Prince Henry Sinclairs 1398 Journey to Oak Island - Page 15
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Thread: Prince Henry Sinclairs 1398 Journey to Oak Island

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  1. #211
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    Not yet.

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  3. #213
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    Quote Originally Posted by ECS View Post
    If Earl Henry Sinclair was a Prince and a Templar, please present the proof behind these two statements.
    Keep in mind when Queen Elizabeth II daughter, Princess Anne got married, it did NOT make her husband a Prince, marrying a princess does not make one a prince.
    Then there is the contemporary documentation of the Sinclairs testifying against the Templars at their 1309 Edinburgh trial, hardly the actions of a family that was Templar, or a family that would be accepted into the Templar Order.
    Then take into consideration the obligation of Earl Henry Sinclair's Feudal Oath of Fealty to the King of Norway and his successor.
    As a vassal to the King, Earl Sinclair was NOT free to take off on a voyage and neglect his duties and obligations without the formal consent of the king.
    Now if this voyage occurred in the year 1398, and Earl Henry died in 1400, how long did this voyage take to get to Oak Island, how much time was spent on Oak Island, AND how long did it take to sail back to Scotland?

    Time would be served well, by reading the professional verified works of as you refer to as "knowledgeable historians" , Mark Oxbrow, Ian Robertson, Brian Smith,Louise Yeoman, William Thompson, and especially Karen Rails, who presented documented proof that the Sinclairs were NOT Templars, instead of trusting this pseudo pabulum published for profit pollution of proven documented history by Muir , Halpern, Ruh, Baigent, Leigh, Lincoln, AND Johann Reinhold Forester and Richard Henry Major who began this Sinclair myth nonsense in the 18th& 19th century that was embellished by Sinclair descendants Richard Sinclair in 1892 and then in 1992, by Andrew Sinclair.
    As with the alleged Sinclair/Templar treasure inventory list you claim to possess, Franklin, you have presented any evidence or source beyond Muir's fictional journal concerning Earl Henry Sinclair being a prince or a Templar, which he was neither, or how he was able to sail in 1398 to Oak Island in opposition to his Oath of Fealty obligations to the King of Norway, weather a Nor'easter off of Nova Scotia that destroyed his ship, bury an alleged treasure, and sail back to Scotland well under two years where he died in 1340.
    Just sayin' 'Nuff said!

  4. #214
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    Quote Originally Posted by ECS View Post
    As with the alleged Sinclair/Templar treasure inventory list you claim to possess, Franklin, you have presented any evidence or source beyond Muir's fictional journal concerning Earl Henry Sinclair being a prince or a Templar, which he was neither, or how he was able to sail in 1398 to Oak Island in opposition to his Oath of Fealty obligations to the King of Norway, weather a Nor'easter off of Nova Scotia that destroyed his ship, bury an alleged treasure, and sail back to Scotland well under two years where he died in 1340.
    Just sayin' 'Nuff said!
    He did not die in 1340? Henry Sinclair died in 1404. He stayed in the Bay of Fundy during the Winter of 1395. But you do not believe anything without proof? So sorry for you.

  5. #215
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    ...and you believe everything without proof, and then post it as fact. So sorry for you.
    Once again you have avoided the actual established fact that Earl Henry Sinclair was NOT a prince, Templar, or free to set sail on an Atlantic ocean voyage whim being an obligated vassal to the King of Norway under his Oath if Fealty.

    "It has been Earl Henry Sinclair's fate to enjoy an ever expanding posthumous reputation which has little to do with anything he achieved on his lifetime"- William Thompson, British Historian
    "Henry Sinclair, an Earl of Orkney of the fourteenth century, didn't go to America"
    - Brian Smith , official Orkney/Shetland Historian

    With their years of research, real professional academic and degreed historians clearly have stated that this Sinclair voyage to Nova Scotia never occurred, and totally dismiss Muir's Sinclair Journals as fabricated fiction fashioned from the equally fictional fantasy Zeno narrative.
    You constantly make these bold broad statements as proclamations of personal knowledge fact, but with the lack of sources for your claims of "fact" that lack true historical verification and support, and are headily dismissed by the professional community as pseudo history fabricated fantasies, does bring forth a credibility issue.
    As mentioned previously, even Scott Wolter purveyor of all possible conspiracies and false history has his doubts-"If the Journals are real", and Sinclair descendant, Jack Sinclair with this-"Honestly folks, isn't it time we all grow up and drop this Zeno nonsense about Prince Henry once and for all".
    Honestly, Franklin. isn't it time to present supporting sources backing up what you post as fact?
    Last edited by ECS; Mar 24, 2020 at 05:37 PM.

