanca." See the original here: http://ursulav.deviantart.com/art/Th...manca-29677500

 

 
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