Bitcoin v. PMs

[jim4silver]

Bitcoin v. PM's

I remember back when Bitcoin was running past 1000 people were saying Bitcoin was a better alternative than PM's. Nowadays I laugh when I think of those "smart" folks.

I actually would prefer virtually any paper asset to bitcoin since bitcoin has all the negative attributes us PM bugs give to "paper" based assets but at least most of those paper backed assets have something behind them (full faith and credit of a national gov, widespread acceptance, etc.).

Just my opinion.

Hundreds of Millions of Dollars Vanish After Bitcoin Exchange Closes / Sputnik International

Jim

 

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[Marchas45]

Good link Jim, I'm surprised there is not much being said about this in the PM and Bitcoin circles. Mmmmmmm maybe another dive down coming.

 

[Jason in Enid]

bitcoin is a scam

 

[Dman]

Kind of like investing in Beenie babies. LOL

 

[Diggin-N-Dumps]

Kind of like investing in Beenie babies. LOL

 

[Hitndahed]

I have been involved in Bitcoin and a multitude of other crypto-currencies for years. Actually ,,, It is NOT a get rich quick scheme and like every other currency,,, you have your scams. (remember Bernie Madoff ? ) .
Same as every thing,,, there are ripoffs and mis-managment. Due diligence and do your homework before getting involved. I have done OK with it,,, not rich or even well to do but I have made enough to help support several of my more expensive hobbies.

The issues surrounding crypto-currencies are what big-brother hates. The banking cartels and taxes,, just to name the two most obvious. Then there is tracking the movements of said currencies. It is just 1s and zeroes folks,, and if the transactions are done correctly,,there is no tracking where the "money" went or where it came from. And that really gets big-brother in a tizzy.

As far as the "darknet" and the underground markets like Silk Road,,, personally I think its wonderful to have the option to buy whatever you want,,, when you want,,, and not have any hassles. The markets have assuredly all the "negative" items we all see in the headlines but also you can buy EVERY item you can get from your local WallMart to. Electronics,,,groceries,,clothing,,you name it. The ONLY TIME that Bitcoin is ever in the news in any fashion is when something negative
occurs.This of course is exactly what the bought and paid for news outlets live for. I DESPISE the current banking cartels and also feel that we are being taxed out of existence. So by my using this adopted form of "payment" I am showing my personal displeasure with the current financial situation of the world.

It has been estimated that 10% of the worlds business may be using "alternative" currencies. Just remember,,,there is NOTHING backing the all mighty dollar,,,"VALUE" is assigned to ANYTHING when all parties involved agree on a "worth" of an object.

Just my personal years worth of experience with this payment system.

Hit

 

[jim4silver]

I have been involved in Bitcoin and a multitude of other crypto-currencies for years. Actually ,,, It is NOT a get rich quick scheme and like every other currency,,, you have your scams. (remember Bernie Madoff ? ) .
Same as every thing,,, there are ripoffs and mis-managment. Due diligence and do your homework before getting involved. I have done OK with it,,, not rich or even well to do but I have made enough to help support several of my more expensive hobbies.

The issues surrounding crypto-currencies are what big-brother hates. The banking cartels and taxes,, just to name the two most obvious. Then there is tracking the movements of said currencies. It is just 1s and zeroes folks,, and if the transactions are done correctly,,there is no tracking where the "money" went or where it came from. And that really gets big-brother in a tizzy.

As far as the "darknet" and the underground markets like Silk Road,,, personally I think its wonderful to have the option to buy whatever you want,,, when you want,,, and not have any hassles. The markets have assuredly all the "negative" items we all see in the headlines but also you can buy EVERY item you can get from your local WallMart to. Electronics,,,groceries,,clothing,,you name it. The ONLY TIME that Bitcoin is ever in the news in any fashion is when something negative
occurs.This of course is exactly what the bought and paid for news outlets live for. I DESPISE the current banking cartels and also feel that we are being taxed out of existence. So by my using this adopted form of "payment" I am showing my personal displeasure with the current financial situation of the world.

It has been estimated that 10% of the worlds business may be using "alternative" currencies. Just remember,,,there is NOTHING backing the all mighty dollar,,,"VALUE" is assigned to ANYTHING when all parties involved agree on a "worth" of an object.

Just my personal years worth of experience with this payment system.

Hit

The problem with the virtual currencies or e currencies is whom is responsible for them when a system gets hacked and the e coins get stolen? Who is regulating it? All of the pros of virtual currencies also fit physical PM's or physical anything that can be traded, etc. The cons of virtual currencies are the same as fiat and other paper assets, without a known company or entity to go after should a problem arise.

Some people obviously made a deal of profit as their e currencies rose in value, but so have people who play pink sheet stocks, although they are probably not reliable for long term either.