  6. #216
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    Quote Originally Posted by ECS View Post
    ...and you believe everything without proof, and then post it as fact. So sorry for you.
    Once again you have avoided the actual established fact that Earl Henry Sinclair was NOT a prince, Templar, or free to set sail on an Atlantic ocean voyage whim being an obligated vassal to the King of Norway under his Oath if Fealty.

    "It has been Earl Henry Sinclair's fate to enjoy an ever expanding posthumous reputation which has little to do with anything he achieved on his lifetime"- William Thompson, British Historian
    "Henry Sinclair, an Earl of Orkney of the fourteenth century, didn't go to America"
    - Brian Smith , official Orkney/Shetland Historian

    With their years of research, real professional academic and degreed historians clearly have stated that this Sinclair voyage to Nova Scotia never occurred, and totally dismiss Muir's Sinclair Journals as fabricated fiction fashioned from the equally fictional fantasy Zeno narrative.
    You constantly make these bold broad statements as proclamations of personal knowledge fact, but with the lack of sources for your claims of "fact" that lack true historical verification and support, and are headily dismissed by the professional community as pseudo history fabricated fantasies, does bring forth a credibility issue.
    As mentioned previously, even Scott Wolter purveyor of all possible conspiracies and false history has his doubts-"If the Journals are real", and Sinclair descendant, Jack Sinclair with this-"Honestly folks, isn't it time we all grow up and drop this Zeno nonsense about Prince Henry once and for all".
    Honestly, Franklin. isn't it time to present supporting sources backing up what you post as fact?
    No. Not Yet. When the treasures are recovered that should be enough supporting sources you are looking for. I will wait until then. I have the location of the Knights Templar treasure still buried on Oak Island. Whether you or the whole World believes Sir Henry Sinclair was not a Knights Templar is irrelevant to me because I know better. I know the exact dates he went through each of the levels of Mason as every freemason does today. I know the exact dates of his birth and death as well as everyone around him. So you keep posting those people not in the know and they and you can keep denying my facts but they will be proven when the treasures are recovered. And they will be recovered.
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  7. #217
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    The oldest records of Freemasonry are held by the Grand Lodge of Scotland, which was found in 1736.
    The oldest records of what would become known as Masons are from the Lodge Aitcheson's Haven, dated January 9, 1599, almost 200 years after the death of Earl Henry Sinclair.
    The misconception of Knights Templar becoming Masons was from the 1737 Grand Oration of Andrew Michael Ramsey, mentor to Charles Edward Stuart with his statement, "Our ancestors, the Crusaders, gathered together from all parts of Christendom in the Holy Land, desired to reunite into one sole fraternity".
    Ramsey's "Crusaders" then became Knights Templars and concluded with this statement, "every Mason is a Knight Templar", and was grafted onto Freemasonry.
    Earl Henry Sinclair was not a prince or a Templar, and there is no record before January 9, 1599 of Freemasons, so it is highly doubtful Sinclair went through any "level of Mason".
    Once again you are posting something as fact, that without documentation, has serious credibility issues when compared with researched real documented history that had weathered professional verification.
    You continue to state that the professional academic lettered history community are "not in the Know" all the while not presenting any actual supporting proof that you are "in the Know", and that these highly questionable claims are not just fantasy fabrications.
    As for your facts being proven when the treasure is recovered...
    Just sayin' 'Nuff said!
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  8. #218
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    Quote Originally Posted by franklin View Post
    He did not die in 1340? Henry Sinclair died in 1404. He stayed in the Bay of Fundy during the Winter of 1395. But you do not believe anything without proof?...
    One source of proof is the SINCLAIR DIPLOMA, a genealogy of the Sinclair family written by Earl Henry Sinclair's grandson, written in Middle English.

    "He retitit to the parts of Orchadie(Orkney) and joist them to the latter tyme of his life, and deit Erile of Orchadie, and for the defence of the country was slain there cruelle by his enemis".

    Performing his obligated duties to defend Orkney and the Shetlands as an OATH OF FEALTY vassal to the King of Norway, Earl Henry Sinclair was killed while repelling an English raiding party invasion of Orkney in late 1400 or early 1401.
    In the SINCLAIR DIPLOMA, all of Earl Henry's titles, most inherited from his father, are listed, including Lord Sinclair, Lord Shetland, Great Protector and Keeper and Defender of the Prince of Scotland.
    This is the only relative contemporary document close to Earl Henry Sinclair's time, and was compiled by his grandson.
    What is NOT mentioned are the titles "prince" and "sir", Templars, treasure, or any voyage beyond those made about the Shetlands, Orkney, and to Norway, AND absolutely NO mention of a 1398 voyage across the great Atlantic to the "New World" or a 1395 winter stay at the Bay of Fundy.

  9. #219
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    He stayed the Winter of 1398 not 1395. I had it wrong. Sorry I do not look up everything. Also he died 1404 as he signed a document that year. At least that proved he was still alive. He was killed while trying to fight off pirates in the Shetlands. They could travel over to Nova Scotia in 4 to 5 weeks but going back home sometimes would take 9 weeks.

  10. #220
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    Are intimating that Earl Henry's grandson SINCLAIR DIPLOMA genealogy account was wrong?
    What about the total lack of mentioning a voyage to the New World?
    One would think that a grandfather would revel it telling his children and great grand children of such a great adventurous voyage.
    Earl Henry Sinclair's fight with "pirates in the Shetlands" occurred in 1390, honoring his Oath of Fealty to the Norwegian King establishing order and returning control to Norway.
    Sinclair attacked the Shetlands with 13 birlinn warships and a just over 100 men, killing the Norse pirates including Henry's cousin, Malis Sperra.
    The DIPLOMA OF THOMAS, Bishop if Orkney and Zetland, states on Page 81, the Earl Henry Sinclair, "Earl of Orkney fighting in the Borders in 1398.
    What document did Earl Henry Sinclair died signing in on 1404?
    Are you referring to the Charter for Henry Santo Claro from King Robert III?
    That was presented by Earl Henry's son, John, granting him the lands of Smeliehope, Loganhouse in the shire of Edinburgh, which was signed well before 1404, like a will, guaranteeing this property to John Sinclair, without this Charter, all lands and titles went to the first born son under law and practice known as "primo gentry".
    Last edited by ECS; Mar 26, 2020 at 08:09 PM.

  11. #221
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    No it was a Charter under King James II or Robert III. Can't remember which.

  12. #222
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    It was a Charter under King Robert III, who ruled Scotland from 1390 to 1406, and it dealt with John Sinclair receiving the lands of Smeliehope, Loganhouse, and was signed years before 1404 by Earl Henry Sinclair as will for son John for reasons mentioned in Post#220.
    The DIPLOMA OF THOMAS, Bishop of Orkney and Zetland stats that Henry Sinclair Earl of Orkney fighting in the Borders in 1398, and the genealogy SINCLAIR DIPLOMA document created by Earl Henry's grandson, clearly stated he was killed while repelling an English raiding party on Orkney in late 1400 or early 1401.
    Both DIPLOMAs are written accounts by two persons that personally knew Earl Henry Sinclair and are contemporary accounts of his actual activities.
    What is obvious by being conspicuous by total lack of even the slightest mention, the alleged voyage to Oak Island/Nova Scotia and for that matter, Templars or treasure.
    If such a voyage happened in 1398, it would be well worth the mention in both DIPLOMAS, but Bishop Thomas has Earl Henry in Scotland fighting in the Borders in 1398, and grandson has Earl Henry being killed in battle by English raiders either 1400 or 1401.