With all the access the world governments have to the internet, etc (silk road was taken down with no problems it seems), why would someone think they could ever use e currencies to escape the gov's reach? The gov was able to get some of the offshore banks to turn over tax records of Americans with money abroad, so I would think anything "online" is within their reach if they want it bad enough. Some conspiracy theorists have surmised that "dark nets" and e currencies are actually created by world gov's to help keep an eye on things better. I don't know if that is true or not.

To me, e currencies are just a another version of fiat currencies, but are being run by unknown private individuals or unknown companies instead of world gov's. You want to trust those unknown folks with your wealth? I don't know much about e currencies so maybe my views are wrong, but I have not seen anything to the contrary yet.


Just my opinion.


Jim

 

[signal]

Well, PM's will never becomes the mainstream currency. Crypto currencies may one day replace fiat currency. It lends itself to commence and decentralizing control of the currency. The value of the dollar has been on such a decline its days are numbered. I think thats why so many of you enjoy PM's. But PM's are not practical for a day to day commerce. So how do you fix currency?

 

[Marchas45]

Silver Dimes, Silver Quarters, Silver Halfs, Silver Dollars? Made out of PM's? Lol By the way Bradley what happened to your post concerning the dollar not being backed by anything? I thought it was a truthful thought. Keep Stacking

 

[jim4silver]

Well, PM's will never becomes the mainstream currency. Crypto currencies may one day replace fiat currency. It lends itself to commence and decentralizing control of the currency. The value of the dollar has been on such a decline its days are numbered. I think thats why so many of you enjoy PM's. But PM's are not practical for a day to day commerce. So how do you fix currency?

Gov's won't ever allow crypto currencies to take over unless said Gov's are in charge of the crypto currencies, but if that happens I guess they aren't crypto. Since the dawn of time it has always been the privilege of the crown or rulers to mint/control currency (also see seigniorage). It is how they can control the way they do, etc.

If there ever is a mass power outage or the internet goes down, how will those crypto currencies hold up then?

PS There are also laws in the US that prohibits persons from creating "private currency" that is intended to replace the mighty dollar. Although there are private currencies that exist such as bartering, etc, if the gov decides you are a problem they will go after you. Look at Bernard Von Nothaus Libery dollar. They got him just for this. Nobody in their right mind can argue his Liberty dollars were meant to fool people as being real US currency (like if you printed fake US bills). That is why he didn't get any time for his conviction in the end. see below older article (a few years before Bernard's sentencing).

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/10/25/u...his-fate-behind-bars.html?pagewanted=all&_r=0

Just my opinion.

Jim

 

[signal]

crypto currencies are in use today, that ship has already sailed. Whether they will gain more market share who knows. With interesting payment options out there now like apple pay, the possibilities are endless.

A currency not controlled by a government would be a good thing. The Fed is so corrupt, it controls our currency, and its not even government. They just make money and don't offer transparency to the american people, biggest scam ever to take over the wealth of this country and was quite successful. Now someone has to come and try to take it back.

 

[kayakpat]

If you think the "Fed" or a "national government" is corrupted , even though it has a constitutional mandate to create currency and regulate markets and accountable to society is more corrupt than a system set up by a private individual or corporation or local warlord or a barter system, would be a real lesson in enslavement

 

[jim4silver]

If you think the "Fed" or a "national government" is corrupted , even though it has a constitutional mandate to create currency and regulate markets and accountable to society is more corrupt than a system set up by a private individual or corporation or local warlord or a barter system, would be a real lesson in enslavement

Although I don't like the whole Bitcoin idea, your post has some flaws. The Constitution does mandate the gov to create currency, but unfortunately that has been delegated (in part) to the Fed reserve, which is NOT a part of the federal gov (look at your paper money- it is a Federal Reserve Note NOT a US dollar anymore), I won't go into why this matters or not.

The fed reserve does have some Gov appointees running various high level posts, but at the end of the day it is private institution that has stock held by the private banks who are part of it. You can look that up I am correct. As one pundit used to say, the Federal reserve is no more federal than federal express. That is why some politicians keep trying to pass bills to "audit the fed" but those keep failing.

The Fed Reserve website says about whether or not they are a private corporation:

"The 12 regional Federal Reserve Banks, which were established by the Congress as the operating arms of the nation's central banking system, are organized similarly to private corporations--possibly leading to some confusion about "ownership." For example, the Reserve Banks issue shares of stock to member banks. However, owning Reserve Bank stock is quite different from owning stock in a private company. The Reserve Banks are not operated for profit, and ownership of a certain amount of stock is, by law, a condition of membership in the System. The stock may not be sold, traded, or pledged as security for a loan; dividends are, by law, 6 percent per year."