  13. #223
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    Quote Originally Posted by franklin View Post
    She reveals a page written in Latin and dated in 1398 as the handwriting of Sir Henry Sinclair.
    There are also letters that can be found on the Internet written to Henry Sinclair during that time frame to verify his handwriting...
    Does Diana Jean Muir state where Earl Henry Sinclair was when this 1398 dated page in Latin was written and its content?
    Also, Muir stated that what she found in that truck were copies of copies and NOT originals, including the pages attributed to Earl Henry,
    Who verified the signature as Sinclair's, when most documents and letters were signed with a signet ring impressed in a wax seal?
    As Bishop Thomas of Orkney and Zetland mentioned, it may have been from the time he was fighting at the Border.
    Last edited by ECS; Mar 27, 2020 at 03:35 PM.

  14. #224
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    Quote Originally Posted by ECS View Post
    It was a Charter under King Robert III, who ruled Scotland from 1390 to 1406, and it dealt with John Sinclair receiving the lands of Smeliehope, Loganhouse, and was signed years before 1404 by Earl Henry Sinclair as will for son John for reasons mentioned in Post#220.
    The DIPLOMA OF THOMAS, Bishop of Orkney and Zetland stats that Henry Sinclair Earl of Orkney fighting in the Borders in 1398, and the genealogy SINCLAIR DIPLOMA document created by Earl Henry's grandson, clearly stated he was killed while repelling an English raiding party on Orkney in late 1400 or early 1401.
    Both DIPLOMAs are written accounts by two persons that personally knew Earl Henry Sinclair and are contemporary accounts of his actual activities.
    What is obvious by being conspicuous by total lack of even the slightest mention, the alleged voyage to Oak Island/Nova Scotia and for that matter, Templars or treasure.
    If such a voyage happened in 1398, it would be well worth the mention in both DIPLOMAS, but Bishop Thomas has Earl Henry in Scotland fighting in the Borders in 1398, and grandson has Earl Henry being killed in battle by English raiders either 1400 or 1401.
    Do you really think they are going to tell anything in those documents about Templars or treasure. Everyone says the Templars were non-existence after early 14th Century. Why is it I find mention of them in British records and Gray's Inn's records in the 1590's? Even in the 18th Century when they had special meetings at the lodges about Templar Treasures they were told no recording is to be made. Why print something that is Secret.

  15. #225
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    Why is no absolutely NO mention of Sinclair's voyage to Nova Scotia until 450 years after his death until 1875 when Richard Henry Major published his translation of the Zeno narrative fiction into English, substituting North Sea "Prince Zichmni" for "Prince Sinclair"?

    Richard Henry Major "wanted for some reason best known to himself, to prove that Zeno was writing about Henry Sinclair, and Orkney, and Shetland. The only way he could do that was to mistranslate Zeno's original. It's a shocking piece of deception"
    -Brian Smith, Orkney Historian/Archivist of Shetland Museum
    Quoted from NEW ORKNEY ANTIQUARIAN JOURNAL, Vol 2, 2002
    The entire article in which Brian Smith goes into great detail concerning the creation of the Sinclair voyage to Nova Scotia myth:
    www.alastairhamilton.com/sinclair.htm

    Contemporary accounts by those who lived along side and knew Earl Henry Sinclair, including Orkney Bishop Thomas's statement of Sinclair at the Borders in 1392, not in the New World, or Sinclair's grandson's genealogy that makes NO mention of this voyage, and NEVER referred to Earl Henry as a "prince" or a "Templar".
    As for Templars being mentioned in the 1590's, it seems you are confusing early freemasons with Templars stemming from a 1737 Oration by Freemason Andrew Michael Ramsey, tutor to Prince Charles Edward Stuart.
    Once again I ask, if this is "something that is Secret", where does knowledge of this Secret originate?
    'Nuff Said!
    Last edited by ECS; Mar 27, 2020 at 12:34 PM.

 

 
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