The above quote is straight from the Federal Reserve's own website. What I am curious about is how much do those member banks earn on those 6% dividends? And from what cash flow does the 6% dividend emanate? Can anyone here answer these questions, I really would like to know.

Also, there is no "Constitutional" mandate to regulate markets. However, it is interesting that after the 1987 crash, Reagan signed an executive order creating what is often referred to as the "plunge protection team" but is really called Working Group on Financial Markets and is supposed to to help stabilize markets. What is often reported on but I cannot show proof of is that this "team" intervenes in the market to help keep things from crashing at various times. However this is not a Constitutional directive in any way that I am aware of.

Working Group on Financial Markets - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Just my opinion.

Jim

 

[jim4silver]

Looks like according to this article the governments will one day have their own version of "bitcoin". If that ever happens, they will all probably ban "bitcoin" and say it is counterfeit or something like that, just like they would do if a person tried to start a competing currency to the dollar. Many think that counterfeit means making copy dollars that try to fool people, but the law related to counterfeiting is more broad. For example, if someone tried to create a private currency in the US to compete with the dollar, that would be illegal (some private currencies like barter and such that don't try to compete with the dollar are allowed). That is how they could go after Liberty Dollar and get a conviction. I would imagine in time if they ever did come up with an official gov e money system like bitcoin, they would try to outlaw the competing ones.

I would bet if they did come up with such an e currency, over time they would eliminate or seek to eliminate paper currency as well. The reason being because they would be seeking to tax all they can, and it is hard to tax cash to cash transactions. Maybe 10 years or so and I can see this happening.

Just my opinion.


RED ALERT ? IBM Moves to Create a Centralized, Central Bank Controlled Blockchain for Currency Control | Liberty Blitzkrieg


Jim

 

[jim4silver]

What a surprise something like this would happen. I guess nobody could see that having non-physical (electronic) private system money being held by some 3rd party as being a risky choice?

Just my opinion.

Bitcoin Scammers Run Off With $12 Million: ?Going to The Caribbean? Hope You Guys Understand? | The Daily Sheeple


Jim

 

[specksandflecks]

The first 'headline' I remember reading about Bitcoin read something like "Internet nerds create their own money". Interesting, I thought as I dismissed it without a second thought or clicking the link. Thinking "Ok cool, good luck with that".

At the time it was probably about ~$.05-.10/btc. Oops. Oh well, maybe next lifetime...

This technology has about as much of a chance of catching on as virtual discussions on something called 'internet forums'. Oh wait.

Can someone please explain to me how 1 man, in 1 lifetime, became one of the richest on earth? I guess Windows 8.1 can be held in my hand in some physical form, but that's not really how it does it's work...

BTW Intel is hiring ASIC engineers for their U.S. fabs. Reason? My conspiracy theory is that it's by US government request. Why? China and who knows what other Governments are subsidizing bitcoin mining and soon to be if not already, ASIC development.. To what extent and to what end I don't know. They either want to 'undermine' the protocol or use it as part of BRICs or something similar. Good luck googling that.. Shhh.

The title of this thread is Bitcoin vs PM's. Interesting yes, and they do have some similarities. Bitcoin was never meant to compete with PM's as a store of value IMO. It is a transfer of value protocol. An incorruptible, open source, distributed ledger. Bitcoin is currently being used primarily as a currency. Currency, in all forms, was the the most powerful thing known to mankind. Until it wasn't. Credit to Mr Antonopoulos for that.

Bitcoin is before it's time, such as a 'Model T' would be before garages or locks and keys. A revolutionary means of transport, with no means, to the common man, to reliably secure it. "And this to shall pass". Biometric authentication will evolve like a virus to antibodies, only faster by a factor of?. There will come a day when real-time DNA based biometric security is considered obsolete. Compare that to a physical lock and key.

Bitcoin, like all else in this realm, will evolve or become extinct. Giving Bitcion (in it's current form) a 50% chance of surviving, is being more than generous. The technology Bitcoin is based on however, that train has left the station.

 

[Hitndahed]

I remember back when Bitcoin was running past 1000 people were saying Bitcoin was a better alternative than PM's. Nowadays I laugh when I think of those "smart" folks.

I actually would prefer virtually any paper asset to bitcoin since bitcoin has all the negative attributes us PM bugs give to "paper" based assets but at least most of those paper backed assets have something behind them (full faith and credit of a national gov, widespread acceptance, etc.).

Just my opinion.

Hundreds of Millions of Dollars Vanish After Bitcoin Exchange Closes / Sputnik International

Jim

======================================================
Millions of OUR tax dollars "VANISH" every day.

What "assets" makes paper good?

OUR OWN government STOLE the citizens of the UNITED STATES PERSONAL GOLD for cripes sake,,Gave those same citizens "pretty colored bits of paper"in return,, and you trust them?


So PLEASE do tell me something bad about Bitcoin. I have been involved for a very long time,,
The ONLY time you hear or see it in the news outlets (MSM) is when there is a negative association with it,,such as the one you mentioned. Or it getting used to buy illicit items.
Bitcoin is now accepted at Amazon,,Overstock.com,,Tiger Direct,,,and a slew of other legitimate places.


Tell me,, do you have stocks,,,bonds,,,or any other form of non-tangible "assets"?
its just PAPER with an "implied" value attached.

Do you like having our own government TAKING from you the things and cash you worked so hard to get?


Bitcoin cuts out the "middleman" (government) and puts the possibility of true self worth within the reach of every single person in the world.

No individual country can make it their own,, it is worldwide now and it will not ever be stopped.

I use it as much as possible to buy everyday things,,and even high end items too.


It is not just Bitcoin that is in the news,, there are over 500 different crypto currencies now. Some are for specific purposes but every one can be turned into a "real" currency.
WITHOUT any government getting involved. To me it
is FREEDOM.
None of this response is an attack on anyone, I use YOU to mean everyone.

Hit

 

[Hitndahed]

What a surprise something like this would happen. I guess nobody could see that having non-physical (electronic) private system money being held by some 3rd party as being a risky choice?

Just my opinion.

Bitcoin Scammers Run Off With $12 Million: ?Going to The Caribbean? Hope You Guys Understand? | The Daily Sheeple


Jim

======================================
For example someone like BERNIE MADOFF maybe?

There are thieves everywhere,,
And contrary to popular MIS BELIEF,,, unless you "tumble" your cryptos,,, it CAN be tracked,,, its hard but I think it involves relating an IP address with a transaction id and a wallet address.
This was how a few got caught.

 

[jim4silver]

======================================
For example someone like BERNIE MADOFF maybe?

There are thieves everywhere,,
And contrary to popular MIS BELIEF,,, unless you "tumble" your cryptos,,, it CAN be tracked,,, its hard but I think it involves relating an IP address with a transaction id and a wallet address.
This was how a few got caught.

My purpose for this thread is not to trash bit coin per se, but to show how risky they are to own compared to physical PM's that I can store on my own. If your bitcoins are stolen, hacked or whatever, who do you call- Ghostbusters? At least if a bank or financial institution steals your money you can sue them (at least for now). I think many overestimated the degree of "crypto-ness" their bitcoin transactions held. I am not an expert on this, but I know the gov technology is far ahead of what is talked about publicly with respect to computer systems, etc.

I think the technology behind bitcoin is amazing. I do believe that at some point down the road the US gov, along with many other nations, will "ban" cash transactions for the simple reason that they will be in desperate need for extra tax dollars. I don't know when this will happen, 2, 5, or 10 years, but I think we will see it. I also think there will be windfall taxes on PM sales should PMs ever regain their glory with much higher prices. The gov will probably initiate new rules that will require coin stores, etc, to 1099 their sellers much like what was proposed back when obamacare was being created, yet eventually failed due to public outcry. The law proposed would have also applied to businesses other than coin stores. Again, new ways to tax more.

Many PM bug types on the blogs were hot for bitcoin when it first came out and yes those that got in early made a killing, not unlike Apple stock, etc. Due to the dropping PM prices some PM bugs I know started playing with bitcoin hoping to make a quick buck. Some of them were buying near 1000. So now I guess they can cry about their bitcoins losing value along with falling gold/silver prices. At least with silver/gold they have shiny pieces of metal to play with even if the price goes to zero.

I think when we do go cashless, the gov will use technology like bitcoin and will ban any forms of it that are not gov related. If all transactions are tracked it would make tax collection a bit easier since "all cash" transactions are hard to trace. It takes time for society to accept certain things that might not be good for them. Nowadays many use debit cards and such and don't carry cash. I have younger clients who have never written a check and I have to explain how to do that when they come see me. Usually the check is the first or second one in their checkbook. (I don't take cc or debit cards cause I don't want to give a cut to the banks- plus don't like the idea of a "chargeback"). Moving down the road to some non cash system which is forced instead of voluntary will probably not offend the sheep at all, and will be heralded as a great thing.

Just my opinion.

Jim

 

[Hitndahed]

Nice post Jim,,
And I do agree with you on the majority. Too many people do advertise their "wealth",,we all see it. Personally I would never speak one word,,or post for that matter any info on any tangible wealth I may have accumulated.
Especially here where the fed trolls do rent a few apartments.

In my opinion The ONLY TRUE readily exchangeable things are PMs and labor,,If it's on paper forget it, but you can use it to lite a fire,,, hehheh
Our country was built on lead and gold,,,as it should be now.
Again,,, your above post was good,,, thanks

Hit